Switch Theme:

Warcry (AoS) News & Rumours - Warcry Catacombs preorder 24th October, 4 Grand Alliances books pg77  [RSS] Share on facebook Share on Twitter Submit to Reddit
»
Author Message
Advert


Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you:
  • No adverts like this in the forums anymore.
  • Times and dates in your local timezone.
  • Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance.
  • Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely.
  • Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net.
If you are already a member then feel free to login now.




Made in be
Longtime Dakkanaut





Bah, it's not really the fact AoS factions are swarming Warcry - what's making this preview more than underwhelming is that it's recycled content.

They're talking about background tables, quests, challenge battles, profiles for AoS factions...mind you, those were already there in White Dwarf articles and previous Tomes of Champion and card packs. Sure, there will be some new additions here and there, a few challenge battles nobody cares about and such, but let's be clear : most of these books will be something we already know and play with in Warcry.

This is just good for new players. They can have multiple card packs in just one book (even if they don't really care to play them all).

And yes, books with profiles inside...what was the point then to use cards with icons rather than the usual characteristics in good old language ? It was solely to make you buy the cards in addition. Now ? There is no coherence anymore.

Bet the profiles for the "core" chaos warbands and the khainite stalkers won't be inside the books. Because, you know, GW has to make people buy the kits and starter boxes after all.

Otherwise, I expect the books to follow closely the release of the starter box, if they are not sold the same week. It's basically the Tome of Champion 2020, but divided in 4 books...more books for the book throne ! More money for the money god !

 Kanluwen wrote:
Dread Master wrote:
Warcry news is lame. Hard to gauge where they are taking the game at this point.

To Catacombs.

Which we get more information on tomorrow.
And it goes up for preorder next Saturday(October 24).


Catacombs is just the new starter box for Warcry. It doesn't change the core rules at all.

So what you're saying just underlines the truth for Warcry : it goes nowhere.

This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at 2020/10/17 18:30:06


 
   
Made in us
Owns Whole Set of Skullz Techpriests






Right behind you.

The core Chaos warbands and Khainite Shadowstalkers are designed for WarCry...the Grand Alliance stuff isn't.

Also, you understand that the "profiles" were those cards with icons right? The icons represent the characteristics.
   
Made in be
Longtime Dakkanaut





 Kanluwen wrote:
The core Chaos warbands and Khainite Shadowstalkers are designed for WarCry...the Grand Alliance stuff isn't.


So what ? They're still part of an Alliance. They can be put in the books as well. But I bet they won't, and it's not because they're "designed for Warcry" - it's because so that people buy the Warcry boxes, instead of the AoS "double" boxes that are cheaper, so that they have rules to play them.


Also, you understand that the "profiles" were those cards with icons right? The icons represent the characteristics.


And I'm saying the reason they were used is because they wanted to sell the cards apart.

They could have put the profiles in books from the beginning and use no icon (especially those who are misleading because they're way too similar...cf the Leader and Champion runemarks).

But no. It was to sell those accessories.

Now that they're using books to put the profiles inside ? It's just a slap to the customers. Those who own the cards and previous books will buy a book just to have the few new additions in a sea of recycled content. Yay.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2020/10/17 18:39:42


 
   
Made in gb
Battle-tested Knight Castellan Pilot





Sarouan wrote:


They could have put the profiles in books from the beginning

And give you the book for free?
   
Made in si
Steady Stonecleaver







JWBS wrote:
Sarouan wrote:


They could have put the profiles in books from the beginning

And give you the book for free?


For starters let's just keep it at "don't charge us twice for the same thing" okay? Baby steps.

Posters on ignore list: 33

40k Potica Edition - 40k patch with reactions, suppression and all that good stuff. Feedback thread here.

Gangs of Nu Ork - Necromunda / Gorkamorka expansion supporting all faction. Feedback thread here
   
Made in us
Owns Whole Set of Skullz Techpriests






Right behind you.

 lord_blackfang wrote:
JWBS wrote:
Sarouan wrote:


They could have put the profiles in books from the beginning

And give you the book for free?


For starters let's just keep it at "don't charge us twice for the same thing" okay? Baby steps.

Then don't buy it?

If it's collected material, as is being discussed here as speculation, then the people who would be "getting charged twice" will already have it.

This isn't hard to puzzle out people. The cards went out of stock. People complained that they did. Remember that the cards were an international product, not a localized one.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/10/17 19:48:26


 
   
Made in gb
Battlefield Professional




Nottingham, England

Another great sue with the cards was retailers had to buy a mixed box of them so after launch many dud the buy more boxes as certain factions didn't sell well.
   
Made in si
Steady Stonecleaver







Kan, I think you know as well as I do that there will be 10% new content that will be effectively required for normal play and not available elsewhere. Same as when they put in one extra card with the Gloomspite faction box.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/10/17 19:55:59


Posters on ignore list: 33

40k Potica Edition - 40k patch with reactions, suppression and all that good stuff. Feedback thread here.

Gangs of Nu Ork - Necromunda / Gorkamorka expansion supporting all faction. Feedback thread here
   
Made in us
Owns Whole Set of Skullz Techpriests






Right behind you.

 lord_blackfang wrote:
Kan, I think you know as well as I do that there will be 10% new content that will be effectively required for normal play and not available elsewhere. Same as when they put in one extra card with the Gloomspite faction box.

And that box is still available for sale. Same thing goes for the Nighthaunt and Myrmourn Banshees...and now they'll be in the book.

It's not like they needed to incentivize the sale of the box either. It was $50 for a good spread of items.
   
Made in gb
Battle-tested Knight Castellan Pilot





By linking some of the old stuff I see you're cleverly avoiding his complaint that the book will potentially include book-exclusive material in an attempt to have players re-buy a whole heap of old stuff in a package with comparatively little new stuff.
   
Made in be
Longtime Dakkanaut





 Kanluwen wrote:
 lord_blackfang wrote:
Kan, I think you know as well as I do that there will be 10% new content that will be effectively required for normal play and not available elsewhere. Same as when they put in one extra card with the Gloomspite faction box.

And that box is still available for sale. Same thing goes for the Nighthaunt and Myrmourn Banshees...and now they'll be in the book.

It's not like they needed to incentivize the sale of the box either. It was $50 for a good spread of items.


You really don't need to try to defend GW on this one, you know. Avoiding the core of our complaints doesn't do anything as well.

Just aknowledge the truth : these books are recycled contents, and GW trying to pass it as something worthy of a preview is ridiculous.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/10/17 20:55:23


 
   
Made in us
Owns Whole Set of Skullz Techpriests






Right behind you.

JWBS wrote:
By linking some of the old stuff I see you're cleverly avoiding his complaint that the book will potentially include book-exclusive material in an attempt to have players re-buy a whole heap of old stuff in a package with comparatively little new stuff.

Then don't buy it?

This isn't a difficult situation to rectify.



Automatically Appended Next Post:
Sarouan wrote:
 Kanluwen wrote:
 lord_blackfang wrote:
Kan, I think you know as well as I do that there will be 10% new content that will be effectively required for normal play and not available elsewhere. Same as when they put in one extra card with the Gloomspite faction box.

And that box is still available for sale. Same thing goes for the Nighthaunt and Myrmourn Banshees...and now they'll be in the book.

It's not like they needed to incentivize the sale of the box either. It was $50 for a good spread of items.


You really don't need to try to defend GW on this one, you know. Avoiding the core of our complaints doesn't do anything as well.

Just aknowledge the truth : these books are recycled contents, and GW trying to pass it as something worthy of a preview is ridiculous.

They didn't try to hide it. There's no "truth" to acknowledge, you're not deciphering the Da Vinci Code here.

And contrary to people like yourself suggesting this isn't "worthy of a preview", this actually is notable in that it's happening and shows continued support for those factions that are currently locked in ePubs or card formats that aren't still sold.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/10/17 21:17:47


 
   
Made in gb
Battle-tested Knight Castellan Pilot





 Kanluwen wrote:
JWBS wrote:
By linking some of the old stuff I see you're cleverly avoiding his complaint that the book will potentially include book-exclusive material in an attempt to have players re-buy a whole heap of old stuff in a package with comparatively little new stuff.

Then don't buy it?

This isn't a difficult situation to rectify.


Oh I'm 100% absolutely not going to buy it, just as with 90% of the other stuff they've released. The bands I did buy I bought for the models, since I don't play the games. Still, to any impartial observer (like myself), "Just don't buy it" is an entirely inadequate counterpoint to the complaint from someone that's invested in the game of "This is a shoddy move". I'd go as far as to say it's a super fething weak response tbh. (edit - this is if they add a few pages of exclusives to the book ofc. If they don't do that, I agree, the book is better than the cards, and if the entirety of the book is just what's been done with the cards, it's better for existing players to have the option).

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/10/17 21:49:55


 
   
Made in si
Steady Stonecleaver







Don't worry, I've promised myself never to pay GW for rules again.

Posters on ignore list: 33

40k Potica Edition - 40k patch with reactions, suppression and all that good stuff. Feedback thread here.

Gangs of Nu Ork - Necromunda / Gorkamorka expansion supporting all faction. Feedback thread here
   
Made in us
Owns Whole Set of Skullz Techpriests






Right behind you.

JWBS wrote:

Oh I'm 100% absolutely not going to buy it, just as with 90% of the other stuff they've released. The bands I did buy I bought for the models, since I don't play the games. Still, to any impartial observer (like myself), "Just don't buy it" is an entirely inadequate counterpoint to the complaint from someone that's invested in the game of "This is a shoddy move". I'd go as far as to say it's a super fething weak response tbh. (edit - this is if they add a few pages of exclusives to the book ofc. If they don't do that, I agree, the book is better than the cards, and if the entirety of the book is just what's been done with the cards, it's better for existing players to have the option).

Then what the hell is the point of you posting these hypotheticals?

People complained that there's too many 'sources' of rules. This alleviates that.

As long as the books aren't unreasonably priced, this isn't a huge deal to anyone but the "BUT GW!" crowd.
   
Made in gb
Battle-tested Knight Castellan Pilot





 Kanluwen wrote:
JWBS wrote:

Oh I'm 100% absolutely not going to buy it, just as with 90% of the other stuff they've released. The bands I did buy I bought for the models, since I don't play the games. Still, to any impartial observer (like myself), "Just don't buy it" is an entirely inadequate counterpoint to the complaint from someone that's invested in the game of "This is a shoddy move". I'd go as far as to say it's a super fething weak response tbh. (edit - this is if they add a few pages of exclusives to the book ofc. If they don't do that, I agree, the book is better than the cards, and if the entirety of the book is just what's been done with the cards, it's better for existing players to have the option).

Then what the hell is the point of you posting these hypotheticals?

People complained that there's too many 'sources' of rules. This alleviates that.

As long as the books aren't unreasonably priced, this isn't a huge deal to anyone but the "BUT GW!" crowd.

That's how these public forums for people chatting online work Bud. I can also go and give my views on the tax system in Bavaria somewhere if I so wish, despite not living in Bavaria or being beholden to Bavarian tax laws.
   
Made in us
Owns Whole Set of Skullz Techpriests






Right behind you.

So basically, you're gakposting. Got it.
   
Made in gb
Battle-tested Knight Castellan Pilot





Nah I'm just talking about GW products online with fellow enthusiasts. I'll be mindful in future to consider your superior approach though. I'm sure all 50k of your contributions over the years have been of a higher standard than my average and I'll try to aim higher.
   
Made in us
Owns Whole Set of Skullz Techpriests






Right behind you.

If I have nothing to add to a topic, I tend not to post in them. It took me awhile to learn but that's some free advice from a long-term poster.
   
Made in us
Humming Great Unclean One of Nurgle






I'm happy to see them. As someone with a smattering of different factions having to get card packs for all of them was not something I wanted to do. Plus there is the slim but possible chance they use the opportunity to rebalance some options, and the likelyhood of adding new ones.

I like that the various AoS factions are getting Warcry support, I would just prefer they take it slower so they have more time to balance things and add depth.

Consider; Games Workshop rules not so much games but as toolboxes for players to craft an experience from, and open/narrative/matched play just examples of how things can be put together. 
   
Made in tw
Longtime Dakkanaut





I hope those rules are basically just a stop-gap until a time when those factions get dedicated warbands.

Honestly, given how amazing the warcry models are in comparison to almost all regular AoS stuff, its just visually disappointing to see the stuff ported over from AoS on the table.

   
Made in us
Humming Great Unclean One of Nurgle






I totally get what you're talking about, but I also find it inspires people to convert and customize their miniatures since they need only a single squad each individual gets more love.

Consider; Games Workshop rules not so much games but as toolboxes for players to craft an experience from, and open/narrative/matched play just examples of how things can be put together. 
   
Made in gb
[DCM]
Battlefield Tourist





On an Express Elevator to Hell!!

Overread wrote:Every high fantasy setting I can think of still has regular troops with swords and such. Heck Malazan Book of the Fallen features large armies of regular troops. Heck look at 40K the average guardsman has a laser pointer to go to battle with and they use WW1 style tanks.

Also the more we see of the Shadow realm and Shadow armies (Morathi and hints at Malarion's) the more it seems that the Shadow Realm is the Realms "Demonic" realm. Allowing for demonic creatures of a realm that isn't from Chaos itself. Which is an itneresting take, but does fit as there's a realm of Light with angelic creatures and a realm of Death etc..


It might be just a personal thing then. It's funny I'm absolutely fine with the example of a 40k guardsman (although perhaps even that doesn't fit as well as it once did? The setting was much more mundane and low-fi originally and has gradually become more extravagant as time has gone on).

But, for me, the renaissance-era pikeman going up against something like the below, it makes it look like someone has plonked down miniatures from two different gaming systems (or I'm being half-arsed or trying to save money and just trying to use my historicals army for everything?)

Spoiler:



I was hoping that they would eventually move away from those old sculpts (you've blown up that world, people have burned their armies and hate you, move on) and come up with some 'standard' human that is more in keeping with the AoS world? I'm sure the designers would love to get their teeth into that and come up with concepts for it.

Epic 30K&40K! A new players guide, contributors welcome https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/751316.page
Small but perfectly formed! A Great Crusade Epic 6mm project: https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/694411.page
Excellent discussion forum & information collection for Epic and other small scale miniatures: http://www.tacticalwargames.net/taccmd/index.php
 
   
Made in us
Confessor Of Sins




 Pacific wrote:
Overread wrote:Every high fantasy setting I can think of still has regular troops with swords and such. Heck Malazan Book of the Fallen features large armies of regular troops. Heck look at 40K the average guardsman has a laser pointer to go to battle with and they use WW1 style tanks.

Also the more we see of the Shadow realm and Shadow armies (Morathi and hints at Malarion's) the more it seems that the Shadow Realm is the Realms "Demonic" realm. Allowing for demonic creatures of a realm that isn't from Chaos itself. Which is an itneresting take, but does fit as there's a realm of Light with angelic creatures and a realm of Death etc..


It might be just a personal thing then. It's funny I'm absolutely fine with the example of a 40k guardsman (although perhaps even that doesn't fit as well as it once did? The setting was much more mundane and low-fi originally and has gradually become more extravagant as time has gone on).

But, for me, the renaissance-era pikeman going up against something like the below, it makes it look like someone has plonked down miniatures from two different gaming systems (or I'm being half-arsed or trying to save money and just trying to use my historicals army for everything?)

Spoiler:



I was hoping that they would eventually move away from those old sculpts (you've blown up that world, people have burned their armies and hate you, move on) and come up with some 'standard' human that is more in keeping with the AoS world? I'm sure the designers would love to get their teeth into that and come up with concepts for it.


That doesn't really make any sense to me. Those are exactly the type of thing the renaissance era pikeman in Warhammer have been fighting for 30 years, just with better sculpts.

2500pts
2500
3000


 
   
Made in be
Longtime Dakkanaut





 Kanluwen wrote:

They didn't try to hide it. There's no "truth" to acknowledge, you're not deciphering the Da Vinci Code here.


The "problem" here is you deflecting all the time and not wanting to address the issue of our complaints. That's why I wrote this.


And contrary to people like yourself suggesting this isn't "worthy of a preview", this actually is notable in that it's happening and shows continued support for those factions that are currently locked in ePubs or card formats that aren't still sold.


That I aknowledge, but let's be honest : the bar is put really low if we're just glad to have this as a preview for Warcry, seriously.

Where are the true expansions, the new ways to play ? A new narrative, another place to discover ? Catacombs was at least showing a bit of that, but these books don't. So that we have this after Catacombs...you have to recognize it's a bit underwhelming, even for a Warcry hardcore fanboy.

It would have been more exciting to know more about what is coming next after Catacombs, not "here are profiles you already know to play your AoS factions in 4 books".


 NinthMusketeer wrote:

I like that the various AoS factions are getting Warcry support, I would just prefer they take it slower so they have more time to balance things and add depth.


Come on, Ninth, we already can play the various AoS factions in Warcry right now. These books change nothing about this, it's just a compilation. I'll remind you that the AoS Profiles are already put in the previous Tomes of Champion, with their personnal quests and background tables.

By the way, when they did, GW didn't rebalance the profiles at that time. Why would they do this for the new books ? Sure, we can wait and see, but I think having faith in something GW never did before is just asking for disappointment,

They'll just add new profiles for some missing fighters and monsters, put some new challenge battles and fated quests, and it'll be enough for them. Mind you, I don't believe it will fill more than 25% of the books' content. The rest will be just copy and paste.


In the end, these 4 books are the Tome of Champion 2020, if you think about it. They're just not named that way, and they're divided in 4. So you have to buy 4 books instead of 1 to have everything...

This message was edited 6 times. Last update was at 2020/10/18 10:32:10


 
   
Made in pl
Dakka Veteran




JWBS wrote:
Sarouan wrote:


They could have put the profiles in books from the beginning

And give you the book for free?

why not? Honestly, their business is selling you toy soldiers and accessories, they could afford to make all the rules free and still make hefty profit. I'm touched by how people look out for the corporations' best interests
   
Made in gb
[DCM]
Battlefield Tourist





On an Express Elevator to Hell!!

ERJAK wrote:
 Pacific wrote:
Overread wrote:Every high fantasy setting I can think of still has regular troops with swords and such. Heck Malazan Book of the Fallen features large armies of regular troops. Heck look at 40K the average guardsman has a laser pointer to go to battle with and they use WW1 style tanks.

Also the more we see of the Shadow realm and Shadow armies (Morathi and hints at Malarion's) the more it seems that the Shadow Realm is the Realms "Demonic" realm. Allowing for demonic creatures of a realm that isn't from Chaos itself. Which is an itneresting take, but does fit as there's a realm of Light with angelic creatures and a realm of Death etc..


It might be just a personal thing then. It's funny I'm absolutely fine with the example of a 40k guardsman (although perhaps even that doesn't fit as well as it once did? The setting was much more mundane and low-fi originally and has gradually become more extravagant as time has gone on).

But, for me, the renaissance-era pikeman going up against something like the below, it makes it look like someone has plonked down miniatures from two different gaming systems (or I'm being half-arsed or trying to save money and just trying to use my historicals army for everything?)

Spoiler:




I was hoping that they would eventually move away from those old sculpts (you've blown up that world, people have burned their armies and hate you, move on) and come up with some 'standard' human that is more in keeping with the AoS world? I'm sure the designers would love to get their teeth into that and come up with concepts for it.


That doesn't really make any sense to me. Those are exactly the type of thing the renaissance era pikeman in Warhammer have been fighting for 30 years, just with better sculpts.


There has been a massive change of concept and style between WHFB and AoS. Previously WHFB was rooted in low-fantasy, Tolkein-esque ranks of Elves, Dwarves and Orcs and Goblins which were fantastical but of a similar theme to the pikemen the were fighting against. You did have some far-out concepts in WHFB but for the most part they were based in a pseudo-historical format, compared to the fish-elves with flying sharks, bone people made of bone constructs, lizard people living within their own dream and other lunacy of AoS that you need to be on a cocktail of goblin mushrooms to fully appreciate.

Maybe they could mount these guys on flying carpets or horses with sheep heads or something and they might fit better, but for now it just looks like they are in some kind of horrible acid-trip nightmare and are probably crying as they poke their halberd at a flying turtle that has come to get them (it's actually a cow in a field)

Epic 30K&40K! A new players guide, contributors welcome https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/751316.page
Small but perfectly formed! A Great Crusade Epic 6mm project: https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/694411.page
Excellent discussion forum & information collection for Epic and other small scale miniatures: http://www.tacticalwargames.net/taccmd/index.php
 
   
Made in gb
Decrepit Dakkanaut




UK

Old World was very low magic Tolkien style on the tabletop for the main game. However at the same time you had Man O War; you had artwork showing huge airships and titanic weapons. You had stories where Chaos used demons and living siege towers; greater monsters and horrors and spells and all.

The disconnect was mostly because back in the days of metal GW couldn't make really big stuff - heck most of their dragons back them were very serpentine to cut down on body-size because, agian, you couldn't make a huge brick of a dragon out of metal and have people buy it.

AoS has taken some concepts to 11/ludicrous speed however when you look at the core compositions of most armies they are fairly "normal"

   
Made in gb
Battle-tested Knight Castellan Pilot





 Overread wrote:


AoS has taken some concepts to 11/ludicrous speed however when you look at the core compositions of most armies they are fairly "normal"

I disagree entirely with this tbh. Even the most basic of common or garden fantasy staples is amped up to 12 once it's been ported to AoS. Orcs (Orruks) encased head to toe in hugely oversized full body armour suits, Dwarves that literally eat burning embers. Not that I don't like it (I'm a fan of more conventional fantasy too but that has benn done then redone then redone again so many times now), but it's a very deliberate left turn towards something more bizarre and surreal and it shows very obviously.
   
Made in gb
Decrepit Dakkanaut




UK

And yet it you look at many armies they aren't that fantastical.

Ossiarchs go to war with spears and swords; Flesheaters are just ghouls who often have nothing but a bone club for a weapon; Lumineth are spears and hammers;


Orks had super thick armour in the Old World, heck its staple that your average ork is either almost naked save for scraps or is head to toe a mountain of metal. Dwarves are much the same.


All the free cities need is some enchanted +10 weapons to survive. Heck the vast multitude of Chaos warriors are going to war with your most basic of standard weapons (granted armies like the Unmade graft them to their very hands with barbed wire wrapping)

   
 
Forum Index » News & Rumors
Go to: