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Made in us
Snivelling Workbot





With the new Codex, 252 Leman Russ Load-outs are now possible. How should a Leman Russ be armed??


Here are my own thoughts:

Leman Russ Executioner [the oldest and rarest of the bunch, that should make them about as common as Space marines ]

This variant is going to be a top pick for dealing with MEQ infantry, and will also do a passable job on light vehicles. I really think this tank is just shouting out for the sponsons to also carry plasmas. Since this is mostly an anti infantry tank, I am going to say heavy bolter on the hull and a stubber on top. Also nice all weapons have the same range.


Leman Russ Punisher

This tank is all about volume of fire, so all the weapons should follow the theme. Hull and sponson heavy bolters, with a stubber on top.


Leman Russ Eradicator

No cover saves, (hah take that Marine, now you have to use your armor). At 6s - 4ap this is also an anti infantry tank. Going with the cover save theme, I am going to call Heavy flamers in the sponsons, and hull. A little more dakka can't hurt so a stubber on top.


Leman Russ Exterminator

I am going to call this like the punisher, and say the game is volume of fire. 3 bolters and a stubber.

The argument could be made that this is a tank for heavy infantry and light vehicles. If that is the role you want for this tank, then upgrade the sponsons to plasma.


Leman Russ Vanquisher

This is a Tank Killer pure and simple. Lascannon in the hull. This is all the tank needs, but if you must spend the points to pimp you ride, then Multi Meltas on the side.


Leman Russ Demolisher

The power of this tank's main weapon means it can kill anything, trouble is it has to be up close. I am going to keep mine with an up close theme with heavy flamers in the sponsons and hull, and a storm bolter on top.


Plain old Vanilla Leman Russ

The battle cannon is a versatile weapon with a good range, the question is how to compliment it. Compared to the other tanks, this son of Russ does not excell at any one role so I think Lascannon in the hull, bolters on the sides, and a stubber up top keeps with the multi role theme.


How do you like your Leman??

 
   
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SoCal, USA!

Sponsons are now horribly overpriced except for static use. Even then, all guns need to fire at the same target, and all Sponsons are S5+, so don't count as Defensive Weapons, so...
- Demolisher with Hull HB, no sponsons (x3)
- basic Russ with Hull HB, no sponsons (x2)

This keeps the points cost down and improves target saturation by having more AV14 gun platforms.


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Kansas

thank you for all the tips! And for Vanquishers, I would think Plasma spons would complement it the best. AP2 on all weapons, with a pyramid-like of S for the weapons (S7 AP2, S8 AP2, S9 AP2)


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I suspect heavy flamer sponsons are a distinct waste of time in games, except for CoD ones. High risk of getting melta'd, or assaulted by powerfists, krak grenades, and melta bombs. S6 kraks are still a threat with rear armor hits, even the 11 rear ones. If you could have flamed a target, you'd often be better off backing up. A single hull one for tank shock attacks once you've lost your turret could be appealing.

Pask in an Executioner with plasma sponsons would be hilariously lethal ... but more effective than 2 bare bones Russes?

The Exterminator and the Punisher would benefit the most from sponsons, as the HB set isn't that expensive and the weapons compliment well. Not so sure I'd bother with sponsons elsewhere. Time to magnetize!



   
Made in ca
Graham McNeil





North of you!

Umm i though you couldn't get heavy flamer sponsons anymore under the codex Please correct me if i am mistaken, i don't have the 'dex yet, my store hasn't received them yet for some reason.

I run my vanilla leman russ tanks with 3x Heavy Bolters, in a squadron of 3 there my horde killers, pick a squad, 3 templates +27 hvy bolter shots (if i stay still)

Along with 3 other leman russ tanks in various formations, don't we all love AV14 front spam. I always wanted to do this under the old dex and now i can!

My rundown of the tanks:
Vanilla Russ:
3x hvy bolters or Hull hvy bolter
Vanquisher
Hull Lascannon(a must!!!!) maybe Plasma (if you have pask); Melta is too short range for this tank
Demolisher
Plasma if your running a gunline, otherwise naked with hull hvybolter
Punisher
Naked or hvy bolters
Exterminator
Hvy bolter is probably a must
Excecutioner
PLASMA all the way baby
Eradicator
Loaded out with heavy bolters (for gunline) or Heavy Flamer (with nothing else, maybe stubber?)

Tell me if i have missed any.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2009/05/08 01:20:38


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Terrax wrote:With the new Codex, 252 Leman Russ Load-outs are now possible.


And I think we'd be lucky players if even 5% of that number were useful...

Terrax wrote:Leman Russ Punisher
This tank is all about volume of fire, so all the weapons should follow the theme. Hull and sponson heavy bolters, with a stubber on top.


Assuming you actually ever bring one. It's 24" range weaksauce cannon combined with its stupidly high points cost makes this tank a liability, not an infantry killer. Stick to the Eradicator.


Terrax wrote:Leman Russ Eradicator
No cover saves, (hah take that Marine, now you have to use your armor). At 6s - 4ap this is also an anti infantry tank. Going with the cover save theme, I am going to call Heavy flamers in the sponsons, and hull. A little more dakka can't hurt so a stubber on top.


Do tell Terrax how you intend to fire all three heavy flamers at once, at the same target? You are aware that Russ Sponsons have trouble firing at things in their front arc when they're very close, making the use of two heavy flamers virtually impossible? And why would you want to send this tank into charge range, negating its heavy armour? 3 Heavy Bolters. It sits at 36" and does its job. It doesn't try to spam flamers and get itself killed.


Terrax wrote:Leman Russ Exterminator
I am going to call this like the punisher, and say the game is volume of fire. 3 bolters and a stubber.


And it's going to be a damn-sight more effective than the pathetic Punisher.

Terrax wrote:Leman Russ Vanquisher
This is a Tank Killer pure and simple. Lascannon in the hull. This is all the tank needs, but if you must spend the points to pimp you ride, then Multi Meltas on the side.


Assuming you ever bring a Vanquisher that is. In 6 turns 3 of its shots will hit, 1.5 of those will be ignored by whatever cover the enemy tank is in, and then you'll get slightly more than 1 damaging hit, none of which are going to score a 5 or 6 on the damage chart. The Vanquisher is a waste of time.


Terrax wrote:Leman Russ Demolisher
The power of this tank's main weapon means it can kill anything, trouble is it has to be up close. I am going to keep mine with an up close theme with heavy flamers in the sponsons and hull, and a storm bolter on top.


Again, the Heavy Flamers can't be used at the same time do to fire-arcs and how spread apart they are, meaning you're only ever going to be using one. And why bring a Storm Bolter when the Stubber has +1 shot and +12" of range? The new Codex hasn't changed the role of the Demolisher in the slightest - it is an area denial weapon, something to park next to an objective, in cover, and goad your enemy into closing. To that end it needs weapons that allow it to cause damage while people try to avoid its 24" zone of death. For this it either needs Lascannon/2 Plasma Cannons, Heavy Bolter/2 Plasma Cannons (+and/or a Stubber) or 3 Heavy Bolters (+and a Stubber). It sits still, it blazes away at the things avoiding it, and then annihilates whatever gets near.

Terrax wrote:Plain old Vanilla Leman Russ
The battle cannon is a versatile weapon with a good range, the question is how to compliment it. Compared to the other tanks, this son of Russ does not excell at any one role so I think Lascannon in the hull, bolters on the sides, and a stubber up top keeps with the multi role theme.


Like with the Demolisher, the new Guard Codex hasn't suddenly altered the way most things are used, nor has it altered the game rules that govern how vehicles work. 40K is a game of 6 turns, giving each unit 6 turns to make their mark. There are very few units that can do everything and be effective or useful in 6 turns, so that means that most units have to specialise. This has been the case with the Russ for the past decade, and it's not about to change now. The Lascannon always has been and always will be a complete and utter waste. It does not gel with any weapons on the standard Russ, and as you can't fire it at a different target to the rest of the guns, there is simply no point in ever taking it (unless paired with twin Plasma Cannons and you're going Terminator Hunting). If you want a Russ to be all it can be, a trio of Heavy Bolters and maybe a Stubber. It is an anti-infantry tank, and always has been, so stop trying to shoe-horn it into a 'versitile' role, something it simply hasn't got the time to do.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2009/05/08 03:03:03


   
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Fantastic thanks everyone for your thoughts!!

I have never considered using flamer Sponsons in the past, nor had I seen anyone do so. In the good old days when all we had were Regular LRs and Demolishers, only the demolisher could mount flame sponsons. I never liked or used demolishers, so I never considered the flame sponson. Had I done so I probably would have realized before now that they would have inherent problems with aiming. With this and the other points made put in consideration, I think it is safe to say that flame sponsons are never a good idea.

That being said I would like to clarify a few things as well as expound on some new points.

1. My intent was to spark discussion on arming LR Tanks that anyone reading or posting could learn from, which I think so far has been at least somewhat successful.

2. It was not my intent to imply that all the new variants were practical or worth the points cost.

3. When talking about tanks, and think there are 2 gameplay factors for each tank: Coolness, and Function

Coolness is the core of fluffy armies, and often the bane of the Guard player who junks up his army with lots of useless points in wargear and crap units. It is the stuff we have in our army because we love it, not because it works. Coolness is often also objective, so what we think is really neat someone else is going to be sure to think it is stupid.

Function is what the unit is actually able to accomplish in a game.




Lets examine are tanks again using these 2 points of view

Executioner

Coolness- to me this plasma spamming tank is super damn sexy cool, I love it

Function - I think the tank would be effective in play, but I really question the point cost. I would play it because I love it, but I don't think it is the most cost effecive decision.

I will stand by my original plasma/bolter/stubber/loadout if for no other reason than I am high on plasma



Punsiher

Coolness - the idea of this tank is cool, but the application is lacking, I would never build it or use it

Function - I never used Demolishers because I never wanted my tank to have to be inside of 24" to be able to work. Short ranged, low powered, no AP, and expensive = do not play

If you must play this I stand by the 3x HB/stubber loadout


Demolisher

Coolness - Like I said, this tank never appealed to me. The idea of a 10/2 gun is cool, but I could never get myself past the 24" to want to play it

Function - my thanks to H.M.B.C. for explaining this, I never understood it.

The new Codex hasn't changed the role of the Demolisher in the slightest - it is an area denial weapon, something to park next to an objective, in cover, and goad your enemy into closing. To that end it needs weapons that allow it to cause damage while people try to avoid its 24" zone of death. For this it either needs Lascannon/2 Plasma Cannons, Heavy Bolter/2 Plasma Cannons (+and/or a Stubber) or 3 Heavy Bolters (+and a Stubber). It sits still, it blazes away at the things avoiding it, and then annihilates whatever gets near.




Eradicator

Coolness - the idea of a gun that ignores cover saves is awesome BUT

Function - The 6-4 stats of this gun means MEQ armies will still get the armor save, so this tank is only useful against non MEQ armies. If you know you will be fighting a less than MEQ army then this is a great tank, otherwise its a big waste.

I will revise my loadout to 3xHB and a stub I would consider building and using this tank for known less than MEQ opponents


Vanquisher

Coolness - I love the idea of this tank, and if they offer a non forge world set I will probalby build one

Function - Unfortunately due to the cruelty of mathematics and statistics H.M.B.C. is once again right on the money. You will not get enough damage out of this tank to ever make it worth its points

I stand by the Hull LasCannon, but you should not play this tank
(This tank should have Sponson LasCannons, if only we could steal them from the Predator when the SMs aren't looking)



Exterminator

Coolness - I think this is a neat tank, and would definitely consider getting one

Function - Actually this seams to be on of the most functional of the family. heavy 4 twin linked will ensure a lot of hits. Combine with 3 x bolter and stubber and aim at those annoying squads.



Leman Russ

Coolness - Come on, it's the original, you have to love it

Function - Yes H.M.B.C. is right again as usual this is a tank best at tearing into infantry. I still call it versatile for a few reasons. 72" range will reach out and touch most anything, if you need to. 8/3 ordnance is plenty heavy enough to be a threat to heavy vehicles, even if you do not shoot at them. I suppose it is not an efficient use of points, but I feel having the Lascannon broadens the perceived threat range my opponent feels, and makes him less sure about what I am going to do with it. That's a good thing in my book.

Once I get over my plasma lust, at the end of the day points cost and effectiveness I think the original is still the best

Functional Loadout goes to H.M.B.C with 3xHB






All said out of 252 loadouts, there are only 4 that I would play actively

LR LC/HB/HB/St
LR HB/HB/HB/St
LR Ext HB/HB/HB/St
LR Exe PC/PC/HB/St

and in reserve

LR Era HB/HB/HB/St

only if I knew opponent was less than MEQ

Looks like 5% may be too generous


 
   
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Regular Dakkanaut





San Francisco

I'm not sure why it's necessary to devise the ultimate load out for all of the Leman Russ variants, since only three of those variants are ever worth taking.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2009/05/09 01:34:26


 
   
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Right. Space Marines hate nothing more than being hit by a AP 4 weapon that does not allow them to take cover saves.


That's the point of Sarcasm

I'm not sure why it's necessary to devise the ultimate load out for all of the Leman Russ variants, since only three of those variants are ever worth taking.


The point is to discuss it because that is what you do in a forum

The point is that even though most of the tanks are not worth taking, people are going to take them anyway, because that is what people do.

The point is to have Guard players hear various points of view and hopefully make better choices because of it

The point is to have fun

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2009/05/09 01:53:01


 
   
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Terrax, I am sorry that you are getting so much grief about this topic.

I understand what you are doing, and thank you for doing it.

I will refrain from commenting, because I do not yet have the new codex. Next week, my friends . . . I will finally have one next week.

Oh yea, Terrax, you really have to try the Demolisher. It is a great tank. MEQ really hate it.

Our local Marine players hate to deepstrike terminators when they are playing me. They know that I am going to plant my Demolisher as close to the middle of the table as possible, so that the D cannon has command of a maximum amount of the table. Also, you would be surprised how helpful the rear AV of 11 is. It puts the tank just out of reach of all those pesky glance-on-a-six attacks people are always trying to do to the rear of your tanks.

Well, I guess that counts as a comment.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2009/05/09 03:52:08



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HBMC is dead on, in all of his comments. The real question is why would you take anything other than

Standard Russ
Executioner
Demolisher

And what do they all have in common boys and girls? ap3 or better.
   
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To be honest, I am still debating what to bring in my Leman Russ's. I know that most of my AP dakka will be covered with the valkyries, (and a Manticore), but the question remains what to do about the 2nd russ. (1st will always be a Demolisher. That thing is just MEAN.)
   
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SoCal, USA!

@Liquidwulfe:

If you have 1 Demolisher, it doesn't hurt to take a second. Or a third. Multiple S10 AP2 plates is scary evil.

After that, a Basilisk and/or basic Russ isn't a bad idea to poke at stuff hiding in the far corners of the board.

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I'm in the Standard/Executioner/Demolisher camp for the most part. Some of the other builds are decent, just not as good as those three.

You also want to avoid fielding white Russes after Labour day, and the tracks should never be painted to match the hull.

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foil7102 wrote:HBMC is dead on, in all of his comments. The real question is why would you take anything other than

Standard Russ
Executioner
Demolisher

And what do they all have in common boys and girls? ap3 or better.


None of it can easily stop 2+ cover-save troops. There are quite a few varients out there now. 2+, even in small elitey units, will laugh off disproportional amounts of firepower. Mobile troops need to be given meltas, not flamers, most of the time. If you do have a chimera spam army with lotsa hull.h.flamers then perhaps this could negate the need for an eradicator.
& Troops in general.. large hordey armies that rely on generally always getting cover (through various means) means, even with all those ap 2/3/4 weapons.. grinding through alot of infantry with 4+cover saves is arduous. Pointing at a unit & making most of that unit go away in one fell swoop will not only make your life easy but force the other guy to play more defenseively or focous on your eradicator (which is fine, as there are lots more weaker bits in my army!)

Demolisher - Meduas does its job & does it better. Yes its weaker. Its specialising.

Executioner - /lovesauce.


 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Friend of mine just sent me this:

"The Tyranid Codex, where I learned the truth about despair, as will you. There's a reason why this codex is the worst hell on earth... Hope. Every man who has ventured here over the decades has looked up to the light and imagined climbing to competitiveness. So easy... So simple... And like shipwrecked men turning to sea water from uncontrollable thirst, many have been fired trying. I learned here that there can be no true despair without hope. So, as I terrorize 40k fans, I will feed its people hope to poison their souls. I will let them believe they can survive so that you can watch them clamouring over each other to "stay in the sun." You can watch me torture an entire fan base and when you have truly understood the depth of your failure, we will fulfil Kirby's destiny... We will destroy 40k and then, when it is done and 40k is ashes, then you have my permission to buy."

Heh.
 
   
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However, giving a Platoon command squad (BS3) full flamers and loading them up in a chimera is not exactly a bad thing.
   
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Liquidwulfe wrote:However, giving a Platoon command squad (BS3) full flamers and loading them up in a chimera is not exactly a bad thing.


Mm indeed. Loading them into an anti-tank vendetta is even better! The best use for the essentailly useless PCS's.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Friend of mine just sent me this:

"The Tyranid Codex, where I learned the truth about despair, as will you. There's a reason why this codex is the worst hell on earth... Hope. Every man who has ventured here over the decades has looked up to the light and imagined climbing to competitiveness. So easy... So simple... And like shipwrecked men turning to sea water from uncontrollable thirst, many have been fired trying. I learned here that there can be no true despair without hope. So, as I terrorize 40k fans, I will feed its people hope to poison their souls. I will let them believe they can survive so that you can watch them clamouring over each other to "stay in the sun." You can watch me torture an entire fan base and when you have truly understood the depth of your failure, we will fulfil Kirby's destiny... We will destroy 40k and then, when it is done and 40k is ashes, then you have my permission to buy."

Heh.
 
   
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San Francisco

Terrax wrote:The point is to discuss it because that is what you do in a forum

The point is that even though most of the tanks are not worth taking, people are going to take them anyway, because that is what people do.

The point is to have Guard players hear various points of view and hopefully make better choices because of it

The point is to have fun

I recently witnessed an IG vs. SM match-up where both players knew their opponent's list ahead of time, and tooled up accordingly. The IG player showed up, reached into his massive box of tanks, and pulled out Exterminators. He was tabled by turn 4. As an IG fan, that makes me sad. Popular armies get more support from GW, and uncompetitive armies tend to be less popular.

I'm not trying to destroy your fun, but I think there's something dubious about creating a long and detailed write-up about the best load out for a unit without ever asking the question "is this unit any good?" A lot of players are currently experiencing Guard for the first time, or at least the first time in 5th Ed. And they're making some very bad decisions, which are distorting their perception of the Codex. The point of a tactics forum is to try and improve their level of play, not to encourage them to make poor choices, become disillusioned, and quit the army.

   
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I'm not trying to destroy your fun, but I think there's something dubious about creating a long and detailed write-up about the best load out for a unit without ever asking the question "is this unit any good?" A lot of players are currently experiencing Guard for the first time, or at least the first time in 5th Ed. And they're making some very bad decisions, which are distorting their perception of the Codex. The point of a tactics forum is to try and improve their level of play, not to encourage them to make poor choices, become disillusioned, and quit the army.


That is perfect, please detail what you recommend and why. Tanks are a great allure for many players of this game. With so many choices possible now, many people will make bad decisions because they are so excited to play with the shiny new versions. I do not disagree with your point of view, but I wish you would structure your comments to benefit those who are reading so they can use them to make the better choices, and improve their level of play. I do not consider myself any great expert, and I started this thread for my own learning benefit, as well of others who read. Even with my limited experience, I have read many IG army lists on these forums that even I could clearly see were filled with hundreds of points of useless units and wargear. If it is in the Codex, someone somewhere who does not know any better is going to try to put it in their army. If you are willing, please detail your picks, and upgrades, comment as to why those are your picks, and if you want comment on why the other choices are not worth the bother.

 
   
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Razerous wrote:None of it can easily stop 2+ cover-save troops.

Demolisher - Meduas does its job & does it better.

Executioner - /lovesauce.

That is why the IG have Hellhounds - ranged S6 AP4 flamers will beat 2+ coversave troops.

How does an AV12 OT Medusa drive right into the enemy's teeth without flinching? A Demolisher uses its AV14/13/11 to spearhead the Guard advance. It's the only Tank with sufficient toughness and firepower to be consistently good at actively taking the fight directly to the enemy.

If this weren't so horribly overpriced, I'd field one. But with the requisite Plasma sponsons, we're approaching Land Raider cost. And once you add the sponsons, you're giving up at least one good shot when you advance.

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Dominar






The only Leman Russ variant that is needed is the plasma executioner, with or without plasma sponsons.

No other tank comes even close to killing troops like the Executioner, regardless of 4+ cover saves.

How does an AV12 OT Medusa drive right into the enemy's teeth without flinching? A Demolisher uses its AV14/13/11 to spearhead the Guard advance. It's the only Tank with sufficient toughness and firepower to be consistently good at actively taking the fight directly to the enemy.


It doesn't have to. It sits behind a low wall and uses its far longer range and specialized ammo to crack AVwhatever open with impunity. And if you invest in bunker busters. It'll even kill AV11-12 with regularity if the hole scatters off, and has a chance at 13-14.

Also, a Demolisher can't drive into an enemy's teeth without flinching. It just dies to melta. Imperial Guard aren't meant to advance until they've shot most of their opponent off of the board. Treating them like some sort of armored spearhead assault formation is just going to get them dead faster.
   
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Razerous wrote:
Liquidwulfe wrote:However, giving a Platoon command squad (BS3) full flamers and loading them up in a chimera is not exactly a bad thing.


Mm indeed. Loading them into an anti-tank vendetta is even better! The best use for the essentailly useless PCS's.


I think "useless" is a little harsh

They're a 30pt scoring unit that can give an order (great for following infantry around giving FRFSRF! when needed).

But yeah, load them up with flamers and stick them in a chimera, BURN THEM ALL!!

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An Executioner is 33% better than a basic Russ, to match the points increase? And better than anything else?

Could you back that up? I'd like to believe it, so I can use the Executioner turrets I've had for the last 4 years, but ....

( A deluge of math is fine for this)

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2009/05/10 21:07:16


 
   
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Dominar






There's really no good way to mathematically express the carnage an executioner can cause because the number of models hit by the template is variable.

However, let's try to quantify it:

Let's say we're shooting at a really tempting target: 10 marines in the outline of their exploded rhino. A normal Leman Russ could, at a maximum, hit 10. If they scatter too far, they could hit as few as zero. One main template weapon is sort of an all-or-nothing proposition.

A fully decked plasma executioner could hit 7 or more with a direct hit, and again 0 with a scatter, but on average you'll get at least one direct hit. So that's a minimum of 7 hits, maximum of 35 hits.

You can see how the larger number of blasts, even though they're smaller, pile up quickly. And their ability to overlap creates far greater potential for mayhem than even a direct hit from something like a Demolisher.

From personal experience, if I shoot my executioner at a squad, I fully expect 2/3 of whatever I shoot it at to die, if it's in cover. If it's not in cover, just take it off the board because it's dead.

I strongly recommend anyone questioning whether or not the executioner is worth it to give it a try; I did and it's worth every point.
   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran




Hmm. Do you Pask one of them or not? It seems like an Executioner would be one of the better tanks for him.
   
Made in us
Dominar






Pask is a waste of points. That's my opinion, at least.
   
Made in gb
Regular Dakkanaut




Wales,UK

I swear by my executioner with naked leman russ sidekick, attracts so much AT fire which is pretty easy to avoid (hide one behind cover, AV 14 and putting most of the hits on the spare Russ until it dies horribly.) which leaves the rest of the tanks to do their job.

I don't think pask is worth it at all, hes expensive and will most likely die to some cheeky melta gun. If you do take him you would have to take lots of sponsors to make use of his rule and have a spare russ to shield him imo.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2009/05/10 22:33:11


 
   
Made in gb
Huge Hierodule



UK

JohnHwangDD wrote:
That is why the IG have Hellhounds - ranged S6 AP4 flamers will beat 2+ coversave troops.


Ah, painfully weak range.. even if it is awesomely better than standard templates. Mounted on a mediocre AV12/12/10 platform means it doesnt actually live all that long to deliver death to infantry & that close (but yes a bit longer) range means it comes within range of small arms fire. Ive seen too many a serpent get stunned by things like rail rifles & the like.

Being able to bombard infantry from non-infantry ranges aswell as investing in some tough armor that isnt exactly a death weapon (while useful, it wont deal with heavy infantry nor armor well at all meaning its ignorable. Good for me.)

All this talk of sponsons. Lumbering Bee baby! Plus im of the opinion of hull before sponsons. Meaning id prefer to beef out on actual leman russ chassis before I start adding sponsons (Although this way of thinking could be the only real weakness in my current 1500pt IG list)

Oh & the executoiner is also an AV11 rear armor vehicle.. meaning it can basically ignore most infantry assaults. No sponsons means you can keep it moving meaning you will need a good amount of str 5+ attacks to do anything. Its also longer ranged meaning it can avoid certain types of firepower & remain effective (multi-melta on an attack bike for example) & again its not an everything weapon. A properly devised list will have an anti-armor component (and anti light-troop) so destroying the LRexec doesnt remove an overiding threat, merely a facet.

My problem with the (not actually competely) useless PCS is its size. I view 5 imperial guardsmen as a complete & utter liability rather than somthing I can rely on to give orders to anything. Scoring is good, though.

@Sourclams - Scattered bastion breachers. Still effective. Genious! Ofcourse, Thanks. /more lovesauce. As for killing troops.. the executioner will be completely wasted trying to shoot at troops with somthing like a 3+ cover-save. Granted, yes 4+ cover allows the amount hits you can score with this weapon to translate to a reasonable amount of wounds but its a fine line. I see far too many armies lynch pinning around infantry with amazing cover.

About the meduas - 15pts is very worth investement - Enclosed crew compartement. Partially flanked by troop-supporting chimera/s & its as safe as it can be, bar upgrades.

- I have fun coming up with and playing (and bonding ) with a list that can take on all comers. I hate the idea of custom building an army to counter a specific race or even a specific theme. Nearly every army can do this well. Hence theres no challenge.
I have been up about 18 hours after 4hrs sleep (damn you Zombies vs plants, Damn yoou ) so I apologise for the rant in all its ranty goodness.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Friend of mine just sent me this:

"The Tyranid Codex, where I learned the truth about despair, as will you. There's a reason why this codex is the worst hell on earth... Hope. Every man who has ventured here over the decades has looked up to the light and imagined climbing to competitiveness. So easy... So simple... And like shipwrecked men turning to sea water from uncontrollable thirst, many have been fired trying. I learned here that there can be no true despair without hope. So, as I terrorize 40k fans, I will feed its people hope to poison their souls. I will let them believe they can survive so that you can watch them clamouring over each other to "stay in the sun." You can watch me torture an entire fan base and when you have truly understood the depth of your failure, we will fulfil Kirby's destiny... We will destroy 40k and then, when it is done and 40k is ashes, then you have my permission to buy."

Heh.
 
   
Made in gb
Regular Dakkanaut




Wales,UK

Enclosed crew compartment medusas with bastion shells are indeed winsauce :]..I want to try out a manticore though since its similar points however im a little wary of leaving my AT to a devil dog + vendetta (and melta guns, but they always miss anyway)..I'm actually thinking of dropping the devil dog for something else because of how good the medusa is at cracking tanks but cant think of anything to include in 1500 apart from another vendetta....

Also part of the 'no leman russ sponsors for me' club, plasma ones are nice but just too expensive at 1500.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2009/05/10 22:58:44


 
   
 
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