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JohnHwangDD wrote:

BaronIveagh wrote:Put their name in the paper in a negative light.

Some opportunistic public parasite or other will try to snap up what he perceives as an easy way to gain votes. Get him talking about regulating their business.

Too bad nobody reads newspapers anymore...

More government regulation? HELL, NO. I'd rather GW drove every other manufacturer into bankruptcy with a perpetual, Disneyean non-compete guarantee than have an even larger government bureaucracy managing my hobby!

Ah, you misinterpret: The objective is not to get any actual government regulation past, it's to bombard people with the idea that it might happen and that it's a good thing. If enough of the right people start talking about GW in a negative light, their stocks value drops, which causes the investors to demand action and puts heat on corporate execs. Though if a government audit was to find malfeasance, well, so much the better. If you happen to load the information the public is exposed to in the right manner, the execs have no choice but to bow to pressure or loose their seats on the board.

I think that presumes that a sufficiently large portion of the stock is not held by GW Management. If a controlling portion is held by Kirby & co, they won't do anything more than what has already been done.

Tho, it would be amusing if the thing backfired and GW ended up being shuttered as a result...

LOL If it did, I'd be there to bid on their IP when it went up for auction.

And even if they do, I would hope, at least, they would have the brains to give. We all know they lack media savvy to fight such a campaign.

BaronIveagh wrote:LOL If it did, I'd be there to bid on their IP when it went up for auction.

It would never get that far. If for some reason GW went under, another company would approach them and offer to buy it. See Wizards of the Coast (regarding both the buying of TSR and being bought by Hasbro), Wizkids(bought by Topps), and Rackham for examples.

The things I find funniest about this whole thread is the fact that no-one actually knows what they're boycotting GW for.

If you intend to hold a protest, you need a series of proposals or demands worked out beforehand that you want the company to meet. Instead, this entire thing is just a general rant against Games Workshop. It has no productive aims or goals. It's only objective is to 'make GW aware that they won't get away with XYZ'. Sorry, but they already did. And the fact that you're not clear exactly what you're boycotting for doesn't help.

Allow me to lay out my personal fictitous crusade against GW. The key is combine realism with efficency, reasonableness and attainable goals.
The first step is lay out exactly what me and my group of misguided followers want. Saying, 'charge less for models', would be foolish, as they are ultimately a company. So, for this imaginary campaign, I settle on the following objectives:-

-Renewal of Support for the Lost and Damned army in either a codex or a white dwarf article.
-A set of solid FAQs and errata that are updated regularly.
-Updating the Dark Eldar Codex.

Okay, we have our 3 aims. What's the next step? To make ourselves heard. It's no good complaining to a grunt, we want the people who make the decisions to hear about this. The internet will not be our primary medium for this, as GW tends to ignore it. We have the upcoming season of December, in which little Timmys will be ordering presents in their millions. Our job is to infiltrate our demands into this constant flow to Games Workshop.

So we pick a date, say from the 1st Dec to 14th, a two week period. Up until this point we just acquire support from people prepared to follow our initiative. We start threads on all the major forums, and get people to commit themselves to it. Not only that, we ask for all the forumgoers to get their friends in on it in order to increase the pressure. As we want this to be a global thing, several co-ordinators in various countries would take charge for different timezones. Then here's what we do.

The Co-ordinator allocates people to different days. Say he has 84 people who have pledged their support in his locale. He divides it by 14, getting six people per day. He then messages each person what them/their groups day is. On their predetermined day, each person physically writes a letter to Games Workshop, putting it in 1st Class, in which he outlines one or more of the above demands. All the letters should be reasonable, and point out why they would like to see the objectives they've picked enacted. The co-ordinator can, if they desire, write a template for people to use. Then, having posted their letter, they should also Email a copy of their letter to Games Workshop. If the co-ordinators can track down the appropriate phone numbers, they should distribute them to the various people, who can then also make a call that day, again outlining their letter.

At the end of the two week period, all of the participants will put their names to a petition that the co-ordinator will then send to Games Workshop. This is to re-enforce the point that has already been made.

Further action can then be decided at that point, depending on the response given by GW. The fact is, bombardment of two or three repeated demands from several nations is most likely to filter through to the upper echelons. Not only that, but not only will the news of all the messages get through, the petition is excellent evidence to be presented to the board members when they ask whether there actually is support enough for such changes for them to be financially viable.

Most GW customer feedback is given from garbled accounts given by redshirts. Consumer-led feedback on this scale would make any company sit up and take notice. The key is to be clear about exactly what you want, reasonable enough not to expect the impossible or financially unviable, and organised enough to ensure that what you want is driven home and cannot be ignored as one isolated petty customer.


This is how I would personally organise a campaign for changes with Games Workshop. It's infinitely more likely to succeed than something like this thread. And even if it didn't, you'd have the necessary framework in place to begin a more concerted pressure campaign through the use of bad publicity for GW, protests, boycotts, etc.

My crusade against GW stands until I recieve an unmarked package, 8"x10" filled to the brim with Elysians, Valkyries, and Ork bodies for the bases.

MY DEMANDS ARE NONNEGOTIABLE, HEATHENS!

#1: Don't you belittle my wish for lower prices! You may have money to wipe your butt with but not me.
#2: I want a ruleset that doesn't make me grit my teeth with its obvious stupidity.
#3: I want a 15MM version of the game, so that the weapon ranges aren't so absurd compared to the miniature scale, and everything can be true-scaled.

And yes, these demands are non-negotiable!!!

This is awesome, let's all come up with a list of 3 demands, none of which may repeat any previous list fo 3 demands.

My 3 demands:
1. Warhammer Armies: Dogs of War (for WFB 8)
2. Warhammer Armies: Chaos Dwarfs (for WFB 8)
3. Replace WFB VPs with modified KPs

Next!

I won't stop, I just won't buy what they'd want me to.

Hedwerx wrote:Actually DC are pretty easygoing with their IP.

I disagree. A friend of mine opened a downtown nightclub she called, 'Club Gotham'. DC was all over her ass like white on rice when she opened. They sued her for royalties.



Ghidorah

RogueMarket wrote:Its time to go Privateer Press.

Support the coming up company.

eh, i'd rather go and support mantic games, cheaper mini's. besides that awesome packaging and some pretty good metals help.

Ghidorah wrote:

Hedwerx wrote:Actually DC are pretty easygoing with their IP.

I disagree. A friend of mine opened a downtown nightclub she called, 'Club Gotham'. DC was all over her ass like white on rice when she opened. They sued her for royalties.
Ghidorah

They wouldn't have a strong case:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gotham
fairly widely used word.

Well, she used a batman logo in the sign, too. Well, not the EXACT logo, but close enough that you could tell what it was and what it was referring to. She had to either change her logo or pay some inordinate amount to DC. To be honest, I don't know the details of the legal bits. I really only know about how awesome she looked in leather, dressed as Catwoman for Halloween...

She changed the logo and, after a few years, the bar's name.



Ghidorah

Ketara wrote:The things I find funniest about this whole thread is the fact that no-one actually knows what they're boycotting GW for.

If you intend to hold a protest, you need a series of proposals or demands worked out beforehand that you want the company to meet. Instead, this entire thing is just a general rant against Games Workshop. It has no productive aims or goals. It's only objective is to 'make GW aware that they won't get away with XYZ'. Sorry, but they already did. And the fact that you're not clear exactly what you're boycotting for doesn't help.

Allow me to lay out my personal fictitous crusade against GW.

No one actually knows what they're boycotting GW for? Really? wow I dont know what I'm doing? Others just go with the flow and have no clue about all this? Glad you are here to clear all that for us. Thanks you mate we would be lost without your guidance.

I have clear goals of supporting heavy the competition, in the form of buying their products with the money planned for GW, give exposure to them on the forums in the form of reviews etc and to sculpt for companies labeled like parasites... I hope their sales skyrocket.

My objective is not that GW notice me or my actions or my boycott my objective is to take my business elsewere these months, and support competition... I'm happy if competition gets some extra cash because THEY will notice for sure and my money will be used well, in consequence i feel better about all this strangulation GW giving to HOBBY comunities.

Sure lay your personal personal fictitous crusade against GW and let me put in practice my personal nonfictitous crusade against GW the way i want it.

I said pretty easygoing, not completely apathetic.

The comment was about supporting their fans, which the second line alluded to. Not allowing businesses to make money off their ideas.

Deadshane1 I've been a long time lurker, and I just joined today to tell you that i'm supporting the Boycott, and I've already posted two threads with your original idea in the B&C and Rogue-market.

I hope we can accomplih something.

I also sent GW a formal letter

Let the boycott beginnn

I composed this letter to send to them, feel free to give input and your own additions and maybe build of Shane's idea.

Title: Business practices and attitude to fanbase

Due to price increases, poorer quality miniatures and ignoring of the customer's input on produts and matters of rules and inconsistency of codexes,

I will be boycotting your product for the minimum of 2 months. Between November and December.

I, Adrian Ruiz.

I am not alone in this, already players across the world are preparing to send GW headquarters the message that we need to be addressed and not dismissed.

This is not a message to any worker in particular, this is to be forwarded sincerely to the shareholders and higher-ups.

I can't believe it has come to a matter of boycotting, but your company has been hiking prices unnecessarily and ignoring fan input while not addressing problems within the balance of codexes.

As a fan and consumer of your products I don't demand that you listen to me, but it pains me that the only way to get through to the decision makers is denying purchase of GW products.

I just want to have my opinion be accounted and my input noted, after all our (The fans) purchases are what keep the games workshop business alive.

I implore you all, be more receptive to us. We have been here as long as the company and it has taken several turns I didn't like but respected, but it's gone too far especially in this economic turmoil.

We also have a right to quality products, as a consumer. Which pertains to all aspects of your IP. (Bold)

Emphasized for point, not sarcasm.

The internet is a great method of communication, expect a list of boycottees and others to follow.



*Edit*

The B&C just shot me down, I posted it, got like 40 views and now its gone, no PM, no lock, just gone.

Well, needless to say i'm not discouraged, and I will also be cancelling my account there.

Ghidorah wrote:Well, she used a batman logo in the sign, too. Well, not the EXACT logo, but close enough that you could tell what it was and what it was referring to.

Left that little part out the first time didn't you?

I thought being sued for the word "Gotham" was kinda fethed up...

I thought maybe the club got sued for violating the music licence by serving

dinner dinner dinner dinner... Batmaaaaaan!

Kilkrazy wrote:I thought maybe the club got sued for violating the music licence by serving

dinner dinner dinner dinner... Batmaaaaaan!

now that was just b.a.d.

*Keeraapp!*

NAVARRO wrote:

My objective is not that GW notice me or my actions or my boycott my objective is to take my business elsewere these months, and support competition... I'm happy if competition gets some extra cash because THEY will notice for sure and my money will be used well, in consequence i feel better about all this strangulation GW giving to HOBBY comunities.

Sure lay your personal personal fictitous crusade against GW and let me put in practice my personal nonfictitous crusade against GW the way i want it.

If you're just stopping buying GW goods altogether because you're unhappy with what they do, it's not really a boycott. A boycott is where you go back to them at the end of the period of time. Even if you phrase it as an indefinite boycott, the fact is, you're just not buying their stuff ever, period. It's difficult to actively not do something if you're not doing it anyway.

Therefore what you're doing has nothing to do with Deadshane's Boycott as being practiced in this thread, as you're not just boycotting for two months, you were, still are and are going to abstain altogether. I wouldn't label that a 'crusade' against GW. You're just not having anything to do with them, which is an entirely different kettle of a fish to actively attempting to reform the policies of the company.

And I'd suggest losing the bad sarcasm, it doesn't suit.

Ketara wrote:

NAVARRO wrote:

My objective is not that GW notice me or my actions or my boycott my objective is to take my business elsewere these months, and support competition... I'm happy if competition gets some extra cash because THEY will notice for sure and my money will be used well, in consequence i feel better about all this strangulation GW giving to HOBBY comunities.

Sure lay your personal personal fictitous crusade against GW and let me put in practice my personal nonfictitous crusade against GW the way i want it.

If you're just stopping buying GW goods altogether because you're unhappy with what they do, it's not really a boycott. A boycott is where you go back to them at the end of the period of time. Even if you phrase it as an indefinite boycott, the fact is, you're just not buying their stuff ever, period. It's difficult to actively not do something if you're not doing it anyway.

Therefore what you're doing has nothing to do with Deadshane's Boycott as being practiced in this thread, as you're not just boycotting for two months, you were, still are and are going to abstain altogether. I wouldn't label that a 'crusade' against GW. You're just not having anything to do with them, which is an entirely different kettle of a fish to actively attempting to reform the policies of the company.

And I'd suggest losing the bad sarcasm, it doesn't suit.

Sigh...
First things first, just to make it easier for you to understand, no pinch of sarcasm here... not before not now.

You assume to much with the little information you have, thats why your conclusions are not accurate and somewhat patronizing...
Thats why you dont know; that I buy lots of GW stuff and that I will stop now for some months and then get back to it at a later date...2 months from now? who the hell knows? in 2 months much can happen...
Blows me away your assumptions and your strange attempt to put me and people inside YOUR personal little boxes of closed definitions...specially when you dont know jack shiat about my shopping and hobby patterns.

Dravenguild wrote:I composed this letter to send to them, feel free to give input and your own additions and maybe build of Shane's idea.

Title: Business practices and attitude to fanbase

Due to price increases, poorer quality miniatures and ignoring of the customer's input on produts and matters of rules and inconsistency of codexes,

I will be boycotting your product for the minimum of 2 months. Between November and December.

I, Adrian Ruiz.

I am not alone in this, already players across the world are preparing to send GW headquarters the message that we need to be addressed and not dismissed.

This is not a message to any worker in particular, this is to be forwarded sincerely to the shareholders and higher-ups.

I can't believe it has come to a matter of boycotting, but your company has been hiking prices unnecessarily and ignoring fan input while not addressing problems within the balance of codexes.

As a fan and consumer of your products I don't demand that you listen to me, but it pains me that the only way to get through to the decision makers is denying purchase of GW products.

I just want to have my opinion be accounted and my input noted, after all our (The fans) purchases are what keep the games workshop business alive.

I implore you all, be more receptive to us. We have been here as long as the company and it has taken several turns I didn't like but respected, but it's gone too far especially in this economic turmoil.

We also have a right to quality products, as a consumer. Which pertains to all aspects of your IP. (Bold)

Emphasized for point, not sarcasm.

The internet is a great method of communication, expect a list of boycottees and others to follow.



*Edit*

The B&C just shot me down, I posted it, got like 40 views and now its gone, no PM, no lock, just gone.

Well, needless to say i'm not discouraged, and I will also be cancelling my account there.

Sounds good. I'll be sending something similar out monday.

Navarro, according to your initial post further up the page, your goals here are completely separate from DeadShanes. Your goal is promote ' the competition, in the form of buying their products with the money planned for GW, give exposure to them on the forums in the form of reviews etc and to sculpt for companies labeled like parasites...'.

Those are your views and reasons for your boycott. However, these aims were not those initiated by DeadShane. Indeed, DeadShane in his initial post on page 1 was rather ambiguous about exactly what it was he was protesting against.

I have a proposition for everyone who is upset by these Cease and Decist orders.
It's time to voice our opinion to GW. Note that this isnt necessarily ONLY to voice our dissatisfaction with the C&D orders, call it dissatisfaction with price increases, lack of Grand Tournaments, Lack of FAQ's, overabundance of Marine codex while ignoring Dark Eldar...whatever.'

There are no clearly delineated reasons for the boycott, and no outlined objectives for the boycott other than to, 'make GW sit up and take notice of us'.

I'll admit I misread your initial post slightly in favour of specific buying habits on your part, and I'll retract my previous post in recognition of that.

However, regardless of whatever your aims may be, those are not aims shared by the initiator of the boycott, and by extension, the rest of the boycotters. Their aim here is recognition by GW of their displeasure of multiple factors, rather than to promote other modeling companies. This may be a side effect of the boycott, but is not the primary reason.
Therefore whatever your ulterior motives may be for joining, most peoples objective is, as you put it, 'that GW notice me or my actions or my boycott'.

Although if your goal is not to be noticed by GW, or even to have your boycott noticed, one would query as to why you even bothered joining a boycott? If you have no aims with regard to improving GW's policies, or actively protesting against its actions, and only want to promote sales for their competitor, you're simply not joining the boycott for the main reason it was initiated in the first place.

My initial criticism was the conducting of a protest with such inefficent processes and poorly defined goals, and the outlining of a more viable and effective way of doing things. However, if you do not even share the aims and reasons for the boycott in the first place, than my criticism of it has absolutely nothing to do with your personal objectives. And as I've said, I would wonder why you even bothered joining it in the first place, as you have such different goals here. After all, Deadshane is attempting to arrange an organised protest to make GW change their policies, not promote other modeling companies.

How are the GW mini's poorer quality?

Far as I know pewter is pewter is pewter. All lead free pewter is the same.

Quality of sculpts. GW, just like any other company has some bad sculpts but all one has to do is take a look at the SH termies to get an idea of just how good the sculpt quality is. PP has some good sculpts but they are largely hit and miss. Rackham has some good sculpts too but really? GW has low quality minis, in what sense?

If I may offer some advice to letter writers. You want to start a letter to a company with an introduction that shows them you are a valuable customer. If you start off and only have things that upset you-they are more likely to throw it away.

1) Introduce yourself, explain how you got into the hobby and what you've loved about GW over the years (the more specific examples you provide the better)
2) Follow up with some small recommendation that are probably common (say something good about the rules before you segway into a problem with the rules for example).
3) Write about their current actions and how they make you feel

Never threaten a company with "no longer buying" and "telling my friends about you". Companies take well structured criticisms seriously when from loyal customers.

Don't end with an altimatum, at best-say that their current actions have cause you to start looking around at their competetion.

Sidstyler wrote: Left that little part out the first time didn't you?

Yeah, I suppose I did. heh-heh.
At the time of that posting, I hadn't really thought much about it. It's been 10+ years. Hmmm... I wonder what's she's been up to?

Kilkrazy wrote:I thought maybe the club got sued for violating the music licence by serving

dinner dinner dinner dinner... Batmaaaaaan!

Priceless!



Ghidorah

Fateweaver wrote:How are the GW mini's poorer quality?

Far as I know pewter is pewter is pewter. All lead free pewter is the same.

Quality of sculpts. GW, just like any other company has some bad sculpts but all one has to do is take a look at the SH termies to get an idea of just how good the sculpt quality is. PP has some good sculpts but they are largely hit and miss. Rackham has some good sculpts too but really? GW has low quality minis, in what sense?

There are different kinds of alloys available for metal figures.

See the Prince August page for the three types they offer. http://www.princeaugust.ie/

No doubt a big buyer can order alloy with any proportion of different metals they specify.