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I grew up with the Ms Marvel Rogue, but I vastly prefer her incarnations without those powers. She gets put to better use when she's not got them to fall back on.
Mysterio wrote: Rogue's comic backstory is too much of a mess for the movies.
It hasn't made it over intact yet for that reason - and it won't be for the same reasons.
Plus, her 'basic' story is "good enough", I guess, for the movie setting?
They retconned Captain Marvels backstory in the comic so it would be more in line with the movie and wouldn't require Mar-Vell so I imagine the same could be done to Rogue.
Amidst the mists and coldest frosts he thrusts his fists against the posts and still insists he sees the ghosts.
But again, its not as interesting to have always crazy strong flying invulnerable rogue. Shes at her best when shes grabing powers and adapting and doesnt have permanent flying super punches to fall back on.
These are my opinions. This is how I feel. Others may feel differently. This needs to be stated for some reason.
Formosa wrote: does anyone think that now we are getting Xmen back in the MCU (ok possibly getting them back) that we may see a rogue done properly due to captain marvel kicking around in the MCU
Maybe? Eventually? I could see them using rogue as a way to put Captain Marvel out of the movies when her contract is up.
Honestly Rogues most interesting aspects is not being suped on Cap Marvel powers. It's her personal issues and adaptability. X men evolution had a good rogue and she never had all the power of the 90s xmen cartoon. Rogue has been great in recent years in the comics and she no longer has Danvers powers.
Ah, you make such a good point, but I really want both Rogues.
My two least favorite things about the X-Men are Cyclops and Superman Rogue. One I grudgingly have to deal with and the other we can avoid because it was bad.
This film seems risky. Not risky in the sense of trying something new that might catch audiences off guard and you’re not sure how they will react. Rather, it seems risky in the sense of assuming the audience will like it because you think they ought to like it. I have a feeling it will be divisive, something the MCU has wisely steered clear of thus far.
Risky is okay if the movie is good.. Just hope they don't make a bad story movie; slap the marvel logo on it. then blame the fans because it didn't do well.
Guardians of the Galaxy was a risky movie but had a solid story. Start with a good story then work from there.
The Last Jedi really broke my trust with franchises; Now I wait for friends to see it and let me know what they think before I consider going to watch it.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/12/20 05:19:36
The first Guardians movie is a good example of Marvel doing something outside of what had been their wheelhouse up to that point. That’s the kind of risk where you’re taking a chance on whether the audience will like something other than what has been successful previously.
Captain Marvel doesn’t seem like that kind of risk. To the contrary, it seems to be a completely conventional Marvel movie given the current state of the MCU. By contrast, what seems risky about Captain Marvel is shifting from trying to deliver what you suspect the customers want to assuming the customers should want what you’re willing to sell them.
To me, it looks like Marvel is giving us another cosmic...ish story, introducing a new character (who will hopefully have some charisma in the movie), and using the time of the setting as an excuse for comedic shenanigans. That feels like one of the things I want from Marvel.
Well the marketing (trailer, comments from Brie Larson) indicate the main character is extremely powerful but at the same time she seems boring, unengaging, stilted, whatever you want to call it. My impression is that I am supposed to like her, that I am expected to like her, regardless of whether she is actually likeable, because she is powerful, full of conviction and confidence, etc.
I dont really understand the problem. She seems parfectly fine in the latest trailers. I'm not sure how we can judge charisma upon 2 second snapshots and sound bytes.
"By this point I'm convinced 100% that every single race in the 40k universe have somehow tapped into the ork ability to just have their tech work because they think it should."
In point of fact, no one said anything of the kind at the time. It’s not even remotely convincing to say it now, either, especially for the sake of a snarky drive by comment like that.
The trailer for First Avenger shows Cap’s character, in both senses, is not about physical but rather moral strength. Contrast to Captain Marvel, where the trailer just hammers away at her being physically powerful and justifiably arrogant about it.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/12/20 14:33:09
Hopefully that's the Kree brain-stuff, and she starts to behave a bit more like a human person as her memories of being Carol Danvers return to her. Assuming that's how they arrange things in the film.
"Your society's broken, so who should we blame? Should we blame the rich, powerful people who caused it? No, lets blame the people with no power and no money and those immigrants who don't even have the vote. Yea, it must be their fething fault." - Iain M Banks
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"The language of modern British politics is meant to sound benign. But words do not mean what they seem to mean. 'Reform' actually means 'cut' or 'end'. 'Flexibility' really means 'exploit'. 'Prudence' really means 'don't invest'. And 'efficient'? That means whatever you want it to mean, usually 'cut'. All really mean 'keep wages low for the masses, taxes low for the rich, profits high for the corporations, and accept the decline in public services and amenities this will cause'." - Robin McAlpine from Common Weal
Sure, it could be they are just mismarketing the film. I mean, I think about seeing a movie introducing the Kree-Skull War and I feel excited ... then I watch these trailers and I’m like, nevermind.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/12/20 14:40:04
AegisGrimm wrote: I dont really understand the problem. She seems parfectly fine in the latest trailers. I'm not sure how we can judge charisma upon 2 second snapshots and sound bytes.
It's easy when you actively want to hate something. I'm reserving judgement until I see the film. Hell, I thought Chris Evans was a bad choice for Cap when he was announced, and I'm more than happy that I was wrong.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/12/20 16:25:49
Manchu wrote: Well the marketing (trailer, comments from Brie Larson) indicate the main character is extremely powerful but at the same time she seems boring, unengaging, stilted, whatever you want to call it. My impression is that I am supposed to like her, that I am expected to like her, regardless of whether she is actually likeable, because she is powerful, full of conviction and confidence, etc.
That does seem like a pretty big problem. However, the trailers let us know this is a story about someone who has been mindwiped, so a lot of her charisma will only come into play after that (hopefully brief) segment of the story is overcome. I still trust Marvel's story telling, so I'm expecting her character to have character during the film. I guess we'll see whether or not that faith is justified.
Robocop would seem pretty lacking in personality, too, if you cut a trailer from his early action scenes.
But I can *defintiely* see where Manchu is coming from.
Not sure if it is because Marvel thinks we are supposed to like her 'just because', but her depiction so far as been quite stotic/bored/disengaged/etc.
I'll also be happy to see that this isn't the case, and as she recovers her memories and becomes more "Carol" and less "Vers", she opens up, etc.
Kree-Skrull War — now there’s the promise of a sprawling adventure! Hence why I actually do want Captain Marvel to be a big success (unlike the Inhumans). And hence why I am concerned that while I can see that I am expected to like and be interested in this character, the trailer gives me no reason to be. Quite the reverse, unfortunately.
RoboCop is an interesting comparison. That film was a parody of the excesses and superficiality of American action schlock. The title character was designed as the personification of how lead characters in such movies were supposed to be cool because they were consumate badasses, at least as far as inflicting violence goes - and this generally at the expense of complexity or nuanced performances.
I’d submit that RoboCop, even just as he appears in the trailers for the original picture, is still more likeable than Bree Larson’s Captain Marvel. They are neck-in-neck as a matter of being emotionally blank and overwhelmingly characterized by violence. But RoboCop doesn’t come across as conceited.
I'm not terribly worried about power level. Thor's last two appearances have been pretty crazy all things considering, but they come at specific story beats and aren't really what the movie is about for long. I mean, the total run time of Thor decimating the purestrain horde, punching through the skeletons on the Bifrost and fighting the Hulk is probably short enough to fit in one trailer when you think about it.
Marvel's been exceptionally good at hiding what its films are really about lately. It seemed to really start with Homecoming, but the last several films have really stood out for all the story elements that have not been the focus of the trailers.
I think its funny how questionable movies get a shorter release window than movies they know will do well..
So if a movie is announced a few weeks before its released you can imagine how good it is...
But I agree with Manchu; I think the marketing group didn't see the movie and just making it up as the go along..
Manchu wrote: Kree-Skrull War — now there’s the promise of a sprawling adventure! Hence why I actually do want Captain Marvel to be a big success (unlike the Inhumans). And hence why I am concerned that while I can see that I am expected to like and be interested in this character, the trailer gives me no reason to be. Quite the reverse, unfortunately.
Does anyone really think they're going to do that justice on a budget of $150 mil, though? I have a feeling that a good chunk of the film will be her walking around on Earth to keep the budget down, like Thor.
Even so, Marvel Studios only needs to introduce the Kree-Skrull War in this picture. If the title character wins over audiences, we can expect to see the really good stuff down the line. But if this becomes another “divisive” (i.e., paid critics love it, audiences don’t) kind of film, it may be less likely.
