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Having asked this on another board, I'm now hoping for some more suggestions; What armies should my Doublewing army have a hard time against? I ask this because in 20+ games against over half of the 40k races I've lost maybe two, both from when I first started playing them. Since then, I'm on a lot more wins than draws or losses, but a) I don't want to get complacent and b) I want to know what my GF can try and do with her Witch Hunters army to give me a harder time.

My general list;

Belial (Special Character Terminator Captain)
Sammael (Flying Land Raider)
3X Deathwing Terminator squads with 1 pair of Lightening Claws and usually 1 Assault Cannon per squad
2X Ravenwing Bike Squadrons with Meltas/Flamers and Attack Bikes with Multimeltas
Apothecaries in one squad of each of the above.

Shuffling some weapons and wargear around (like the Deathwing company banner), that list clocks in at 1500pts, and is the one I play with the most. Using a smaller version at 1000pts usually involves just dropping a bike squad and a Terminator squad, though I'm forced to make compromises I don't want to (either dropping special weapons on the bikes/the attack bike/the Deathwing standard/an Assault Cannon).


Some general things I already know;

1) SoB melta-spam and Acts of Faith should ruin my day, as can Exorcists and Flying Nuns of Doom if used right

2) I /should/ have a hard time against Horde armies, but I haven't so far against either melee Nids, new Guard or Orks, largely due to luck (no casualties from 60+ lasgun shots at close range) and my choice of deployment.

3) DWA isn't anywhere near as nasty if I don't get the first turn, as my bikes have a chance to be wiped off the board if I'm not careful with their Scout move, especially at 1000pts.

4) Mechanised Eldar will ruin my day.

5) Mechanised most things should make my life harder, but in practice I tend to take out most troop transports on turn 1 between Multi-melta and AC fire.

So, any other suggestions, from DA players or those who beat them often?

I usually get my GF to infiltrate into my deployment zone and then fleet of foot and assault my troops.

I can beat doublewing in killpoints and victory points missions, but objective missions end up being close matches.

I run a Space Wolf Land Raider spam, the meltabikers end up being the #1 threat, because they can pop my land raiders on the wrong side of the field. This his superior ranged firepower can me a sad panda.

Also, my opponent runs Belial with 5 termies, 1 apothecary, 1 thunderhammer+stormshield, 1 chainfist+heavy flamer, 2 twin lightning claw.
even this unit has a hard time against any of my sub-300 point smashy blood claw units led by a simple wolf guard battle leader.

In any case, the results are skewed, as all Space Wolves and all Dark Angels hit in close combat on 3's because of Blood Feud.

The worst is dark eldar by far. A smart player will start his ravagers in reserve, and 3 plasma cannons per ravager annihilates doublewing. When you shoot, you kill a 55 point raider. Then you take a billion dark lance shots in return fire.

So you are running no vehicles? Seems like those few numbers would not fare well under the weight of fire of most gunlines, or worse, manoeuvreable shooty such as tau or eldar.

Gunlines are terrible against doublewing. DWA and teleport homers on the bikes allow you to place your shooting to annihilate static elements and take very little return fire.

It is very similar to mech Eldar in this regard.

It loses to any army with any sort of effective manuverable shooting, like eldar, dark eldar, and certain tau builds.

It struggles against armies that counter deep-strike, like IG with mystics from DH.

Lash can be difficult for Doublewing as well, assuming the CHaos player knows well enough to counter-deepstrike oblits in return and put daemon princes in reserve.

The army also doesn't scale well as you go up in points. It's greatest effectiveness is at 1500. It's significantly less effective at 1750. At 2000 the army is just too small and doesn't have enough firepower.

Thanks for the replies guys. It seems that people on different forums seem to all be saying the same thing, which is that mechanised Eldar/Dark Eldar will probably be the nastiest "general" armies though there are builds that can be done specifically with them in mind. My GF's WH army is likely to be getting some DH Inquisitor+ Mystic buddies, since they're something like 32pts...

Scuddman - A friend who's Marines and Chaos Marines I've beaten has offered to see how I fare against his Tau, it'll be interesting to see how that goes.

Demogerg - Interesting, don't know how the new SW Codex will skew those results, but it'll probably end up in the SW's favour due to Codex power creep. I might try and get a hold of the one SW player at my local store if I can before the 'dex gets updated so I can compare.

Fearspect - I run 4 bikes at 1,000 pts and 8 at 1,500, which is either one or two bike+ MM attack bike squads. Between a Scout move and their usual move I can get the MM in position to hit most things on turn 1 most of the time. Sometimes I can't quite manage it though. Also, the bike Melta(s) often gets fatally ignored in lieu of the MM Attack Bike(s)...

My mech eldar list would love to play your doublewing.

eldrad,banshee in wave,2 units of 5 dragons in wave 2 units of dires in wave and 2 prisms/holo/stones

banshees/dires with bladestorm usually take care of termies. the waves and prisms handle the rest.


I play on vassal40k all the time. names Miggles on there.

Okay, I'm curious, what's Vassal40k? And Eldrad alone is probably enough to ruin my day, I played alongside him in an Apocalypse game the other day and have a passing awareness of his actual in-game dickishness...

www.vassal40k.com its a mod for vassal an program that lets you play tabletop games online.

GW put the legal hounds on them so no more updates will come as of july 31 so download it now before you cant anymore.

Also Eldrad gets a bad rep. he's just a farseer that can cast 1 more power than a regular farseer. with a better save and toughness. Eldar powers would be the dickishness you talk about and all the good ones are only support powers. you need actual units and tactics to make use of them.

Ah, I see. Grabbing it now, but don't expect me to be on for a while. I might well give it a shot though, in which case I'll try and game with you.

As for Eldrad, I could probably have phrased it better, but yes, the sheer amount of options he has for support powers made him stick in my head from that game, and the extra power is very useful.