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HQ
Warlord Deff Jaw (Ghazghkull’s Rules) = 225

Elites
1 Tankbusta Nob w/ Bosspole
10 Tankbustaz = 180

10 Lootaz = 150

Troops
5 Mega Nobz = 200
Da Deff Klanka II w/ 4 Big Shootaz, Zzap gun, Armor Platez, Grot Riggaz, Reinforced Ram = 145

1 Nob w/ Power Klaw, Bosspole
29 Boyz = 220

1 Nob w/ Power Klaw, Bosspole
29 Boyz = 220

1 Nob w/ Power Klaw, Bosspole
29 Boyz = 220

1 Nob w/ Power Klaw, Bosspole
9 Boyz w/ Shootaz, Big Shoota = 105
1 Trukk w/ Boarding Plank, Grot Riggaz, Armor Platez = 55

1 Nob w/ Bosspole, Shoota
9 Boyz w/ Shootaz = 75

Fast Attack
1 Deffkopta w/ Twinlinked Rokkit Launcha

Heavy Support
Da Deff Hamma w/ 4 Big Shootaz, Zzap gun, ‘Ard Case, Armor Platez, Grot Riggaz, Reinforced Ram = 160

Total: 2000 Points


10 Shoota boyz hold home objektives
10 Trukk Boyz contest/cap at last game turn.
Deffkopta comes in the sides to wound tanks/monsterous creatures
Tankbustaz blown up enemy tanks/Monsterous creatures.
Lootaz are there fer some moar dakka.l

Id be tempted to leave off the 'ard case on the HS Battlewagon, and put the tankbusters in it. Drive up, shoot, assault.
The lone trukk is going to die. either take 3 or so, or drop it.
Shootas are best in large footslogging gangs, SLuggas best in trukks.
With the Battle wagons, Id say its better to run 2Big Shootas and a Kannon - as this allows you to fire twice (kannon on frag, shoota)moving. The 2nd shoota provides wep destoyed cover.

Id say: drop Deffkoptar and change the weapons on the battlewagons, to buy a second trukk. Maybe split a mob of 30 into 2 10s in trukks as well.

That is a speed freak list this is like Da Green tide, but a little different. The Deff Klanka is for the Meganobz. the other one is for firesupport/fireship. Did you even read the stuff at the bottom. This shall not be a speed freak list the boyz in a trukk are there to cap/contest objektives on the last game turn. Plz Kannonz are worthless unless you use the Krak round. I refuse to have speed freaks they suck. Not enough boyz fer me. Though some disagree and I was looking for small suggestions not change the list like replace ghaz with a warboss.

I love it.... What are you asking in this thread? Someone puts their opinion on what you should change, and you blast them for it. (By the way, he was not asking you to change your army to a speed freak.... just suggesting a change)
At 2000 points your army will most likely be wasted....
My 1500 point could probably beat your 2000 because you would likely be attacking in waves (which is bad for ork)

Things to look at:
[b]Deffkopta - dont expect to do much with only one. You get to reroll misses to hit.... but not misses to penetrated the armour. If your going to use them, I would use either 2 or 3 (in different squads of course because their ld sucks)
Da Deff Hamma- If your going to put people in it you better take out the 'ard case (that way there are no fire points), if your going to use it as a gun station leave off the armor plates, grot riggaz, and reinforced ram. Better yet, take off the 'ard case and the other stuff and put your lootaz in it as a firing base
Da deff klanka II - Why does it have so much stuff on it? Wont you be trying to hit the front lines with the mega nobz and ghaz? If so, I would leave off the armour platez, grot Riggaz, and 2 big shootaz and add a deffrolla
Lootaz - The rule with ork is... if your going to do something, max it out. 10 lootaz in a 2000 point army is not going to work well. When 3 die they tend to run off the board because their ld sucks.
Tankbusta - Why using a nob? They already have great anti-tank, and I hope your not going to use them to attack infantry so... not much need. If your footslogging them then I can see that you need a bosspole, but Tankbustaz really need to be in a trukk or battlewagon since the glory hog rule makes it so they can pretty much never run.
Shoota Boyz- Why use them to hold an objective when you can do the same thing with grotz? Save your 65 points and use them elsewhere.
MegaNobz- This is a matter of taste, but regular nobz are much better in my opinion.
Trukk- Only having one makes a great target. You have 3 vehicles right now. All will be great targets on turn one because the enemy knows it will take you at least 3 turns to get your boyz to the front.
Last thing (and most important) - Where is your big mek with kff??? You are foot-slogging and your not going to use the 5+ invulnerable? Since you will take around 3 turns to get to the enemies lines you will be taken out pretty quickly by blast/pie-plates.

I'm done. Now you can blast me; however, I win about 90% of the time in points 1850 or above.

Ive got to second dink's opinions, they really seem like solid stuff. The only thing I would disagree with is his take on lootas. Now his suggestion does work, and a squad of 15 lootas will put some serious hurt on just about everything, it is not strictly necessary to use a big squad. I use 2-3 squads of 5-7, depending on my other choices. It lets you split fire, reduce the damage done by bad rolls, and lose a squad or two and still have lootas in the list.

As for some other things;
1. Your model count is low. I have as many models in my 1000 pt list as you have in 2000 point list. My 2000 point list has more double your models.

2. A single trukk will not be able to capture objectives on the last turn 9 times out of 10. First it has to survive through the game and you have to get second turn, then you have to get to the objective before the variable game length ends, then you have to hope the game doesnt continue, and allow your trukk and its 10 boyz to get blown off the face of the earth. It just doesnt pan out. Also, why do you have a boarding plank on a trukk that is just being used to steal objectives? And why did you spring for the pk/bp nob?

3. Battle wagons, on their own, are terrible at fire support, at least in the configurations you have them set in. Your zap gun has an average strength of 6 (if I remember my statistics), and is a single shot weapon with a bs of 2. You can only shoot multiple weapons if you dont move, which means you have 12 big shoota shots at 24 inches, of which you only average 8 hits, and a third chance of a Zapp gun hit. This is one unimpressive fire support vehicle. Add in the fact that its rear armor is 10, and its side armor is only 12, you really have a mediocre tank. There are ways to make it better at fire support, but battle wagons are strongest when they are carrying troops.

Dink:

How do you get Tankbustas in a Trukk?

Also, this is not the first time I have heard someone recommend Lootas in a wagon. But doesn't that require the wagon to sit still, since Deffguns are Heavy? Tankbustas with rokkits would seem to be a better idea, since they can fire and move.

Just curious.

I don't like using tankbustaz in a trukk for multiple reasons.
1) They become a high priority target for the enemy, so you better have a mechanized list or they will be gone by turn 1... gotta love armour 10 open top.
2) You would probably have to bring in some trukk boys, kick them out of their trukk and then put the tankbustaz in it... that means the trukk boys are runnin' the whole map, but in his army it doesn't seem to matter.

If I do use them (only in games greater then 1500 points) I stick 10-15 of them in a battlewagon, open topped with a deffrolla and boarding planks. Total of 270-345 points that the enemy has to be afraid of.
Here is a 1500 list I use them in.. not my strongest list but fun as hell.

Ghazghkull Thraka (In battlewagon #1): 225
Big Mek (In battlewagon #2): 85
+KFF
Troops:
12 Slugga Boyz: 152
+ Nob (PK, BP)
+ Trukk (plank)
12 Slugga Boyz: 152
+ Nob (PK, BP)
+ Trukk (Plank)
12 Slugga Boyz: 147
+ Nob (PK, BP)
+ Trukk
12 Slugga Boyz: 147
+ Nob (PK, BP)
+ Trukk
Elite:
10 Burna Boyz (In battlewagon #1): 150
10 Tankbusta (In battlewagon #2): 155
+ Tankhammer x1
+ Bomb Squig
Heavy Support:
Battlewagon #1: 120
+ Big shoota, Grabbin' claw, Deffrolla
Battlewagon #2: 120
+ Big shoota, Boarding plank, Deffrolla
KillaKan: 45
+ Grotzooka

In regards to Lootas in a wagon - No, they can't fire while the battlewagon is moving. I don't use Lootas very often because I am an assaulty type of person, but if I do use them this is what I do-
I put 15 of them in the battlewagon. Turn 1 I move to an area with cover so I can get a +4 save if they do attack me (which they will) Then from then on I don't move, fire lots of dakka, and hope it doesn't get blown up. It is a great unit, because it's a great distraction. Let's my trukk boys and nobs live longer.... but it is a pretty expensive distraction, and if you get knocked 1st turn... not much fun.

I agree with Elnicko about the battlewagons being terrible fire supports... (unless they have Lootas) I was just trying to work with the list that was given.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I forgot to comment on the tankbusta vs Lootas.

- It's a matter of taste. Lootas are not the greatest at killing tanks.... now light vehicles... that's where they excel at. Plus, they can rip up infantry. 15 will fire 45 rounds per turn 33% of the time. Downside - they are heavy and you won't be moving them much, if at all. Plus, no bosspole... so if you fail your ld of 7..... hello table edge.
- Tankbustas do get to fire while your moving. Problem is - most likely you won't be firing first turn anyways because:
1) You will be in a battlewagon
2) You will be moving flat-out to get into range of the enemy.

Again, just like anything in the ork army, it's a matter of taste. You have to choose what kind of army you are and stick with it. Horde, shooty, assaulty, mechy, fast all work if played correctly. (except flash gitz... they suck)

So you guyz are saying that I either go green tide or mechanized. But I just prefer Ghaz and no other HQ choices. Now why do HAVE to max each unit that you can? That just seems like well you HAVE to max everything cause I said so. The 11 Tankbustaz are good the way they are. The 10 Lootaz are good the way they are. So what do you me to do to the Shoota boyz mobz? put them in one mob and add 1 unit of grotz.

Well I'm done answering...
Have fun! Good luck! Experience will teach you a lot in regards to the game.

Okay here is the revised list:
HQ
Warlord Deff Jaw (Ghazghkull’s Rules) = 225

Elites
1 Tankbusta Nob w/ Bosspole
10 Tankbustaz = 180

15 Lootaz = 225

Troops
5 Mega Nobz = 200
Da Deff Klanka II w/ 4 Big Shootaz, Zzap gun, Armor Platez, Grot Riggaz, Reinforced Ram = 145

1 Nob w/ Power Klaw, Bosspole
29 Boyz = 220

1 Nob w/ Power Klaw, Bosspole
29 Boyz = 220

1 Nob w/ Power Klaw, Bosspole
29 Boyz = 220

1 Nob w/ Power Klaw, Bosspole
19 Boyz w/ 2 Big Shootaz, Shootaz = 165

1 Runtherd
10 Grots = 40 (should I have more of these?)

Heavy Support
Da Deff Hamma w/ 4 Big Shootaz, Zzap gun, ‘Ard Case, Armor Platez, Grot Riggaz, Reinforced Ram = 160

Total: 2000 Points

Grotz hold home.
Tankbustaz blown up enemy tanks/Monsterous creatures.
Lootaz are there fer some moar dakka.

you know the loota's can fire from a BW that moves less than 6" (or 7" with red paint job)

they would be safer in there

if you want tankbusta's keep them but i think theres better units to use,
rokkits buggies x3 are 105 pts, x3 BS are 90pts
about 24 boyz with Nob,pk BP
you could have 9 Big Guns (kannons for 180pts)
and these would complement your lootas

ZZap guns really sucks use a kannon instead you can fire at troops or vehicles with it

i think you have WAY to much pts invested in transports they should be stripped down as even your BW isn't going to last past turn 3 usually

BW-2 guns, 1 BS, 1 Kannon
and ram or deffrolla

at 2000pts im trying to fit in Nobz, Nob bikers, MaNz, and 'Ard boyz,
looking for a dead 'Ard army

Here is the revised-revised list:
HQ
Warlord Deff Jaw (Ghazghkull’s Rules) = 225

Nazdakka w/ Kustom Force Field = 85

Elites
1 Tankbusta Nob w/ Bosspole
10 Tankbustaz = 180

15 Lootaz = 225

Troops
5 Mega Nobz = 200
Da Deff Klanka II w/ 1 Big Shoota, Armor Platez, Deff Rolla = 130

1 Nob w/ Power Klaw, Bosspole
29 Boyz = 220

1 Nob w/ Power Klaw, Bosspole
29 Boyz = 220

1 Nob w/ Power Klaw, Bosspole
29 Boyz = 220

1 Nob w/ Shoota, Bosspole
19 Boyz w/ 2 Big Shootaz, Shootaz = 140

1 Runtherd
10 Grots = 40

Heavy Support
Da Deff Hamma w/ 4 Big Shootaz, Kannon = 120 (Lootaz in here)



Total: 2000 Points

Grotz hold home.
Tankbustaz blown up enemy tanks/Monsterous creatures.
Lootaz are there fer some moar dakka.

Deff Jaw wrote:So you guyz are saying that I either go green tide or mechanized. But I just prefer Ghaz and no other HQ choices. Now why do HAVE to max each unit that you can? That just seems like well you HAVE to max everything cause I said so. The 11 Tankbustaz are good the way they are. The 10 Lootaz are good the way they are. So what do you me to do to the Shoota boyz mobz? put them in one mob and add 1 unit of grotz.

You dont have to do anything. In fact, you dont have to listen to our suggestions, but I feel like you already knew that. Why do you have to post on this board if you would rather do what you prefer? If you search the tactics board, people go on, at length, as to why these things are better than their alternatives. You should read the article on ork Tactica, it lays out the do's and don'ts of a competitive army well.

The most effective armies, for orks, are one way or the other. Why? Because most opponents you play bring a well rounded force in competitive play. By splitting your resources you allow everything in their arsenal to work as they planned. He has targets for all of his guns to play the roles they were intended. By going all mech, or all foot, you make him "waste" some of his guns. A laz cannon on a dread isnt worth the 40 points it costs if it shoots at boyz on foot all game. S4 and S5 weapons do him no good against AV 12 and 14. This is why people will say you have to go one way or the other- target denial. If you arent sold, play some games with this army and see what happens.

Grotz- 10 is not enough, unless you are fine with them cracking under any pressure applied. No armor saves, Ld7, and losing d3 for a chance to reroll will find you running from just about everything- ive had 20 of them lose in combat to 5 tau firewarriors. The will be prime targets for late game deep strikers.

Footslogging tankbustas are a mistake, and that mistake is made worse by taking only 10 of them. On the plus side, because they are such a target, they will probably draw fire off of your boyz for a bit.

Mega nobs are a bad unit. Atleast yours is mounted, but negatively in one of 2 vehicles. They are a point-sink that moves slowly, and strikes last in combat. In your list, they are going to be the first five models in combat, with the entire enemy army in 2/3 of your games, unless you hold them back, in which case, Why give them the transport?

There are several reasons you max out your squads:
1. You die in droves. Your primary armor save is +6. Almost every gun in the game invalidates your armor. You may be T4, but that only gets you so far.
2. You are only fearless so long as you number 12 or more. This is made a bigger problem by the fact that you die in droves.
3. You are base Ld 7, unless you smuggle a character into the mix.
All of these things make larger squads safer, not to mention larger squads have more strength, and for those reasons are more effective. You dont have to go with them, but seeing as how they are more effective, and therefore better, people will suggest them. Your 10 and 11 man squads will be testing LD when they lose 3 men. on a ld 7 and 8 respectively. Just something to think about.

Also, lootas can not fire from a moving vehicle at all- as they have heavy weapons and count as moving if the vehicle has moved- unless I've missed something.

Any skimmer based army (Eldar, Dark Eldar, Tau) is going to destroy your mobility in the first turn, then spend the rest of the game skirting you and blasting holes in your army.

Skimmers are not a problem. They get blown to bits so fast its not even funny. anyway Elnicko5 you make the list since mine must just suck so bad that I can ever hope to win. I geuss that you mucst be the supreme god ar Warhammer 40k.

NEXT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Deff Jaw wrote:Skimmers are not a problem. They get blown to bits so fast its not even funny. anyway Elnicko5 you make the list since mine must just suck so bad that I can ever hope to win. I geuss that you mucst be the supreme god ar Warhammer 40k.

Wow are you like 10 ?



Guy takes time out to help YOU and you bash him cause you DON"T know what your doing .

Go play some games KID and learn the HARD way.

agree with smackaelf (sorry if i mistyped it). that guy wrote a lot of good tips to help you, and most of them sound pretty sensible too. you shouldn't take a piss at people who really tried to help.

go roll a one, man.