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Made in de
Ladies Love the Vibro-Cannon Operator






Hamburg

 Badablack wrote:
It might not matter for your local games, but riflemen dreads got punted into Legends. No more dual auto cannon options unfortunately.

Thanks. I know.
In pickup games it doesn't matter. GK is my pickup army atm. Because my opponents often complain about power gaming from my side.
I wouldn't attend a tourney with GK these days.

Draigo is certainly worth a thought. But I'd also consider 3 Invictors led by a Techmarine. I have fully painted 3 models. But wait, power gaming? I'll rethink about it.

The tactics is rather clear. The army hides in turn 1 as much as possible - Dreads, Techmarines and Interceptors start on the field.
In turn 2, the Strikes and GMNK's deep strike and the Interceptors shunt. This gives me a lot of storm bolter shots.
Recently, I played a unit of Paladins which also started on the field and used the gate in turn 2 to move forward.
It certainly gives me an overweight in my turn 2, but some armies are too resilient against storm bolters.
Nevertheless, if everything works well, I can bring in round 2 all weapons to bear!

What I appreciate is that the army is about 200 pts cheaper at the 2000 pts level. It would give a much larger Paladin squad. In the last game vs. CMS they were dead in round 2 - three wounds per model didn't save them.

Here is the 2000 pt list with Draigo + Paladins:

Spoiler:

New Roster (Warhammer 40,000 8th Edition) [151 PL, 1,995pts]

Battalion Detachment +5CP (Imperium - Grey Knights) [81 PL, 991pts]

HQ

Grand Master in Nemesis Dreadknight [14 PL, 214pts]
Selections: Dreadfist, Dreadfist, Dreadknight teleporter, Gatling Psilencer, Heavy Incinerator, Sanctuary

Grand Master in Nemesis Dreadknight [14 PL, 214pts]
Selections: Dreadfist, Dreadfist, Dreadknight teleporter, Gatling Psilencer, Heavy Incinerator, Sanctuary

Troops

Strike Squad [7 PL, 85pts]
Selections: Gate of Infinity
4x Grey Knight (Sword)
Selections: 4x Nemesis Force Sword, 4x Storm Bolter
Grey Knight Justicar
Selections: Storm bolter
Nemesis Force Sword
Selections: Nemesis Force Sword

Strike Squad [7 PL, 85pts]
Selections: Hammerhand
4x Grey Knight (Sword)
Selections: 4x Nemesis Force Sword, 4x Storm Bolter
Grey Knight Justicar
Selections: Storm bolter
Nemesis Force Sword
Selections: Nemesis Force Sword

Strike Squad [7 PL, 85pts]
Selections: Hammerhand
4x Grey Knight (Sword)
Selections: 4x Nemesis Force Sword, 4x Storm Bolter
Grey Knight Justicar
Selections: Storm bolter
Nemesis Force Sword
Selections: Nemesis Force Sword

Elites

Paladin Squad [32 PL, 308pts]
Selections: Gate of Infinity
6x Paladin (Sword)
Selections: 6x Nemesis Force Sword, 6x Storm Bolter
Paragon
Selections: Storm Bolter
Nemesis Force Sword
Selections: Nemesis Force Sword

Outrider Detachment +1CP (Imperium - Grey Knights) [31 PL, 371pts]

HQ

Techmarine [7 PL, 71pts]
Selections: Boltgun, Power axe, Vortex of Doom
Servo-arms (CODEX)
Selections: Flamer, Plasma cutter

Fast Attack

Interceptor Squad [8 PL, 100pts]
Selections: Hammerhand
4x Interceptor (Sword)
Selections: 4x Nemesis Force Sword, 4x Storm Bolter
Interceptor Justicar
Selections: Storm bolter
Nemesis Force Sword
Selections: Nemesis Force Sword

Interceptor Squad [8 PL, 100pts]
Selections: Hammerhand
4x Interceptor (Sword)
Selections: 4x Nemesis Force Sword, 4x Storm Bolter
Interceptor Justicar
Selections: Storm bolter
Nemesis Force Sword
Selections: Nemesis Force Sword

Interceptor Squad [8 PL, 100pts]
Selections: Hammerhand
4x Interceptor (Sword)
Selections: 4x Nemesis Force Sword, 4x Storm Bolter
Interceptor Justicar
Selections: Storm bolter
Nemesis Force Sword
Selections: Nemesis Force Sword

Vanguard Detachment +1CP (Imperium - Grey Knights) [39 PL, 633pts]

HQ

Lord Kaldor Draigo [12 PL, 180pts]
Selections: 1: Daemon Slayer, Gate of Infinity, Hammerhand, Warlord

Elites

Venerable Dreadnought [9 PL, 151pts]
Twin Autocannon (Index)
Selections: Twin autocannon
Twin Autocannon (Index)
Selections: Twin autocannon

Venerable Dreadnought [9 PL, 151pts]
Twin Autocannon (Index)
Selections: Twin autocannon
Twin Autocannon (Index)
Selections: Twin autocannon

Venerable Dreadnought [9 PL, 151pts]
Twin Autocannon (Index)
Selections: Twin autocannon
Twin Autocannon (Index)
Selections: Twin autocannon

Created with BattleScribe

This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at 2019/12/14 13:06:06


Former moderator 40kOnline

Lanchester's square law - please obey in list building!

Illumini: "And thank you for not finishing your post with a "" I'm sorry, but after 7200 's that has to be the most annoying sign-off ever."

Armies: Eldar, Necrons, Blood Angels, Grey Knights; World Eaters (30k); Bloodbound; Cryx, Circle, Cyriss 
   
Made in us
Devestating Grey Knight Dreadknight




San Diego, CA

I don’t think paladins are worth it. If you want tough 3W infantry, Custodes are better for the points. What we have are high damage-output infantry with innate deepstrike. I still think that spamming strike squads and interceptors is probably better than a paladin blob; a lot depends on what psychic awakening gives us though.



Automatically Appended Next Post:
Played a game with basically the same list I took to LVO two years ago, it went down to 1628 points. I added paladins, draigo, and a ven dread. Long story short, I merely had 350 extra points for my opponent (pure drukhari) to kill. I'm holding off until PA to really start building.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/12/15 01:12:40


Hope is the first step on the road to disappointment.
 
   
Made in de
Ladies Love the Vibro-Cannon Operator






Hamburg

 greyknight12 wrote:
I don’t think paladins are worth it. If you want tough 3W infantry, Custodes are better for the points. What we have are high damage-output infantry with innate deepstrike. I still think that spamming strike squads and interceptors is probably better than a paladin blob; a lot depends on what psychic awakening gives us though.

Well, that's too unfluffy for me.
I know that Paladines die too easily.
I could imagine 2 Armiger Hellglaives.

Former moderator 40kOnline

Lanchester's square law - please obey in list building!

Illumini: "And thank you for not finishing your post with a "" I'm sorry, but after 7200 's that has to be the most annoying sign-off ever."

Armies: Eldar, Necrons, Blood Angels, Grey Knights; World Eaters (30k); Bloodbound; Cryx, Circle, Cyriss 
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut




 greyknight12 wrote:
I don’t think paladins are worth it. If you want tough 3W infantry, Custodes are better for the points. What we have are high damage-output infantry with innate deepstrike. I still think that spamming strike squads and interceptors is probably better than a paladin blob; a lot depends on what psychic awakening gives us though.



Automatically Appended Next Post:
Played a game with basically the same list I took to LVO two years ago, it went down to 1628 points. I added paladins, draigo, and a ven dread. Long story short, I merely had 350 extra points for my opponent (pure drukhari) to kill. I'm holding off until PA to really start building.

Cistodes are better, but if we are talking about Grey Knights themselves, there's simply no reason to pick Terminators over Paladins.

CaptainStabby wrote:
If Tyberos falls and needs to catch himself it's because the ground needed killing.

 jy2 wrote:
BTW, I can't wait to run Double-D-thirsters! Man, just thinking about it gets me Khorney.

 vipoid wrote:
Indeed - what sort of bastard would want to use their codex?

 MarsNZ wrote:
ITT: SoB players upset that they're receiving the same condescending treatment that they've doled out in every CSM thread ever.
 
   
Made in us
Devestating Grey Knight Dreadknight




San Diego, CA

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
 greyknight12 wrote:
I don’t think paladins are worth it. If you want tough 3W infantry, Custodes are better for the points. What we have are high damage-output infantry with innate deepstrike. I still think that spamming strike squads and interceptors is probably better than a paladin blob; a lot depends on what psychic awakening gives us though.



Automatically Appended Next Post:
Played a game with basically the same list I took to LVO two years ago, it went down to 1628 points. I added paladins, draigo, and a ven dread. Long story short, I merely had 350 extra points for my opponent (pure drukhari) to kill. I'm holding off until PA to really start building.

Cistodes are better, but if we are talking about Grey Knights themselves, there's simply no reason to pick Terminators over Paladins.

Agreed, I’m also saying there’s not a reason to pick terminators either. I just think the damage output from power armored dudes is better and worth the survivablity decrease. But again. Psychic awakening is right around the corner.

Hope is the first step on the road to disappointment.
 
   
Made in us
Shas'o Commanding the Hunter Kadre




Olympia, WA

Kaldor Draigo is really just so good that he would be impossible not to take in MOST lists.

Hold out bait to entice the enemy. Feign disorder, and then crush him.
-Sun Tzu, the Art of War
http://www.40kunorthodoxy.blogspot.com

7th Ambassadorial Grand Tournament Registration: http://40kambassadors.com/register.php 
   
Made in de
Ladies Love the Vibro-Cannon Operator






Hamburg

 Jancoran wrote:
Kaldor Draigo is really just so good that he would be impossible not to take in MOST lists.

Seconded.
But I also like the GMNK as this guy is something my opponents fear when they arrive at the battle field in round 2 - close and personal.

Former moderator 40kOnline

Lanchester's square law - please obey in list building!

Illumini: "And thank you for not finishing your post with a "" I'm sorry, but after 7200 's that has to be the most annoying sign-off ever."

Armies: Eldar, Necrons, Blood Angels, Grey Knights; World Eaters (30k); Bloodbound; Cryx, Circle, Cyriss 
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut




 Jancoran wrote:
Kaldor Draigo is really just so good that he would be impossible not to take in MOST lists.

As long as Dreadknights exist, Draigo can be skipped completely.

CaptainStabby wrote:
If Tyberos falls and needs to catch himself it's because the ground needed killing.

 jy2 wrote:
BTW, I can't wait to run Double-D-thirsters! Man, just thinking about it gets me Khorney.

 vipoid wrote:
Indeed - what sort of bastard would want to use their codex?

 MarsNZ wrote:
ITT: SoB players upset that they're receiving the same condescending treatment that they've doled out in every CSM thread ever.
 
   
Made in au
Neophyte undergoing Ritual of Detestation





 wuestenfux wrote:
 Jancoran wrote:
Kaldor Draigo is really just so good that he would be impossible not to take in MOST lists.

Seconded.
But I also like the GMNK as this guy is something my opponents fear when they arrive at the battle field in round 2 - close and personal.


Agreed.

Draigo hits hard, buffs hard, is hard to budge (3++, W7 and Character protection), and is solid in the Psychic phase (2 casts and 2 DtW) too!

GoI Draigo in the middle of a group of 20 GK Infantry and he will make sure you're re-rolling those 1s and 2s for either your 40-80 bolter shots...or up to 96 psilencer shots (both types of shooting which can be improved with our ammo/onslaught stratagems).

 
   
Made in de
Ladies Love the Vibro-Cannon Operator






Hamburg

 Waking Dreamer wrote:
 wuestenfux wrote:
 Jancoran wrote:
Kaldor Draigo is really just so good that he would be impossible not to take in MOST lists.

Seconded.
But I also like the GMNK as this guy is something my opponents fear when they arrive at the battle field in round 2 - close and personal.


Agreed.

Draigo hits hard, buffs hard, is hard to budge (3++, W7 and Character protection), and is solid in the Psychic phase (2 casts and 2 DtW) too!

GoI Draigo in the middle of a group of 20 GK Infantry and he will make sure you're re-rolling those 1s and 2s for either your 40-80 bolter shots...or up to 96 psilencer shots (both types of shooting which can be improved with our ammo/onslaught stratagems).

Ouch!
Draigo is a decent force multiplier!

Former moderator 40kOnline

Lanchester's square law - please obey in list building!

Illumini: "And thank you for not finishing your post with a "" I'm sorry, but after 7200 's that has to be the most annoying sign-off ever."

Armies: Eldar, Necrons, Blood Angels, Grey Knights; World Eaters (30k); Bloodbound; Cryx, Circle, Cyriss 
   
Made in au
Neophyte undergoing Ritual of Detestation





 wuestenfux wrote:

Ouch!
Draigo is a decent force multiplier!


Draigo in a tournament list surrounded by 20 psilencer-armed Purgation Infantry, apparently did well in a tournament earlier this year.

So yeah, if you use him properly and protect him, he can buff your GK army up a notch.

 
   
Made in us
Guarded Grey Knight Terminator






Draigo is super flexible too! He is great as a force boost with Aura and psychic powers. He can also operate on his own as well as a psychic bomb/flank. While I don't suggest that often, I've had him weasel his way into a back line by himself and tear through gun lines with his psychic might and his arm.

He is fantastic as a counter charge unit vs something big. He can realistically put quite a few wounds on something like a Knight or another scary melee unit.

Want to see a demon primarch die? He does that. They all run in terror from him. (Looking at you Mortarian).

And for what he does, he is very reasonable in price.

This dude does it all except be there warlord. He sucks as a warlord.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/12/16 17:52:21


"Glory in our suffering, because we know that suffering produces perseverance; perseverance, character; and character, hope. And hope does not disappoint"
-Paul of Tarsus

If my post seems goofy, assume I am posting from my phone and the autocorrect elf in my phone is drunk again 
   
Made in us
Ultramarine Chaplain with Hate to Spare






 greyknight12 wrote:
I don’t think paladins are worth it. If you want tough 3W infantry, Custodes are better for the points. What we have are high damage-output infantry with innate deepstrike. I still think that spamming strike squads and interceptors is probably better than a paladin blob; a lot depends on what psychic awakening gives us though.



Automatically Appended Next Post:
Played a game with basically the same list I took to LVO two years ago, it went down to 1628 points. I added paladins, draigo, and a ven dread. Long story short, I merely had 350 extra points for my opponent (pure drukhari) to kill. I'm holding off until PA to really start building.
I gotta agree. I took a 10 man paladin in my last game and It's impact was so low 4 heavies and 4 hammers. For the price you get 3 NDK now with max build...I mean...It's really no comparison. Also the 25ish interceptors would have been a lot better too.

If we fail to anticipate the unforeseen or expect the unexpected in a universe of infinite possibilities, we may find ourselves at the mercy of anyone or anything that cannot be programmed, categorized or easily referenced.
- Fox Mulder 
   
Made in us
Guarded Grey Knight Terminator






Interceptors I think are really priced well now. I want to start running 30 of them.

Then -IF- we get a Chaplin who can use litanies, who can improve charges (comeon PA!), then give him GOI and teleport him up too. Make him warlord for reroll charge.

In that one guy we will have +2 charge, reroll charge, reroll attacks in CC from 31 bodies. Bring an inqy in the army to bring the ability to deny overwatch. Laugh on turn one when all those bodies get into cc and crush our foes. Orks will be jealous of our speed and cc output.

And as we start into a heavier CC meta, that mobility will be very useful. Even more so when they get doctrines.

Either way, I think they are very useful at this price point. Even now, them hitting a flank early with a teleported gm for rerolls is a lot of bolter hate. Further you could add to their survivability by teleporting a metal bawks to block line of sight from retaliation.

Lots of tactics here.



This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at 2019/12/17 14:22:16


"Glory in our suffering, because we know that suffering produces perseverance; perseverance, character; and character, hope. And hope does not disappoint"
-Paul of Tarsus

If my post seems goofy, assume I am posting from my phone and the autocorrect elf in my phone is drunk again 
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut




Yeah, Interceptors and Paladins (well compared to other things) seem to be the strong suit. Not counting GM Dreadknights of course.

At least that one quickie list I put together for that one poster will have went down significantly in points. I definitely want to see how that goes.

CaptainStabby wrote:
If Tyberos falls and needs to catch himself it's because the ground needed killing.

 jy2 wrote:
BTW, I can't wait to run Double-D-thirsters! Man, just thinking about it gets me Khorney.

 vipoid wrote:
Indeed - what sort of bastard would want to use their codex?

 MarsNZ wrote:
ITT: SoB players upset that they're receiving the same condescending treatment that they've doled out in every CSM thread ever.
 
   
Made in de
Ladies Love the Vibro-Cannon Operator






Hamburg

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
Yeah, Interceptors and Paladins (well compared to other things) seem to be the strong suit. Not counting GM Dreadknights of course.

At least that one quickie list I put together for that one poster will have went down significantly in points. I definitely want to see how that goes.

Both, Interceptors and Strikes are equally useful.
Let the Strikes deep strike in round 2 and let the Interceptors shunt in round 2 and keep them out of sight as much as possible in round 1.

Paladins die too easily. My experience in my last game vs. Chaos. If the enemy has too many multi-wound weapons, its better to have only Strikes or Interceptors.

Former moderator 40kOnline

Lanchester's square law - please obey in list building!

Illumini: "And thank you for not finishing your post with a "" I'm sorry, but after 7200 's that has to be the most annoying sign-off ever."

Armies: Eldar, Necrons, Blood Angels, Grey Knights; World Eaters (30k); Bloodbound; Cryx, Circle, Cyriss 
   
Made in us
Shas'o Commanding the Hunter Kadre




Olympia, WA

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:


 Jancoran wrote:
Kaldor Draigo is really just so good that he would be impossible not to take in MOST lists.

As long as Dreadknights exist, Draigo can be skipped completely.


Well... No. I think that passing him up when he is so potent would seem odd at best. He's MUCH easier to hide. He's better at buffing. He's an absolute beast in close combat. Just the fact that he can avoid all damage until he's ready to deal it is pretty sweet.



Hold out bait to entice the enemy. Feign disorder, and then crush him.
-Sun Tzu, the Art of War
http://www.40kunorthodoxy.blogspot.com

7th Ambassadorial Grand Tournament Registration: http://40kambassadors.com/register.php 
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut




 Jancoran wrote:
Slayer-Fan123 wrote:


 Jancoran wrote:
Kaldor Draigo is really just so good that he would be impossible not to take in MOST lists.

As long as Dreadknights exist, Draigo can be skipped completely.


Well... No. I think that passing him up when he is so potent would seem odd at best. He's MUCH easier to hide. He's better at buffing. He's an absolute beast in close combat. Just the fact that he can avoid all damage until he's ready to deal it is pretty sweet.



His damage is nothing compared to getting a Dreadknight, sorry. Especially with the range damage output + hammer hitting things. They also don't have the issue of needing to get into melee compared to Draigo, who is just an expensive baby sitter in an already expensive army.

CaptainStabby wrote:
If Tyberos falls and needs to catch himself it's because the ground needed killing.

 jy2 wrote:
BTW, I can't wait to run Double-D-thirsters! Man, just thinking about it gets me Khorney.

 vipoid wrote:
Indeed - what sort of bastard would want to use their codex?

 MarsNZ wrote:
ITT: SoB players upset that they're receiving the same condescending treatment that they've doled out in every CSM thread ever.
 
   
Made in us
Ultramarine Chaplain with Hate to Spare






Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
 Jancoran wrote:
Slayer-Fan123 wrote:


 Jancoran wrote:
Kaldor Draigo is really just so good that he would be impossible not to take in MOST lists.

As long as Dreadknights exist, Draigo can be skipped completely.


Well... No. I think that passing him up when he is so potent would seem odd at best. He's MUCH easier to hide. He's better at buffing. He's an absolute beast in close combat. Just the fact that he can avoid all damage until he's ready to deal it is pretty sweet.



His damage is nothing compared to getting a Dreadknight, sorry. Especially with the range damage output + hammer hitting things. They also don't have the issue of needing to get into melee compared to Draigo, who is just an expensive baby sitter in an already expensive army.

Yeah a DK hits harder and has guns. I bet we get a new draigo model and his aura goes to reroll all hits. Which would make him that much better.

If we fail to anticipate the unforeseen or expect the unexpected in a universe of infinite possibilities, we may find ourselves at the mercy of anyone or anything that cannot be programmed, categorized or easily referenced.
- Fox Mulder 
   
Made in us
Utilizing Careful Highlighting





Augusta GA

I’ve been trying out normal barebones Dreadknights with swords and they do pretty well for 120 points. They’re as durable as a grandmaster to anything but the heaviest weapons and perform nearly the same with rerolls. Instead of 3 gmndk’s I’m doing 2 dreads supported by 1 grandmaster, and it’s saving a ton of points. Also lets me take one purgation squad for an easy heavy support detachment.
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut




 Badablack wrote:
I’ve been trying out normal barebones Dreadknights with swords and they do pretty well for 120 points. They’re as durable as a grandmaster to anything but the heaviest weapons and perform nearly the same with rerolls. Instead of 3 gmndk’s I’m doing 2 dreads supported by 1 grandmaster, and it’s saving a ton of points. Also lets me take one purgation squad for an easy heavy support detachment.

Dreadknights are fine with either just fists or Sword, and just equipped with a Incinerator. Keep them as cheap as possible.

CaptainStabby wrote:
If Tyberos falls and needs to catch himself it's because the ground needed killing.

 jy2 wrote:
BTW, I can't wait to run Double-D-thirsters! Man, just thinking about it gets me Khorney.

 vipoid wrote:
Indeed - what sort of bastard would want to use their codex?

 MarsNZ wrote:
ITT: SoB players upset that they're receiving the same condescending treatment that they've doled out in every CSM thread ever.
 
   
Made in us
Shas'o Commanding the Hunter Kadre




Olympia, WA

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
 Jancoran wrote:
Slayer-Fan123 wrote:


 Jancoran wrote:
Kaldor Draigo is really just so good that he would be impossible not to take in MOST lists.

As long as Dreadknights exist, Draigo can be skipped completely.


Well... No. I think that passing him up when he is so potent would seem odd at best. He's MUCH easier to hide. He's better at buffing. He's an absolute beast in close combat. Just the fact that he can avoid all damage until he's ready to deal it is pretty sweet.



His damage is nothing compared to getting a Dreadknight, sorry. Especially with the range damage output + hammer hitting things. They also don't have the issue of needing to get into melee compared to Draigo, who is just an expensive baby sitter in an already expensive army.


What good is all the money in the world if you're not alive to spend it?

Hold out bait to entice the enemy. Feign disorder, and then crush him.
-Sun Tzu, the Art of War
http://www.40kunorthodoxy.blogspot.com

7th Ambassadorial Grand Tournament Registration: http://40kambassadors.com/register.php 
   
Made in au
Neophyte undergoing Ritual of Detestation





 Jancoran wrote:
Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
 Jancoran wrote:
Slayer-Fan123 wrote:


As long as Dreadknights exist, Draigo can be skipped completely.


Well... No. I think that passing him up when he is so potent would seem odd at best. He's MUCH easier to hide. He's better at buffing. He's an absolute beast in close combat. Just the fact that he can avoid all damage until he's ready to deal it is pretty sweet.



His damage is nothing compared to getting a Dreadknight, sorry. Especially with the range damage output + hammer hitting things. They also don't have the issue of needing to get into melee compared to Draigo, who is just an expensive baby sitter in an already expensive army.


What good is all the money in the world if you're not alive to spend it?


It's not uncommon for a GMNDK to die in your first turn if your opponent goes first. Draigo has never been picked off in the first turn no matter what, in my experience.

Some of my local GK players have decided to drop GMNDKs all together...they're way too much of a high priority target. They're thinking of running bare bones NDKs just to distract the opponents and have them fire everything into them first turn instead. They are going to rely GK infantry Characters to do the work..

 
   
Made in us
Devestating Grey Knight Dreadknight




San Diego, CA

I think if you run GMDKs you should never run more than 2, and probably keep them in deepstrike unless you’re going first. 3++ is their only hope of staying alive, and your opponent has nothing else to shoot his AT weapons into

Hope is the first step on the road to disappointment.
 
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut




 Jancoran wrote:
Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
 Jancoran wrote:
Slayer-Fan123 wrote:


 Jancoran wrote:
Kaldor Draigo is really just so good that he would be impossible not to take in MOST lists.

As long as Dreadknights exist, Draigo can be skipped completely.


Well... No. I think that passing him up when he is so potent would seem odd at best. He's MUCH easier to hide. He's better at buffing. He's an absolute beast in close combat. Just the fact that he can avoid all damage until he's ready to deal it is pretty sweet.



His damage is nothing compared to getting a Dreadknight, sorry. Especially with the range damage output + hammer hitting things. They also don't have the issue of needing to get into melee compared to Draigo, who is just an expensive baby sitter in an already expensive army.


What good is all the money in the world if you're not alive to spend it?

What good is the necklace that looks nicer but doesn't get worn?

CaptainStabby wrote:
If Tyberos falls and needs to catch himself it's because the ground needed killing.

 jy2 wrote:
BTW, I can't wait to run Double-D-thirsters! Man, just thinking about it gets me Khorney.

 vipoid wrote:
Indeed - what sort of bastard would want to use their codex?

 MarsNZ wrote:
ITT: SoB players upset that they're receiving the same condescending treatment that they've doled out in every CSM thread ever.
 
   
Made in us
Guarded Grey Knight Terminator






 greyknight12 wrote:
I think if you run GMDKs you should never run more than 2, and probably keep them in deepstrike unless you’re going first. 3++ is their only hope of staying alive, and your opponent has nothing else to shoot his AT weapons into


I honestly only run one now. I give him the teleporter, and depending on the opponent, I either deepstrike him or hide him. Depends.

"Glory in our suffering, because we know that suffering produces perseverance; perseverance, character; and character, hope. And hope does not disappoint"
-Paul of Tarsus

If my post seems goofy, assume I am posting from my phone and the autocorrect elf in my phone is drunk again 
   
Made in au
Neophyte undergoing Ritual of Detestation





 Smotejob wrote:
 greyknight12 wrote:
I think if you run GMDKs you should never run more than 2, and probably keep them in deepstrike unless you’re going first. 3++ is their only hope of staying alive, and your opponent has nothing else to shoot his AT weapons into


I honestly only run one now. I give him the teleporter, and depending on the opponent, I either deepstrike him or hide him. Depends.


Yeah, any experienced opponent knows that taking down our GMNDK is halfway to their victory already. GW didn't need to nerf the 2++ on our GMNDK, especially since they were going to roll out SM Supplements by the end of the year anyway.

 
   
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 Waking Dreamer wrote:
 Smotejob wrote:
 greyknight12 wrote:
I think if you run GMDKs you should never run more than 2, and probably keep them in deepstrike unless you’re going first. 3++ is their only hope of staying alive, and your opponent has nothing else to shoot his AT weapons into


I honestly only run one now. I give him the teleporter, and depending on the opponent, I either deepstrike him or hide him. Depends.


Yeah, any experienced opponent knows that taking down our GMNDK is halfway to their victory already. GW didn't need to nerf the 2++ on our GMNDK, especially since they were going to roll out SM Supplements by the end of the year anyway.


Yeah Draigo is just easier to hide and more sure to impact the game for the longest amount of time by far. If you wanna take him AND a big boy (as a distraction), it isn't necessarily the wrong call at all. It's just that you know full well there's no way to protect the big boy, so I cant see how you'd want to choose the big guy FIRST. You'd want to put Draigo in the list and fit the big boy in if you can.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Waking Dreamer wrote:

It's not uncommon for a GMNDK to die in your first turn if your opponent goes first. Draigo has never been picked off in the first turn no matter what, in my experience.

Some of my local GK players have decided to drop GMNDKs all together...they're way too much of a high priority target....


True story.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/12/18 06:41:26


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 Waking Dreamer wrote:
 Smotejob wrote:
 greyknight12 wrote:
I think if you run GMDKs you should never run more than 2, and probably keep them in deepstrike unless you’re going first. 3++ is their only hope of staying alive, and your opponent has nothing else to shoot his AT weapons into


I honestly only run one now. I give him the teleporter, and depending on the opponent, I either deepstrike him or hide him. Depends.


Yeah, any experienced opponent knows that taking down our GMNDK is halfway to their victory already. GW didn't need to nerf the 2++ on our GMNDK, especially since they were going to roll out SM Supplements by the end of the year anyway.


IMO just because marines don't have trouble with dealing with 2++ GMNDK isn't good reason for that. Some armies are having hard enough time with 3++ nevermind 2++. S4 AP0 D1 shots aren't all that ideal with dealing with 2++ GMNDK and when it's that or weapons like melta gun...

Rather nerf the marines to reasonable level(not much they will struggle to deal with...) and buff rest of the GK's so it's not just codex: GMNDK would be route I would go with.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/12/18 07:47:51


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 Waking Dreamer wrote:
 Smotejob wrote:
 greyknight12 wrote:
I think if you run GMDKs you should never run more than 2, and probably keep them in deepstrike unless you’re going first. 3++ is their only hope of staying alive, and your opponent has nothing else to shoot his AT weapons into


I honestly only run one now. I give him the teleporter, and depending on the opponent, I either deepstrike him or hide him. Depends.


Yeah, any experienced opponent knows that taking down our GMNDK is halfway to their victory already. GW didn't need to nerf the 2++ on our GMNDK, especially since they were going to roll out SM Supplements by the end of the year anyway.

Well all of your problems seem to be only taking two and wondering why they die. The game is all about redundancy in the list phase. You take three for threat saturation and flexible deployment. Never make any of them a Warlord because that's silly, not that any of the Warlord traits are good anyway outside the rerolling charges.

It isn't like they're THAT easy to kill either. Meanwhile Draigo pays an insane amount for melee he won't use unless your opponents are literally stupid and then the additional rerolling of 2s. He is not worth it whatsoever.

CaptainStabby wrote:
If Tyberos falls and needs to catch himself it's because the ground needed killing.

 jy2 wrote:
BTW, I can't wait to run Double-D-thirsters! Man, just thinking about it gets me Khorney.

 vipoid wrote:
Indeed - what sort of bastard would want to use their codex?

 MarsNZ wrote:
ITT: SoB players upset that they're receiving the same condescending treatment that they've doled out in every CSM thread ever.
 
   
 
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