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Rune Priest w/ terminator armor, melta bombs, jaws, ***

10 Wolf Guard Terminators w/ power fist x2, cyclone x2

10 Wolf Guard Terminators w/ power fist x2, cyclone x2

10 Grey Hunters w/ melta x2, Rhino

10 Grey Hunters w/ melta x2, Rhino

10 Grey Hunters w/ melta x2, Rhino

5 Long Fangs w/ missile launcher x4

5 Long Fangs w/ missile launcher x4

WG Termies and Grey Hunters approach while the Long Fangs give fire support.

Just one question: what would you do against a Redeemer with rhino killing long range support ?

Ragnar Blackmane wrote:Just one question: what would you do against a Redeemer with rhino killing long range support ?

Probably meltagun its pants off and then charge whatever is inside with up to 20 WG termies...

As for the list: I feel like a lot of the points tied up in the Termies are wasted. They'll be walking, which makes them ultra slow. You've got the Long Fangs to try to hamstring opposing mobility (if it comes from tanks/mech elements) but I still feel like it isn't altogether difficult to remove them from the game by deploying smartly and then playing around them (or perhaps take on one unit of them at a time). I guess it feels one dimensional and a little blunt to me.

I really feel like the beauty of the SW book is that you can build a very strong army out of it without removing the character and soul of the list in the process. This just feels like the same type of cookie-cutter stuff you see coming from the other books. Sure, that is effective for SW but it will also force you to suffer from the same thing most other copy/paste type lists suffer from, and that is a lack of flexibility/diversity and thus ability to adapt to awkward situations. There are so many good combinations of units within the book and there is so much synergy between units within it that I don't really see the point in ignoring it.

Don't get me wrong, this is a fairly strong list, I guess I just disagree on the style of the army as it pertains to the other available options in the SW codex. I'm a bit hesitant to suggest changes because the way I would change it personally would drastically alter the style of the list.

I will suggest Living Lightning, Murerous Hurricane or Tempest as the second WG power. All 3 of them are quite good.

It's way to slow for the competitive scene. Even your one psychic choice is only 24 in. Eldar jet bike, IG mech, etc will destroy this list. The heavies are vulnerable to shelling from from mechs because your front line can't cause enough instant pressure.

16 strength 8 shots @ 48 inch range at six different targets seems effective to me.

Oh, and good luck going trying to lay waste to over 60+ marines!

Certainly has potential.

wuestenfux wrote:Rune Priest w/ terminator armor, melta bombs, jaws, ***

10 Wolf Guard Terminators w/ power fist x2, cyclone x2

10 Wolf Guard Terminators w/ power fist x2, cyclone x2

10 Grey Hunters w/ melta x2, Rhino

10 Grey Hunters w/ melta x2, Rhino

10 Grey Hunters w/ melta x2, Rhino

5 Long Fangs w/ missile launcher x4

5 Long Fangs w/ missile launcher x4

WG Termies and Grey Hunters approach while the Long Fangs give fire support.

Instead of 2 10 man WG units maybe take:

5 WG termies: DP, 1 PF, 1 Cyclone _ Cyclone Joins LF _ RP joins this Squad
6 WG termies: DP, 2 PF, 1 Cyclone _ Cyclone Joins LF
5 WG Termies: DP, 1 PF, 1 Cyclone

Gives a bit more mobility with 2 units dropping in on the first turn.

aye, what he (wyomingfox) said!

NotThisTime wrote:16 strength 8 shots @ 48 inch range at six different targets seems effective to me.

Oh, and good luck going trying to lay waste to over 60+ marines!

Certainly has potential.

Don't have to kill 60.. I can deal with the LF first.. pop rhinos.. then kill termies at my pace because they're walking.

WarmasterScott wrote:Don't have to kill 60.. I can deal with the LF first.. pop rhinos.. then kill termies at my pace because they're walking.

I don't think walking them is that bad. You can screen ap 2 from shooting them with the GH rhinos, while they make use of the 8 storm bolters and 2 CML in each squad.

It might be worth making one squad smaller to fill out another LF squad, but it's probably a wash as you just trade firepower for survivability.

Well, its a frontal approach. No outflankers or deep strikers.
However, I find that this army has some potential.
The Rhinos would a bit ahead of the Termies but the Termies can shoot each round,
and the approach of these squads is supported by the Long Fangs.

Don't have to kill 60.. I can deal with the LF first.. pop rhinos.. then kill termies at my pace because they're walking.

Not sure if you'll have the time to take on these squads sequentially.
While you deal with the LF's and the Rhinos, the Termies can be in your face.

wuestenfux wrote:Well, its a frontal approach. No outflankers or deep strikers.
However, I find that this army has some potential.
The Rhinos would a bit ahead of the Termies but the Termies can shoot each round,
and the approach of these squads is supported by the Long Fangs.

Don't have to kill 60.. I can deal with the LF first.. pop rhinos.. then kill termies at my pace because they're walking.

Not sure if you'll have the time to take on these squads sequentially.
While you deal with the LF's and the Rhinos, the Termies can be in your face.

yea doubt the termies will be in my face vs my eldar and IG list. I never said it was a crappy list, just slow when it cam to tournaments. Most tournies here in Orlando are loaded with long range meqs, speed freaks, etc. Footslogging just isn't as a solid of a choice here. For my wolf lists I had to use drop pods for my dreads, and some form of fast attack to give the slower stuff time to do it's thing. I get about 2 turns before the rhino(with the way his are equiped) to even factor as a threat, Th long fangs first because of all their rockets, and how would termies be in my face if they're shooting those rockets? It's heavy..

and how would termies be in my face if they're shooting those rockets? It's heavy..

Termies are heavy-weapon platforms and can shoot heavy weapons after moving.

wuestenfux wrote:

and how would termies be in my face if they're shooting those rockets? It's heavy..

Termies are heavy-weapon platforms and can shoot heavy weapons after moving.

yea 6".. That would be like 4 turns to get to my stuff.. Just curious why you wanna debate my statement of thinking it's too slow. He asked opinions, I gave mine. What's there to debate. If you disagree put you think its fine and move on. I don't wanna bog down a thread with a useless debate. It's not like you can change my mind over a thread lol. So stay on topic and help the guy out.

Giving input to continue with your theme....

I would drop 1 GH squad, and the other two to 5man in your choice of rzr backs to include Logan Grimnar.

That makes your WG troops. Then split them into 5man squads or one at least...this will give you 5-6 tough troop choices....cpl to guard objecties and your long fangs and few to advance, etc.

This will open up a few options if you want to DS a squad, DoW lets you start with bunch of termies half way across the table etc.

You can also walk one squad of Long fangs forward shooting all the time with Logan.

You will be slow, but you will send out the hurt, have a long reach, a accept a charge very well.

For the Runepriest...i would opt for tempest and lightening. Tempest is the best power for foot slogging as it forces all jump infantry, skimmers, Deep strikers to move as in difficult AND dangerous terrain.

Liv. Lightening is a walking D6 auto cannon with unlimited range.

This will give you the opportunity to down many fast moving targest from a distance or forcing them to consider crashing if even getting near you, etc.

If you do take logan...consider making one LF squad multi meltas....the are more effective at tank and big nasty killin', add a WG with SS and a plasma gun on your LF pack ldr...split fire as you advance with lots of shooty deagh...Logan will handle all that try to assault.

my two fangs,
BDS

WarmasterScott wrote:

wuestenfux wrote:

and how would termies be in my face if they're shooting those rockets? It's heavy..

Termies are heavy-weapon platforms and can shoot heavy weapons after moving.

yea 6".. That would be like 4 turns to get to my stuff.. Just curious why you wanna debate my statement of thinking it's too slow. He asked opinions, I gave mine. What's there to debate. If you disagree put you think its fine and move on. I don't wanna bog down a thread with a useless debate. It's not like you can change my mind over a thread lol. So stay on topic and help the guy out.

Well, your opinion is that its too slow.
However, imagine that the Rhinos move 12'' and the GH disembark in rapid-fire range.
The WG Termies are a bit slower but can contribute to the GH shooting thanks to their storm bolters.

WarmasterScott wrote:

wuestenfux wrote:

and how would termies be in my face if they're shooting those rockets? It's heavy..

Termies are heavy-weapon platforms and can shoot heavy weapons after moving.

yea 6".. That would be like 4 turns to get to my stuff.. Just curious why you wanna debate my statement of thinking it's too slow. He asked opinions, I gave mine. What's there to debate. If you disagree put you think its fine and move on. I don't wanna bog down a thread with a useless debate. It's not like you can change my mind over a thread lol. So stay on topic and help the guy out.

Uhm, the guy you quoted (wuestenfux) is the OP of the thread. If he could help 'the guy' (himself) out, then why would he post the army list here?

I do think there are too much points tied up in those Wolf Guard Terminators, though. They aren't scoring either, so a smart opponent will just let them shoot the Cyclone Missile Launchers all game (which makes them a bad investment). If the opponent doesn't want them in combat, they won't get there. I'd replace them with a third Long Fang squad and some Wolf Guard squads in Rhino's / Razorbacks. I'd give the Rune Priest the Living Lightning power. It will almost always be useful. Take Jaws of the World Wolf as well, as it is just too good in certain situations.

wuestenfux wrote:

WarmasterScott wrote:

wuestenfux wrote:

and how would termies be in my face if they're shooting those rockets? It's heavy..

Termies are heavy-weapon platforms and can shoot heavy weapons after moving.

yea 6".. That would be like 4 turns to get to my stuff.. Just curious why you wanna debate my statement of thinking it's too slow. He asked opinions, I gave mine. What's there to debate. If you disagree put you think its fine and move on. I don't wanna bog down a thread with a useless debate. It's not like you can change my mind over a thread lol. So stay on topic and help the guy out.

Well, your opinion is that its too slow.
However, imagine that the Rhinos move 12'' and the GH disembark in rapid-fire range.
The WG Termies are a bit slower but can contribute to the GH shooting thanks to their storm bolters.

hey just because I thought it was slow doesn't mean you have to take my opinion. There were more who liked it. I was just looking at the list as if it was across the table from mine. I would drop my long range firepower into the lf to weaken their numbers. In my IG I have about 11 big str 8+ templates to drop on the fangs. In my csm army I have 11 templates to drop on them so I thought they were a bit exposed. My sw army isn't complete yet so that wouldn't be a fair compare yet nor eldar because it's being revamped. I also felt they were exposed because there would be nothing to be in my face right off the bat(which seems important to a cc army like sw). I don't feel the sw would do well in a long range shoot fest with IG or SM. Also the list isn't fast enough to keep up with mech eldar or orks. So from my exp of tournies and the south us scene the list was a bit too slow. I do think it's a pretty solid list against all comers I just think for tournies you may wanna speed ti up a bit or play the heck out of the list so you have exp and some solid strats against all comers. It could be strong list just not forgiving.c

I believe you are tyring too hard to have shooting in your list. If replace the Long Fangs with 2 units of Scouts and made your Rhinos into Drop Pods then you have a much better chance of getting those Termis into combat as the enemy will have no where on the table that they are safe. The Drop pods and Scouts will force the enemy to move to the center of the table to avoid those threats and your termis can move up and pound them to the ground.

-Good luck

Personally, I think it looks great. Really, I think you might be better off finding a place for Logan + Lascannon Relentless Fangs in there but really, this list does work.