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New, Tzeentch-themed Warriors of Chaos list. Tell me what you think, Dakka!

Please keep in mind that I'm still very new to Fantasy, and trying to figure out all of the ins-and-outs.

Sorcerer Lord
- Level 4 Wizard, Mark of Tzeentch, Spell Familiar, Enchanted Shield, Conjoined Homonculus, Disk of Tzeentch

Chaos Sorcerer
- Level 2 Wizard, Mark of Tzeentch, Dispel Scroll (2)

Chaos Sorcerer
- Level 2 Wizard, Mark of Tzeentch, Infernal Puppet

Exalted Hero
- Sword of Might, Soporific Musk, Shield, Chariot

Chaos Warriors (10)
- Champion, Shields

Chaos Warriors (10)
- Champion, Shields

Maruaders (12)
- Musician, Flails

Marauders (12)
- Musician, Flails

Marauders (12)
- Musician, Flails

Marauders Horsemen (6)
- Throwing Axes

Chaos Warhounds (5)

Chaos Warhounds (5)

Chaos Chariot

Chaos Knights
- Ensorcelled Weapons, Mark of Tzeentch

Im no WOC master player, but i would suggest larger units.
The warriors are allways nice in 15+ units (5x3 rank style)

The marauders i would put into 20+ units.

The static combat res. would help out alot more, and also means they will be taking on better units.

As they stand, WOC have some great base troops with good stats.
the extra combat res. from the ranks would boost that even more, meaning they can start taking out specialised units.

I see the utility of MSU flail marauders myself, there for bait & flank fun. I don't really get the 10-man warrior blocks - I'm guessing they bunker the wizards, with champs to take challenges? Except they have no holding power of their own, so most likely crumpling and giving the sorcerers up anyway.

Really, I've got just a few suggestions:

- Group the warriors together into a healthy 20, full command, rapture or war banner, and slap on MoT. I run 2x 20 tizz warriors, and they make for some insane anvils. Going with 1 super CR-heavy (6 with warbanner), pretty damn killy, pretty damn tough, mage bunkering unit will also ease up your battleline some, as you'll have more room for the marauder units to bait and flank for the tizz anvil. Another use for those flailers, they can escort sorcerers if the enemy aren't heavy on shooting or things fast enough to get to them first.

- Get a better ward for the main man, a single bolter can tag him down pretty easily right now. Golden eye ftw, and I'd take it over the e.shield.

- Find some command (std / mus) for the knights, tizz ones need any help they can get.

- How about a flail on the chariot hero? The chariot mostly needs to blow through things - nice combo with the musk by the way! - and a flail will just emphasize that point. Nice and cheap too, might need the points.

Here's all that in list:

L: Sorcerer Lord - MoT, golden eye, spell familiar, level 4, disc = 350
H: Sorcerer - MoT, 2 scrolls, level 2 = 190
H: Sorcerer - MoT, puppet, level 2 = 175
H: Exalted - MoT, sword of might, musk, shield, chariot = 265

C: 20 Warriors - MoT, warbanner, full command, shields = 395
C: 12 Marauders - musician, flails = 64
C: 12 Marauders - musician, flails = 64
C: 12 Marauders - musician, flails = 64
C: 5 Warhounds = 30
C: 5 Warhounds = 30

S: 5 Knights - MoT, standard, musician = 250
S: Chariot = 120
-------
1997

So yes, the horsemen bit it, as I needed to find some points, and they seemed the most superfluous. Which gave me extra points, that were spent on a MoT for the exalted (mostly so all the characters are tizzified, but he benefits all the same) and let him keep the sword o' might - it does seem pretty decent for protracted combat, and I figure you might have it modeled with a sword + shield as is, so meh.

- Salvage

JD21290 wrote:Im no WOC master player, but i would suggest larger units.
The warriors are allways nice in 15+ units (5x3 rank style)

The marauders i would put into 20+ units.

The static combat res. would help out alot more, and also means they will be taking on better units.

As they stand, WOC have some great base troops with good stats.
the extra combat res. from the ranks would boost that even more, meaning they can start taking out specialised units.

I used to run giant Warrior blocks, but I've found that if they aren't scoring enough CR from casualties, then I'm doing something wrong. Also, I run them 6-wide so that they can maximize the amount of attacks.

Giant Marauder blocks? Definitely no point to that. They run up (2 ranks of 6), bash people with Flails, and die. Giant blocks just die because they don't have any good way of defending themselves.

Boss_Salvage wrote:Really, I've got just a few suggestions:

- Group the warriors together into a healthy 20, full command, rapture or war banner, and slap on MoT. I run 2x 20 tizz warriors, and they make for some insane anvils. Going with 1 super CR-heavy (6 with warbanner), pretty damn killy, pretty damn tough, mage bunkering unit will also ease up your battleline some, as you'll have more room for the marauder units to bait and flank for the tizz anvil. Another use for those flailers, they can escort sorcerers if the enemy aren't heavy on shooting or things fast enough to get to them first.

- Get a better ward for the main man, a single bolter can tag him down pretty easily right now. Golden eye ftw, and I'd take it over the e.shield.

- Find some command (std / mus) for the knights, tizz ones need any help they can get.

- How about a flail on the chariot hero? The chariot mostly needs to blow through things - nice combo with the musk by the way! - and a flail will just emphasize that point. Nice and cheap too, might need the points.

- I used to run my Warriors in giant blocks, and I'm still considering dropping some things to find the points to make them bigger. I've tried one unit of 17, and find that it usually just gets blasted by everything, especially stuff like the Skaven 13th spell, and Infernal Gateways, getting crashed into by Stegs, and so on. Basically, stuff where it doesn't matter how many ranks I have, they're all done for. For now, I'm gonna keep running them small.

- That's definitely a good idea. Golden Eye instead of Enchanted Shield, ho! Also, he's been running with the Marauder Horsemen, taking advantage of the fact that they're Fast Cav to unleash some serious destruction, while allowing him to avoid unsavoury combats (Any combats, really).

- What I'd like to do is find the points to stick on a Blasted Banner. 4+ Ward save vs missiles for them, too. Couldn't go wrong. Musician? Eh. I shouldn't ever tie. If I do, I'm done for anyways.

- Flails are nice... Unfortunately, as you pointed out, I've got him modelled Sword-and-Shield, and I enjoy the ability to harm things that need magic weapons to do so. I may still tear him apart to get a Flail instead.

Anyway. Thanks for all the suggestions, guys, and keep 'em coming!

MinMax wrote:
- I used to run my Warriors in giant blocks, and I'm still considering dropping some things to find the points to make them bigger. I've tried one unit of 17, and find that it usually just gets blasted by everything, especially stuff like the Skaven 13th spell, and Infernal Gateways, getting crashed into by Stegs, and so on. Basically, stuff where it doesn't matter how many ranks I have, they're all done for. For now, I'm gonna keep running them small.

- That's definitely a good idea. Golden Eye instead of Enchanted Shield, ho! Also, he's been running with the Marauder Horsemen, taking advantage of the fact that they're Fast Cav to unleash some serious destruction, while allowing him to avoid unsavoury combats (Any combats, really).

- What I'd like to do is find the points to stick on a Blasted Banner. 4+ Ward save vs missiles for them, too. Couldn't go wrong. Musician? Eh. I shouldn't ever tie. If I do, I'm done for anyways.

- Flails are nice... Unfortunately, as you pointed out, I've got him modelled Sword-and-Shield, and I enjoy the ability to harm things that need magic weapons to do so. I may still tear him apart to get a Flail instead.

- Suit yourself, though I have little idea what 10 warriors + champ are going to do against anything serious or with CR5. Maybe combo-charge ftw is what you've got in mind ...

- Note that a character on a disk cannot join any unit in the WoC army (if there were a flying cavalry unit than maybe he could join them, but I'm not even sure of that), hence the need for the eye to keep him around even more, with no meatshields to sop wounds.

- IMO it's hard to think of a combat unit that should have a musician more than non-Khorne knights, who are relying on fighting to win combats and back up their puny static CR1. 10 pts saves you the embarasment of failing a Ld7 break when those big bad dudes can't muster that last kill and get drummed off the field (and with no Ld9 rally test next turn ). Or in another way of thinking, run the math on how many attaks it would take to make that last wound, and a musician is probably cheaper than adding more knights.

- Charging the chariot into ethereal things is probably bad, as all the impacts and crew attaks are wasted ... but yes, modeling > maximizing for me too.

- Salvage

All right. Followed your advice, added more Warriors. I can't believe I didn't want to add more Warriors, before. Warriors are my favourite unit! Am I crazy? I must be crazy.

Sorcerer Lord
- Level 4 Wizard, Mark of Tzeentch, Spell Familiar, Enchanted Shield, Conjoined Homonculus, Golden Eye of Tzeentch, Disk of Tzeentch

Chaos Sorcerer
- Level 2 Wizard, Mark of Tzeentch, Dispel Scroll (2)

Chaos Sorcerer
- Level 2 Wizard, Mark of Tzeentch, Infernal Puppet

Exalted Hero
- Battle Standard Bearer, Shield, Barded Chaos Steed

Chaos Warriors (15)
- Champion, Shields

Chaos Warriors (15)
- Champion, Shields

Maruaders (12)
- Musician, Flails

Marauders (12)
- Musician, Flails

Marauders (12)
- Musician, Flails

Chaos Warhounds (5)

Chaos Warhounds (5)

Chaos Chariot

Chaos Knights (5)
- Ensorcelled Weapons, Musician, Mark of Tzeentch

w00t for more warriors! Except now they're big enough to justify standards for heavier lifting. I also think the BSB deserves some more protection, as well as blue paint to hook him up with the rest of the HQ. Here's my shot:

L: Sorcerer Lord - MoT, golden eye, spell familiar, disc, level 4 = 350
H: Sorcerer - MoT, 2 scrolls, level 2 = 190
H: Sorcerer - MoT, puppet, level 2 = 175
H: Exalted - MoT, BSB, talisman, favor, shield, steed = 186

C: 15 Warriors - full command, shields = 270
C: 15 Warriors - full command, shields = 270
C: 12 Marauders - musician, flails = 64
C: 12 Marauders - musician, flails = 64
C: 5 Warhounds = 30
C: 5 Warhounds = 30

S: 5 Knights - MoT, standard, musician = 250
S: Chariot = 120
-------
1999

As much as I dislike dropping models from a chaos list, 12 more marauders take up deployment room, are somewhat awkward flankers when too many units are running around, and you have 4 other bait units should you need some baiting. So I hacked them - and the slord's homonc, cause I dislike that gift for whatever reason - and scrounged for banners and glowy blue paint on the BSB. I wish you could keep a second chariot in here, to ensure at least one hits combat, but perhaps save that for 2250.

- Salvage