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Recently getting back into WHFB and decided to ignore the new skaven to go back to lizardmen.
However, i havent actually been able to look at the new book yet, and from what i can see on GW's site, alot has changed. (mainly, the models look decent now)

Just wanted to know some tactics if possible please, and just to make things harder, i prefer a pure skink force
So no saurus atall in the list.

From what i can see, steggies make it as a special unit now, meaning up to 5 in a 2k army 0_0

However, im just wondering how much terradons have changed.
Is it still worth taking a unit of 5 or so for machine hunting and flank charges? (also, is the new special character Tiqtaq'to any use with them?)

Also, i understand krox can now fight in blocks of skinks, does this work like it used to? or did GW turn this into a rules abortion?

Razordons, WTF!? Im guessing they function much like sallies, but with some real fugly models.

so, all in all, any help is appreciated, also, is kroak still hitting the 1,200 points mark? or has he dropped to a more reasonable level? lol

Thanks for any and all help

Abandoning Skaven already?! The Council will not be pleased. Rest assured Clan Eshin's finest are on the way to Lustria as we speak...

I'm not a Lizardmen player, but I have the book. A Stegadon army is indeed a possibility, but if you come up against something which is good at killing Stegadons (Doomwheels spring to mind, squeak, squeak), then you'll have nothing else to fall back on.

Kroak is a lot cheaper now (bout 700pts), but can only cast 1 spell because it was what he was casting when he died. It is a pretty good spell from what I recall (sat on the bean bag and can't be bothered to get up and find the book, sorry)and does 2D6 S4 hits to all enemy units in range (I think!).

Yes, Kroxigors can fight in skink units, which enables you to take them as Core choices. Rules wise, they basically fight as though they're in the front rank.

Jury's out on Razordons, I think most people still take Salamanders.

Help that helps, but keep and eye on the under-empire

Hey, im not sure which yet
This is my problem, im stuck between skaven and lizzies :(

Skaven: some really nice dark comical models, tons of character, highly unpredictable.

Lizzies: Strong vibrant colours, the new models look great, they will never run away, and you can rely on thier units lol.

so all in all, they are direct opposits



So, they nerfed kroak and cut his points in half lol, jervis fix?
Please say that spell is the ruination of cities spell he used to have

Krox seem great (especially the new models) just a shame they dont have much T :K
Allthough, that would mean running rank and file skinks instead of skirmish units.

so, razordons was just another one of GW's things that suffers from "gakky unit syndrome"?


Heh, i will do once i make a decision here
also heard about some skaven plague catapault? lol, i know its not the plague mortar.

anyways, need to make my mind up soon.
Been promised a 2k army for xmas by the missus

Actually razordons are really good. I consider them to be better than the new salamanders.

I believe you can fit in 7 stegadons at 2k. 1 skink priest on ancient (the one with the engine of the gods), 2 rare choice ancients, and 4 special choice normal stegadons. 3 min sized skink units. Comes out to 1995 I believe.

One of the stronger units lizards have is the basic saurus warrior. They have 2 attacks each, so giving them spears means that the typical 6 wide saurus block will have 24 attacks. Since they are T4 S4, they are very dangerous in combat.

Skinks: No more bows , javelins + shield or blow pipe , jungle poison . They are allowed to have kroxigor cohort every 8 skinks without using special slot.

Saurus: Str 4 , TWO attacks each. 2 ranks of spear saurus at 6 unit wide = 24 attacks.

Hunting Packs : Razordon and Salamander are 1-3 per rare slot. ( razordon can stand and shoot with 2x fire rate as charge reaction ! )
6 artillery dice worth of rolls when charged o_o... and they can move + fire

EoTGS: Spells from the engines CANNOT be dispelled.
Arcane Configuration: pick a lore , all cast needed are reduced by one
Burning Alignment: ALL enemy within 2D6 takes str 4 damage , no AS allowed ( this is what i do between saurus blocks , EOTGS to eat away enemy while saurus keeps them in place )
Portent of warding: 5+ ward save . ( This is what i use before my saurus get into CC. 4+ armor save AND a 5+ ward save against shooting )
AND aslong as priest is alive on the EOTGS , it generates power + dispell dice 1 lvl higher than he is ( so lvl 3 wizard! )

Old Blood heroe with great weapon + Charm of Jaguar Warrior gets steed of shadow bound spell , he can ran around killing warmachine and charriots.

Shield of mirrored pool , i like a heroe with this in a unit of temple guards. reflects all magic missles back on 2+ roll o_o

problem with razordons is that if you charge you roll 2 artillery dice, if either is a misfire you do not shoot any shots but instead eat skinks. So 1/3 of the time (a little less actually) you will fail to shoot and will eat d3 skinks.

Lizards are a tough army. T4 Troops form a solid core whilst Giant Monsters are the heavy hitters of the army (Stegadons, Terradons, Salamanders etc.) They don't have an "exciting" shooting phase, but like WoC they make up for it with magic.

You sure?
Ever seen a Giant going down in a single shooting phase by two units of Skinks?
If that's not exciting, then don't even look at the book.

With the new book, I have a couple of issues:
- No Southlands list. My buddie used to use 2000 points list with over 100 skinks with bows!
- No Scouts for the Skinks. Now this sucks hard
- Kroxigors are only S4. It's not bad (coupled with great weapon) but now they are not as hard hitting as before.

For the nice things:
- Increased armour saves for Saurus
- Increased Toughness of the Saurus-Scar Veteran
- Customasible Slann
- More Stegadons!

So yeah, the 7th edition favours combat, but magic and shooting is still pretty nice with them.

Terradons are awesome now. Turn 1 fly them into a forest to hide, turn 2 smash the enemy with rocks.

An (almost) all stegadon list is lame. Don't do it if you want local players to give you a game.

I played against an awesome skink based force earlier in the year:

2250:
Tenehuini on ancient with EOG
Skink priest (lev 2) on ancient steg with EOG (no dispel scrolls)
Skink chief on terradon
Skink chief BSB with the (IIRC frenzy banner)
1 unit skinks and 3 kroxigor (BSB here)
2 units skinks and 2 kroxigor
4 terradon (skink chief on terradon here)
2 salamanders

Had a fantastic game vs him. Really different to regular lizardmen lists without being super awesome or super lame.

Answers my Q pretty well that i was going to ask.

Chief's now get to take a terradon as a mount
and they get the drop-rocks rule back.


Not too sure, i may keep to a 100% skink list, but i make break the mould and take a large block of temple guard (really do love the new models)

but i only used to use steggies on a rare occasion.
Usually took sallies instead since point for point i caused more damage with them.

So ill possibly take 1-2 steggies, however, they will be EoTG's. (nothing worse than a T2 wizard with no protection lol)

The latest Lizardmen Armybook changed quite a lot of the tactics that were previously being used. No more charging Kroxigors through Skink units, which, coupled with a Strength reduction, made the Kroxigor not worth it in my opinion. The most competitive options are pretty much:

Slann Mage Priest
Skink Priest (on Engine of the Gods)

Skink Skirmishers
Saurus Warriors

Terradon Riders
Temple Guard
Stegadon

Salamanders

You cant say no to these! I dont know how to effectively use Chakax , but he is beautiful!

Use Chakax as a Scar Veteran, he costs to much to be worth it otherwise.

Luna, Chakax will make my list no matter what
Either as himself, or as a unit champion for the temple guards.
the model just kicks ass.

Im still not sure about the razors yet, is there any option to upgrade more skinks into the hunting pack?
If so then it might be worth it, but i dont really want to fire as a charge reaction and much the skinks

How points heavy are they aswell? If they are on par with sallies i may take them, but anymore than that and ill stick with the fire lizzies

Airmaniac wrote:Use Chakax as a Scar Veteran, he costs to much to be worth it otherwise.

Omg.... *cries , why am i so dumb?

- I always loved that model
- I have been troubled on how to make a scar vet with great weapon

And for some reason i didnt connect the 2 together.... *sigh

Thanks air

lol, luna, ive still got an old carnosaur rider with great wep and a steggy helm i made ages ago


also, are kroq'gar cav. lists still an option? wouldnt go for it as its such a low model count (due to expensive cav.) but its a fun option none the less

JD21290 wrote:Thanks air

lol, luna, ive still got an old carnosaur rider with great wep and a steggy helm i made ages ago


also, are kroq'gar cav. lists still an option? wouldnt go for it as its such a low model count (due to expensive cav.) but its a fun option none the less

Does Kroq'gar need back up? I cant imagine anything can surviving his attacks . ( i dont like coldone's stupidity test either >< )

Luna, i tend to throw kroq in a unit of 7 saurus cav with a scar vet BSB

Uses up the foot space of 10 cav models.

Has a very heavy charge and breaks units quickly.

Never runs away.

Thanks to good LD and cold blooded they wont fail LD tests (so no stupidity probs)


also, ive very rarely had a problem with cold ones failing stupidity, cold blooded has allways kept it in check.

Kroq-Gar allows you to take a single Saurus Cavalry unit as a Core choice.

I don't think he is worth it though. His Hand of Gods bound spell is a nice spell. Everyone will see it coming though and make sure to dispel it. A regular Saurus Oldblood would probably do better (Blade of Realities). Both are outclassed by the Slann Mage Priest though. The Slann is almost mandatory for Lizardmen in competitive play.

So its no longer all saurus cav count as troops? :(

I hate the slaan, such bad models lol, is kroak worthwhile? (its the only slaan model i can stand)

Yes, don't leave home without a Hypno Toad and be sure to take the power that let's you pick your spells. Against Daemons and Vampires, Lore of Light is great fun

Can you pick from a single lore (i take it you select lore, then roll for spell) or can you chose from multiple ones?

If so, could be amusing to take the 1st spell from a few lores simply to blast away at units / drag up dice lol.

Something is making me think that you can pick from several lores, but I might be getting muddled with another army/older version of the book. I'm at work at the moment (so no book), but if nobdy else answers before I get home, I'll let you know later...

Thanks mate

Could be amusing to mix up a few basic spells for some damage, allthough, 2nd sign will make it simply for the D3 re-rolls that allways come in handy lol.

Previous edition Armybook let the Slann roll for spells from multiple Lores. This edition however, does not. The Slann can pick any of the Lores of Magic in the Main Rulesbook and selects spells as normal (as in roll a die for every level). He can be upgraded to get an additional spell (Plague of Tepok) or to know an entire Lore (Focus of Mystery).

I don't think Lord Kroak is worth it. He only gets a single Spell (though it can be cast more then once per turn). It has varying Casting Values (higher Casting Value chosen gives the Spell more range). It is a pure damage spell. I prefer the utility a regular Slann Mage Priest gives you (chosing a different Lore based on your opponent, being able to take the Becalming Cogitation for Magic Defensive purposes, having the Focused Rumination for more Power Dice).

Ah, so now i must decide weather i go with offensive magic, defensive, or a mix of both -_-

i guess Focus is a must then to make sure i get the spells i want.

as for the actual lore, i guess metal could help from time to time, but heavens is allways nice for some help with a nice power spell.




thats quite a cut back lol, is the spell ruination of cities that he used to have?
that wasnt bad, and to be honest, i wouldnt mind using that and only that.
Priests are there for things like 2nd sign and defensive magic.

On a note (not sure how much info you are allowed to post) how destructive is his only spell? Being a 1st generation slaan i would think it is pretty good (2-3 D6) but going by GW's nerf-bat im guessing its a single D6 of damage lol.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Edit: Thanks air, that post really did help and clear up alot

There are no Slann Generations anymore. Slann are automatically Level 4 Wizards. Lord Kroak is immune to Miscasts, regular Slann are not. Regular Slann do have more options through their Disciplines though. Lore of Beasts is a very good Lore for a Slann Mage Priest (The Wolf Hunts on Stegadons is devastating, The Hunter's Spear channeled through a Skink Priest with the Cloak of Feathers in a flank of a heavy Cavalry unit is devastating as well, and of course there is The Beast Cowers). Against Empire you may want to take the Lore of Metal (Spirit of the Forge against their Steam Tanks). The Lore of Light is very usefull against Daemons of Chaos and Vampire Counts (S6 spells are great).

The Spell that Lord Kroak has is called The Deliverance of Itza. It is basically a Wind of Death Spell against any Enemy unit within range (varies from 6" to 24" depending upon Casting Values).

Lord Kroak costs about 150% of a decently kitted Slann Mage Priest though, so I don't find him worth it. Besides, the Engine of the Gods has an unstoppable AoE spell which ignores armour saves (though obviously the range and amount of hits on each unit are lower).

Meh, i liked my generation system lol, let you chance your dedication into magic in the army without having to throw massive amounts of points into it.
Metal is a nice lore, from ruining gunlines to messing about with Stanks, and the offensive spells aint bad either

Meh, not really worth it then, was expecting something with some power to it, but maybe not.

After that, ill agree, looks like a basic slaan (heavily converted of course) will make it if i take a slaan.
Ill be taking an EoTG anyway simply to try it and get a play with the new kit

Slann can pick any 1 lore , through Focus of Mystery Dicipline , they can know all spells from that lore.

The cost of an Engine of the Gods might scare you the first time you read through the Codex, but once you read what it can do, you will understand the cost. Just protect your Engine of the Gods from Warmachine fire (Terradons are great Warmachine hunters) and it will shine.