Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

First post and list on Dakka. Have learned a ton since discovering this forum. Now looking to put it out there for some comments and critique.

Non-competitive list for a recurring game with some friends. Escalating from 1000 points to 1500.
I'm only going to list the 1000 point list for now, since any changes I make will trickle down.

HQ

Daemon Prince - 155
-Wings, MoS, LoS

Heavy Support

2x Obliterator Cult - 150

Troops
12x CSM - 205
IoCG, Melta, Flamer

10x Khorne Berserkers - 245
Skull Champion, Power First, Personal Icon

7x Plague Marines - 206
Plague Champion, Power Weapon, Melta, Flamer

Rhino - 40
TL Bolter

Total = 1001 points

The Rhino will obviously go with the Berserkers or Plague Marines, since the CSM squad is too big (unless I split them into two smaller groups).




An alternate list I have iincludes Termies instead of CSMs.

HQ

Daemon Prince - 155
-Wings, MoS, LoS

Heavy Support

2x Obliterator Cult - 150

Elites
5x Chaos Terminators - 210
Terminator Champion, Power Fist, RAC, Heavy Flame, Combi-flamer, Combi-melta

10x Khorne Berserkers - 245
Skull Champion, Power First, Personal Icon

7x Plague Marines - 206
Plague Champion, Power Weapon, Melta, Flamer

Rhino - 35

Total = 1001 points

Being that I'm brand new to the game, I didn't do smart things like magnetize for loadouts, so I'm basically gearing this army with the models I have in the format I assembled them (see Termies). If there are major flaws beyond loadout, I'd love some ideas on how to fix this.

Thanks in advance for your C&C.

Well, looks semi-competitive.
I'd give the troops Rhinos for protection purposes.
The PM and CSM units should have 2 special weapons of the same type.
I'd consider the 1st list, drop 2 CSM and 2 Berzerkers, and add another Obliterator.

Yeah, I agree with Wuestenfux, it has potential but needs some work...

- Almost every Chaos player agrees that they are best mechanised, as such I'd add rhino's to your troop choices - yes this means dropping 2 CSM's...

- I would also recommend having 2 of the same weapons on your units, as its a friendly game you could use flamer/melta, its not as competitive but it can add flexibility.

- You don't really need 3 troop choices at 1000pts, I would consider dropping the Zerkers or PM's (Zerkers IMHO) to get rhino's and another Daemon Prince?

- In regards of your troop choices, its fine keeping them, but I would recommend dropping the Plague Champ. he's not really needed at this pts level and even so he should really use a power fist. The CSM's and Zerkers are fine except I'd drop 2 men from each and add rhino's also.

Hope that's helped, good luck and welcome to (the oh-so-helpful world of) Dakka!

Yeah, if you're non-competitive and playing with friends Chaos is great because you can field or keep adding all sorts of interesting units.

I suggest building towards something weird, like an all-normal-CSM Fabius Bile list or the like.

- Blackbone

Thanks guys.

There is one Rhino at the bottom of the list. I left is there because I really wasn't sure where to attach it (CSM/Zerkers/PMS).

From my research PMs really seem to be the way to go (Fearless, FnP, 5T), so I'm considering dropping the normal CSMs in favor of another Rhino, another Oblit, and 3 more PMs.

On the PMs, I agree the Plague Champ probably isn't adding much. Another Melta in that group would likely be a better way to spend the points.

One of the best thing about playing Chaos is the feel of the armies you can make. Perhaps it's personal preference, but when I build an army I try and make it powerful, because I'm a competitive person, but also have a strong theme - it seems so much more rewarding. For example: www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/274053.page
So when I look at this list, it's odd because you've got a Slaanesh daemon leading Khorne and Nurgle troops. If it doesn't bother you though, that's fine, the list still looks pretty good.

I'd definitely opt for the first list though l, not the second. I despise terminators.

I agree with all that's been said so far, mechanised is definitely the way forward - just straight forward 35pt Rhinos are all you need.

Thanks Trantras. I'm a fluff guy too, and I'm sure I will take that road eventually (I have penned some Nurgle, Khorne, and Slaan armies) but right now my focus is on learning the game mechanics, experiencing different opponent armies, and the abilities of my own army. After that, I'm sure I will become a thematic nut, once I know how to make a theme into a winner.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
How does this list fare?

HQ:

Daemon Prince - 155
Wings,MoS,LoS

Heavy Support:

3x Obliterator Cult - 225

Troops:

10x Khorne Berserkers - 305
Skull Champion, Power Fist, Personal Icon
Rhino, Havoc Launcher (for Lash template)

10xPlague Marines - 305
2xMelta, Flamer
Rhino,Havoc Launcher (for Lash Template)

Total Points = 990

After a while it came to me: What's the point of having Lash, if you don't have anything to drop on the Unit you moved? Havoc Launchers on each Rhino give me some level of "splode" to drop on poor lashed targets, and Doombolt on the DP rounds out the last 10 points.

Thoughts?



Or......(OMG, can't stop thinking)

HQ:

Daemon Prince - 155
Wings, MoS, LoS


Heavy Support:

3x Obliterator Cult - 225

Troops:

10x Noise Marines - 320
9x Sonic Blasters,1x Blastmaster
Rhino

10x Plague Marines - 290
2x Melta, 1x Flamer
Rhino

Total points = 990

Again, for LoS Template now we have the Blastmaster. All Noise Marines except the BM carrier are Sonic Blaster Equipped, so they get an extra shot during the shooting phase, and can assault with a higher initiative than KBs.

List #1, or List #2?

Well both lists have their merits... one thing I'd need to point out immediately though is your Daemon Prince can only have one psychic power, unless he's also got the mark of Tzeentch, so you can drop Doombolt and refund yourself the points. 10, is it? Something like that.

For the second list, whilst I like Noise Marines, you may have gone a little OTT on their gear here, one way or the other. If they've ALL got Sonic Blasters, then perhaps a Rhino isn't necessary, only two of them can fire out of it, after all. If you dropped seven of them, you could put a champion in that unit and give him a power weapon. It depends on your style of play, but that would allow them to assault marines and butcher them on higher initiative.

Then again, the sonic blasters aren't bad if you can get them to a strong position and keep them alive long enough for them to use their heavy function...

Choices, choices, eh!

Aye. Part of the problem Tantras, is I don't HAVE a style of play yet. I'm brand new to the game, and Chaos just suited me (when I played D&D, I always favored Demons). Now I'm simply trying to do the mathematics of putting something together so that when I do get a game with my friends, or down at my local shop, I have a concept to work with. To be honest, talking about armies has helped me learn a lot about the game. I've already revealed a lot of things I misunderstood (such as Doombolt - good catch, and thanks).

The Rhino is simply to get the Noise Marines in range, objective, assault, heavy shooting distance, whatever is needed. Now I just need to figure out how many come in the box.....8? 10? Anyone know.

Ok, you want rhinos for all your squads if you can fit em. Always double up on weapons, and at this point level, you should do 2x flamers on both the CSM and plague marines (as 2 oblits should more than take care of any armor at 1k pts). If you face a land raider, just lol at them and hide til it gets close, anyone using one at 1k is asking for a beatin.

Noise marines in rhinos work well with 2 blasters and doomsiren. Otherwise, place em in cover with a blastmaster and tons of blasters for shooting. Noise marines are either very aggressive, or sitting in the back shooting at things that get too close. And a power fist should never be used on em, take advantage of I5!

Otherwise, works well.

Heh, 8 come in the box mate, they're clever like that. Welcome to spending a fortune!

I also think that reading a lot helps with tactics and understanding, head over to the battle report forum in Dakka and pick out all the reports involving Chaos. There's some very interesting reads.

It's also nice just to have people to bounce ideas off - take LoS for example, I always knew it was powerful, but until I started talking to friends about it, I just thought of it as a means to pull units towards me to assault... In reality there's so many uses! Pulling stuff towards you, pushing things away that you don't want to assault you, pushing things into dangerous terrain, pulling things out of cover to shoot at... It's amazing!

@ Tantras - 8 in a box eh......

Meh, money isn't an issue for me, so the price doesn't concern me, but yes......8 is evil. Same with PMs, 7 in a box, although I heard that's because they are metal, and they needed to maintain a certain price point. 12 Berserkers in a box though.....even though only 10 will fit in a Rhino. I really need to bitch-slap my friend who works for GW when I see him in March

The tactic I heard today from my hobby store owner, was use Lash to move the unit within the range you want, but also to tighten their coherency. Make all models in the unit touching bases (tightest compact possible) and then drop a template or blast on them (in my list, Havoc Launcher from Rhino on list #1, or Blastmaster on List #2). A direct hit, even on a small blast template, and they are all rolling wounds. Lash is looking fun!


@ Zid. Why would I not go with 9 Sonic Blasters on the Noise Marine Squad? They are 24", Assault 2/Heavy 3, vs 24" Rapid Fire on a Bolter. Seems to me a wise way to spend 45 points.
The Doomsiren does seem like a good way to spend points. It's basically an AP# flamer.

HQ:

Daemon Prince - 155
Wings, MoS, LoS


Heavy Support:

3x Obliterator Cult - 225

Troops:

10x Noise Marines - 330
8x Sonic Blasters, 1x Doom Siren, 1x Blastmaster
Rhino

10x Plague Marines - 290
2x Melta, 1x Flamer
Rhino

Total points = 1000

Yeah, the bunch up to blast use is probably the most common for LoS, I just love the versatility. I read an amusing battle report recently in which a Chaos sorcerer held off a unit of three Carnifexes (Carnifexi?) by repeatedly shooing them away every turn with lash... Amazing!

LOL @ Carnifexi

Mizzri wrote:@ Tantras - 8 in a box eh......

Meh, money isn't an issue for me, so the price doesn't concern me, but yes......8 is evil. Same with PMs, 7 in a box, although I heard that's because they are metal, and they needed to maintain a certain price point. 12 Berserkers in a box though.....even though only 10 will fit in a Rhino. I really need to bitch-slap my friend who works for GW when I see him in March

The tactic I heard today from my hobby store owner, was use Lash to move the unit within the range you want, but also to tighten their coherency. Make all models in the unit touching bases (tightest compact possible) and then drop a template or blast on them (in my list, Havoc Launcher from Rhino on list #1, or Blastmaster on List #2). A direct hit, even on a small blast template, and they are all rolling wounds. Lash is looking fun!


@ Zid. Why would I not go with 9 Sonic Blasters on the Noise Marine Squad? They are 24", Assault 2/Heavy 3, vs 24" Rapid Fire on a Bolter. Seems to me a wise way to spend 45 points.
The Doomsiren does seem like a good way to spend points. It's basically an AP# flamer.

HQ:

Daemon Prince - 155
Wings, MoS, LoS


Heavy Support:

3x Obliterator Cult - 225

Troops:

10x Noise Marines - 330
8x Sonic Blasters, 1x Doom Siren, 1x Blastmaster
Rhino

10x Plague Marines - 290
2x Melta, 1x Flamer
Rhino

Total points = 1000

Cuz its a waste of points when they ride around in a rhino most of the game... and when they disembark, they die just as easily as a normal marine, so why make em even more costly? I find the best way to run sonic marines is simple;

8-10 guys, 2 blasters, 1 doomsiren, power sword, in a rhino - 245-265 pts

Thats if your agressive. Sonic marines excell in killing MEQ's by getting close, disembarking, flaming/pistols/blasters, and running in to polish off the squad before they swing. more than 2 blasters is a waste as your basically moving up into range to assault/doomsiren. Blastmaster is a complete waste of points unless your sitting in back using its heavy frequency. 40 pts for 3 str 4 shots isn't economical.

The best way to run sonic marines is up close and personal (the way I run em above) or gunline. If you want the gunline variant;

8-10 guys, 5-6 blasters, 1 blastmaster - 225-265 pts

These guys sit in cover and shoot the blastmaster at high frequency. Don't fill everything with blasters, you want guys to take wounds and die before you lose blasters. Once stuff gets within range, open up with your craptons of shots. Great vs orcs, meltavets, nids, and anything else that explodes to bolters.

For your list, especially 1k pts, and the fact your running a lash prince, I'm very much inclined to say stick with the zerkers. Lashing things up close for a zerker charge is far more effective in 90% of games than for shooting em (unless your template spamming with oblits, defilers, and vindicators). Thats my personal take

The idea of the Blastmaster wasn't for varied frequency 5/4, but for the Str8, AP3 Blast. DP uses Lash to not only move them, but put them into base to base contact with each other; small enough for the Blastmasters template to smoke most of them in one shot.

I guess the only way to find out is to try both. I hope my Tutor is a patient guy.....or likes ice cream

Mizzri wrote:The idea of the Blastmaster wasn't for varied frequency 5/4, but for the Str8, AP3 Blast. DP uses Lash to not only move them, but put them into base to base contact with each other; small enough for the Blastmasters template to smoke most of them in one shot.

I guess the only way to find out is to try both. I hope my Tutor is a patient guy.....or likes ice cream

yeah, which means not moving lol. Thats why i never recommend a rhino with that tactic because that gives you 35 pts to spend elseware

Technically, the Blastmaster could fire from the Rhino's single fire point, provided the Rhino didn't move that turn. But I do see your point.

@Mizzri:

The most recent list:

Prince is ok
Oblits are ok as well, but maybe a bit much at 1000.

Noise Marines: I do not suggest mixing all the sonic weapons.
In addition, I think you have the points wrong on that squad, they should be 345 points.
Plague marines can’t have 3 special weapons, only 2.

I suggest a champ with a fist somewhere, but the two Rhino Troops are decent.