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" a sophisticated AI- Assisted transmission system. All friendly units with a model within 12'' may use the bearer's leadership for the purposes of target priority tests" page 26 Tau codex.

Obviously there is no longer a target priority test... what does this do now? Allow all models w/in 12'' to use bearer's leadership for whatever? nothing?

Does nothing

TopC wrote:" a sophisticated AI- Assisted transmission system. All friendly units with a model within 12'' may use the bearer's leadership for the purposes of target priority tests" page 26 Tau codex.

Obviously there is no longer a target priority test... what does this do now? Allow all models w/in 12'' to use bearer's leadership for whatever? nothing?

It does nothing

Thanks guys


but: epic fail for command and control node now :( lol

yup... the daemonhunter teleport homer called and says hi to the C&CN, it's roommate in the "wargear gw doesn't deem fit for a quick one line update in the FAQ" apartments.

My solution for the DH teleport homer was to label objectives with the words "deepstrike template." Now the homer works again LOL.

As for the C&CN, play a team game with black templars. The black templar still suffer from target priority (with a -1 to the roll), thus the C&CN currently exists only for those oh so common TAU and BLACK TEMPLAR alliances!

Alliances almost as common as Black Templar and Filthy Eldar Witch alliances

Yes it is useless. But hey it is still a FAR better spend of your points than an Ethereal or the Space Pope... Look on the bright side

i actually like the ethereal.. sniff.. 50pts and i get to reroll ALL my morale (except for the kroot but the ethereal is with them anyways so they're ld10). that and i have a cool painted model!

warboss wrote:i actually like the ethereal.. sniff.. 50pts and i get to reroll ALL my morale (except for the kroot but the ethereal is with them anyways so they're ld10). that and i have a cool painted model!

Yes but a moral test on every one isn't that great ... I've watched a game where every one ran away turn one ... ok the tanks stayed put but he'd lost at that point any way.

i actually like the ethereal.. sniff.. 50pts and i get to reroll ALL my morale (except for the kroot but the ethereal is with them anyways so they're ld10). that and i have a cool painted model!

You need LoS for Morale re-rolls hence he is not in a vehcile hence he an dthe squad he is with is dead, hence that re-roll disappears and your entire army has to take a morale check, the army with the worst morale in the entire game I might add...

My ethereal is probably the best painted model in the army but I would still never ever take him. I did try once after I'd just finished painting him and epic fail would have be kind to him...

FlingitNow wrote:

You need LoS for Morale re-rolls hence he is not in a vehcile hence he an dthe squad he is with is dead, hence that re-roll disappears and your entire army has to take a morale check, the army with the worst morale in the entire game I might add...

My ethereal is probably the best painted model in the army but I would still never ever take him. I did try once after I'd just finished painting him and epic fail would have be kind to him...

true, but mine usually goes with the kroot who get 2+ cover saves in forest (they go to ground at the FIRST sign of incoming fire!!) in games where there is an objective since i'll place it there for them to claim. in prep for this, i always put a forest piece in both deployment zones (straddling both table quarters if possible) so that i have some trees no matter what table side i get in deployment. i agree that he could die with a well placed IG pie plate or assault but so far it hasn't happened (and he'd be the last model i'd put a wound on from that!). if anyone threatens to charge that unit (although people tend to go for the "bait" broadsides and crisis suits i deploy), then i focus my 3 fish'o'fury on the threatening unit. call me lucky i guess... i'll be hopefully trying this again saturday at a local 3 round tourney.

true, but mine usually goes with the kroot who get 2+ cover saves in forest (they go to ground at the FIRST sign of incoming fire!!) in games where there is an objective since i'll place it there for them to claim. in prep for this, i always put a forest piece in both deployment zones (straddling both table quarters if possible) so that i have some trees no matter what table side i get in deployment. i agree that he could die with a well placed IG pie plate or assault but so far it hasn't happened (and he'd be the last model i'd put a wound on from that!). if anyone threatens to charge that unit (although people tend to go for the "bait" broadsides and crisis suits i deploy), then i focus my 3 fish'o'fury on the threatening unit. call me lucky i guess... i'll be hopefully trying this again saturday at a local 3 round tourney.

Then you seem to play against inexperienced players. Given that SMs can make a 45" assault move on turn 1 I don't see how you can protect them from assault. Also how do you ensure you have woods? Most tables I've encountered don't have any woods/trees. Also Hellhounds will toast the squad in turn 1. OK they may not break but it is pretty easy to get a number of heavy flamers right up to any unit in turn 1. Certainly by turn 2.

It appears you opponents simply don;t know Tau well at all or they'd kill that Ethereal turn 1 as it is pertty easy to do without commiting many points worth of stuff (160 points of scouts and land speeder would do it an dthen be in cover from return fire) and you are reliant on there being woods which there generally aren't on most tables...

FlingitNow wrote:
1)Then you seem to play against inexperienced players.
2) Given that SMs can make a 45" assault move on turn 1 I don't see how you can protect them from assault.
3) Also how do you ensure you have woods? Most tables I've encountered don't have any woods/trees.
4) Also Hellhounds will toast the squad in turn 1. OK they may not break but it is pretty easy to get a number of heavy flamers right up to any unit in turn 1. Certainly by turn 2.
5) It appears you opponents simply don;t know Tau well at all or they'd kill that Ethereal turn 1 as it is pertty easy to do without commiting many points worth of stuff (160 points of scouts and land speeder would do it an dthen be in cover from return fire) and you are reliant on there being woods which there generally aren't on most tables...

1) there's a mix, some inexperienced, some with multiple editions under their belt.
2) how the heck do you get that number?? 45" assault on turn 1? i can understand 12" jump move, 6" fleet, and 6" charge or 12 landraider/ork trukk move, disembark 2", fleet 6" charge 6" but they don't come close to 45" and assaulting on turn 1. even with those numbers, not everyone fields eldar or shrike.
3) woods are a common terrain piece. if your club/store has no woods, i'd say you are not in the norm. the only terrain we're lacking are hills and fortifications. otherwise, we have bunkers, forests, ruins, and walls/fences a plenty.
4) if they forward deployed the hellhound and drove 12" forward, then yes, they would threaten the kroot especially if it were a squadron. it would also place the hellhound (squadron) in perfect place for back shots from a fish of fury and side shots from the crisis and broadside teams. i'd be more worried about flamer vet teams in valks but luckily people seem to prefer plasma and melta vets.
5) how would the scouts kill me? they wouldn't be able to even assault me on turn 1 with even a bit of common sense in unit placement on my part.

your points, while valid, rely on a few things that don't generally hold up in games that i play. you assume people playing ONLY mobile-assault-turn-1 armies, perfect luck on their part in choosing side and getting first turn as well as not having it stolen, tabletop deforestation akin to risk after a logging company visits, opponent charge ranges that i can't fathom as how you calculated them, my apparent boneheadedness in putting my ethereal with his kroot far up in deployment with nothing in between him and the enemy, and my inability to apparently deal with any threats due to luck/boneheadedness at all on turn 1. sure, if all or most of the above magically happen, they would be threatened on turn 1. i think both of our opinions are colored by the experiences we have had, which were opposites. if i field an ethereal (genereally at over 1500pts i do), i protect them and it's worked out pretty well so far. i'll be hopefully posting a battle report after this weekend's local tourney with 3 rounds of games so we'll see what people not from my FLGS do when facing it.

1) They seem to be missing an easy target in the Ethereal.

2) Scouts in a Landspeeder storm. 24" scout move, 12" further move 3" deployment, 6" assault. Doesn't even require Shrike. Add shrike in and that is potentially 51", plus Shrike and his assault marines will be within assault range turn 1 but you can avoid them.

3) Not saying woods are uncommon just that in the majority of places only 1 in 3-4 tables would have woods on them. It is very rare to have woods on every 40k table.

4) How would the fish get round to rear armour? Your Crsis suits will be busy running away so them getting to side is also far from a given...

5) You recon you can easily hide from a 45" assault? How big are the tables you play on? I place my land speeder storms at the front and centre of my deployment zone and I can literally reach any corner of a 6'x4' table. First they heavy flame you and then they assault you, you will lose badly in the assault you will run and the Ethereal will die and half you army will disappear to the trees...

DP armies can mess with the Ethereal on turn 1. Ever been hit by 2 heavy flamers and 4 combi-flamers in 1 turn from one unit? Does Kroot no favours at all...

I'm not saying that the Ethereal will die turn 1 every time. But most SM armies can easily take him out turn 1. Certainly any IG armies can take him out turn 1. Other armies less so but the point is taking him apart is pretty easy and getting to him by turn 2-3 is very easy unless you can completely stop your opponent in that time?

Your tactic seems reliant on there being trees (in general a 1 in 3 or 4 chance) and your opponent not going after your ethereal which again seems unlikely. Now maybe the people at you LFGS aren't very competitive and don't care about winning so they don;t target you ethereal for extermination straight away. But in a competition you are likely to find players are going to play to win and if they can make half your army run away by killing 1 T3 model believe me they are going to do it...

ahh, the scout speeder. frankly, no one in the 3 gaming stores i have frequented in the past 2 years has ever used one, let alone 3. 5 scouts in a light vehicle like a speeder isn't very popular here across the pond. i'm glad they work for you but i rarely see lists locally or even in the batrep section of dakka that use them. i suspect that as many people as don't like ethereals would find problems with the scout speeder option also. one thing you are also forgetting is that you have to stay away from the enemy 12" with your scout move and my ethereal is in back; you won't get a first turn assault with the speeder's marines with my usual deployement. you may get within disembarkation range but i'm not afraid of 5 scouts with zero flamers.

ahh, the scout speeder. frankly, no one in the 3 gaming stores i have frequented in the past 2 years has ever used one, let alone 3. 5 scouts in a light vehicle light a speeder isn't very popular here across the pond. i'm glad they work for you but i rarely see lists locally or even in the batrep section of dakka that use them. i suspect that as many people as don't like ethereals would find problems with the scout speeder option also.

I see a fair number of them turning up on lists here on Dakka and where I game. It is a very effective tactic for first turn charges against gun line armies (you can wreck a squadron of Leman Russ with 2 and seriously hurt a squad with even 1, auto hitting as they can't have possibly moved). Obviously if you don't go first then they are an excellent out flank assault unit with a 21" threat range from the board edges. If they steal the initiative you just have to hold your hands up and accept they are going to die.

Does no one Use Sternguard in DPs over there? They'd wreck the kroot. Scout biker squad could do the same asthe speeder squad though less effective.

You are the only person I know of that doesn't think Ethereals are the worse choice in the game (with the Space Pope beign the king of the worst choices). The LSS is situational and not the greatest thing in the world but it can be effective. The Ethereal is just a liability.

FlingitNow wrote:Does no one Use Sternguard in DPs over there? They'd wreck the kroot. Scout biker squad could do the same asthe speeder squad though less effective.

You are the only person I know of that doesn't think Ethereals are the worse choice in the game (with the Space Pope beign the king of the worst choices). The LSS is situational and not the greatest thing in the world but it can be effective. The Ethereal is just a liability.

nope, generally no sternguard here (seen it once or twice in the year since i came back to playing 40k). definitely no vanguard (i've seen one guy use the models but not the rules). i guess "local metagame" really is local despite the internet. scout bikers are moderately popular. as for the space pope, i agree. i take the ethereal for one reason (and with no upgrades other than drones occasionally): morale rerolls. nothing sucks worse than having your broadside unit 3" from the table edge fail a morale because one drone died and run off the board. the tau special characters are all (except for shadowsun) geared for close combat and the tau suck at close combat; the specials just make them mediocre at best (especially the space pope). they're definitely not worth it.

FlingitNow your working too hard on this ... you must take +1 commanders. So with your remaining HQ slot why take a model that may cause your army to run away and only cause tau units it joins to be fearless. Back in 4th he couldn't be shot at in a unit or if he was with in 2" of a unit ... that made him useable. Now he can be directly targeted.

In 5th he's bringing a negative factor to the army. About the only possible use is to use him as a decoy in a mech heavy list.

Oh I wish I had the power to lock this thread...

FlingitNow your working too hard on this ... you must take +1 commanders. So with your remaining HQ slot why take a model that may cause your army to run away and only cause tau units it joins to be fearless. Back in 4th he couldn't be shot at in a unit or if he was with in 2" of a unit ... that made him useable. Now he can be directly targeted.

In 5th he's bringing a negative factor to the army. About the only possible use is to use him as a decoy in a mech heavy list.

Ok hold up a second...Why can he be directly targeted?

Second I love my ethereal. And I always take a squad of honour guard. You cant go wrong with BS 4 tau

Second I love my ethereal. And I always take a squad of honour guard. You cant go wrong with BS 4 tau

You can because they aren't scoring... FW need to sit in Devilfish 90% of the time if they come ML should ensure they have high enough BS anyway. 74 points just to make a FW team BS4 at the cost of scoring? No thanks.

Since the original query has been answered, and this has wandered off into tactics, I'm going to go ahead and lock it down.

Feel free to start a thread on the merits or lack thereof of Ethereals over on the tactics board.