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I have been totally rethinking the Nidz after taking a pounding this weekend. The thing that has been my downfall, I am thinking, is that the "ground" portion of my list is too easily shot up and I end up playing down when my drop portion shows up.

I think I am splitting the difference between the two styles of play and that is ultimately what is hurting me from forming solid competitive lists. I will probably not be taking them to Adepticon because I don't think I am ready with them just yet.

I think the Tyranid army, to be played effectively, requires focus when it comes to the army list.

So my next round of testing will be one of these two lists.



The "meat" shield army:

Hive Tyrant w/ Lashwhip-Bonesword, Scything Talons, Ancient Enemy, Life Leach, Paroxysm, Regeneration, Thorax Swarm w/ Shreddershard Beatles = 240

2 Tyrant Guard = 120

-Elites-

3 Hive Guard = 150

3 Hive Guard = 150

2 Venomthropes = 110

-Troops-

18 Termagaunts = 90

18 Termagaunts = 90

Tervigon w/ Catalyst, Toxin, Adrenal, Regeneration, Cluster Spines = 225

Tervigon w/ Catalyst, Toxin, Adrenal, Regeneration, Cluster Spines = 225

-Heavy Support-

Tyrannofex w/ Rupture Cannon, Regeneration, Thorax Swarm w/ Shreddershard Beatles, Cluster Spines = 295

Tyrannofex w/ Rupture Cannon, Regeneration, Thorax Swarm w/ Shreddershard Beatles, Cluster Spines = 295


Basically, I want to try an army with a crap ton of creatures with Regeneration. I put that on the table and dare you to kill all of that. It's different then the "net" builds, through barrows heavily on that. There is just so much durable creatures, that I can rush the center with them and be up in people's grill. Regenerate on everything forces gun lines to kill a creature at a time. And I have the Tyrant and Gaunt Screen to soak up charges from aggressive armies. Plus it has a surprising amount of anti-horde firepower. It's a little weak against Jaws though.


Here is the more up in your face Drop List:

-HQ-

Hive Tyrant w/ 2 sets of Scything Talons, Life Leech, Paroxysm, Hive Commander, Acid Blood, Adrenal Glands, Implant Attack, Wings = 285

-Elites-

2 Zoenthropes in Pod = 160

2 Zoenthropes in Pod = 160

Deathleaper = 140

-Troops-

10 Termagants w/ Devourers in Pod = 140

Tervigon w/ Adrenal, Toxin, Catalyst, Onslaught = 210

9 Ripper Swarms w/ Tunnel Swarm = 108

-Fast Attack-

20 Gargoyles w/ Toxin, Adrenal = 160

20 Gargoyles w/ Toxin, Adrenal = 160

-Heavy Support-

Carnifex w/ Scything Talons, Devourers, Bioplasma in Pod = 235

Carnifex w/ Scything Talons, Devourers, Bioplasma in Pod = 235


Everything on this list can start off the table. And at local events, I think Hive Commander will work while the Tyrant is off the table. (As, unlike with the Lictor rule, all it says is that as long as the Tyrant is alive you get the +1). The Gargolyes and Rippers are something that just deep strikes on top of your opponent and forces you to deal with them, while giving cover to the other things that drop.

What do you think?

Both lists are fine. In the first list I would drop regenerate since you DONT want the enemy focusing on 1 MC at a time then get 2 min squads of stealers with toxin sacs so gunlines cant deploy in the corner to give them more shooting phases before you get to them.

In the second I'd like to see trygons instead of fexes, more attacks more wounds less kill points and the less strength only really matters vs land raiders and monoliths but you have zoanthropes for that.

Both lists are fine. In the first list I would drop regenerate since you DONT want the enemy focusing on 1 MC at a time then get 2 min squads of stealers with toxin sacs so gunlines cant deploy in the corner to give them more shooting phases before you get to them.

In the second I'd like to see trygons instead of fexes, more attacks more wounds less kill points and the less strength only really matters vs land raiders and monoliths but you have zoanthropes for that.

Both lists are fine. In the first list I would drop regenerate since you DONT want the enemy focusing on 1 MC at a time then get 2 min squads of stealers with toxin sacs so gunlines cant deploy in the corner to give them more shooting phases before you get to them.

In the second I'd like to see trygons instead of fexes, more attacks more wounds less kill points and the less strength only really matters vs land raiders and monoliths but you have zoanthropes for that.

Woot, triple postage for the win .

Anywho, I like these lists, though I think the "Hive Commander" while off the table will be argued against you. I believe even the INAT FAQ has favored that it does not work while the Tyrant's off the table.

I think the second list is better but both suffer from too many upgrades. You can make a case for the Wings and Hive Commander in list two but why Acid blood and Implant attack? If I run Fexes they are with a meat shield list as in list one and I run them naked - do not tell me how good devourers or bioplasma are on Fexes. They need to run up the table not shoot. Giving them pods is wasteful when a naked Trygon does better for less. And why Onslaught on Tervs? The Zoans are podding in. Any smart opponent will take them out fast for some nice easy kill points as you should expect. You want them to do their job on arrival and then deflect damage from the units that are killy. I'm not fond of the ripper swarms either. They will be a bit annoying but no threat to a savvy opponent.

So - I would get Trygons for those Fexes. You need more killy squads. I would drop the rippers and upgrades and maybe get a small squad of Ravs or Ymgarl Stealers instead.

You have a lot of support units but no killy units in the first list, imho. I like meat sshield lists. This one doesn't work though. Again you have way too many upgrades on your Tyrant. He is dead killy naked and the Guard on the wakling Tyrant seems like a good idea but is a waste. You an easily get cover saves for him with all those MCs. Regeneration sounds very good on paper. Have you played a lot of games yet with Nids? I found it a total waste of points. I would also use squads of two Hive Guard - it's enough with your TFexes. Guess what - that is enough points for this ...

Prime, LW/BS, Tox 105
4 Warriors, BS 130

Let your HT join this squad.

I believe even the INAT FAQ has favored that it does not work while the Tyrant's off the table.

That FaQ is totally bogus and I would place where the sun never shines.

Darth Bob wrote:Woot, triple postage for the win .

Anywho, I like these lists, though I think the "Hive Commander" while off the table will be argued against you. I believe even the INAT FAQ has favored that it does not work while the Tyrant's off the table.

I recall checking into that and by RAW it should work. I don't recall the specifics at the moment.

As far as the lists.. I agree with the regenerate removal. It's a huge point sink, with very little return. Also, Tervigons are ok, but I'd rather have stealers in there, especially with a drop /outflank list. I haven't run any games with a Tyrano fex, but that's an awfully large amount of points to sink into those guys.

Other thoughts: My last game I ran a basic Tyranid Prime with my Zoanthropes. It worked out pretty well. You could theoretically Pod one in with the Zoanthropes or other warriors.

Both lists are fine. In the first list I would drop regenerate since you DONT want the enemy focusing on 1 MC at a time then get 2 min squads of stealers with toxin sacs so gunlines cant deploy in the corner to give them more shooting phases before you get to them.

They would focus on one MC a turn anyways. They best pray they kill that MC. Three Vendetta's could do it, but the rest of most IG guns lines, I get saves against. After playing a lot of Stealers versus gun lines, there really is no benefit to them outflanking Guard.

In the second I'd like to see trygons instead of fexes, more attacks more wounds less kill points and the less strength only really matters vs land raiders and monoliths but you have zoanthropes for that.

I admit that is awfully tempting. But it is really hard to get them a cover save, and I have seen them die in a single round of shooting just by scattering into the open.

Anywho, I like these lists, though I think the "Hive Commander" while off the table will be argued against you. I believe even the INAT FAQ has favored that it does not work while the Tyrant's off the table.

I know, but it is not what RAW says. All the Hive Commander says is that as long as the Hive Tyrant is alive, you add +1. I am not taking these lists to adepticon.

You have a lot of support units but no killy units in the first list, imho. I like meat sshield lists. This one doesn't work though. Again you have way too many upgrades on your Tyrant. He is dead killy naked and the Guard on the wakling Tyrant seems like a good idea but is a waste. You an easily get cover saves for him with all those MCs

I learned the hard way not to line up MC's for mutual cover saves. Space Wolf players love that.

Regeneration sounds very good on paper. Have you played a lot of games yet with Nids? I found it a total waste of points.

I have played many, many games, part of it though is that I have never played Nidz, so there is an adjustment period. In my list I am paying 140 points for regeneration on 5 MCs. Compared to the rest of the codex, most 4 wound MCs cost more then that, so I figure if I gain at least 4 wounds in the course of the game, it has at least payed for itself. My thoughts are that it becomes an attrition argument. If I take it in the shorts against a good gun line, maybe by the time my stuff is damaging his stuff, I have the ability to "rebuild" my army, where as most can't do that.

Prime, LW/BS, Tox 105
4 Warriors, BS 130

Let your HT join this squad.

The Hive Tyrant is not an independent character. Though I have been tempted to take a Tyranid Prime and stick it with the Guard.

I agree with the regenerate removal. It's a huge point sink, with very little return.

I want to try it at least once.

*Note

Regen possibly worth it on 6 wound MC's depending on what you face. There's a good chance to survive a full round of shooting and get to regen after.

About your meat shield army - if you're paying 240 points for a CC/tactical backup Hive Tyrant, there's no reason to not find the extra 40 points and take the Swarmlord instead.