Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Dakka member Brazila

On February 18th I sold him a Bloodcrusher. We agreed on 2, but after his paypal payment, I discovered I only had 1. I promptly refunded him via paypal, he acknowledged refund. I sent with insurance, delivery confirmation. I see it arrived today at 1:50pm via USPS.com.

Tonight I get a Paypal dispute notice. He started at some point today. I assume after 'crusher came in mail.

I will go to no ends to make sure he is charged with mail fraud, trust me. I suggest all of you discontinue interaction with this until he explains himself.

Updates coming as I get them.

I am always worried about that when doing business on here with paypal. I guess that is why I always post detailed pictures and discriptions of everything I trade or sell before allowing anyone to agree to a trade.

This sounds like some one that is just just pissed off because he could not play two bloodcrushers in his next game. Stay strong dude, you will win this because of the refund and communication from you.

Oh, I'm strong.

I use delivery confirmation and insurance with every trade, I was ripped off once on Dakka, previous. I may regress and not trade Internationally after this. There is no recourse if International traders want to rip off.

Moral of story...

USE DELIVERY CONFIRMATION AND INSURANCE TRACKING.

Costs about $3 to use and covers your ass.




Automatically Appended Next Post:
Pretty sure I'm going to USPS tomorrow and see about filing attempted fraud charges regardless of outcome.

To cover your ass, you might take a page from Bartertown.com, and post the trail of e-mails / PMs to substantiate your claim.

As requested...

I don't have all of his responses, as I deleted them. I have a couple and all my responses via my sent box.

2/19 I wrote...
"Brazila wrote:
I'll pay $18 each for them and a little for shipping, as long as they are in good shape. let me know what your info is.
I live in IL for shipping purposes."

I said...
I will sell them for $21 each and $5 shipping, for a total of $47.

If interested, respond.

2/19 I wrote...
They are in perfect shape. One is still in shrink wrap.

Send $47 to <my paypal>

Item will go out ASAP

2/19 he wrote...
Payment sent

2/19 I wrote...
First, I want to apologize for thinking I had 2 Bloodcrushers. I only have 1. I refunded you $21 via paypal.
The one I do have is being mailed Friday morning. I will have tracking number tonight.

Sorry.

2/19 he wrote...
Hey I wanted to let you know my address is not correct on the paypal (sorry i am correcting it now)
My real info is

Adam Brazzell
"address deleted to respect his privacy"


Thanks and sorry


2/19 I wrote...
Good thing I looked at Dakka this morning.

2/19
tracking number 0309 1830 0002 2371 0494

I've dealt with a few people who 'claim' their mailing address is different than the PayPal address.

BE WARNED IF THIS HAPPENS.

If this were correct, they could easily update within a couple minutes.

Anyone who informs me the PayPal shipping address is not correct, just verbally canceled the deal.

The problem with mailing to an address other than the one listed by paypal, is that you're not covered in case something happens (at least when using ebay). Is this the same for transactions outside of ebay?

Yes - Paypal only covers you if you use the detials provided in the transaction. This guy is obviously trying to scam.

What's worse...

He paid $42 + $5 shipping for 2 Bloodcrushers. I only had one. I refunded $21. He files claim for the FULL $47.

Alright people, I had to go through this thread and clean it up a bit.

Please keep discussions on topic. If you do not have any relevant information to add to the Transaction Report, please refrain from posting. Furthermore, regardless of the details of the Transaction Report, please refrain from ad hominem attacks and insults/name-calling. Bad trades are understandably a source of distress and unhappiness, but you can still carry about seeking recompense without the name-calling. Any more of this and I start sending it up to the regular MODs.

man. Hope you get the guy.

The same time, its really hard to publically inform people about these paypal loops, because scammers will get more ideas on how to actually try to perform it. Paypal only goes one way or another on certain conditions. A bit black and white, which makes things a bit hardcore. There are lot of ways in which paypal will 'always' favor the seller, and conditions in which the paypal will 'always' favor the buyer.

Bit tough. But I hope you nail this guy.

Nope not trying to scam at all. I have already made things correct. I used an old paypal account (which caused the wrong address and caused it to try and charge an incorrect account of mine). But It was my mistake and I'm making it all right. I too worry about getting ripped off on here and really enjoy the community, I would NEVER rip someone off like that. I have already emailed the seller and told them it's been corrected on my side and if it's not right I've promised to make it right.

As soon as we receive confirmation from Old Man Ultramarine, we'll lock this thread.

Status is still in dispute. Paypal is reviewing info I gave them. This is the same as it was when I came across it last night.




Automatically Appended Next Post:
He has emailed noone. Neither my wife or I have received an email today from him. I just checked our emails..


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Brazila wrote:Nope not trying to scam at all. I have already made things correct. I used an old paypal account (which caused the wrong address and caused it to try and charge an incorrect account of mine). But It was my mistake and I'm making it all right. I too worry about getting ripped off on here and really enjoy the community, I would NEVER rip someone off like that. I have already emailed the seller and told them it's been corrected on my side and if it's not right I've promised to make it right.

You haven't sent any message. Not by email or Dakka PM. Worried about being ripped off? Punch in the tracking number, 0309 1830 0002 2371 0494, at USPS.com

I already got the bloodcrusher and I did email you and already received a response from you. Again I'm trying to make this right and am doing everything I can to correct it. I have already attempted to pay for this again on a credit card and my paypal shows it posted so should be resolved again very shortly.

Brazila, Old Man Ultramarine has made a lot of successful trades on here. How can you say that you received a response from him when he says he never got an email from you?

This could have changed in the last 6 hours, of course...

I'm glad that you appear to be working to correct the mistake. You should never file a dispute with Paypal just because you are unsure about a trade- especially if you have a valid tracking number!

@Brazila: can you post the PM you sent to OMU?

can mods check the authenticity of pm's posted here? ie. can they view another member's inbox? if not, then someone could post anything no matter how unbelieveable as a PM.

I don't think either the Swap Mods or regular Mods have that ability, though honestly, I'd be very surprised if BOTH parties were lying about such a thing.

i was just asking as someone could post they recieved a pm and the sender could simply deny it; without 3rd party access, it can become a he said/she said argument. i'm not necessarily pushing for that type of access to supposedly private messages but was just curious as to the situation.

I have not received an EMAIL from Brazila!!!!

I have received 2 PM's on Dakka from him. He stated what he has said in this post.

Status on Paypal is the same as it was from the start. I sent them the tracking number. Brazila has not responded to paypal dispute from what I can see. It is still being reviewed by paypal. Why, I can onl guess.

I'm not trying to cause trouble. I just want fair trading and respectable dealings here. I follow through on my end and expect no less than the same in return.




Automatically Appended Next Post:

warboss wrote:can mods check the authenticity of pm's posted here? ie. can they view another member's inbox? if not, then someone could post anything no matter how unbelieveable as a PM.

Like I feel like wasting my time making things up.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
The most recent responses from Brazila via Dakka PM's.

From: Brazila
To: Old Man Ultramarine
Date: 2010/02/25 23:43:57
Subject: Re:Re:address update.
Sorry for any confusion, the issue should now be all cleared up, please let me know if it's not resolved on your end.

Again sorry for any trouble if there is still a problem, let me know and I'll make it right ASAP.



From: Brazila
To: Old Man Ultramarine
Date: 2010/02/26 02:05:55
Subject: Re:Re:Re:Re:address update.
No, I used an old paypal account and I must have had the wrong account registered to it, it paid you and tried to take the funds from my bank account but tried to do so from the wrong one and it got rejected, I have went and paid the amount owed with a debit card already and it said it was all resolved. I did not mean to short you and was not ever planning on trying to not hold up my part of the deal, I'll happily send you a copy of my record showing I have paid it and I'll contact paypal first thing in the AM to make sure this is resolved, again I'm sorry for any trouble but please be assured I'm not trying to cheat you in any way at all.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Furthermore, he has not returned the favor of feedback on reputable trader post.

I may be alittle more pissy than need be on this, but it's irratating to see him say one thing and I see nothing of what he is saying.

I fully understand why your upset about this and I to worry anytime something doesn't go smoothly when I do an online deal. I'm fully acknowledging this was my mistake due to bad info on my Paypal account. I am staying in contact with you regularly on this, and I AM GOING TO MAKE THIS RIGHT! I do show a dispute open on PayPal but it says it is being investigated and doesn't give me an option to resolve this. If I can't get this resolved, I attempt to have payment sent to you via another account, and if you get double payment you can just please reimburse me.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I just sent Paypal the following message I'll post any reply I get as soon as I get it. This is an old account and I made the mistake of having an old bank account listed. I agreed to buy 2 things from seller for 47, after the deal they found they only had 1, so they refunded me 21 of it. After realizing my mistake I paid off the balance owed with a debt card, but and my account shows an even balance now, but they still show the dispute open. I would really like to get this resolved for them, since it was my error, can you please get the issue closed and get their full amount of money to them. Thank you very much.

hey brazila At the bottom of the dispute page there is a cancel claim button, hit it, confirm it and the claim is canceled, dead simple (as a matter of fact it takes roughtly 10 seconds), if you contacted paypal about this they would have told you so....



see the button? go to your account and USE it.

regards PBT

Edited out any nasty comments i might have had...

I understand the intent to resolve.

As of 7:45 USA CST it is not resolved.

I did send them a message and the reply I got was this. Dear Adam Brazzell,

Thanks for your email. You can expect to hear back from us with an
answer to your question within : 003 hours.

In the meantime, check out some of our online resources:

Help Center
- Find answers to frequently asked questions.
- Chat with our virtual customer service representative.
- See what other people are asking.

To go to the Help Center, just click “Help” at the top of any page.

Resolution Center
- Report a problem with a transaction.
- Communicate with a PayPal member to work out a dispute.
- Check on the status of an open case.

To go to the Resolution Center, log in to your account and click
“Resolution Center” under My Account.

We look forward to helping you.

Sincerely,

PayPal

Original message:
--------
Form Message
customer subject: PP-905-156-193 // I have paid off the difference and
would like to PLEASE make sure the seller is paid in full.
customer message: Transaction ID: '51S99058FR920224X'
Case or claim or dispute ID: 'PP-905-156-193'
Additional Information: 'This is an old account and I made the mistake
of having an old bank account listed. I agreed to buy # things from
seller for ##, after the deal they found they only had #, so they
refunded me ## of it. After realizing my mistake I paid off the balance
owed with a debt card, but and my account shows an even balance now, but
they still show the dispute open. I would really like to get this
resolved for them, since it was my error, can you please get the issue
closed and get their full amount of money to them. Thank you very
much.'







Automatically Appended Next Post:
I didn't open a dispute it was opened by paypal because I had the wrong bank account listed and it DOES NOT give me any option to close it. To make everyone happy I will try to pay this on another account and I just hope I get my money returned if the buyer gets paid twice for this. I understand that this was do to an error on my part but I have been trying to be VERY understanding about this and have communicated with the seller on a regular basis. I did not get upset when they last minute changed the deal we made and have tried to be very understanding about this but I don't enjoy being made to look like some kind of crook and hope this is a close matter now!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
OK I just sent payment again from another account so hopefully this is a done deal and my name can be cleared up. Here is the record of it.

Payment Sent (Unique Transaction ID #6D399224A2795602Y)


Sent to:
Kara L
Email:
EDITED FOR PRIVACY PER USER REQUEST
Amount sent:
-$26.00 USD
Fee amount:
$0.00 USD
Net amount:
-$26.00 USD


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



Date:
Feb 27, 2010
Time:
21:47:27 PST
Status:
Completed

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



Subject:
You've got money!
Note:
This is Adam Brazzell, my other account shows this paid as well, but hopefully this will end any dispute, if you get paid 2 times I would appreciate getting refunded quickly, thanks.

Brazilia- have you tried contacting Paypal directly? There is an option for contacting them via a phone service, but you must have your account information, ect. in order to access it. I find that talking directly with corporations and groups are the best way to resolve conflicts, especially ones related to indirect conversations such as letters and e-mail.

In this case, maybe they can resolve the issue with your bank account so it does not happen again rather than create a new account.

Thanks for the advise.

WTF is going on here????????

When is it policy to openly display an our email address? Get your gak together, man. Did you notice that I didn't reveal your home address previously in this post.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Rest assured I'll do right thing. Not sure why you sent more money, but I appreciate you trying to clear up issue. Refund will be issued, if neccessary.

The fact that I look like an asshat to Paypal is very annoying. I use them extensively for Ebay and buying product.

Edit your post and rid it of my email addy. That is very poor form.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
MODS aren't doing gak to requests tonight.

I don't know why Brazila is beating around the bush. Even if you can't resolve the issue with Paypals system, then just send OMU money in the amount being disputed. If and when Paypal completes the dispute then you can decide what to do.

There is no reason this should have been so complex.

Old Man Ultramarine wrote:Edit your post and rid it of my email addy. That is very poor form.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
MODS aren't doing gak to requests tonight.

Edited. You're welcome.

We'll be sure to speed up our responses so as to improve our chances for our next pay raise!