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I thought the Giga shoota looked good, 6d6 is a hell of a lot of shots, orks need high rate of fire

 Geemoney wrote:

I am 0-2 with this list, I was tabled once, lost on points the other time (both maelstrom games). Like I said before hordes of boyz get mowed down in a couple turn in my meta; and I never have enough to win assaults. I worry if I get into a bigger meta with the list, I will not be able to deal with hordes.

Spoiler:

Spearhead
Battlewagon
Deff Rolla
ard case

Battlewagon
Deff Rolla
ard case

Battlewagon
Deff Rolla

Big Mek w/ Bike
KFF

Spearhead
Battlewagon
Deff Rolla

Mek Gun x3
KMK x3
Grotz x15

Mek Gun x3
KMK x3
Grotz x15

Big Mek
KFF

Vangaurd
Tankbustaz x10
Boss Nob, rokkit
Bomb Squigs x1

Tankbustaz x10
Boss Nob, rokkit
Bomb Squigs x1

Kommandos x8
Burna x2
Nob

Boyz x19
Nob w/ Big Choppa

Boyz x19
Nob w/ Big Choppa

Warboss
Big Choppa
Kustom Shoota
Attack Squig

Warboss
Big Choppa
Kustom Shoota
Attack Squig

But that's not a horde.

Anywayz, hordes do get mowed down by defensive gunlines pretty easilly but it takes 2-3 turns to do so. And while they're shooting you down, they can't controle enough ground to score more points. That's the idea. Hordes don't really roll over the enemy. They push forward locking the opponent in his deployment zone while scoring points midboard themselves. And by the time you've run out of boyz you should have 2x more VP and the enemy should not be able to recover.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

BAN wrote:
I thought the Giga shoota looked good, 6d6 is a hell of a lot of shots, orks need high rate of fire

That's around 2.33 dead meq in cover. and 3.5 out of cover. I think the burst cannon is better because we do lack big guns. Anywayz, no matter what you pick, a killtank is gona be a good unit cause of it's overall utility.

 Geemoney wrote:

 koooaei wrote:

 Geemoney wrote:
I just had another game where my orks get shot to pieces and I can't do anything about it. This time assassins killed my support characters, so now I guess I don't get to have saves anymore...

Sometimes it feels like it is all I can do just to kill a couple models before I get tabled. 8th edition was supposed to fix things, but it is almost worse, because we lost the couple of broken things we used to have.

In my local meta I can't but 100+ boyz on the table and expect them to survive; for even two turns even with KFF and a painboy. If I mek up the boyz get out and probably kill something, but then immediately die in the shooting phase. I don't know how to fix this....

Could you post your list and mission types you're playing. I keep hearing that orks lose most of the time in classic dawn of war missions where only the last turn matters. And the first suggestion is to simply play maelstorm missions. It's a good start. The army books are not balanced around dawn of war anymore.

I am 0-2 with this list, I was tabled once, lost on points the other time (both maelstrom games). Like I said before hordes of boyz get mowed down in a couple turn in my meta; and I never have enough to win assaults. I worry if I get into a bigger meta with the list, I will not be able to deal with hordes.

Spoiler:

Spearhead
Battlewagon
Deff Rolla
ard case

Battlewagon
Deff Rolla
ard case

Battlewagon
Deff Rolla

Big Mek w/ Bike
KFF

Spearhead
Battlewagon
Deff Rolla

Mek Gun x3
KMK x3
Grotz x15

Mek Gun x3
KMK x3
Grotz x15

Big Mek
KFF

Vangaurd
Tankbustaz x10
Boss Nob, rokkit
Bomb Squigs x1

Tankbustaz x10
Boss Nob, rokkit
Bomb Squigs x1

Kommandos x8
Burna x2
Nob

Boyz x19
Nob w/ Big Choppa

Boyz x19
Nob w/ Big Choppa

Warboss
Big Choppa
Kustom Shoota
Attack Squig

Warboss
Big Choppa
Kustom Shoota
Attack Squig

You have too many BWs, just bring 3 and cut most of the footslogging HQs, bring a biker big mek, a biker warboss and a footslogging cheap warboss to stick in a BW with boyz. Bring 2 min squads of kommandos instead of a bigger one. Tankbustas can ride in the same BW, but I prefer using trukks to carry them. Try a list with biker big mek, biker warboss, footslogging warboss, 3 units of boyz, 3 BWs, 10-20 tankbustas in 1-2 trukks, KMKs and kommandos. That's the list I mostly played in 8th edition, and unless your meta is extremely competitive I think it can be a decent suggestion that doesn't change that much the list you posted.

if its an accepted fact that BW's are overcosted by a large margine you must imagine that in comparison to your opponents you are getting alot less on the board than you should.
seems to me you could save more than 100 points by going down to 2 BW, useing zhadsnark for a bikerboss, and pumping up your footsloggers.

So the strategy is a horde 150+ and just sit on objectives and hope you win?

BTW the cheap warboss go in the BW's with the 19 boyz (which includes the nob). He is there to help with ld so the boyz can operate independently.

 Geemoney wrote:
So the strategy is a horde 150+ and just sit on objectives and hope you win?

BTW the cheap warboss go in the BW's with the 19 boyz (which includes the nob). He is there to help with ld so the boyz can operate independently.

I think that's the tourny meta style of play, but i personally feel like the best way to win is to cripple your enemy. I never once played just for objectives.
I think you can put a ton of boyz on the table and enough other gak to take the fight to the enemy. I have never ran a true tide in my life, i cant it would be not my style.
But i always use a good mix of boyz and toyz and in general i usually win most of my games, 8/10. But i literally only play Ork and i have become pretty adept at making
good decisions and target priority. Also i find alot of people underestimate my armies, until its too late ahahahahaha.

Thats said this edition i expect my win/loss ratio will slide a bit as i cant handle using horde but whatever feth it, i manage to have fun all the time regardless of outcome.
SO my personal take is to mix boyz and toyz, and i think i can pull it off. I dont think i could resort to just objective camping and call it fun and i dont think thats what the
spirit of Orks are, i think its to have fun and make a mess of the tidy plans of more serious people and armies.

 Geemoney wrote:
So the strategy is a horde 150+ and just sit on objectives and hope you win?

BTW the cheap warboss go in the BW's with the 19 boyz (which includes the nob). He is there to help with ld so the boyz can operate independently.

"Sitting" on objectives won't work. You advance towards the ennrmy with your 200 models scoring objectives as you march across them.

I don't have 200 models ready to go, so in the short term I will need to do something different.

 Geemoney wrote:
I don't have 200 models ready to go, so in the short term I will need to do something different.

What do you have in you're collection? Anything that could stand in for a Killtank? Gives us what ya got and we can give ya Ideas.
Big fan of the 2 separate squads of tankbustas ina trukk as long as theres more vehicular threats than just 1 trukk. but if you throw a few BW's across the board it could be overlooked.

I can honestly field almost anything, but I am capped at 90 boyz, 10 kommandos, and 60 stormboyz (not all painted) for a 8th edition horde style list.

Here is a variation of the previous list, based on the feedback:
Battle wagon + 20 boyz x3
trukk + 10 tankbustas x2

4 KMK Mek gunz

Big Mek, KFF
Big Mek w/ Bike, KFF
Zhardsnark or Biker Boss
Pain boy on Bike

That is 2038 points, so something needs to go.

Stormboyz, minimum size or maximum?

BAN wrote:
Stormboyz, minimum size or maximum?

Maximum.

They Cant deepstrike anymore and regardless of their speed must start on the board and make their way towards the foe, it would be nothing for a single small unit to damage a minimum squad and force morale annihilation. Unless you wanna run a boss nearby or bring Zagstrukk. Go with More.

So if i take zagstruck too still max mobs?

I think it wouldnt hurt, a large mob can also suffer alot casualties so the fearless thing would help. but if your shy on points you can skip him.

I use zagstrukk when I take Stormboyz, he is a decent character for the points, even with out the leadership buffs.

 Geemoney wrote:
I can honestly field almost anything, but I am capped at 90 boyz, 10 kommandos, and 60 stormboyz (not all painted) for a 8th edition horde style list.

Here is a variation of the previous list, based on the feedback:
Battle wagon + 20 boyz x3
trukk + 10 tankbustas x2

4 KMK Mek gunz

Big Mek, KFF
Big Mek w/ Bike, KFF
Zhardsnark or Biker Boss
Pain boy on Bike

That is 2038 points, so something needs to go.

Your lists durability comes from 4+ armour and 5++ KFFs, so I would double down on big meks (for repair and KFFs). The advantage of this list is that single dmg weapons are basically useless for the first turn or two, so I like that. However, if a tank is exposed, you're weak to high ap/dmg shots, and since you only have one KFF on a bike, those 5 vehicles will have a hard time fitting in one KFF bubble. You probably want the big mek on foot back with your mek gunz (which you should bring more of, by the way, like 10 i'm not kidding) so I recommend dropping zhardsnark for another big mek on bike w/ KFF. Your mechanised list doesn't really need the warboss advance/charge rule since your speed comes from the expensive vehicles. Plus, another big mek with KFF gives your tanks more options in which way they want to go, you can control more board space and prevent escapes if you're clever. The bane of assault armies is people that are faster than you, or ones that spread out, and the way your list looks, it feels as if you are forced to funnel down the line under one KFF which makes you vulnerable to these counter strategies.

Also, I would drop the painboy. You're not slogging along the field in a clean manner maximising your painboy 6+++ each turn. You look like an alpha strike army that has guaranteed charges, and you're paying a premium for that so you don't really need the durability of a painboy. Plus you just don't have the models to make him efficient, in the end will he save the lives of 20 orkz? Probably not. His dakka guns are irrelevant and his powerklaw is doing the same job as your tankbustahs and KMK's. I would bring 20 more boyz, split em in groups of 10 for objective holding or protecting the gunz. Another small thing, bring bomb squiggs. I find that if you are able to get some shots off with the tank bustahs, 18' will probably be fine anyway, especially since you've got a trukk deployment. But also, tank bustahs are almost always one-shot-only kinda dudes, once they are in range, you kill what you shoot (or don't) and then the return fire blows up the trukk and a stiff breeze kills the remainder of the boyz. I almost always save my command points for the squig bombs and get some real damage in. I like to use tankbustahs as 7 man suicide squads (5 rokkits 2 bombs) that I jump in and shoot once + charge. With the trukk strategy, I would still like to see two squig bombs in the vehicle, they'll fit.

To fit in all the extra points I'm recommending, I would drop a battlewagon. You might even have space to lift one boy squad up to 30, and hopefully include a weirdboy to jump them in turn 2 when your strike begins. If you have any more space, I would put deff rollahs on the remaining two BWs. Alternatively, you could bring a dakkajet if you have the model, its cheaper than a BW so the points should fit. It's shooting is quite good, and it fits your fully armoured list really well, it's also hard to hit and looks really juicy, so it might bait some heavy fire and protect your trukks. Talk it up heaps: "do you know my dakkajet shoots EIGHTEEN TIMES YO, strength 6! it even has AP. It's literally my MOST ACCURATE shooter (at only BS4+)!".

Personally I like a mek gunline (I bring 6-10 KMKs) protected with a stormboy counter charge. One squad of 30 stormboyz does work if the gunz are in trouble or there is a deepstrike backfield. I deploy the gunline really far forward, and have stormboyz hanging around backfield out of range until I know how to make them useful (or midfield in cover/LOS). I rarely use them as front line chargers these days, I have da jumping boyz for that. Mekz gunz are awesome, legit, not just for orkz standards. Durable as hell, come with a free bubble wrap, great board controllers, point efficient, and since they split into single units after deployment they reduce enemy shooting efficiency substantially. Also if you double down on mekz, you've got a major amount of repairing that starts to make a difference with these guns. The further forward you deploy your guns the better, 36' sucks for a gunline. There are also some crazy annoying tricks you can do with the gunner grotts as well once you start playing with them a lot. Their "take cover" rule is crazy easy to abuse (they take cover from each other, for example, so you can typically only shoot the grotts you're about to charge after deepstrike). With this sort of strategy, if I go first, I will own 4/6ft of the table without even really trying, and in maelstrom I can hold that for a few turns. If I use dajump turn one on boyz, then I own the entire board except their deployment. Most of that will be thanks to mek gunz.

Finally, like everyone else has says, drop the wagons and bring more boyz. 90 boyz + 60 stormboyz is a good number, then you can start talking about warboses and painboyz, but then we are talking about a different list. And just in case you're bringing powerklaws for your nobz, don't do that. Especially with your list's heavy ap already. Save the points, bring BCs or nothing, your list has enough armour piercing, and you're not bringing a banner to add value to these weapons.

Aaaaand thats my monthly post now boyz, see you in November.

Edit: just some crazy sh!t you can do with grots btw: They deploy 3" away from each other (for some reason) not the normal 2" coherency, so you can deploy out of coherency and get massive spread on turn 0 or turn 1. You only need 1 grot per KMK, so 1 KMK's worth of grots shoots 5 KMKS, the rest are independent groups of 5 that you should be moving (and advancing) outwards all over the place. by turn 2 (or maybe even turn 1 with some nice advance rolls) you can have pockets of 5 grots across the entire back field 9" away from each other, untargettable, zero chance of deepstrike. The biggest problem with this is flyers getting stuck in the middle of your grots, but you cant beat every strategy, and sometimes you can even beat this if you have enough grots. Screen in front of your gunz as well, take cover protects them thanks to the boyz charging, and obviously far enough that consolidate doesn't threaten your gunz. Keep them on the move so you have anoying 5 man screens as far away from each other as possible. I used to do concentric circles, which isn't bad, but I'm going for more of a splotchy pattern now, lots of half circles spotting the table. It takes literal turns to charge a gun through pathetic grots, and most of my opponents that have played my army more than once just don't bother and instead shoot into them if they feel the need. With grots in the midfield, I can often use them as a shooting screen for vulnerable weirdboyz (character rule) who have just jumped a crew. Oh and did I mention grots count toward wierdboy psychic boosts? can you say guaranteed overcharged smites? even after you've jumped a 30man squad forward. Take cover grots are amazing, the strategic benefit of having these jokers around with that special rule is potentially worth the points for them alone! let alone you have a heavy D6 armour shredder for free with them. They are the smallest unit of most useful jokers you've seen on the board.

 Geemoney wrote:
So the strategy is a horde 150+ and just sit on objectives and hope you win?

Unfortunately the most effective orks' built is currently a horde of 180+ t-shirt save dudes (boyz, stormboyz, kommandos) plus buffing characters (warboss, ghaz, zagstruk, weirdboy, bik mek with kff, painboy/mad dok), nothing else.

 Blackie wrote:

 Geemoney wrote:
So the strategy is a horde 150+ and just sit on objectives and hope you win?

Unfortunately the most effective orks' built is currently a horde of 180+ t-shirt save dudes (boyz, stormboyz, kommandos) plus buffing characters (warboss, ghaz, zagstruk, weirdboy, bik mek with kff, painboy/mad dok), nothing else.

That is simply not the case.

http://bloodofkittens.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/09/Josh-Leondaris-2nd-Overall-EastCon-2017.pdf
http://bloodofkittens.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/Jeff-Everitt-1st-Overall-Attack-X-2017.pdf

I didn't even need to look very far to find successful ork lists with a quarter or less of their points spent on boyz. Stop pretending the sky is falling and work with the tools we have.

LOL 8 weirdboyz. Second list is actually a green tide with buffing characters and a few points of artillery.

First list look quite average, I guess the player that brought it is a very good one, or maybe just extremely lucky.

I've just tried the green tide a few times to be honest, because I hate playing with tons of footslogging dudes. Yes we can have decent results even with other units but if we're talking about very competitive games green tides are by far the best built we have, I don't seen tons of orks lists winning tournaments, especially if they're not green tides.

In casual games 75% of the codex actually work and is fun to play.

Inside those two lists, who are playing in tournaments that have 30 maelific lord armies (for example), include:
over 10 different HQ choices and support staff,
weirdboyz,
kommandoz,
stormboyz,
boyz,
gretchin,
big gunz,
morkanaut,
and dakkajets.

I can link more lists if you want, I know I've seen lists with mek gunz, tank bustaz, trukkz, even flashgitz and a giant squiggoth.

We're looking at over half our codex turning up in competitive play (and doing quite well) and when you get shown evidence of this you just brush it off as extremely lucky. There are some things, like killtanks, that I'm extremely surprised I have not seen in a list yet, because I'm sure that vehicle is competitively costed.

Edit: bro, I found a list with lootahs in it! http://bloodofkittens.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/09/Elliott-Levy-2nd-Overall-Rampager-GT-2017.pdf
Edit x2: I might add, that these successful lists have all been pretty recent, and include fairly shooty lists (lots of gun lines). Which quite a few people in these forums seem to think is not viable. Just saying, maybe check your facts? Green tide is out there, but maybe that's not all.

But other than searaching lists on the internet have you actually played orks in 8th edition?

The green tide is not only boyz plus characters, as I mentioned before, it also includes stormboyz and kommandos but they're just faster boyz and sneaky boyz.

Where are the trukks, nobz, meganobz, BWs, koptas, buggies, 5-6 types of mek gunz, kans, stompa, burnas, tankbustas, warbikes, 3 types of fliers? Currently only a few units are actually viable and tipycally in the same combinations, t-shirt save dudes with other t-shirts dudes and eventually cheap artillery (kannons or hidden lobbas, not KMKs for example).

One good result at tournaments means nothing, I've seen very average lists winning local tournaments over the years, it's still a game of dice. Try to play that list with a morkanaut at high levels for some games, you'll see yourself how it actually performs. Find full battle reports about those lists, that would be "evidence".

I've played almost everything in the ork codex, with the exceptions of kans, flyers and stompas which I don't own, I've tried several different combinations, and 95% of my lists didn't have more than 90 among boyz, stormboyz or kommandos. Even with some results against competitive lists, but tipycally against any competitive TAC player there's only the green tide standing. And small variants of green tides, like the cheap artillery spam or the weirdboy spam.

I didn't consider the kill tank since in my area FW is basically banned, but I don't deny its effectiveness.

What is up with people in this forum asking if I even play Orkz. Is it really that hard to believe there are people out there that are playing non-green tide and doing well? You're blowing off artillery spam as if its barely a choice, weirdboy spam as if its even relevant, and combinations of these things like it doesn't matter.

I'm not denying the things you listed have not seen results, but you listed like half the codex (maybe less?), that's still half a codex to work with.

Try not to be so defeatist when it comes to the army. And in my opinion, especially towards people asking for advice on Orkz. Imagine if you're asking how to make your army better and the only response people give is depressing "green tide or gtfo" responses, when 1) that's just not true, and 2) it asks them to change their army so much that they probably won't follow the advice anyway. There's no "tactics" in this thread in that circumstance, just people complaining.

Orkz are not topping tables, they are not teir 1, and they sorely need help with their codex. But they are still getting results, and are doing so with a variety of things.

hollow one wrote:
What is up with people in this forum asking if I even play Orkz. Is it really that hard to believe there are people out there that are playing non-green tide and doing well? You're blowing off artillery spam as if its barely a choice, weirdboy spam as if its even relevant, and combinations of these things like it doesn't matter.

I'm not denying the things you listed have not seen results, but you listed like half the codex (maybe less?), that's still half a codex to work with.

Try not to be so defeatist when it comes to the army. And in my opinion, especially towards people asking for advice on Orkz. Imagine if you're asking how to make your army better and the only response people give is depressing "green tide or gtfo" responses, when 1) that's just not true, and 2) it asks them to change their army so much that they probably won't follow the advice anyway. There's no "tactics" in this thread in that circumstance, just people complaining.

Orkz are not topping tables, they are not teir 1, and they sorely need help with their codex. But they are still getting results, and are doing so with a variety of things.

Or it could be that the Ork armies that are doing the best in Big tournaments are based around exactly what he said, HQs and Boyz (which includes stormboyz/Kommandos)

Mek Gunz/Artillery are used as are grotz as back field objective grabbers, not as offensive units. Think of them as throw away units.

The Crap units in our codex are

Burna Boyz
Nobz
Meganobz
Nob Bikers
Flash Gitz
Lootas
Warbikers
Deff Koptas
Warbuggies
Wartrakks
Skorchas
Trukkz
Battlewagonz
Killa Kanz
Deff Dreadz
Morkanaut
Stompa
Burna Bommer
Dive Bommer (Whatever the feth its called)
And I would argue the Dakkajet isn't really worth taking either.



So in reality, the majority of the index is trash, we have a couple of useful options and that is it.

I think we should specify that painboyz work especially well for healing wierdboyz and Ghaz in the op. But currently, Grotsnik is always more preferable than a footslogging painboy. Cause he is basically one. But better.

And...probably move burna bomber from red to yellow because of how you can play around with their special 4+ on-death explosion that deals 3 mortal wounds to anything around. This also requires some better positioning on your part - which is not always possible - but a couple ork squads loose much less from 3 mortal wounds than a couple marine squads.

I disagree with SemperMortis that most of the index is trash. We have a lot of semi-viable units like the gorkanaut, Nobz, battlewagons, tankbustas, the Dakkajet and burna-bommers. But if you field them against a competetive list like guilliman-assaultcannon-soup then you get annihilated. Every time. If you bring 200 Boyz (or kommandos/stormboyz) and characters for the balance then, and only then, you have a chance.

Personally I like playing infantry-heavy Orks, and I like the green tide. But playing with 200 models is too extreme, it is simply too much of a hassle.

For playing semi-competetively the index is good. Most of our units is decent, and there a only a few real stinkers (looking at you, Stompa)

pismakron wrote:
I disagree with SemperMortis that most of the index is trash. We have a lot of semi-viable units like the gorkanaut, Nobz, battlewagons, tankbustas, the Dakkajet and burna-bommers. But if you field them against a competetive list like guilliman-assaultcannon-soup then you get annihilated.

It goes without saying that the crappiness threshhold is much higher for casual play.

But even in competitive play you might sometimes integrate the average units in your army when they synergise well. For example, kommandoes on their own are not that amazing. Just too expensive for regular boyz with infiltrate. But add in the pressure of a greentide or stormboyz, a teleporting 30-strong blob and kommandoes start to shine. Dakkajets and bombers are quite overpriced for the average damage output and lack of utility. But take into consideration that the rest of your list might lack means of dealing with far away units or even regular bauble-wraps and this mediocre flyers suddenly get a place in your list and perform ok.

But keep in mind that all this options still require a solid core to function. And solid core are boyz, stormboyz and characters. That's probably how GW intended it. But the problem is that the core is so much better than the rest that you can play with 'just' core and it will often be more effective.

If the person says that: "i loose 95% games with my battlewagons, mek gunz and tankbustas" what else can we suggest other than "take more boyz and stormboyz or play casual games"? Unfortunately, you can't just mesh average units together and get a strong list out of it. Not with orks. Not at the moment.

pismakron wrote:
We have a lot of semi-viable units like the gorkanaut, Nobz, battlewagons, tankbustas, the Dakkajet and burna-bommers. But if you field them against a competetive list like guilliman-assaultcannon-soup then you get annihilated. Every time. If you bring 200 Boyz (or kommandos/stormboyz) and characters for the balance then, and only then, you have a chance.

For playing semi-competetively the index is good. Most of our units is decent, and there a only a few real stinkers (looking at you, Stompa)

This. Against competitive armies there's very little we can do, unless we take our best built and its small variants. Some of the lists that placed in tournaments also benefit from some tournament's format which limit the game to 3 turns usually while a regular game of 40 lasts 5-7. The same lists won't reach the same results in regular 40k games. I've tried the gunlines for example, with 10-20 lootas and 10 mek gunz, but against competitive opponents turns 3+ are very hard.

I don't have 200 models ready to go

This is the lament of every Ork player this edition! Sales of Ork boys and carry cases (soon to be renamed 'boyz boxez') must be through the roof...

hollow one wrote:
What is up with people in this forum asking if I even play Orkz. Is it really that hard to believe there are people out there that are playing non-green tide and doing well? You're blowing off artillery spam as if its barely a choice, weirdboy spam as if its even relevant, and combinations of these things like it doesn't matter.

To be fair, all of those lists are pretty much exactly what's he was talking about. 8 Weirdboyz is just around 500 points, the big gun spam is barely half of that. The entire rest of all those lists is pretty much boyz, deep striking boyz and fast boyz (each one is still running 80-105 boyz) plus a bunch of support characters. Not green tide, but definitely the footslogger archetype.
The only two really surprising things to me on those lists are the morkanaut and lobbas.

I'm not denying the things you listed have not seen results, but you listed like half the codex (maybe less?), that's still half a codex to work with.

When counting SAG/KFF, three big gunz and six mek guns separately, the codex has 54 entries. Those three lists use 19 out of those, plus one FW model. So about a third.
7 of those choice are HQs though, which leave 8/12 elites, 5/6 fast attack, 13/16 heavy support, 3/4 flyers and the trukk (only DT) and the stompa (only LoW) unused, not counting FW.

Try not to be so defeatist when it comes to the army. And in my opinion, especially towards people asking for advice on Orkz. Imagine if you're asking how to make your army better and the only response people give is depressing "green tide or gtfo" responses, when 1) that's just not true, and 2) it asks them to change their army so much that they probably won't follow the advice anyway. There's no "tactics" in this thread in that circumstance, just people complaining.

You're not wrong, but getting 7+ weirdboyz or 10+ big gun units isn't that much less of a change than going full green tide.

The real issue is that the centerpieces of many archetypes are no longer viable, so no battlewagon bash, trukk rush, speed freaks, dread mob or deff wing. It's comparable to all those people telling Black Templar/Space Wolves/Whitescar/Blood Angel players to just have their army count as Ultramarines and use Roboute Guilliman.

In any case, the original question was about tournament winning ork lists. This means beating Mortarion/Magnus tag team, Roboute Guilliman and his donut of assault cannon razorbacks, tripple bane blades and armored companies. That's probably why those armies are doing so well, weird boyz, kannons and even lootaz work pretty well against all of those. Plus boyz (and also kannons) are pretty good at clearing out conscripts, so that's covered as well.

If anything, those army lists have shown that orks can still play the meta, even if TAC is dead. I guess that's better than nothing

What is the best loadout for nobs in trukks?

Like how many nobs do you take vrs grots etc.

I'd rather take nobz over tankbustas because they have a plastic kit.