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ok so way I see it:

Rhinos with CSM bum rush to objectives/enemy
DP's behind the rhinos and assaulting into assaulty goodness
Defilers for any hordes
Oblits for obvious reasons
Non mech plague marines for support/sitting on close objectives
GD for popping out and being one of the best cheap MC's in the game


1 Daemon Prince (Wings; Mark of Nurgle; Warptime x1) 175 pts

1 Daemon Prince (Wings; Mark of Nurgle; Warptime x1) 175 pts

Summoned Greater Daemon 100 pts

7 Plague Marines (Plasmagun x2) 191 pts

7 Plague Marines (Plasmagun x2) 191 pts


9 Chaos Space Marines (Chaos Glory; Meltagun x1; Rhino)
1 Aspiring Champion (Power Fist)
1 Rhino
245 pts

9 Chaos Space Marines (Chaos Glory; Meltagun x1; Rhino)
1 Aspiring Champion (Power Fist)
1 Rhino
245 pts

9 Chaos Space Marines (Chaos Glory; Meltagun x1; Rhino)
1 Aspiring Champion (Power Fist)
1 Rhino
245 pts

2 Obliterators @ 150 pts

2 Obliterators @ 150 pts

1 Defiler @ 150 pts
Total: 1997

Looks good overall, but why 9 CSM per squad?
I would suggest keeping the champions naked for GD summoning, and using the leftover points for an extra CSM/Melta in each squad.

Daemon Princes are fine.

Give the plauge marines a champ with fist incase they get in trouble and maybe swap the plasmas for meltas also give them a rhino if you can find the points.

Greater daemon isnt that good at all but I wont stop you from playing him.

Make the chaos marines squads up to 10 and give them 2 meltas each.

Defiler you need 2 or none same as vindicators, one isnt scary and will be destroyed easy, 3 is to many points of your army but two is just right one on both sides of your board edge causing havoc is fun.

So with that typed make a squad of 3 oblits and 2 defilers or 3 squads of 2 oblits.

Hope this helps and Gl.

I will ask as well, why 9?
IMO, it's the equivalent of using a rusty screwdriver to gouge out ones eyes.

Oblits are nice, but the Defiler is lonely, while the 3 Rhinos and MCs are just minimal target saturation...saying a pair would do it better, but otherwise it's pretty exposed to heavier fire.

Plague marines are ok, but they benefit from Rhinos as well.

Princes are ok, while the SGreater Deamon doesn't have economical entrances and doesn't get you very much.

everyone everyone EVERYONE!

its 9 CSM+1 ASP CHAMPION! what does that give you?....

9+1=10, DAMN! its 3x 10.

defiler is a tad lonesome, i'll reconfigure. and i do not ave enough rhinos for the PM's. I also only use Plasma witth my PM's since they are so much less likley to die from overheat and i have a mass of plasma around. going WYSIWYG here!


1 Daemon Prince @ 175 pts (Wings; Mark of Nurgle; Warptime x1)

1 Daemon Prince @ 175 pts (Wings; Mark of Nurgle; Warptime x1)

1 Summoned Greater Daemon @ 100 pts

7 Plague Marines @ 191 pts (Plasmagun x2)

7 Plague Marines @ 191 pts (Plasmagun x2)

9 Chaos Space Marines @ 255 pts (Chaos Glory; Meltagun x2; Rhino)
1 Aspiring Champion (Power Fist)
1 Rhino (Twin Linked Bolter)

9 Chaos Space Marines @ 255 pts (Chaos Glory; Meltagun x2; Rhino)
1 Aspiring Champion (Power Fist)
1 Rhino (Twin Linked Bolter)

9 Chaos Space Marines @ 250 pts (Meltagun x2; Rhino)
1 Aspiring Champion (Power Fist)
1 Rhino (Dozer Blade; Twin Linked Bolter)

2 Obliterators @ 150 pts

2 Obliterators @ 150 pts

1 Chaos Terminators 105 pts
1 Terminator (Combi-melta x1)
1 Terminator (Combi-melta x1)
1 Terminator (Combi-melta x1)

Total: 1997

I don't see the point in the chaos terminators tbh. Get rhinos for the plague marines and you're sorted. No point in the plague marines being on foot tbh and if they stop on foot they can easily be killed by plasma and battle cannons etc.

Again, the SGreater Daemon is coming in on a fist champion....that really sucks IMO.

In addition, you already have 2 princes... I don't get why you need a slogging MC at that point, it's a bit much at 2000 when you could use the points from the SGD and maybe even dropping the termies for say another troop... or some chosen or more termies to make it worth it at the 2000 mark.

TBH I used a GD in 2k and it works well. Just make sure you pull it onto the board in the thick of things because it has no fleet or wings so it cannot make assault quickly.

Sure you could drop it but you certainly don't need another troop choice. I say keep it as having three monstrous creatures running around takes fire power away from the rest of your army or those creatures will run riot.

Im dconverting some excellent SGD's and i really want to use them... long story short. not trying to win a GT with them.

@mercer: as i mentioned before i dont have enough rhinos for the PM's and way i see it they will last in the open longer than standard CSM, besides they can sit back on the objective if its say capture and control or something.

IronfrontAlex wrote:everyone everyone EVERYONE!

its 9 CSM+1 ASP CHAMPION! what does that give you?....

9+1=10, DAMN! its 3x 10.

No need to be a *censored* about it. It's not our fault you listed it as a unit, when in the codex it's referred to as an upgrade, if this was a Thousand Sons list no one would have given it a second thought.

This has been said so much I'm starting to hear an echo, but champions need to be cheap if you're going to summon a GD, because the PF brings the GD cost from 130-155pts. Like you said "GD being one of the best cheap MC's," no longer the case at 155pts when you could have a Lash Prince for the same price.

I'm not giving them all fists soley for GD summoning, the GD is like the cherry on top not my main form of assault. In the past ive seen way to many CSM squads go down without a powerfist or some equivalent.

I wouldn't call the GD a 'cherry on top' as he's not reliably good. Often I see him be very useless...anyway, if those suggestions fall on deaf ears/the list will be operating at a handicap, then just roll with what you want.

If the choice is between defiler or termies, I'd say defiler sadly. Termicides are just so-so at 2000 points with respect to easy kill points and just not enough bodies to actually expect anything else out of them.

Aye, the GD isn't rocking. For the points it's good but it can still be taken down with mass fire power and power weapon attacks.

like i mentioned before: This is for friendly games and soley because im converting some pretty epic SGD's at the moment.


on a slightly unrelated note since you guys are very.... opinionated. Which GD do you prefer for C:CD?

If going chaos daemons I'd consider a blodothirster or keeper of secrets; both are good in combat buit the keeper gets I10 and frag grenades!!

mercer wrote:If going chaos daemons I'd consider a blodothirster or keeper of secrets; both are good in combat buit the keeper gets I10 and frag grenades!!

QFT

The only model i can actually have completed by tomorrow would be the keeper anyways, at I10 and his attacks he....i mean she....wait i mean .... IT is a beast.

You mean s/he?

Probably, Also: making a sweet conversio for a dual CCw dred.. i understand people hate them and rightfully so but in games with spearhead deployment or other close deployment ones ive actually been hit pretty hard by them, they are also pretty cheap, anyone's thoughts?

chaos dreadnoughts are cheap, but remember they only shoot at things which is visible, so 45c arc from the weapon mounts, you keep other units out of sight of these they'll be fine

wait... only 45 degrees...?

is this true? i made the plasma cannon and las asd well as a multimelta for him but i was only going to use him as dual CCW because of fire frenzy... but it only works with the 45 drgree arc? REALLY? then i can put decent guns on them wooot!

It's a walker. IIRC (as I don't use them) walkers can shoot all around, like infantry. Or something like they can pivot, I just can't recall right now :(

As a side note: don't post a list if you don't want people giving criticism. Sorry, I see this too much and it really bugs, ya know?

yeah and i never said i didn't want critisism, just not scathing.

IronfrontAlex wrote:wait... only 45 degrees...?

is this true? i made the plasma cannon and las asd well as a multimelta for him but i was only going to use him as dual CCW because of fire frenzy... but it only works with the 45 drgree arc? REALLY? then i can put decent guns on them wooot!

They have 45 degrees LOS from the weapon barrel, they only pivot to the nearest VISIBLE target. So if you have a target visible within the 45 degree arc it then pivots towards it So keep your dreads forward and make sure none are in the 45 degree arc

..... AWESOME!

i have a gun dred and a CC dred... might start using them more often now!

I'd have to agree with Sanctjud about the Defiler. This is also because I have only every ran one on all my lists. I just think that it has way too much versitility to ignore. I usually run mine with Autocannons and and extra DCC arm since the AC actually can to something, esp when the BC is blown off.

Besides the SGD the only other thing I, maybe, don't like are the PM. I do like the way they are kitted out, but I think giving each a Rhino would really help. Try it out and see if you like it, idk, its up to you.

Other than that, have you every thought of any other Cult troops or icons? Since the other three squads are just rushing forward maybe one of them should be some Zerkers? Or even giving one a Icon of Slaanesh, or Khorne?

All in all I think it would do fine for friendly games, I know I'd love to play this one.

trying to keep it word bearers. idk... least fluffyish with my own fluff lolz..


and defilers twinsies.... might have to try this one!

The Chaos codex clearly says "... At the beginning of the Shooting phase it must pivot on the spot towards the closest visible unit and fire all its weapons..." Visible = LoS, not "currently visible". Unless there's a FAQ about this somewhere you can't hide your troops if I'm reading this correctly.

Zulander wrote:The Chaos codex clearly says "... At the beginning of the Shooting phase it must pivot on the spot towards the closest visible unit and fire all its weapons..." Visible = LoS, not "currently visible". Unless there's a FAQ about this somewhere you can't hide your troops if I'm reading this correctly.

One of the many FAQs I've read on the subject: http://www.theruleslawyers.com/2009/09/chaos-dreadnought-fire-frenzy-in-5th-edition/ The overall consensus is that you use the 45 degree arc, then pivot.

So do you have to pivot it to face a unit and then shoot or is it check the arc then pivot?

Zulander wrote:So do you have to pivot it to face a unit and then shoot or is it check the arc then pivot?

Check arc, pivot to face the closest unit in the original arc, then fire.