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I cant say im a massive fan of LOTR but that said i belive if tomorrow GW brought their other gaming systerms into the same pricing shceme thats in place for LOTR it would restore a lot of my faith in the hobby

Posted By syr8766 on 01/20/2007 8:34 PM
Heck, they could have solved half their problems by switching all three games to the same LOTR/WAB rules set (with minor, requisite mods to make relevant for the different genres). Then, they could effectively have had one gaming engine for ALL Warhammer games: FB, LOTR, 40k and WAB. That would have actually been pretty sweet. Too bad.

Crisis on Infinite Earths, eh?  I like the way you think.

Suppose GW got a couple of freelance technical authors and put out a tight new edition of 40K by Easter.

No new rules, just everything organised and explained properly, and the FAQ questions answered.

Who would buy it?

Posted By Tigerone on 01/20/2007 6:14 PM
Sorry that was what I thought Dakka was all about...I mean really anything that is poston on here except the Anti GW rants starts off "I saw this on warseer"....

Well, that's a good thing.  This way I can get all the latest rumors without having to trawl through page after page of "Spase Marinez!!! Hurr!" and "power gamer BAD!!!" on Warseer. 

"It was all a bit too easy.  We forgot the basic skills."   Oops! o

Dear "Ted" (if that is your real name):

I've got a radical idea for you!  What if, rather than simply trying to piss off as many of your customers as humanly possible, you instead attempted to offer them goods and services in exchange for money?  I know, I know... it's crazy.  So crazy, it just might work!

Sincerely,
Abadabadoobaddon

Posted By Red on 01/20/2007 9:08 PM
I cant say im a massive fan of LOTR but that said i belive if tomorrow GW brought their other gaming systerms into the same pricing shceme thats in place for LOTR it would restore a lot of my faith in the hobby

If GW priced all the plastic WHFB and 40K plastics like the LOTR plastic boxes I would instantly look past all of the other gaping flaws with their products. Would never happen though.

Unless their new market strategy involves drastic reductions in price, then I won't be interested. Also, considering I just saw the price of 5 new Dev Marines (20 pounds sterling), which is two pounds more than the 10-man Tac box, I guess prices won't be going anywhere but up.

BYE

Well GW just signed another 5 year license for LOTR. The reason being because of legal delays between Jackson and newline. Newlines license is about to expire as well, hoping to get the Hobbit made. The hobbit movie was anticipated for release after 2010.

Recent news pertaining to that issue has stated Newline wont do another picture with jackson.
derhobbit-film.de/indexengl.shtml
But the Tolkein estate wants Jackson to do the hobbit.

That leaves the Hobbit, and GW hopes for another bubble to burst in limbo...

GW has given a whole wad of cash in anticipation for newline to make the hobbit. Not sure where that leaves GW and their license, but I can assure you that LOTR will be bugging nonLOTR players for the next half decade minimum. This license renewal (because of the jackson/Newline conflict) may turn out to be a very bad business move for GW.

GW isnt going to renew a license and not try to make money off of it by crooning its virtues in their fav ad rag.

I predict because of that, there wont be anything worthwhile in WD because LOTR has to take up the slack. Because the renewal may potentially backfire with no Hobbit spinof for them to milk, I can assume we will see prices skyrocket even more into the stratosphere because GW cannot afford further losses.

As Hellfury points out, LotR is never ever going away. Ever. Not in the next five years at least. And don't count out GW managing to get their hands on the Hobbit licensing either. While New Line is unlikely to make it thanks to the enormous jerkbag that is Shay and New Line's exceptionally sleazy business practices, Jackson has the full backing of the Tolkien estate and much of the original cast, so someone else will be making that film in the next few years. And GW is guaranteed to be there begging to do the miniatures for it (and they'll have a strong case too).

As to pricing, well, large swathes of the LotR is priced a bit high, IMNSHO. Two miniatures for $20? No thank you. Two true 28mm scale minatures for $20? Uh, hell no. Though 20 plastic figures for $25 is freaking sweet. That does at least help ease the entry into the hobby pain, unlike with 40k or WHFB where you get this $45 box with oodles and oodles of figures and then when little Billy wants to go expand his army, the same amount of money only gets him at most twenty figures and often only five or one even one (vehicle) for the same price. Little Billy then goes and finds another hobby (or game system) that isn't so ridiculously expensive.

I expect Lucasfilms to pick up the slack. I'd expect to hear a little more about the deal near or around Easter, and I expect the toys/ games/ and propaganda machine that is hasbro to begin announcing a new aquisition in or around the fall, in light of the next few months of a downward tailspin. I plan on hearing of a certain CEO's departure in light of his recent stock buy, and either he to dump the stock, or him to be bought out.

The pricing has pretty much hit the glass cealing, and I'll be very suprised if the current stock trend doesn't begin a whole advertising/ scaleback/ repricing phase from GW.

- Kirby's flip flop public rantings, between stock info and the trade mags- as well as the profit loss.

- Jervis Johnson making a comback into the limelight, after years of hiding in the Fanatic Dungeon.

- Reconstitution of the Stormboys program, to coincide with the new product schedual.

- Recent trends of the other gaming companies Prepaints becoming more and more popular, Mongoose will get its stuff together, because thier life depends on the next two rolls of the preverbial dice. They can not afford a rehash of the Picture debacal, and they will make it a priority to enforce high standards on the SST evo line.

- The popularity of the little engine that could- AT-43. Even though around here it's 100$ a box, I can see some of the future reductions in price, and a glut in the market, along with sale of the game from an unexpected quarter, Mail order and internet sales.

- With the spread of the information, almost tacticly placed amongst the publications, from Money mags, to trade publications, to the new direction that LOTR is evolving, and the armies level of play that is now starting to grip GW.

There is no way that they will continue to think they can make the money if they continue with the adverse pricing that they have going on at this time.

I expect a reduction in or around the Easter timeframe, well into the Tourny season, and well into the new product distribution time frame.

Halfway expecting to hear about more Online products, such as the RPG, the Tacticals, and other games such as that little heard about chaos game to continue to pop up into the market.

-MMO's are a resource that they will be paying more attention to as well.

Those tea leaves always taste better the second time around.

It would have been nice if the LotR models could have been interchangeable with fantasy...The Fantasy croud (me included) would have been wild to see the new minis they put out. On the other hand, the "realistic" scale of the models makes the models as beautiful as they are.

Other then that, I just prefer the Fantasy-theme over the LotR theme...the movies killed it with their high-fantasy, fantastic-nine,we-own everything hero gang...it's just like they are Space Marines...

...wait...



...they are the Primarchs! The greatest riddle is finally solved!


Greets
Schepp himself

The all-mighty dollar is what matters to me. I couldn't give a rats behind about the state of the current edition rules and codex release schedule or the constant space marine updates if I could get 20-30 models for 20-30 dollars or even 50-60 dollars. If I'm going to pay 50 dollars for 5 figures, I expect damn fine rules support, good customer service, a release schedule that isn't idiotic, and increasing quality in product which I just don't see. My yearly games-workshop expenditures used to top out at 750-1000 dollars a year . I the past year and half I have spent exactly $15.99. What has eaten up my spare gaming dollars? Booze and Xbox 360 games.

I think that the reason that LotR has deflated in terms of sales is because the background behind it is too static. I mean, with 40k or fantasy you can (to some extent) just make up a place and a reason to fight each other. LotR does not seem to allow this, forcing people to reinact the movies/novels. If they had given people the ability to make the world their own then they might have been met with greater sucess.

   I always love to see this argument.  Obviously you have never even looked at the rules for this game.  You do not have to just replay the movie scenes.  Duhh... that is why everything comes with points.  At least become familiar with a product before you make specific criticisms of it.

   One of the reasons the bubble has burst is that it is so cheap and you only need to spend like 100 dollars and you have more then enough stuff to play with.  And we all have to admit that gamers don't exactly need 20 versions of Legolas and Gimli.  So once the movies are finished there was no reason for collectors to buy more miniatures and just making new versions of the same old miniature isn't going to rake in the sales.

 

I've been thinking about getting into lord of the rings, but currently D'n'D miniatures is what's holding my attention. I think I prefer slightly bigger miniatures anyway.

The question we all want answered though is how are GW going to revise their market strategy?
Less photoshopped models replacing artwork?
Intelligent language on the website?
A more equal service to all factions?
Or something else entirely?

I'm pessimistic.

Posted By Da Boss on 01/22/2007 7:57 AM
I've been thinking about getting into lord of the rings, but currently D'n'D miniatures is what's holding my attention. I think I prefer slightly bigger miniatures anyway.

Uh....just FYI.

LOTR mini's are bigger than DnD mini's, or at least comparable scale if I remember correctly.

Not really, there's a range of scales in D'n'D, as in LotR. On the whole the mini's in D'n'D are less detailed, slightly bigger and made of super durable bouncy plastic. Some are smaller than some LotR figures I have but the scale for say a human to human is slightly bigger. Very slightly.
But the scale thing only really comes into it because small models don't suit my painting style which is best complemented by, for example, Brian Nelson's Orcs. The LotR thing would have been a sideline for me, and D'n'D minis is an easier sideline to do- no painting, no scenery, just pick up and play.
Easier, and mechanically fun too as long as you don't get to bogged down in tourney mindset.
I might try LotR later, but for now I'm happily poking other wargames and playing Warhammer with what I've got. Nothing released for 40K in the last 4 years has made me go "Oh, I must have that."

Guess I'm strange. The DnD game didn't take with me.

I should point out that I GM a D'n'D game too, and that was how I initially got into it. I like it because it's easy and requires SFA initial investment. It really is a beer and pretzels game. And I'm lighthearted in my approach to it.

Not being ...emotionally invested in a faction is a good thing about it too, as is the release schedule (everyone gets something new every few months).
It's quite frustrating caring about your Ork army but seeing it relegated to second class army time and time again, and really that is the greatest disservice GW does it's customers. Also, reading threads like this on the wizards boards makes me happy in my nappy. (Clap clap)
Have look. Maybe GW really could learn a thing or two:
http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=774992

(All of that said, for high quality, tasty minis, D'n'D definitely looses out to GW. The sculpts are far superior in GW)

Posted By FunnyTom on 01/22/2007 2:48 AM
I think that the reason that LotR has deflated in terms of sales is because the background behind it is too static. I mean, with 40k or fantasy you can (to some extent) just make up a place and a reason to fight each other. LotR does not seem to allow this, forcing people to reinact the movies/novels. If they had given people the ability to make the world their own then they might have been met with greater sucess.

You could always do "Easterling Civil War".  Tolkein didn't flesh out that area of Middle Earth very thoroughly, right?

Posted By Da Boss on 01/22/2007 7:57 AM
The question we all want answered though is how are GW going to revise their market strategy?

Instead of making every other release space marines they'll make them every release?

Posted By whitedragon on 01/22/2007 8:40 AM

Posted By Da Boss on 01/22/2007 7:57 AM
I've been thinking about getting into lord of the rings, but currently D'n'D miniatures is what's holding my attention. I think I prefer slightly bigger miniatures anyway.

Uh....just FYI.

LOTR mini's are bigger than DnD mini's, or at least comparable scale if I remember correctly.

*Looks at Colossal Red Dragon*



Bigger is better sometimes.

I see your colossal red dragon and Raise you a Mumak.

Colossal red dragon eats mamuk, as it is bigger.
(It's about 2-3 feet tall if I remember...)

My Horrorclix great Cthulhu so woops up on your dragon and your mamuk in total coolness.

Insanity of whom the deep ones bow to, for the win!

There is no way the colossal dragon is 2 FEET TALL! It's only mounted on a 6 inch x 6 inch square for crying out loud. Its probably 8-10 inches tall.

No it's about 8" or so tall, maybe 10".

The thing about the dragon models is that they encompass every aspect of a Draconic creature. I was literally speachless when I first saw one in the box.

That said, I'm curious as to how the fortunes of the WarMachine company are. I wonder how soon it'll be until WarMachine overtakes GW, if they continue with their current....suboptimal strategy.

What bothers me the most of GW minis, especially with 40K, is the fact that most of the options for troops, HQ, etc. are not with the blister or box set but the rules list lots more options forcing you to buy more models.

And speaking of blisters, how many of you have noticed the blisters are being phased out? Many of the special characters and individual models in blisters will no longer be sold in stores and will only be available via mail order.

One of the many "marketing changes" I've seen GW make recently...