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Ah yeah, Dogma's Idea about the gunlock and keeping the ammo separated are great ideas. Unfortunately, I have already proposed them, and she has flat out admitted, she's unwilling to compromise.

I dont understand the have to have a gun thing to be honest, I live on a farm and we have guns but I dont use them very much and dont really like them.

Two things you should check:
1. Do you have a gun license?
2. Do you part-take in any gun using activities?

If you answered no to either of the questions then you dont need a gun.

AND just because "the American constitution says I can" doesnt mean you need one. America has the world's largest number of mass shootings, and you people wonder why?

FITZZ wrote: Honestly Falconlance,if your GF is that opposed to having a gun in the house I don't belive any amount of statistics or "logical" debate will sway her opinion.
And of course when it comes to a choice between a loved on and an "object",there is no real choice,especialy since owning a gun isn't that important to you in the first place.
In a way I'm happy my GF grew up in Brooklyn.NY and understands the importance of home defence.
And by the way,when the zombies start smashing through your windows and doors,and you and your GF are about to become a snack,take your last few seconds to remind her how dangerous guns are.lol.

Although I think you're correct, I hope you're wrong.

As far as home defense goes, she can't see a gun being any better than a baseball bat.

FITZZ wrote: And of course when it comes to a choice between a loved on and an "object",there is no real choice,especialy since owning a gun isn't that important to you in the first place.

You are sorting assuming a lot of information in here to come to a conclusion. We don't know if 'loved one' is the right term yet as we have no context for the relationship at this point. It is also not as simple as "an object or a person". That is like saying you throw a Bible in the trash and give up going to Church for a girl/boy because it is just a book and a place you visit. It isn't the things proper but the ideas behind them. This is relationship politics. It is the conflicting ideas that are the problem, which is not that simple.

Squig_herder wrote:I dont understand the have to have a gun thing to be honest, I live on a farm and we have guns but I dont use them very much and dont really like them.

Two things you should check:
1. Do you have a gun license?
2. Do you part-take in any gun using activities?

If you answered no to either of the questions then you dont need a gun.

AND just because "the American constitution says I can" doesnt mean you need one. America has the world's largest number of mass shootings, and you people wonder why?

Nobody starts out with a yes to either of those. My intention was to begin a hobby that would allow me to answer YES to 2, which would then justify me answering YES to 1.

Squig_herder wrote:AND just because "the American constitution says I can" doesnt mean you need one. America has the world's largest number of mass shootings, and you people wonder why?

Are you seriously going to try and tell me that most of the guns used in those shootings are legally owned firearms? How in the feth would that work?

You can go into a rant about how pistols and shotguns are just as dangerous as tec-9's and ak47's, but you would be wrong. The weapons that are primarily used in mass shooting like you are talking about, are primarily black market weapons, and this does not ignore the fact that sometime they are not; but most of the time, yes they are illegal, so taking that pistol away from Farmer Joe, is not going to make a lick of difference.

Falconlance wrote:As far as home defense goes, she can't see a gun being any better than a baseball bat.

In general, I would be inclined to agree. Having a shootout at the old corral, does not make you any safer than just exiting your home, and contacting a neighbor for help. If you choose to keep a loaded gun, that is kind of a different story, but I doubt that she would be having that at all.

Note...

If your lady, can lay down a decent batting average, and knows how to crack a skull or two. You know... I would be inclined to agree with her on that... just to be safe.

Ahtman wrote:

FITZZ wrote: And of course when it comes to a choice between a loved on and an "object",there is no real choice,especialy since owning a gun isn't that important to you in the first place.

You are sorting assuming a lot of information in here to come to a conclusion. We don't know if 'loved one' is the right term yet as we have no context for the relationship at this point. It is also not as simple as "an object or a person". That is like saying you throw a Bible in the trash and give up going to Church for a girl/boy because it is just a book and a place you visit. It isn't the things proper but the ideas behind them. This is relationship politics. It is the conflicting ideas that are the problem, which is not that simple.

To be fair, I did flat out state a few posts back that I would ditch the gun without thinking twice if I had to choose between her and it.

Falconlance wrote:We've been together going on three years now, and she is pretty awesome all things said and done. We don't fight a whole lot, but when we do argue its usually over stupid political crap. You see she is SO far left, it would make democrats give her the stink eye, but from what I've seen and heard, political extremes like that are normal in British persons. (Anyone remember that political axis thread from a few months back?)

To be honest the gun isn't all that important to me, and if it comes down to It or Her, I will ditch the weapon in a heartbeat (but If I told her that it would strengthen her resolve, so I'm keeping that bit to myself..) What's really bothering me is I can't see why shes so adamant about this, and really I don't believe it should be as big a deal as she's making it. I'm really looking for some statistics or something that might fetter her inherent British aversion to fire-arms, and help me convince her that a gun isn't something to be afraid of.

You're not going to have an easy time proving a negative in that regard.

Instead, I'd recommend asking her what she specifically has problems with; what an example would be of a situation she sees as being more likely to occur if you own a gun, what specific things she dislikes about them are. That sort of thing. Maybe she does have some good reasons, maybe she doesn't have some and you can help to show why they're flawed. Either way, it's better than trying to come onto the situation with something as broad as "guns are good!"

Albatross wrote:Also, 'Gun as Hobby' strikes me as a bit creepy and weird. Maybe it's a cultural thing. Saying that, you can own a gun here - most people choose not to.
You may say it's your right to own one (blah, blah, blah ad infinitum, ad nauseum...), but it's your girlfriend's right to protest against an inexperienced gun-user purchasing a firearm and bringing it into the home. Why do you want to get into it as a hobby if you don't intend to hunt? To look cool? To feel powerful? The fact that you came to a Tabletop Wargaming Fansite for advice on how to persuade your GF to agree to you keeping a tool for killing other human beings in the house you share, suggests that perhaps you might not be emotionally mature enough to handle the responsibility of owning said weapon.
Sorry if that sounds like flaming - it isn't meant that way, honest! I'll just never understand the fascination with guns.

Do you also hate fencing and archery?

I really don't see why people can't stand the concept of a deadly weapon (knife?) being around them. I mean, most of us aren't Buffalo Bill here, are we?

Not trying to be rude, I just don't see why guns are so intrinsically different from so many other things.

Orkeo wrote:I really don't see why people can't stand the concept of a deadly weapon (knife?) being around them. I mean, most of us aren't Buffalo Bill here, are we?

Goddam, am I really that buff? Wow... you should thank them for the compliments though.



(Changed the image... mainly because Buffalo Bill made no sense to me... as far as I know, he was a pretty good guy)

Rambo on the other hand... Rambo don't play no shooting games... Rambo crush, Rambo smash, Rambo... eat trail mix.

Orkeosaurus wrote:That seems pretty incomplete.

How many of these were accidentally being shot by themselves when messing around with their gun? How many of these people had enemies they thought they needed protection from? How many were suicide?

I mean, you can't really control all other variables, because some of the most important variables influence gun ownership.

I was just going off of memory, so I didn't list every possible factor. I do find it interesting that you'd be willing to dismiss it entirely without reading the survey.

I just looked up the survey and it was remarkably simple and clean in it's method. The study took 677 random sampled shootings and checked what portion were in possession of a gun when they were shot, and then looked at the gun ownership rates among people of the same age, sex, ethnicity and socio-economic status. The result was that possession of a gun made people 4.5 times more likely to get shot.

You are free to ignore it all you want, but it is the same method used to identify the correlation between smoking and cancer.

But I do note that it is only one survey result. With the number of gun deaths in the US each year I'm continually amazed at how little genuine scientific study there is into the issue.

Falconlance wrote:

Ahtman wrote:

FITZZ wrote: And of course when it comes to a choice between a loved on and an "object",there is no real choice,especialy since owning a gun isn't that important to you in the first place.

You are sorting assuming a lot of information in here to come to a conclusion. We don't know if 'loved one' is the right term yet as we have no context for the relationship at this point. It is also not as simple as "an object or a person". That is like saying you throw a Bible in the trash and give up going to Church for a girl/boy because it is just a book and a place you visit. It isn't the things proper but the ideas behind them. This is relationship politics. It is the conflicting ideas that are the problem, which is not that simple.

To be fair, I did flat out state a few posts back that I would ditch the gun without thinking twice if I had to choose between her and it.

Which is basicly why I assumed she was a "loved one",however Ahtman does bring up some good points concerning the deeper dynamics concerning the relationship.

Wrexasaur wrote:

Squig_herder wrote:AND just because "the American constitution says I can" doesnt mean you need one. America has the world's largest number of mass shootings, and you people wonder why?

Are you seriously going to try and tell me that most of the guns used in those shootings are legally owned firearms? How in the feth would that work?

You can go into a rant about how pistols and shotguns are just as dangerous as tec-9's and ak47's, but you would be wrong. The weapons that are primarily used in mass shooting like you are talking about, are primarily black market weapons, and this does not ignore the fact that sometime they are not; but most of the time, yes they are illegal, so taking that pistol away from Farmer Joe, is not going to make a lick of difference.

Falconlance wrote:As far as home defense goes, she can't see a gun being any better than a baseball bat.

In general, I would be inclined to agree. Having a shootout at the old corral, does not make you any safer than just exiting your home, and contacting a neighbor for help. If you choose to keep a loaded gun, that is kind of a different story, but I doubt that she would be having that at all.

No im saying that gun control and regulation is flawed and somewhat wrong IMO compared to countries like the UK and Oz, Yes we all have illegal weapons but we dont have the shooting rate of America.

NOTE: Im not looking to pick a fight or anything but from where I sit, its not so much the illegal guns that make the head lines, its the normal handgun that seems to be doing the most damage.

Well I'm inclined to agree that its the concealable ones that are the biggest trouble, but not legally owned ones. A gun can be legal to own and still be illegally owned. Especially if you intend to use it for a crime and not have it traced back to you.

Squig_herder wrote:No im saying that gun control and regulation is flawed and somewhat wrong IMO compared to countries like the UK and Oz, Yes we all have illegal weapons but we dont have the shooting rate of America.

Your also in entirely different countries, with entirely different demographics, with their own, entirely different set of problems. Statistically, I would not be surprised if you made up for it in other ways. People are people after all...

NOTE: Im not looking to pick a fight or anything but from where I sit, its not so much the illegal guns that make the head lines, its the normal handgun that seems to be doing the most damage.

No worries man, just realize that even an illegal pistol, is illegal. Most legal firearms, are simply not involved in the large majority of crime; on the defensive, or offensive side. Most of the legal firearms, are used against criminals, by police, there is absolutely no way around that. I am not uncomfortable around a cop with a gun, in fact, I found it odd being in England with their police. Different countries though, different needs.

In France though, I did see more than a few submachine gun toting anti-terrorist units. If I am not mistaken, I saw something of the same nature in the London Airport.

Guns don't kill people, Bullets do. 5,000 dollars a bullet, and you sure as hell better want to actually kill that person. If you are rich, One million dollars a bullet, and stop whining, your fething rich.

Hmm, conundrum. I know we don't see eye to eye Falcon and I know we've more or less flamed one another every chance we've gotten so take my advice however you choose.

I'm lucky in that I've had a gun for as long as I've been 18 and I've never dated anyone that was against guns (but then even my liberal gf's were into hunting so them being lefty was still never an issue).

You really must decide what you want the gun for? It is easy for lots of people to say "How often will you need to pull it for protection..blah..blah...blah...etc?" in which case in those persons eyes you look psycho because unless you live in Compton your odds of dying in a car wreck on the way to work are a lot greater than being shot at or robbed or whatnot where you'll have to use the gun for defense. On the other hand I feel it is better to be safe than sorry. It's easy for someone to say the above but I'm willing to bet 99% of the naysayers when burglarized or robbed at gunpoint or raped would go out the very next day and apply for a permit to own a gun (not sure UK laws but in 7-10 days you'd be granted legal rights to buy one so long as you aren't a felon).

Second point is what else might you want it for? If you are considering going out shooting for a hobby and/or thinking of entering shooting competitions I would suggest going to a range or a competition and seeing first hand what some people consider a "hobby". Lots of people don't see shooting as a hobby but there are gun clubs that do re-enactments for civil war, wild west (hugely popular in the US actually) and other types of re-enactments and they are as passionate about it as 40k players are about 40k (even going so far as to dress as cowboys and or civil war soldiers). They don't use real bullets obviously but the guns are as real as you can get. Shooting competitions are fun. I've never won one but I'm a good enough shot to not hit innocent bystanders or create collateral damage (well, till I get the MG-42 purchased) so I'm not that bad of an aim.

You aren't required to get safety training just for purchase but depending on where you live you might or might not need a CC permit. Some states don't require one, some do. You won't need the CC permit if you intend to keep it in your home or transport it in your car in the trunk or backseat so long as it's unloaded and boxed without easy access (Mn law anyway). If it would make you comfortable I would recommend taking a safety course. It may or may not be required for you to carry it on your person (if you ever decided to, you already have that little hurtle taken care of) and it will show the GF that you won't accidentally shoot her or you as I would hope you'd actually learn something during the safety class.

Think long and hard about it Falcon. If you THINK you might want a gun and the gf won't budge don't risk the relationship but don't also back down too easy either. Take her to a shooting competition and tell her when she starts to feel uncomfortable you will leave and then drop it. If after seeing firsthand on your own a shooting match or re-enactment and it is something you really feel passionate about doing (if that is what you'd like to do) than you will have to talk it over with her and tell her that just like Warhammer it is something you want to do and will have fun doing. Unless she is a gamer geek herself I somehow picture her only TOLERATING your Warhammer hobby. Correct me if I'm wrong because I don't just want to assume.

Real guns are as safe as toy guns so long as the person holding the gun or cleaning it or showing it off isn't a mentally dysfunctional idiot or intending to kill someone with it.

If you want to exercise your 2nd Amendment Rights don't let people convince you otherwise. See my sig for my thoughts on gun control and gun rights.

sebster wrote:I was just going off of memory, so I didn't list every possible factor. I do find it interesting that you'd be willing to dismiss it entirely without reading the survey.

I'm not saying the study wasn't done well within the boundaries of what a study like that is capable of; I'm saying it's going to be inherently limited by the fact that it's not doing a dissection of each individual shooting, and what led up to it. It's not showing causation.

Unless guns secretly get up in the middle of the night and shoot you there are things that lead up to being shot by them. Possessing a gun, and burying it in a safe under your cellar, is not going to make you more likely to be shot by it. You need to look at what would cause a correlation. Burglars seizing your gun? You getting shot by burglars while trying to shoot them? Accidentally shooting yourself? Being killed by the person you bought the gun to protect yourself from? Being killed in the criminal activity you engage in that requires you to buy a gun to try and protect yourself? Suicide?

There are a lot of possible explanations, but it can't simply be ownership.

I just looked up the survey and it was remarkably simple and clean in it's method. The study took 677 random sampled shootings and checked what portion were in possession of a gun when they were shot, and then looked at the gun ownership rates among people of the same age, sex, ethnicity and socio-economic status. The result was that possession of a gun made people 4.5 times more likely to get shot.

It doesn't sound like it won't do what it is supposed to well, but it's limited by it's own scope.

You are free to ignore it all you want, but it is the same method used to identify the correlation between smoking and cancer.

And it would mean nothing if it was physically impossible for smoking to cause cancer. I bet if you surveyed people who died of lung cancer, most would have purchased quite a few cigarettes. However, if you purchase cigarettes and store them in their original cartons in your closet and never smoke them, you're not increasing your risk of lung cancer.

But I do note that it is only one survey result. With the number of gun deaths in the US each year I'm continually amazed at how little genuine scientific study there is into the issue.

Yeah, there's a lot of studies, but they usually end up with either somewhat dubious results of fairly inconclusive.

Wait Wha? but still i own a Katana and no one complains about unless if i cut down trees with it -.-. but still Owning a gun is not horrible just ask myself and I. I use to own it but thats only because that my friend worked in the Air Force ........ OK. But still its not like your gonna shot anyone or else i might have to hunt you down and use my ninja skills. Tell her that you are going to take a training course of how to HANDLE GUNS APPORATELY! That is how you learn how to shot guns and prove to her that you are able to use a gun THIS DOES NOT MEAN YOUR A RED NECK OR FROM WAY DOWN SOUTH (TEXAS!!!!!!). If you have not notice but look at the news and see how people use the damn guns. just use it only for safety reasons ie. Zombie Invasion, yes that i really mean a zombie invasion. But still shes your girlfriend just tell her that you love her yada yada yada. bLAH. Tell her to get her facts straight its not like as if she is just going to go balastic if you buy a gun, if its a shotgun thats a good thing trust me. DO NOT GET A SIDE ARM! Keep unloaded, away high up so noone can find it meaning not under the bed, or in the closet. but in a vault like closet with a thumb scanner : D.

Yay, yet another thread that started off with a legit and sensable question, and then devolved into a US bashing thread.

I can't help but wonder how many more times this will go on before mods actually hand out REAL warnings to those that are constantly doing this. Seriously, what the hell do mass shootings and US gun laws/regulations have to do with trying to help the OP convince his GF to allow a gun in the house?

Falcon,
It sounds to me that no matter what you say or do, it wont affect her mind one bit. Maybe suggest takeing some self-defence classes to go along with buying the gun? Pending where you live I can point out several places you could look into.

Wrexasaur wrote:(Changed the image... mainly because Buffalo Bill made no sense to me... as far as I know, he was a pretty good guy)

Well, Buffalo Bill constantly had people trying to kill him. So he might not let you come too near him with a steak knife in your hand.

Fateweaver wrote:Hmm, conundrum. I know we don't see eye to eye Falcon and I know we've more or less flamed one another every chance we've gotten so take my advice however you choose.

To be honest I was hoping you would pop in and throw in your two cents.

Fateweaver wrote:You really must decide what you want the gun for? It is easy for lots of people to say "How often will you need to pull it for protection..blah..blah...blah...etc?" in which case in those persons eyes you look psycho because unless you live in Compton your odds of dying in a car wreck on the way to work are a lot greater than being shot at or robbed or whatnot where you'll have to use the gun for defense. On the other hand I feel it is better to be safe than sorry. It's easy for someone to say the above but I'm willing to bet 99% of the naysayers when burglarized or robbed at gunpoint or raped would go out the very next day and apply for a permit to own a gun (not sure UK laws but in 7-10 days you'd be granted legal rights to buy one so long as you aren't a felon).

Well I spent a good chunk of my life in Carson and I when I was a kid I watched two guys mug my dad for TWO DOLLARS. I'm not paranoid but I'm not naive either.

Fateweaver wrote:Second point is what else might you want it for? If you are considering going out shooting for a hobby and/or thinking of entering shooting competitions I would suggest going to a range or a competition and seeing first hand what some people consider a "hobby". Lots of people don't see shooting as a hobby but there are gun clubs that do re-enactments for civil war, wild west (hugely popular in the US actually) and other types of re-enactments and they are as passionate about it as 40k players are about 40k (even going so far as to dress as cowboys and or civil war soldiers). They don't use real bullets obviously but the guns are as real as you can get. Shooting competitions are fun. I've never won one but I'm a good enough shot to not hit innocent bystanders or create collateral damage (well, till I get the MG-42 purchased) so I'm not that bad of an aim.

I hadn't even thought about a gun for re-enacting (though I have put a lot of thought into re-enacting itself.) I always thought my airsoft guns would make a decent enough stand-in for the real thing, except that they cant fire blanks. It's good food for thought, though.

Fateweaver wrote:You aren't required to get safety training just for purchase but depending on where you live you might or might not need a CC permit. Some states don't require one, some do. You won't need the CC permit if you intend to keep it in your home or transport it in your car in the trunk or backseat so long as it's unloaded and boxed without easy access (Mn law anyway). If it would make you comfortable I would recommend taking a safety course. It may or may not be required for you to carry it on your person (if you ever decided to, you already have that little hurtle taken care of) and it will show the GF that you won't accidentally shoot her or you as I would hope you'd actually learn something during the safety class.

This goes without saying.

Fateweaver wrote:Think long and hard about it Falcon. If you THINK you might want a gun and the gf won't budge don't risk the relationship but don't also back down too easy either. Take her to a shooting competition and tell her when she starts to feel uncomfortable you will leave and then drop it. If after seeing firsthand on your own a shooting match or re-enactment and it is something you really feel passionate about doing (if that is what you'd like to do) than you will have to talk it over with her and tell her that just like Warhammer it is something you want to do and will have fun doing. Unless she is a gamer geek herself I somehow picture her only TOLERATING your Warhammer hobby. Correct me if I'm wrong because I don't just want to assume.

Honestly I don't think shed go. You are right, she barely tolerates warhammer, but to her its at least harmless.

I see your Rambo and raise you a

A: Suggest keeping the gun in a safe spot. (lockbox for example)
B: Suggest keeping Ammo in a different spot. (Unwise if you ask me, but "safer")
C: Suggest takeing self defence (Pistol) classes from your local indoor shooting range.
D: Suggest getting a CC license. If the state thinks your able to handle a firearm properly and safely, the GF will have a hard time to argue against this.
E: Point out that never in recorded history has a gun jumped off the table and shot somebody. A gun is a tool, nothing more. When handled with proper care in a wise and safe manner it will never EVER harm anyone that was not asking for it.

Honestly, it sounds like you're both being pretty childish. She has a fairly irrational political/personal bias, and you have at best a half assed interest in getting a gun. You don't want to cave because it's the principle of the thing, but if you really don't care, there really isn't a principle going on here.

Everybody is allowed one weird thing. Beyond that, you can start horse trading and playing games with your quirks, but letting one thing slide might not be the worst thing.

Polonius wrote: You don't want to cave because it's the principle of the thing.

Well you hit that one right on the head, but I'm not so sure about the "half-assed" thing. This is an idea I have been playing with for a couple years, and I don't want to throw myself into it full-bore when there's obvious opposition.

She's not saying you don't have a right to have a gun. She's explaining that you don't need one and that it makes her uncomfortable. I find suggestions that she is being 'unreasonable' laughable. You admitted youself that you don't have a reason.

Get a crossbow.

Falconlance wrote:

Fateweaver wrote:Hmm, conundrum. I know we don't see eye to eye Falcon and I know we've more or less flamed one another every chance we've gotten so take my advice however you choose.

To be honest I was hoping you would pop in and throw in your two cents.

Fateweaver wrote:You really must decide what you want the gun for? It is easy for lots of people to say "How often will you need to pull it for protection..blah..blah...blah...etc?" in which case in those persons eyes you look psycho because unless you live in Compton your odds of dying in a car wreck on the way to work are a lot greater than being shot at or robbed or whatnot where you'll have to use the gun for defense. On the other hand I feel it is better to be safe than sorry. It's easy for someone to say the above but I'm willing to bet 99% of the naysayers when burglarized or robbed at gunpoint or raped would go out the very next day and apply for a permit to own a gun (not sure UK laws but in 7-10 days you'd be granted legal rights to buy one so long as you aren't a felon).

Well I spent a good chunk of my life in Carson and I when I was a kid I watched two guys mug my dad for TWO DOLLARS. I'm not paranoid but I'm not naive either.

Fateweaver wrote:Second point is what else might you want it for? If you are considering going out shooting for a hobby and/or thinking of entering shooting competitions I would suggest going to a range or a competition and seeing first hand what some people consider a "hobby". Lots of people don't see shooting as a hobby but there are gun clubs that do re-enactments for civil war, wild west (hugely popular in the US actually) and other types of re-enactments and they are as passionate about it as 40k players are about 40k (even going so far as to dress as cowboys and or civil war soldiers). They don't use real bullets obviously but the guns are as real as you can get. Shooting competitions are fun. I've never won one but I'm a good enough shot to not hit innocent bystanders or create collateral damage (well, till I get the MG-42 purchased) so I'm not that bad of an aim.

I hadn't even thought about a gun for re-enacting (though I have put a lot of thought into re-enacting itself.) I always thought my airsoft guns would make a decent enough stand-in for the real thing, except that they cant fire blanks. It's good food for thought, though.

Fateweaver wrote:You aren't required to get safety training just for purchase but depending on where you live you might or might not need a CC permit. Some states don't require one, some do. You won't need the CC permit if you intend to keep it in your home or transport it in your car in the trunk or backseat so long as it's unloaded and boxed without easy access (Mn law anyway). If it would make you comfortable I would recommend taking a safety course. It may or may not be required for you to carry it on your person (if you ever decided to, you already have that little hurtle taken care of) and it will show the GF that you won't accidentally shoot her or you as I would hope you'd actually learn something during the safety class.

This goes without saying.

Fateweaver wrote:Think long and hard about it Falcon. If you THINK you might want a gun and the gf won't budge don't risk the relationship but don't also back down too easy either. Take her to a shooting competition and tell her when she starts to feel uncomfortable you will leave and then drop it. If after seeing firsthand on your own a shooting match or re-enactment and it is something you really feel passionate about doing (if that is what you'd like to do) than you will have to talk it over with her and tell her that just like Warhammer it is something you want to do and will have fun doing. Unless she is a gamer geek herself I somehow picture her only TOLERATING your Warhammer hobby. Correct me if I'm wrong because I don't just want to assume.

Honestly I don't think shed go. You are right, she barely tolerates warhammer, but to her its at least harmless.

Having a gun in the house though doesn't automatically make it dangerous. I know you are convinced and it's your job to convince her. If having a gun in the house is dangerous than so is having all those sharp kitchen knives, all those forks and I'm going to assume you have an X-acto for modeling purposes. You should know first hand an X-acto can be a very dangerous thing as I am sure everyone on this board has cut themselves or stabbed themselves more than once with a dull (or sharp) blade. Sure it probably won't kill you unless you are running with it, trip and fall and stab yourself in the throat or heart but then if that happens I can't say I'd really shed a tear as that is something learned hopefully at toddler age so you'd probably deserve that happening to you.

It's a tough place to be Falcon. I'm lucky in that my current gf has no objections to me owning a gun but it is something she's known about since the day we started dating so for me it would have been easy to ditch the broad if she objected. Contrary to popular opinion I am not violent or war hungry or psychotic. Hell, I'll even get in my car and drive off if my gf and I get into it TOO hardcore.

I think that is the key. You might be dating for 3 years and you probably love her and I'm sure her opinion is important to you but you really need to ask yourself how much is the relationship worth. Maybe you can reach a compromise, I hope so as I don't want to see any man I don't personally know lose something he holds dear. Gun or girl. Only you can make the ultimate decision. You will hear both sides quite a lot so it's up to you to choose your persuasion.

Arctik_Firangi wrote:She's not saying you don't have a right to have a gun. She's explaining that you don't need one and that it makes her uncomfortable. I find suggestions that she is being 'unreasonable' laughable. You admitted youself that you don't have a reason.

I think Polonius made a pretty good point. I mean, you've been with the girl for three years, and you like her a lot. Assuming you're a good judge of character she's not going to try and use this to wedge a bunch of other things against you.

Some people simply don't have good reasons for things, but place a lot of importance on them anyways. I mean, say you had a girlfriend who was afraid of snakes, and you were mildly interested in getting a pet garter snake; if you know what you're doing it's not going to get out of the cage and bite her, and even if it did bite her (which it wouldn't), it's not poisonous or anything. The snake is no threat, she has no rational reason to be afraid of it.

A lot of people just can't stand the presence of snakes though, and they can know full well why they have no reason to be afraid of them. If you're not that dead set on getting a snake, why not let this one go?

Arctik_Firangi wrote:She's not saying you don't have a right to have a gun. She's explaining that you don't need one and that it makes her uncomfortable. I find suggestions that she is being 'unreasonable' laughable. You admitted youself that you don't have a reason.

Falcon says he's been thinking about it for a few years. He apparently feels a reason to get one. Not bashing your country but it really does and always will make no sense to a country (yours or any other that isn't the US) for any citizen to have a gun in their house, just as it makes no sense for most of us that do believe in having one that other people in other countries aren't allowed to have a gun in their house.

99% of the time the average Joe does not need a handgun but if more people stopped having that attitude and started realizing that 99% =/= 100% there would be less rape victims, less drive by victims, less victims killed in muggings and burglaries and car jackings.

To ban or make it nearly impossible for law abiding citizens to obtain a gun just makes it easier for the people not getting guns legally to victimize the ones that can't defend themselves. Even if you could make it 100% impossible for people to get guns in the US the felons would just resort to knives or bats or tire irons or various OTHER implements of death.

A woman pulling a .38 on a would-be rapist will more often than not walk away without a scratch. An unarmed woman will likely end up some sickos plaything for a few minutes to a few hours. Which scenario is the more favorable scenario Arc? I sure as hell hope you don't say #2.