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If you've been following the news, very few companies did well in 2009. It's not terribly surprising to hear a company not paying out dividends when the economy is staving off world-wide Depression.

Just something to keep in mind before launching conspiracy theories.

Osbad wrote:All we can say for certain following last year's results is that GW don't yet feel confident enough to restart paying dividends having halted them after the LotR bubble finally finished bursting. And
corporately speaking that is a Really Bad Thing.

Oh I dunno - I'm not sure taking a risk on starting dividends again in the mist of a massive recession would be seen particuarily negatively, even by investors. It actually seems a reasonably prudent thing to do. GW's previous stance of building up debt just so they could keep paying out dividends was certainly considerably more of a Really Bad Thing.

Phazer

A lot of companies still paid dividends this year; heck I got .01 cent per share from citibank and .30 cents per share from a tech stock I have holdings with.

If the company made a profit, they should reward the shareholders for having faith in them.

Isn't it obvious? In July, an Investor went to a website that was violating GW's IP. Said Investor notified GW of the infringement. GW, shocked by the gaul of an investor to even go to a site that would do that, announced that no investor was getting a dividend this year. And the rest is history.

The majority of GW shares are held by an institutional investor, some venture capital outfit, who would be closely involved in the decision whether to pay a dividend or not.

Umm - did anyone notice that the dividend anouncement was posted in the summer? This is nothing new...

Games Workshop PLC Not To Proposes Final Dividend
Tuesday, 28 Jul 2009 02:00am EDT

natedawgg wrote:Umm - did anyone notice that the dividend anouncement was posted in the summer? This is nothing new...

Games Workshop PLC Not To Proposes Final Dividend
Tuesday, 28 Jul 2009 02:00am EDT

Yeah, a great majority of dividends are sent out either in January or at the end of the fiscal year, July.

Talking about strategies, does anyone have any thoughts on what might happen if GW undertook a marketing campaign? I mean, there are just about NO advertisements. Having done some work in the advertising/marketing field, the "word of mouth" method doesn't do wonders.

Someone mentioned that 40K has reached its "saturation point" in the market, to which I'd disagree. The problem is that everyone who knows what 40K is or how it works has already made up their minds about getting into it or not.

In order to make more sales, they have to bring in more customers. Putting ads in print magazines targeted toward PC/console gaming, airsoft/other war simulations, and other hobby magazines would bring GW products to the attention of the markets most likely to get into the "GW Hobby."

I thought that GW cut out a huge chunk of debt which was why they weren't declaring a major profit and therefore not doing dividends. Don't remember where I saw that though

Commander Endova wrote:Talking about strategies, does anyone have any thoughts on what might happen if GW undertook a marketing campaign? I mean, there are just about NO advertisements. Having done some work in the advertising/marketing field, the "word of mouth" method doesn't do wonders.

Someone mentioned that 40K has reached its "saturation point" in the market, to which I'd disagree. The problem is that everyone who knows what 40K is or how it works has already made up their minds about getting into it or not.

In order to make more sales, they have to bring in more customers. Putting ads in print magazines targeted toward PC/console gaming, airsoft/other war simulations, and other hobby magazines would bring GW products to the attention of the markets most likely to get into the "GW Hobby."

And waste one boatload of money, IMHO. Those ads cost quite a bit, and the return would be quite limited. I've spent 22 years in the comic and game industries, working with many similar stores, and not finding good ways to advertise a niche market.

Best advertising GW has is the games and concepts it has liscensed out. They get paid money, and the video games, books, and online games are great advertising.

The only 'people' this hurts are the institutional investment firms who own large chuncks of stock and the senior GW staff who have stock options.

I don't know if I own GW stock, my investment firms do all that for me. But as I order to buy for dividend returns GW stock is a very low chance.

Commander Endova wrote:Talking about strategies, does anyone have any thoughts on what might happen if GW undertook a marketing campaign? I mean, there are just about NO advertisements. Having done some work in the advertising/marketing field, the "word of mouth" method doesn't do wonders.

Someone mentioned that 40K has reached its "saturation point" in the market, to which I'd disagree. The problem is that everyone who knows what 40K is or how it works has already made up their minds about getting into it or not.

In order to make more sales, they have to bring in more customers. Putting ads in print magazines targeted toward PC/console gaming, airsoft/other war simulations, and other hobby magazines would bring GW products to the attention of the markets most likely to get into the "GW Hobby."

I think their stores are their most effective advertising. They often pick spots with great foot traffic, either in busy commercial areas or malls. The hobby is pretty complex to explain to a newcomer, particularly the idea that they are responsible for painting their own minis, so I don't think an ad would have much effect on most people. A store with fully painted armies and terrain gives the biggest impact, and hopefully displays the full potential of the hobby.

Their computer games are also a good way to spread their marketing into other realms. Unless the viewer has some interest in modelling though, I suspect there aren't many electronic gamers who will make the crossover.

That said, taking the leap in computer games can give electronic gamers a toe in the water so to speak, and give a chance to learn more.

(Sidenote: This is where I think all mini games owe some debt to GW: GW is the most likely first connection to the hobby)

I agree. The retail chain is their main form of marketing.

They also benefit from existing within the wider world of tabletop wargames. It's impossible to have more than the slightest interest in wargames and not become aware of GW.

The videogames do offer a kind of promotion in terms of raising awareness of the name Warhammer and the basic look and concepts of the games.

We don't know how many copies of Dawn Of War sell to existing 40K players, and how many go to people who have no awareness of 40K.

A computer game is a very different experience to a tabletop game, so it is important to get videogamers into a shop where they can experience the game and make up their mind about it.

Kilkrazy wrote:A computer game is a very different experience to a tabletop game, so it is important to get videogamers into a shop where they can experience the game and make up their mind about it.

Which is why I feel that the videogames are actually a pretty poor form of advertising. You can slap WH40K on anything. People will generally remain oblivious to the fact that it's based off a table top game. I know the manuals have an advert on the last page, but that depends on people reading the manual, which I know many don't.

H.B.M.C. wrote:Oh well, Christmas is as good a time as any to raise prices. And if anyone complains, the apologists can come here to reassure us that higher prices are a good thing.

Oh the bittersweet irony in this thread; it only takes the mentioning of GW for whineseers to spew beaten-to-death rants over and over again

God this old argument, again. I love how people come in and talk big about how GW is doomed for failure when they probably have little to no corporate financial background and zero insight into GW's actual financial specifics.

Unless you have run an international gaming company, are a economics professor, or possess some other insight the rest of us do not then your opinion has very, very little merit in this conversation. GW is by a very large margin the biggest gaming company of its kind in the world. They have outlasted all their competitors and continue to put out high quality product, to grow, and to innovate the industry.

Joe Blow on the internet who probably works at a menial job with no training in corporate finances should keep his proclomations of doom and gloom to himself or risk looking like a windbag.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Talking about strategies, does anyone have any thoughts on what might happen if GW undertook a marketing campaign? I mean, there are just about NO advertisements. Having done some work in the advertising/marketing field, the "word of mouth" method doesn't do wonders.

Actually, word of mouth advertising is the recognized most effective from of advertising.

GW is renowned for having done as well as they have without marketing. They save oodles of money by not having to pay for marketing. They produce White Dwarf which many of us pay for and is in effect a large marketing piece. It is genius, really.

Commander Endova wrote:

Kilkrazy wrote:A computer game is a very different experience to a tabletop game, so it is important to get videogamers into a shop where they can experience the game and make up their mind about it.

Which is why I feel that the videogames are actually a pretty poor form of advertising. You can slap WH40K on anything. People will generally remain oblivious to the fact that it's based off a table top game. I know the manuals have an advert on the last page, but that depends on people reading the manual, which I know many don't.

There must be a fairly good overlap in awareness between videogamers and tabletop gamers. They are both nerdy hobbies. I would be surprised to find the same amount of overlap between anglers and tabletop gamers, or racing enthusiasts and computer gamers.

The question is how many people who buy a Warhammer based game are not already a tabletop gamer.

Also, how much can GW sustain the Warhammer fluff background without the tabletop game underpinning it. I am trying to imagine a future in which GW abandon production of models and rules in favour of exploitation of their built-up fluff IP through videogame licensing. I have a gut feeling it would not work, but I don't know.

Kilkrazy wrote:

Commander Endova wrote:

Kilkrazy wrote:A computer game is a very different experience to a tabletop game, so it is important to get videogamers into a shop where they can experience the game and make up their mind about it.

Which is why I feel that the videogames are actually a pretty poor form of advertising. You can slap WH40K on anything. People will generally remain oblivious to the fact that it's based off a table top game. I know the manuals have an advert on the last page, but that depends on people reading the manual, which I know many don't.

There must be a fairly good overlap in awareness between videogamers and tabletop gamers. They are both nerdy hobbies. I would be surprised to find the same amount of overlap between anglers and tabletop gamers, or racing enthusiasts and computer gamers.

The question is how many people who buy a Warhammer based game are not already a tabletop gamer.

Also, how much can GW sustain the Warhammer fluff background without the tabletop game underpinning it. I am trying to imagine a future in which GW abandon production of models and rules in favour of exploitation of their built-up fluff IP through videogame licensing. I have a gut feeling it would not work, but I don't know.

Warhammer isn't a sci fi or fantasy institution in the same way that starwars or lord of the rings is. It could try, and it could do well, but without maintaining a historical underpinning (lotr has the books, and now the films, starwars had the films and now the books) it would likely go well for a while then eventually stutter out as the brand would lack a broad appeal beyond the realistically smalllish market that drives interactive game sales. If they had a series of blockbuster movies, or could somehow penetrate the comic book market in more than a haphazard way they could probably pull it off. But as it is the figure line is too niche and the books aren't massive sellers.

You need something that can withstand the test of time to underline popularity in an IP. Videogames are the absolutely last market to attempt to do something like that given their platform specific ephemeral nature. They have a good thing going with the tabletop games, and if they can push them better the PnP games. But they still haven't gone beyond the small nerdish niche that they developed in.

Yep. I agree.

Kilkrazy wrote: Also, how much can GW sustain the Warhammer fluff background without the tabletop game underpinning it. I am trying to imagine a future in which GW abandon production of models and rules in favour of exploitation of their built-up fluff IP through videogame licensing. I have a gut feeling it would not work, but I don't know.

I think you're definitely on to something there, there seems to be an intrinsic connection between GW fluff and its tabletop roots. 40k fluff is made out of OTT and I think that connects to the need to oversize stuff on small models, so people can see how badass your shoulders and guns are!

Cane wrote:

H.B.M.C. wrote:Oh well, Christmas is as good a time as any to raise prices. And if anyone complains, the apologists can come here to reassure us that higher prices are a good thing.

Oh the bittersweet irony in this thread; it only takes the mentioning of GW for whineseers to spew beaten-to-death rants over and over again

nice flamebait.

quit being bad.