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Chibi Bodge-Battle wrote:The point is the organisers failed to act for whatever reason, so he took it upon himself.

How do you know what the organizers did or did not do? The event judges were never even given the chance to deal with this during the tournament. No one from the convention was shown the video or the had a chance to review anything before BoK dropped his scoop on the world....and then when he did it is vague and open to interpretation. The possibility of cheating was mentioned Sunday evening, but the judges have seen/know just as much as the rest of the internet. Did Tim make a mistake? Did Tim cheat? Ask any number of people and you will get any number of answers. The truth is - even if judges were called to the table, I am 99% positive they would have had him remove the additional models from the table. It is not outside the realm of a possible mistake and would have been a first strike sort of situation without any after-the-fact internet collaboration. They happen. The game would have been ruled on, would have continued and none of this would be being discussed right now. If it had been a repetitive situation through the day or the weekend, then harsher actions would have been taken without question....but that requires people to speak up at the event DURING games and with consistency.

Given the nature in which this was 'uncovered' and used for unrelated gain/notoriety - I can only pass judgment on this situation by placing myself in the shoes of the judges, at the table, during the game. At that point I would have not personally disqualified him - as solid proof of intentional cheating in my opinion did not exist at the table. By placing this single game under the microscope of instant replay, you not only invalidate the player/opponent/judge responsibility in the matter, but you also are skewing the results of the tournament just as much as someone cheating. At this point you need video tape of all games from all rounds in order to level the field again - because I can GUARANTEE you many other imperfections, whether intentional or not, occurred throughout the day.

I am 100% opposed to cheating. I find the fact that people over the age of 20 feel the need to cheat their way to winning games of Warhammer mind boggling. I am also 100% opposed to witch-hunts and internet Warhammer Sheriffs trying to dictate public opinion and disparaging people/events for personal glory.

Tim did the right thing, Nick is perfectly fine with the resolution and hopefully people across the board will be more proactive about dealing with these issues as they occur.

For what it's worth.

He played in 2008 and 2009 Ard Boyz 1st rd at one of the stores I work at. He won 2008 1st round. He also, played at the 2009 2nd rd. that I went to.

I asked several people if they remember him. They did and they said "questionable" things went on during games. So presidence is there.

I will get specific examples of what went down. My friend played him in 2008 1st round final. We briefly discussed and never finished conversation, as we were in tournament the past Saturday.

Matthias wrote:

Chibi Bodge-Battle wrote:The point is the organisers failed to act for whatever reason, so he took it upon himself.

How do you know what the organizers did or did not do? The event judges were never even given the chance to deal with this during the tournament.

Matthias, I don't think Chibi's post is meant to say that the event judges are shady. I think he was just responding to Fullheadofhair being angry at Tim yet citing the judges not doing anything about his cheating. If he's mad at the event judges, why not say so, instead of harping on Tim repeatedly.

On the other hand, I fully agree that the tourney organizers and judges did an excellent job in running Adepticon 2010, and I also agree that this type of "incident" with the video taping and internet hype hurts the actual discussion of the issue. You are absolutely correct in that it was unfair to bring this issue up outside of the jurisdiction of the Adepticon staff, because when the game is over, it's over, and there really isn't anything that can be done anymore. If the judges were called over immediately, this may have a different ending, and also examining one snippet of one game under a microscope without context is terribly irresponsible.

The fact is, both players made the choice to continue playing, and so really each of these issues become irrelevant. However, Tim showed great character and integrity by still forfeiting his ticket in the face of this internet circus.

So, I think we're all on your team Matthias.

We've been over this how many times already ?