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Lets try this another way, what are you defining as long-ranged? Devastators in the C:SM have 5 weapon options: 1 @ 24", 2@ 36" and 2 @ 48". Sure they are "long ranged" compared to a boltgun, but where does your definition start for long ranged?

I've always considered under 24" to be short ranged, 24"-47" as mid ranged and 48"+ as long ranged. From that perspective, it might be easier for you to recognize why I am saying that since 3 of the 5 options fall in short to mid ranged.

OTOH, I guess if you consider 36" to be long ranged, they would be 4/5 options long ranged. From that perspective I can see your point. Its just a difference of defining "long ranged".

Dracos wrote:Lets try this another way, what are you defining as long-ranged? Devastators in the C:SM have 5 weapon options: 1 @ 24", 2@ 36" and 2 @ 48". Sure they are "long ranged" compared to a boltgun, but where does your definition start for long ranged?

I've always considered under 24" to be short ranged, 24"-47" as mid ranged and 48"+ as long ranged. From that perspective, it might be easier for you to recognize why I am saying that since 3 of the 5 options fall in short to mid ranged.

OTOH, I guess if you consider 36" to be long ranged, they would be 4/5 options long ranged. From that perspective I can see your point. Its just a difference of defining "long ranged".

Ah, fair enough. I'd argue 24" to be medium, under that to be short range. I would consider 36" long range (as it means if placed centrally you can reach most of the board on the first turn) and any more than that as extremely long ranged (as it means you can reach most of the board no matter where you're placed).

So yeah, I'd argue 4/5 guns available to devestators are long range or more, with 2 of those extreme long range. Thinking of them this way also fits with the descriptive of devestators taking up a position and laying down a withering hail of fire while other units advance. Multi-meltas would be the exception, and given that no-one takes them anyway, I'm not sure it's an exception we need to give that much consideration.

Personally, I consider 24" to be standard ranged. Under that is short, under 36" would be longer, but 48"+ is definately extremely long ranged. (Apart from in Apoc.)

adressing the fluff ammo problem:

In crysis, You can carry a minigun, assault rifle, various grenades and a pistol. not to mention missile launchers. now, he's got to carry all that. where is he going to carry it, if a space marine can't take an assault cannon and what? three ammo clips.

it's not like they hold the burst for very long. you're lucky if you ever get a burst of fire lasting 6 seconds.

Nurglitch wrote:

TyraelVladinhurst wrote:

cosmic pixie wrote:Blood Angels 'till I die (Which, even with FnP, is more often than you would think ).

Sorry about any rule problems with Living Metal. But I don't see the connection between Assault Cannons and Autocannons - One is for shredding lighter armour with volume of fire, the other is for killing small tanks with a few heavy shots. Also, the Autocannon is a much longer weapon - more suited to fixed emplacements and tanks.

except that assault cannons use auto cannon rounds

Where do you get this notion?

taken from lexicamun

It is a medium calibre rotary autocannon, with 6 barrels cycled by an electric motor past a single chamber.

TyraelVladinhurst wrote:

Nurglitch wrote:

TyraelVladinhurst wrote:

cosmic pixie wrote:Blood Angels 'till I die (Which, even with FnP, is more often than you would think ).

Sorry about any rule problems with Living Metal. But I don't see the connection between Assault Cannons and Autocannons - One is for shredding lighter armour with volume of fire, the other is for killing small tanks with a few heavy shots. Also, the Autocannon is a much longer weapon - more suited to fixed emplacements and tanks.

except that assault cannons use auto cannon rounds

Where do you get this notion?

taken from lexicamun

It is a medium calibre rotary autocannon, with 6 barrels cycled by an electric motor past a single chamber.

So nowhere, check.

Nurglitch wrote:

TyraelVladinhurst wrote:

cosmic pixie wrote:Blood Angels 'till I die (Which, even with FnP, is more often than you would think ).

Sorry about any rule problems with Living Metal. But I don't see the connection between Assault Cannons and Autocannons - One is for shredding lighter armour with volume of fire, the other is for killing small tanks with a few heavy shots. Also, the Autocannon is a much longer weapon - more suited to fixed emplacements and tanks.

except that assault cannons use auto cannon rounds

Where do you get this notion?

that is also taken from from 4th edtion codex space marines

Page number?

assault cannon entry taken from lexicanum (which is only offical canon for all you non-believers)
"The standard ammunition fired is a cased round, comprising a dense metallic core covered in a non-metallic composite sheath with a diamantine tip"

autocannon entry also taken from lexicanum
"They are rapid firing and use mass-reactive explosive ammunition."

so no. assault cannons and autocannons do not use the same ammunition

Even if there were Assault Cannons on a Devastator squad, I could not use them...

EDIT: Sorry, double post, dunno how that happened...

Each to their own...

I don't mind people not using it, but is the consensus that they would not be OP for the right price.