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I believe that Sabretooth acquired the license and produced a LOTR minis game before being purchased by GW. In fact, I recall that GW bought Sabretooth in part because of the LOTR minis...shortly after being bought, the LOTR game was discontinued.

Unsure what LOTR status is with GW these days, but I can say that in my group A LOT of people play 40K, a few Fantasy and no one plays LOTR.

I'm hoping the LoTR license is almost up. Maybe then GW can get back to releasing small games like necromunda, mordheim and blood bowl.

Sweet. Wizkids is great at taking a license, making a crappy game with it.. running it into the ground and then leaving people with buckets full of useless minis

Although I suppose thats more fun than the LOTR gw game...

Kid_Kyoto wrote:When the films were out we had GW's game (unpainted tabletop game), Sabertooth (painted collectable game), Mithral Minis (unpainted collectable minis based on the books), board games and action figures.

There was also another company (whose name escapes me right now) producing 32 or 54mm unpainted metal display miniatures.

I would agree with the notion that the license WK have aquired is most likely just the collectible minatures game license that would have previously been borrowed by Sabretooth.

From what I understand, GW also maintains a license to both the movies and the material in the novels.

Likely, this one for WizKids just covers the movies.

Clix figures always provide me with a cheap resource of parts for conversions, so anytime they announce a new clix game I get excited.

Hell, if they had ever produced NFL clix, like they originally planned, I would be in Blood Bowl Heaven.

Gibbsey wrote:I never really got why people hated GW's lotr... might be because i never see anyone play it/ advertising for it?

I think for alot of people it signaled the end of support for Specialist Games. There were and still are alot of very loyal SG players. Just look at Dakka's own Inquisimunda craze which is maybe the largest individual effort of gamers to evolve the Necromunda/Mordheim/Inquisitor game systems for their own gaming interests without any support from GW. There's alot of interest in those games still with over 10 years of no support.

I think LotR is due a good deal of credit for generating interest in GW's other games and the profits allowed for GW to spend more money on advancing mold production and therefore producing higher quality models, but personally, I'd like to see LotR bite the bullet. Especially if it leads to re-releases of other Specialist Games like they did for Space Hulk.

adamsouza wrote:Clix figures always provide me with a cheap resource of parts for conversions, so anytime they announce a new clix game I get excited.

Hell, if they had ever produced NFL clix, like they originally planned, I would be in Blood Bowl Heaven.

Hehe, The funny thing is, that's exactly my thought in reverse: if I didn't like the sculpts on the LotR clix, I was going to use the excellent Perry sculpts (I think Perry bros sculpt the range, no?) from GW to mod my Clix!

Kroothawk wrote:. Seems like they still have a soft spot for obviously unsuccessful projects Maybe we will see a Mutant Chronicles clix-project after that

They have also sold 250 million figs to date, so Im guessing they just might find a way to sell a few of these a well...

Buzzsaw wrote:if I didn't like the sculpts on the LotR clix, I was going to use the excellent Perry sculpts (I think Perry bros sculpt the range, no?) from GW to mod my Clix!

The Perrys have sculpted a lot of it, although there have been a few other hands involved as well. From memory, though, the Perrys were indeed responsible for most of the better sculpts in the range.

CT GAMER wrote:

Kroothawk wrote:. Seems like they still have a soft spot for obviously unsuccessful projects Maybe we will see a Mutant Chronicles clix-project after that

They have also sold 250 million figs to date, so Im guessing they just might find a way to sell a few of these a well...

FFG just tried one, they're still warming shelves.

puma713 wrote:

shealyr wrote:
Too bad. When I read the title I was hoping that GW lost the license so they can focus solely on 40k and WHFB.

QFT.

Got me all excited too. Hopefully this is the case. The LotR hype has died out, Wizkids is unlikely to really be able to do much w/ the license anyway, then again... the Hobbit is nearing release isn't it?

Meh, who knows, but GW would do well for itself to give it up.

chaos0xomega wrote:
Got me all excited too. Hopefully this is the case. The LotR hype has died out, Wizkids is unlikely to really be able to do much w/ the license anyway, then again... the Hobbit is nearing release isn't it?

Meh, who knows, but GW would do well for itself to give it up.

If by 'nearing release' you mean almost ready to start filming, then yes. Look for it in 2012 or 2013.

Kid_Kyoto wrote:

CT GAMER wrote:

Kroothawk wrote:. Seems like they still have a soft spot for obviously unsuccessful projects Maybe we will see a Mutant Chronicles clix-project after that

They have also sold 250 million figs to date, so Im guessing they just might find a way to sell a few of these a well...

FFG just tried one, they're still warming shelves.

Tried one what? I've only been playing HeroClix since the new launch, but in that time there have been 4 Sets and a few limited releases have been put out;

Hammer of Thor (Marvel)
Brave and the Bold (DC)
Watchmen (Independent, 25 figure collector set)
Jonah Hex (DC, 4 figure pack)
Blackest Night Starter (DC)
Web of Spiderman (Marvel)
Brightest Day pack (DC)
DC 75th anniversary (DC)

The ones in bold are sets that are sold out at the manufacturer level (note, 3/4 full sets are sold out): the mere rumor of available boosters of Hammer of Thor or DC75 can start a virtual stampede.

Have there been stumbles? Let's just say not even a night in Meagan's Foxhole would persuade me to buy the Jonah Hex set (okay, maybe...), and Watchmen was an experiment that simply did not pan out (a 25 piece set, sold for $100, that consisted of a bunch of street level bruisers and one physical god. Not exactly a balanced set.)

Edit: To be clear, it's my impression that Wizkids is doing as well as it could be. By the way, the Wizkids rule team are regular posters on fan websites, and frequently give rulings on the rules questions that arise. In the most recent set, one figure (Larfleeze) was considered to have poorly worded rules and a bad interaction that had not been noticed: after exploring people's views, errata was issued the day (or very nearly) the figure hit the street.

FFG tried a pre-painted Mutant Chronicles game that is.

I wasn't aware that Wizkids was really doing well at all. My FLGS has heaps upon heaps of boosters for their clix games and I never see any of them move. We still have the AVP and Hellboy release boxes lying around.

They're very popular at one of my locals (the one that supports the people that play the game with events etc.) and not popular at all at the local that ignores the game beyond putting it on a shelf. Weird how that works.

Daggermaw wrote:I'm hoping the LoTR license is almost up. Maybe then GW can get back to releasing small games like necromunda, mordheim and blood bowl.

Those days are long gone, friend. They left with Andy Chambers.

Also I wouldn't be at all surprised if LoTR made more money for GW than all the specialist games combined ever did. It certainly would have made more people aware of GW products, despite furious assertions that "no-one they know plays it!" by inexplicably vested warhammer players.

Kid_Kyoto wrote:

puma713 wrote:Tremors of loss and a bad financial decision can be felt elsewhere in the hobby, though. And I think that has a bit to do with the resentment towards War of the Ring. If GW hadn't ventured out into the realm of Middle Earth, how would their shareholders be doing? Would they be receiving more dividends than they have this year (have they received any?). Would there be as many price hikes as there have been? Would there be more codices out? More supplements? Less filler in White Dwarf?

I've also seen rumors that GW policy of no discounts, no rumors and their ever-stricter IP policies come from the LotR deal.

Many companies with a prestigious licence like LotR was will include a deal you can never put their stuff on clearance. Supposedly this has influnced GW to have a policy against sales which did happen back before LotR (remember Troll Boss Bob's Bargain Basement? I built me an IG armored company out of those sales).

On IP it's even clearer, New Line is very strict about guarding their designs so GW and other licencees have to keep materials under lock and key. They'd write in WD how there were rooms their staff could not enter because of LotR. Even now, 10 years later, in order to get the Hobbit licence GW has to show how good they are keeping their own stuff under wraps.

Or so the rumor mill says.

Which is all total rubbish. Without the financial boost from LotR sales 2001-2004 (and ongoing in the last 6 years) GW would have been bankrupt years back. As it was, the only problem LotR caused GW was that the sales bubble masked the underlying problems with 40k and WFB's dwindling sales so that senior management couldn't see it until it slapped them in the face.

These "internet rumours" need to be stamped out as they are complete cock. Without LotR there wouldn't even be any 40k now for the LotR-haters to enjoy.

Osbad wrote:

Which is all total rubbish. Without the financial boost from LotR sales 2001-2004 (and ongoing in the last 6 years) GW would have been bankrupt years back. As it was, the only problem LotR caused GW was that the sales bubble masked the underlying problems with 40k and WFB's dwindling sales so that senior management couldn't see it until it slapped them in the face.

These "internet rumours" need to be stamped out as they are complete cock. Without LotR there wouldn't even be any 40k now for the LotR-haters to enjoy.

Well, we don't know that for sure either do we? GW certainly wouldn't have been able to expand the way they did during those years, being infused with cash from LotR sales. But perhaps the lack of expansion could have ended up being a *good* thing for the company (from a certain perspective)...I don't think there's any way we can know for sure.


But yes, I do love the tunnel vision people sometimes have...if I don't see any of my buddies playing it, then certainly no one is playing it!

That's the mentality that has led some to say that Apocalypse was gigantic failure for GW as well despite every global indicator showing the opposite to be true.

Only GW knows for sure how well the LotR line sells in comparison to their other lines.


And I still think its funny, because if LotR was published by anyone other than GW I am absolutely positive it would be lauded as an unheralded success and an amazing game.

A critical mass of players is essential to the continued success of any wargame. In the US, LOTR has lost that mass. At GamesDay the WOTR mega battle was poorly attended. Very few people play LOTR or WOTR at the local shops.

This being said, people do come in and buy LOTR stuff. Moms seem to prefer it to the other GW games.

If GW decides to keep the game going they need to support it. This means having a starter set for WOTR, army boxes for WOTR, regular releases in plastic and metal, and an updated faq.

In my opinion WOTR killed the range, as it was much more expensive than LOTR, the rules were broken, and it took GW forever to release the FAQ.

I don't see anyone playing Fantasy. Does this mean everyone is only playing 40K or Magic the Gathering?

I remember about 3 years ago, that LotR was the most money making for GW besides 40K. So that would mean 40K does better than Fantasy. Then again that was over 3 years ago, what it is like now? I am not sure now.

But if it wasn't for LotR, as was said before, there would be no 40K or Fantasy today. Quite funny the game most people hate, is what saved their favorite plastic toy soldier so they can play with them now.

CT GAMER wrote:

Kroothawk wrote:. Seems like they still have a soft spot for obviously unsuccessful projects Maybe we will see a Mutant Chronicles clix-project after that

They have also sold 250 million figs to date, so Im guessing they just might find a way to sell a few of these a well...

250 million clix figs? Id have to attribute that to people collecting the comic book figs. The clix game itself wasnt too good.

Not seeing anyone playing Fantasy might be indicative of 8th being an abortion. I don't see anyone play it or WotR at GW ; if you didn't see stock on the shelves you'd think 40k is the only game they produce. Hell, GOTHIC is getting more table time currently. Maybe there are tons of dudes playing "unpopular" GW games in their basements driving up sales unseen by regular folk but honestly I think it's at least somewhat indicative of what is been played by the majority of GW customers.

I'd like to see some actual data on sales since I have a REALLY hard time believing that LotR stuff was selling well as recent as three years ago, well after the movies had waned in popularity. Maybe there was a spike in sales when WotR hit before people abandoned it...

Kid_Kyoto wrote:

CT GAMER wrote:

Kroothawk wrote:. Seems like they still have a soft spot for obviously unsuccessful projects Maybe we will see a Mutant Chronicles clix-project after that

They have also sold 250 million figs to date, so Im guessing they just might find a way to sell a few of these a well...

FFG just tried one, they're still warming shelves.

We are talking about whizkids not FFG, and I'll say again: Whizkids has sold 250 million figs to date, so they must know a little tiny bit abut what they are doing, and I'm guessing they have done their homework and figured out that they can turn a profit on this lisence.

Look I love "internet hate" and "doom & Gloom" as much as the next guy, but I think whizkids has a pretty good track record, so maybe tone it back a few notches huh?

yakface wrote:

But yes, I do love the tunnel vision people sometimes have...if I don't see any of my buddies playing it, then certainly no one is playing it!

I think that view is a bit myopic compared to what I was saying. I didn't mean that because I haven't seen it played in three states in the US, means it's not being played anywhere - but you don't have to be a genius to take the temperature of the LotR climate from different sources. From forums, from talking to other gamers, from experience, to the support that it is getting from stores and GW itself.

While what you're saying is true - only GW knows - I've yet to see LotR crowding the tables at events or product flying off the shelves (in fact, I'm not sure the FLGS that we frequent in Alabama and Tennessee even carry LotR).

shealyr wrote:Too bad. When I read the title I was hoping that GW lost the license so they can focus solely on 40k and WHFB.

As a collector of WHFB, 40k and LOTR (well, specifically WOTR), I'd be very sad to see it go. Some of the sculpts are genuinely fantastic (in large part thanks to the Perry twins), and (despite some comments about it being 'broken') I've found the actual system in WOTR to be very elegant; the emphasis on tabletop tactics rather than obscene combinations of wargear is nice to see, even though there are some serious balancing issues with some of the armies (poor Angmar).

Gibbsey wrote:I never really got why people hated GW's lotr... might be because i never see anyone play it/ advertising for it?

While in an of itself as a game I hear its a good one, the hate stems from a)it takes away focus from the main 2 of WHFB and 40K, b)money folling in from it masked underlying problems GW had, c) it takes up resources and space in WD and other that majority of GW players dont care about.

Back when I was buying WD, or even cheap back issues, if it had majority in my opinion LOTR articles it wasnt worth buying.

shealyr wrote:This shouldn't effect GW at all.

Too bad. When I read the title I was hoping that GW lost the license so they can focus solely on 40k and WHFB.

You mean they actually put effort into the LotR? Ive heard pretty much the opposite from some group talking about it.