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Sigh.

Quickly settled with that little thing called a tape measure. If in a friendly game - not sen this as an issue so far. In a tournament call a TO if you truly cannot decide, or if one guy is just being unreasonable.

Mountain, meet molehill.

In that case, you just have to spend few seconds and measure it.
Note that you can do this while fulfilling the "check you're in range" part of shooting already.

Indeed.

When you follow the rules this method is very quick, even more so than the fast 5th ed rules. Not as fast as 4th, of course, but then in 4th the special / sarge wasnt ever in danger.

nosferatu1001 wrote:And, again, not difficult.

Work out how many wounds you can take before LOS! is an issue, roll in batchs that ensure you dont have to bother about LOS! (so 3 wounds lost before LOS! is an issue, then roll 3 dice. If no wounds are taken, roll another 3. Repeat)

When you get to LOS!, assuming youre going to try to bounce, roll the bounces. Rinse, repeat.

This is a lot quicker in the GENERAL case than it was in 5th

I'm not sold that it is. After playing several games with (ch) units--which were the culprit units of 6th, I think it's as slow/slower.

Luide wrote:In that case, you just have to spend few seconds and measure it.
Note that you can do this while fulfilling the "check you're in range" part of shooting already.

The issue is never the first model. It's when let's say--a Nob PK is 3 deep in the middle of the mob---and the unit sustains heavy casualty to the point that it becomes a toss up of if it's the Nob/another Boy that's in range. This usually requires that;

The person moving spends more time fiddling with their models, trying to protect Sgts/Nobs from being the closest after casualties--+ being safe from challenges.
You get down and view line of sight--as that has definitely changed now and you can only kill what you can see
You pull out a tape measure and start measuring again

It definitely slows down the game.



As to OP--Yep barrage sniping is back. Manticores are pretty disgusting.

I'm with Nos. This system is faster. No more allocating to wargear groups. I can ensure that my special weapons don't die to an unlucky roll of mine.

Line os sight is exactly the same as 5th (and 4th, 3rd, 2nd and 1st)

Having played a number of games with this, i find it much faster than mixed wargear 5th edition, and i didnt exactly find that slow. Games flow a LOT faster than previously

nosferatu1001 wrote:Line os sight is exactly the same as 5th (and 4th, 3rd, 2nd and 1st)

Having played a number of games with this, i find it much faster than mixed wargear 5th edition, and i didnt exactly find that slow. Games flow a LOT faster than previously

Well, line of sight wasn't the topic of discussion--but more on how casualty removal and wound allocation works in 6th. Line of sight happens to interact more aggressively with the change in the removal process--that process has changed from 5th to 6th (Which was my original post).

Combine that fact with front-back casualty removal--Line of Sight issues evolve from "Let's hammer out if I can see your unit or not" to "Let's hammer out if I can see individual models as wound allocation becomes important". I don't find this to be quicker.

RE: Wound allocation on the problematic units--I cannot see how this is faster, either in my gaming experience or simply adding dice rolls.

5th Edition, I shoot Nobz and do 10 wounds
He allocates based off Wargear
Makes 10 cover, likely 5 FNP
15 rolls

6th Edition, I shoot Nobz and do 10 wounds
Front to back, say a Warboss is leading the unit (Although not required, as all Nobz have (ch))
Makes a Look Out Sir on each wound, allocates to another Nob (Fails 1-2, still requires saves/FNP rolls on Warboss)
Makes 10 cover, likely 5 FNP
25 rolls--with a decision on allocating where I want after each Look Out Sir roll


Close combat becomes even more tedious, as most Deathstars/units now have some form of a 2++/2+ that soaks wounds. This requires you roll saves in small groups or even worse...one...at...a...time. Reece has a battle report where he vents a bit about this;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0x_NcOhoVy8&feature=player_embedded

The allocation based off wargear could take some people a lot of time in 5th, especially when you had some odd wounds thrown in there from previous rounds and you wanted to play this set of allocations as well as possible.

This is also only exacerbated from 2 - 3 units in the entire game. IN GENERAL the game moves more quickly

nosferatu1001 wrote:The allocation based off wargear could take some people a lot of time in 5th, especially when you had some odd wounds thrown in there from previous rounds and you wanted to play this set of allocations as well as possible.

This is also only exacerbated from 2 - 3 units in the entire game. IN GENERAL the game moves more quickly

That certainly wasn't my experience in 5th--and given the problematic units have actually grown worse with added dice rolls (along with the addition of more problematic units in 6th due to the new rules), I guess we'll have to agree to disagree.

Allocation for unwounded units was easy - what dragged was when you had odd wounds. Especially with paladins, where you have to think about whether you want to risk psycannon, swords, etc

6th has so far moved surprisingly quickly.