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Made in us
Douglas Bader






 Shandara wrote:
Paying 20 points for a single shot S8 missile is slightly under the top though.


Exactly. The cost makes it clear IMO. Hellstrike missiles are only a marginal improvement over 10-point hunter-killer missiles, so the only explanation that makes sense to justify paying double the cost* is that hellstrike missiles are an infinite-ammunition weapon. Add in the fact that the identical weapon on the Valkyrie is very clearly not a one-shot weapon and there is no suggestion at all that the other hellstrike missiles should be one-shot weapons. The entire argument, aside from applying "this is how it worked in 7th" to a weapon that has clearly changed in 8th, is that the plural 's' is intended to make it an entirely different weapon with additional rules that somehow didn't make it into print. I don't think this is plausible at all.

*And yes, at least one unit can choose either. The Vulture can take two hellstrike missiles or six hunter-killer missiles. The only way that choice makes sense is if it's between a two-shot weapon that can be fired every turn and six one-shot weapons that have better alpha strike but lower damage over time. If hellstrike missiles are a one-shot weapon then it makes no sense to even consider taking them on a Vulture.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 yakface wrote:
In contrast, the Imperial Armour version is called a 'Hellstrike Missile' (singular) and then models are able to take quite a few of them (like 8 on the Marauder Destroyer, for example). Yes, you're still paying 20 points for each of them, but the potential damage output of being able to fire 8 Hellstrike MIssiles every turn (on top of the model's other weapons) just seems quite OTT.


Compare the Marauder Destroyer's firepower with infinite hellstrike missiles to the Baneblade variants at a similar point cost and it's not that impressive. If the bomber only gets one shot with its missiles then it's a joke, and the tanks outclass it by a decisive margin.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/08/28 08:50:58


There is no such thing as a hobby without politics. "Leave politics at the door" is itself a political statement, an endorsement of the status quo and an attempt to silence dissenting voices. 
   
Made in gb
Norn Queen






IA: Forces of the AM

COVENANT OF TZEENTCH
Any INFANTRY unit with this keyword gains +1 to hit when firing Overwatch.

Except the rules for overwatch say you hit on a 6 regardless of modifiers. So this rule literally does nothing. It needs to say "Any INFANTRY unit with this keyword gains hits on a 5+ when firing Overwatch."

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/08/31 13:43:07


 
   
Made in us
Douglas Bader






 BaconCatBug wrote:
IA: Forces of the AM

COVENANT OF TZEENTCH
Any INFANTRY unit with this keyword gains +1 to hit when firing Overwatch.

Except the rules for overwatch say you hit on a 6 regardless of modifiers. So this rule literally does nothing. It needs to say "Any INFANTRY unit with this keyword gains hits on a 5+ when firing Overwatch."


This is already handled by the rule of "specific overrides general". A rule that explicitly says "this modifies overwatch" is clearly an exception to the general rule of modifiers not applying to overwatch.

There is no such thing as a hobby without politics. "Leave politics at the door" is itself a political statement, an endorsement of the status quo and an attempt to silence dissenting voices. 
   
Made in gb
Norn Queen






 Peregrine wrote:
This is already handled by the rule of "specific overrides general". A rule that explicitly says "this modifies overwatch" is clearly an exception to the general rule of modifiers not applying to overwatch.
I wouldn't have asked it if that was the case. The rule for overwatch says "regardless of modifiers" and the rule granting the modifier doesn't change that fact, it just gives the modifier.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/09/01 16:00:52


 
   
Made in us
Been Around the Block





Renegade Malefic Lords cost 30 points (with no weapons upgrades), but are listed as power level 4. Is one of those numbers a mistake?

Can a player use the Adeptus Astartes stratagem called "Only in Death Does Duty End" and the Grey Knights stratagem with the same name in the same phase (and can you use them on the same character), or are they the "same" stratagem?

The Adeptus Astartes version costs 2 command points, references Adeptus Astartes keywords, and references use of the stratagem in conjunction with a banner ability. The Grey Knights version costs 1 command point, only effects grey knights characters, and the text is several lines shorter.
   
Made in gb
Sneaky Striking Scorpion






Two questions about Swooping Hawks:

The Sunrifle ability states that "If a unit suffers any unsaved wounds from this weapon, your opponent must subtract 1 from their hit rolls until the end of the turn". This suggests that if you cause an unsaved wound on an enemy unit they must subtract 1 to hit only in the rest of your player turn. Is this correct? Or should it be that the enemy unit has to subtract 1 to hit until the end of their next turn?

Can you clarify how the Swooping Hawk Grenade pack works. If I have a unit of 5 Swooping Hawks fly over a unit 20 models I roll 5 dice for the Grenade pack? If I have a unit of 5 fly over a unit of 3 models I roll 3 dice for the Grenade pack?

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/09/03 09:52:48


~500pts Asuryani painted new colour scheme
~7500pts Asuryani assembled some with old colour scheme
 
   
Made in ch
Legendary Dogfighter





RNAS Rockall

BRB/Core Rules - Overwatch

The overwatch rule applies an additional restriction that units with an enemy model within 1" cannot be selected to fire overwatch. Does the limitation that charged units cannot be selected to fire overwatch if an enemy unit is within 1" apply to models with rules such as Steel Behemoth and Imperial God Engine which grant the ability to shoot normally if an enemy unit is within 1"?

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/09/12 10:01:54


Some people find the idea that other people can be happy offensive, and will prefer causing harm to self improvement.  
   
Made in de
Regular Dakkanaut





Is the wolf guard battle leader with jump pack really only 3 points more expensive than the one without the pack?
   
Made in us
Been Around the Block





Death Guard Codex is missing points cost for a Demon Prince with wings (or alternatively, that option is included on the datasheet in error)?
   
Made in de
Longtime Dakkanaut




Codex: Craftworlds

Are Autarchs built using the index datasheets still legal? How do we calculate the point cost of such Autarchs? Do they use the updated rules for Path of Command and Banshee Masks?

Autarchs and Hemlocks have abilities (Forceshield and Spirit Stones) that have the same name as wargear options, but do not actually have the wargear in question. Do they have to pay points as if they were equipped with it?

The Blazing Star of Vaul can be given to any non-named character with "a shuriken pistol or shuriken catapult", but no character has a weapon named "shuriken catapult". Should this include avenger and twin shuriken catapults?
   
Made in ru
Been Around the Block




Sorry if this offtop, but can we use email answers about rules clarifications as valid FAQ embodiment?
   
Made in gb
Norn Queen






EricDominus wrote:
Sorry if this offtop, but can we use email answers about rules clarifications as valid FAQ embodiment?
No, see Tenants of YMDC.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Since GW decided to once again be useless:

Several codexes never define what a "Named Character" is. The SM, DG and IG codex does, but the AdMech and GK codex calls them "Unique units", while the Craftworlds and Chaos Space Marine codexes lists them as "Units".

It would be very nice to have an explicit unambigous ruling that states that "Named Characters" is synonymous with "Units that are Unique and 1 per army Units".

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/10/29 18:36:13


 
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut





• The rules for re-rolls (pg 178) say that re-rolls happen 'before modifiers are applied', which was also backed up with the answer given in the 'designer's commentary' PDF. But how does this policy work with re-rolls that require the player to know whether something has succeeded or failed before being able to re-roll the dice when modifiers are involved? For example, an Ultramarine model with a BS 2+ is firing a heavy weapon on the move against a unit of T'au Stealthsuits in cover (-2 to its rolls to hit), but is also within 6" of Roboute Guilliman, and so will be able to re-roll failed hit rolls. If modifiers are always applied after re-rolls then that means this model would only be able to re-roll any '1's rolled, even though the rolls of '2' & '3' will ultimately end up being misses. Is this really the correct way to play?

Quite simple really. Re rolls happen BEFORE modifiers. That means you have to do the entire re roll step BEFORE modifiers, including the re roll. So lets say your BS is 3+. You have -2 to hit like your example. You roll a 1,2, and 2. You re roll all the dice, because you have not applied modifiers yet, and the re roll step happens before that. Then you roll a 4,5,6. Hey! Look at that! I hit with my attacks! But then you apply with the modifier, -2, so you actually only hit with the 5 and 6. So you get 2 hits, and the 3 doesnt count at the end.

I have no idea why the gaming community could not grasp a simple concept laid out and confirmed by GW. Follow the rules and your life will be easier!

Hope this clears it up so you dont have to wait for GW response.

This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at 2017/10/30 14:54:51


 
   
Made in us
Stalwart Space Marine




Following the changes in the Astra Militarum codex, should the Vendetta have the same "Roving Gunship" rule as the Valkyrie?
   
Made in ch
Legendary Dogfighter





RNAS Rockall

BRB Matched play Tactical reserves;

Do units embarked on a transport - and thus removed from the battlefield - count towards the 'at least half the total number of units ... must be set up on the battlefield' stipulation ?

Some people find the idea that other people can be happy offensive, and will prefer causing harm to self improvement.  
   
Made in dk
Loyal Necron Lychguard






 combatcotton wrote:
Is the wolf guard battle leader with jump pack really only 3 points more expensive than the one without the pack?

18 pts in the codex.

For the Necrons:

In the Dynastic Agents section of the Necron Codex C'TAN SHARD units are mentioned, no units in the codex actually have this keyword, are we to assume the C'TAN SHARD keyword is synonymous with the C'TAN SHARDS keyword found on the C'tan Shard of the Deceiver, C'tan Shard of the Nightbringer, Transcendent C'tan and Tesseract Vault?
   
Made in us
[ADMIN]
President of the Mat Ward Fan Club






Los Angeles, CA



This thread is pretty much hopelessly outdated for its original intention (the last post before yours was from Nov 2017).

As such, its best to lock this thread down and if anyone else wants to bother with doing something similar, feel free to start a new thread.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/09/20 18:02:07


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