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If I take 10 of them, I take 7 power stabba, 2 x big choppa, and one claw. Keeps them cheap. 10 big choppas or 10 claws are overpriced and usually overkill

If they dropped the price of the kustom shoota that would be cool. I like the looks and idea of kustom shootas, but from a practical perspective I'd much rather have an ammo runt for the same points or pay a little bit more and get another ork boy.

 Dakka Flakka Flame wrote:
If they dropped the price of the kustom shoota that would be cool. I like the looks and idea of kustom shootas, but from a practical perspective I'd much rather have an ammo runt for the same points or pay a little bit more and get another ork boy.

I thought kustom shootas were only 4 points? That seems pretty fair to me- that's basically 2 points per extra shot.

 Vitali Advenil wrote:

 Dakka Flakka Flame wrote:
If they dropped the price of the kustom shoota that would be cool. I like the looks and idea of kustom shootas, but from a practical perspective I'd much rather have an ammo runt for the same points or pay a little bit more and get another ork boy.

I thought kustom shootas were only 4 points? That seems pretty fair to me- that's basically 2 points per extra shot.

They are only four points, which isn't terribly expensive but at the same time if the nob is always either in close combat or advancing towards the enemy trying to get into close combat those extra shots aren't likely to do anything. Alternatively an ammo runt effectively gives an extra shot and it gives an extra wound for the same points. It takes up an extra spot in the transport but is also another body for capturing objectives. A boy with a shoota gives the same two extra shots plus is way more useful in other ways for only two points more. Six points could also buy a big shoota on a boy or on a Battlewagon.

Kustom Shootas are cheap enough at four points that if a person likes them they aren't horrible, but I think from a strictly practical point of view there is almost always going to be something better to spend those four points on. If they came down to two points each (which is what Space Marines pay for Storm Bolters, and a Storm Bolter is way more effective on a Space Marine than a Kustom Shoota is on a Nob) then that's getting to where in a competitive environment people could throw them on their nobz and not feel like they were wasting points.

I'm not very competitive so I'll probably include some even if they stay at four points, I just think that if the cool factor is taken away they generally aren't a very good use of points.

Maybe a case could be made for small groups of Nobz as bodyguards for transports having Kustom Shootas? Like, maybe a Battlewagon has a bunch of shooty orks in it, plus a unit of five nobz who's job is to jump out and charge the enemy if they get too close? In that case ammo runts might take up too much space, and the nobz might spend a lot of time in the wagon not advancing. I'm not sure if that's a good use for them or not.

 Vitali Advenil wrote:

 Dakka Flakka Flame wrote:
If they dropped the price of the kustom shoota that would be cool. I like the looks and idea of kustom shootas, but from a practical perspective I'd much rather have an ammo runt for the same points or pay a little bit more and get another ork boy.

I thought kustom shootas were only 4 points? That seems pretty fair to me- that's basically 2 points per extra shot.

For 4 Pts a Space Marine can take 2 Stormbolters. Those push out the same S4 shots, at 24 instead of 18in range and heres the kicker. At 12in range they are 8 shots not 4. Kustom Shootas are at the absolute most 2pts, 1pt to be competitive, but 2pts would be ok and I might throw them on a model or 2 if I have a couple points left over.

Just to really set this in.

2 Stormbolters for Marines cost the same amount, they push out 4shots at longer range then the Kustom Shoota. they hit on 3s we hit on 5s, So they out range us, they have better ballistic skill and when we finally get in range they can advance another 6 inches and get in double tap range and unleash 8 shots for about 6 hits, compared to our 4 shots for about 1 hit.

Yeah im going to go ahead and change my stance, 1pt otherwise its a waste.

I'm not so keen on the ammo runt, with flash gits I love them, but in a vehicle I just can't justify the slot for 1 more chance at a 5+shot and 1 less wound, might as well save the slot and get 2 more chances at a 5+shot, but I guess if you're low on points and the vehicle is half full that's 5 wounds and shots for 20p, versus 2 shots and 2 wounds for 17p, or 3 wounds and 6 shots for 18p in a boy squad.

I guess the ammo runtz can help in melee too? I've never remembered to use them, but I've had half a unit of gretchin take down a few chaos-marines before so you never know lol.
It's a shame generic grots can't be tagged onto boy squads for extra wounds, it might be a way to do gretchin meat-shield with this cover-system.

I'm definitely going to have to for at least 5 shoota and big-choppa nobz, so I may just bulk them up with some runtz rather than take extra nobz for my smaller games, get some grot of boyz instead

I think it's more the extra wound for relatively cheap than the re-roll that makes ammo runts good on regular nobs. If I had a trukk packed with nobz (or nobz plus a different unit) I'd want to throw in a couple ammo runts to assign any ones to when my opponent blows the trukk up.

The reroll is just a small bonus. Nice when you take a kombi rokkit as well.
Footslogging nobs with KFF, dok and ammo runts can also suck up some damage.

 Kap'n Krump wrote:

I'll do a frigging backflip if klaws become 14 ppm.

There's a russian proverb: "Man says - man does".

 Dakka Flakka Flame wrote:
I think it's more the extra wound for relatively cheap than the re-roll that makes ammo runts good on regular nobs. If I had a trukk packed with nobz (or nobz plus a different unit) I'd want to throw in a couple ammo runts to assign any ones to when my opponent blows the trukk up.

I feel like these guys are pretty much exclusively for this purpose. Unless I'm bringing some kombi-rokkits on my nobs (and I really see no good reason to do so for their high price and terrible accuracy) I'm never going to use him for his actual purpose.

Ammo runts no longer disappear when 'used' to re-roll shots.

You are pretty much guaranteed to miss half your shots, so ammo runts pretty much make the nobz' shootas assault 3.

Not stellar but those extra hits tend to kill a model or two.