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 Matt.Kingsley wrote:

 captain bloody fists wrote:
so, who's going to take the Phantom 2 over the Phantom 1? i personally think that the Phantom 1 title is better

For sure.
Coordinate is useful though, especially on such a cheap shuttle. Certainly not worth docking it over double turret attacks though.

A Shealthipede by itself though... that might be a good investment.

Yeah, generic shuttle looks like it could be good, but the Phantom II title falls hard into the trap of using an expensive unit to support a cheap one.

 Matt.Kingsley wrote:

 captain bloody fists wrote:
so, who's going to take the Phantom 2 over the Phantom 1? i personally think that the Phantom 1 title is better

For sure.
Coordinate is useful though, especially on such a cheap shuttle. Certainly not worth docking it over double turret attacks though.

A Shealthipede by itself though... that might be a good investment.

Especially old Fenn and his ability.

This wave gets more interesting the more I think about, the PS8/10 Kimoglia pilot is going to be absolutely brutal if flown well (bet its dial is going to suck though) and its surprisingly cheap.
Loving the title for the gunboat, that's limited to Tractor and flechette at the moment isn't it? really hope the dial on this doesn't suck!
With the shuttle I concur with the above posts, by itself its pretty good attached to the Ghost, nope.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also excited to see what the Saturation Shot? Ept that comes with the Kimoglia and 'boat does. Looks like if you attack with a Torp you get to do something (attack with primary? attack with another ship? Hard to make out the text).

See i'm a little confused at the moment as to why the title for the gunboat is 2 cannons? are there going to be cannons that are actions instead of shooting?

I think that's because the cannon next to the jammer is something like 'linked batteries' which will use a cannon slot. The card seems to be that after you perform a primary attack you may attack with a cannon secondary. Its also small ship only to not allow IG-88 to take it.

Eh, the missile boat is the only one that really piques my interest.

And finally, a freaking reload action! Now, if we could just get it retrofitted to things like the TIE bomber...

 Stormonu wrote:
And finally, a freaking reload action! Now, if we could just get it retrofitted to things like the TIE bomber...

See after reading about this, it seems like a mechanic that should've been in the game from day dot....

ingtaer wrote:
Also excited to see what the Saturation Shot? Ept that comes with the Kimoglia and 'boat does. Looks like if you attack with a Torp you get to do something (attack with primary? attack with another ship? Hard to make out the text).

I think it'll be called "Saturation Salvo" actually - if you look closely on the Kimogila image, the second word starts with "Sa", not "Sh". But yes, exciting stuff. I expect it's a "when you fire a torp or missile, discard this card to trigger some kind of attack".

 Stormonu wrote:
Eh, the missile boat is the only one that really piques my interest.

And finally, a freaking reload action! Now, if we could just get it retrofitted to things like the TIE bomber...

Same here, I'm down. Started playing X-Wing, and, yeah, they are awesome.

Phantom II might not be that bad, but I think the Phantom is still better

Still, as much as I'm happy to see the missile boat, the more I look at it, the more I like the scum ship in this set. It's like fist glance okay...then the more you look at it the cooler it gets.

 captain bloody fists wrote:
See i'm a little confused at the moment as to why the title for the gunboat is 2 cannons? are there going to be cannons that are actions instead of shooting?

This way you can grab an actual attack cannon, and one that you can shoot when you have a weapon disabled token.

yeah i now know after watching the wave 12 break down by Crabbok last night

Finally, first impressions:

Assault Gunboat: nothing else in this wave matters. My beloved is finally coming to X-Wing, and it is perfect. The stat line is pretty good for its cost, looks like probably ~20-21 points base cost for the PS 2. A 2/2/4/3 stat line is pretty good durability for that cost, and the only weakness (low attack dice) is compensated for by the fact that you'll almost never be making primary weapon shots. And dear god that action bar. SLAM has been demonstrated to be very powerful, giving you arguably the best repositioning options in the game and powerful action economy with advanced SLAM, and you even get a title to negate the one drawback to it. And the new reload action is absurd points efficiency. Spend an action, gain 5+ points worth of upgrades. You can be very aggressive with your ordnance, and again the only penalty other than spending an action is negated by the title. Unless the dial is terrible this ship is pure <3 <3 <3 <3.

XG-1 Assault Configuration: unless that card behind it is a competing title (as is likely) that is equally amazing this is an auto-take. You pay a single point to gain two upgrade slots and the ability to negate the drawback of weapons disabled tokens. Say hi to the new imperial control ship, SLAM to reposition, advanced SLAM to ensure action economy, and a tractor beam/flechette cannon/jamming beam to lock down your target.

Major Vynder: PS 7 is just an insult when even the scum ship gets PS 8 for its top pilot, but otherwise awesome. Remember how the combo of the title and advanced SLAM makes SLAM a free and penalty-free action? Now you get a bonus green die when you SLAM every turn (unless you're in a perfect position already and don't need the green die). Now your stat line is effectively 2/3/4/3, better than a TIE/D defender. Not bad for a 26 point base cost, ~32 with upgrades. And with VI you can do all of this at PS 9. Not the most amazing firepower for an ace, but nasty arc dodging and control.

Jamming beam: exact stats unknown, but from the reference card we know the effect. It's probably going to be 1-2 points to work with the title, but 3 attack dice? The effect is interesting, action anti-economy for the target and the tokens don't go away until you spend actions to remove them. Is this better than just tractor beaming the target into a kill shot? I'm not sure.

Kimogila: oh yay, another SWG ship, just what the game didn't need. Good stat line for the point cost, good available upgrades, and the bullseye arc is just plain nasty. If you can catch an ace (VI seems mandatory here, for PS 10) you can wipe them off the table. On the other hand, with Nym in the meta, do aces even exist anymore? It's certainly a much less impressive effect if you're shooting at something without a pile of defensive tokens. And that low agility has the potential to really hurt. One of the counters to Nym/Miranda is ion weapons exploiting their low agility, and now we have a ship that can't even shoot back with a turret once you hit it with the ion weapon. On the other hand, that bullseye firing arc works with ordnance and you have the ability to reload. Wreck something on the joust, reload while you set up for the next joust.

Torani Kulda: clear best and only relevant ship in the expansion. PS 8 (PS 10 with VI) is what matters here, for getting that bullseye arc on a target. The pilot ability is just a nice bonus. You're already denying your target the ability to spend defensive tokens, so for this to be relevant you either need to follow up the shot with another ship or strip offensive focus before they can shoot, AND they have to be in a position where they don't just take the extra damage and hit you back. That's not a "never going to happen" thing, but let's be realistic about it, it's not why you're taking the ship.

Enforcer: cheap, but not great. Automatic stress is obviously good, but it only works when jousting and any good player is going to try to flank you instead of jousting. You're probably going to take it because it's so cheap, but expect to get 1 point of value out of it.

New shuttle: good, but only because it's so absurdly cheap. At 20 points for PS 9 we're talking about TIE fighter levels of price for the PS 1. Sure, the stat line is on the same level as a TIE fighter or z-95, but see that coordinate action? Now you can get dirt cheap action economy for a more important ship, and a bit of supporting fire/blocking/etc as a nice bonus. Oh, and that rear arc? Yes please. But IMO if you aren't getting anything out of the coordinate action you're not getting a very good deal, you almost certainly pay for that rear arc and extra point of HP compared to a z-95 but you're still talking about a 2-attack ship that will struggle to accomplish anything on its own.

Phantom II: trash. This falls into the trap of using a very expensive ship (Ghost + shuttle) to support a cheaper ship (pretty much anything else), instead of doing it the right way around. Why would you ever take a free action instead of getting to double tap with a powerful turret weapon backed up by FCS/piles of focus tokens/etc? The only justification I can see for this is if you're planning to undock the shuttle early in the game, and treat the title as a "it's free, might as well take it" upgrade. But even then you'd have to coincidentally have both ships in your list, it's not at all worth taking the other just to use the combo on the one you actually want.

Fenn Rau: like the PS 8 kimogila, the main benefit here is high PS to maximize the effectiveness of the coordinate action. At PS 9 (11 with VI!) you can reposition any ship with boost/BR and make up for their low PS, feed target locks to ordnance carriers that couldn't pick them up at low PS, etc. And I guess the ability isn't terrible either, it's kind of situationally effective and taking stress every turn is a high price to pay unless this thing has a god-tier dial, but it will probably save you some damage here and there. But I'm not going to be rushing to take him for the pilot ability alone.

Ezra: seems to be the same pilot ability as on the old shuttle, effectively giving you a re-roll on all of your green dice as long as you're stressed (which is easy to arrange). This is still good action economy, but it's really hurt by the lack of a TLT. Now being locked into green maneuvers hurts a lot more, and your firepower is a lot weaker in general. IMO you're probably going to want old-Ezra if you take him at all.

Zeb: same pilot ability as his two previous ships, still trash. Canceling crits before hits is a little more valuable with 4 hull instead of 2, but it's not like he's hard to kill with face-down damage cards. And now you don't even have the justification that he's the cheapest possible shuttle pilot to throw on your Ghost and unlock the title bonuses, as there's a PS 1 option to do his one job even better. I doubt he's ever going to see play.

@Peregrine: mate do you think that the game is seriously starting to have an issue with Power creep? IMHO i believe that the Empire is seriously starting to feel that it's being left behind and the other two factions are starting to pull too far ahead in the game.

 captain bloody fists wrote:
@Peregrine: mate do you think that the game is seriously starting to have an issue with Power creep? IMHO i believe that the Empire is seriously starting to feel that it's being left behind and the other two factions are starting to pull too far ahead in the game.

Yes and no. There's power creep, but it's primarily a scum problem. Scum keep getting to do everything, with no weaknesses and blatantly undercosted ships, while the other two factions have to play by the rules. Rebels aren't all that great either, outside of exploiting Biggs in a single list that is the polar opposite of fun for either player. Though in this wave imperials seem like the winner, getting a clearly great ship while the other two factions get ships that are situationally good at best.

I will say that the Gunboat's viability is somewhat dependent on it's dial. I'm really feeling like PtL is going to be wanted on Major Vynder, but that begs the question of if you can shed that stress with a speed 3 green maneuver the following turn. A green 3 straight and decent 3 banks and turns would be all that's necessary.

 Grey Templar wrote:
I will say that the Gunboat's viability is somewhat dependent on it's dial. I'm really feeling like PtL is going to be wanted on Major Vynder, but that begs the question of if you can shed that stress with a speed 3 green maneuver the following turn. A green 3 straight and decent 3 banks and turns would be all that's necessary.

IMO it's going to be VI there. PS 9 is just too valuable on a ship where so much of the power comes from its repositioning action, and advanced SLAM gives you great action economy. A SLAM action with a 2-3 speed maneuver on a k-wing dial is about equivalent to a boost and barrel roll on a non-SLAM ship, and advanced SLAM gives you a free action on top of that. So that's effectively three actions per turn already. Obviously more actions are always good, but I don't think I'd give up PS 9 for a target lock every turn.

Agreed with VI - literally the first upgrade that isn't already in the expansion that came to my head when when I saw Vynder.

Probably going to field Vynder with VI, title, either Jammer Beam or Flechette, potentially the other cannon upgrade in the expansion (depending on what it does and if it synergises with having wd tokens), Adv SLAM and Cruise Missiles, because Cruise Missiles.

Yeah VI unless the new EPT has an impressive synergy with re gunboat. The dial is unlikely to have much green on it so ptl is likely to be a mistake.

The wave looks good to me, the gunboat in particular.

 Peregrine wrote:
Finally, first impressions:

Assault Gunboat: nothing else in this wave matters. My beloved is finally coming to X-Wing, and it is perfect. The stat line is pretty good for its cost, looks like probably ~20-21 points base cost for the PS 2. A 2/2/4/3 stat line is pretty good durability for that cost, and the only weakness (low attack dice) is compensated for by the fact that you'll almost never be making primary weapon shots. And dear god that action bar. SLAM has been demonstrated to be very powerful, giving you arguably the best repositioning options in the game and powerful action economy with advanced SLAM, and you even get a title to negate the one drawback to it. And the new reload action is absurd points efficiency. Spend an action, gain 5+ points worth of upgrades. You can be very aggressive with your ordnance, and again the only penalty other than spending an action is negated by the title. Unless the dial is terrible this ship is pure <3 <3 <3 <3.

XG-1 Assault Configuration: unless that card behind it is a competing title (as is likely) that is equally amazing this is an auto-take. You pay a single point to gain two upgrade slots and the ability to negate the drawback of weapons disabled tokens. Say hi to the new imperial control ship, SLAM to reposition, advanced SLAM to ensure action economy, and a tractor beam/flechette cannon/jamming beam to lock down your target.

Major Vynder: PS 7 is just an insult when even the scum ship gets PS 8 for its top pilot, but otherwise awesome. Remember how the combo of the title and advanced SLAM makes SLAM a free and penalty-free action? Now you get a bonus green die when you SLAM every turn (unless you're in a perfect position already and don't need the green die). Now your stat line is effectively 2/3/4/3, better than a TIE/D defender. Not bad for a 26 point base cost, ~32 with upgrades. And with VI you can do all of this at PS 9. Not the most amazing firepower for an ace, but nasty arc dodging and control.

Jamming beam: exact stats unknown, but from the reference card we know the effect. It's probably going to be 1-2 points to work with the title, but 3 attack dice? The effect is interesting, action anti-economy for the target and the tokens don't go away until you spend actions to remove them. Is this better than just tractor beaming the target into a kill shot? I'm not sure.

I honestly think that this is the first time I've heard you sound Happy about a release.

Fenn Rau: like the PS 8 kimogila, the main benefit here is high PS to maximize the effectiveness of the coordinate action. At PS 9 (11 with VI!) you can reposition any ship with boost/BR and make up for their low PS, feed target locks to ordnance carriers that couldn't pick them up at low PS, etc. And I guess the ability isn't terrible either, it's kind of situationally effective and taking stress every turn is a high price to pay unless this thing has a god-tier dial, but it will probably save you some damage here and there. But I'm not going to be rushing to take him for the pilot ability alone.

It will have access to R2 Astromechs. If it's dial is similar to the Phantom 1, this makes it pretty good.

Assault shuttle, s-threads and an escorts swarm of TIES could be entertaining