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 Kilkrazy wrote:

It's interesting to contrast the uncanny valley of Battle Angel Alita with Paddington.


How so? Uncanny valley usually does not apply at all to things that are fantastical, and there is no mistaking that particular bear for a real one.

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My secret fortress at the base of the volcano!

The eyes... THE EYES!!! *shudder*

Seriously, they are so terrible. Every time that trailer started to convince me it was a live-action version of Alita, they would show her face and I'd think it was a 3d animated movie, like the Angelina Jolie version of Beowulf. This movie doesn't know what it wants to be. Is it a live-action version of an anime? Or is it a 3d rendered version of an anime? It wants to be both, and it can't be, because the walking tour of the Uncanny Valley they insist on turning the lead actress into won't let it be. Also because trying to be both a live action film and a 3d anime is insane and no-one should do it.

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We'll find out soon enough eh.

I mean, whether they pull it off in practice is one thing, but I genuinely don't see what the problem is about using a CGI character clearly built deliberately to push into uncanny valley territory to represent what is, to all external appearances, a robot.

If they decided to randomly give Giant Anime Eyes to some random human being in an otherwise live action movie, sure, that would be puzzling, but she's a cybernetic borderline-android, I don't see choosing a particular visual style in order to reinforce her inhumanity in the mind of the viewer as inherently "insane" or wrong.

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Decrepit Dakkanaut






SoCal, USA!

Gally is mostly a brain in a box, but her head is supposed to be human. The body Ido initially gifts her is supposed to be "beautiful", so an inhuman / uncanny valley face is wrong from that standpoint, too. She should be more inhumanly perfectly, flawlessly beautiful than any human can be.

   
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Decrepit Dakkanaut




UK

The trailer doesn't make it clear, but I'm getting the feeling that we might not see her changing bodies during the film. It's quite a lot to squish everything into a single film (although I forget if the anime film/OVA was longer than a typical western film so it might be possible) so I could see them cutting that and having her just go straight into the battle-ready body.

And yes she is pretty much a brain in a box, much like the Major in Ghost in the Shell, so every part is cybernetic, just that her face is modelled very well after a humans.

Spoiler:

In the manga she destroys her first gifted "beautiful/doll"
body and instead gets a second battle based body which is supposed to be a very old, yet advanced military design.
Thus she shows a very human exterior and a high level of finish and human features compared to the more insane/wild/creative cybernetic bodies of the place she resides in. Which makes sense as most of the cybernetic bodies in the junker town are that, basically junk/kobbled together/enhanced etc... ergo not as clean/pure/pristine/developed as those who dwell in the city above.

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If we don't get the Berzerker body, I will be very, very disappointed, as it's an integral part of Ido accepting Gally for who she really is vs. who he wants her to be (a doll).

Spoiler:
Also, she doesn't destroy the body because it's beautify - her first body gets destroyed because she uses it in combat, but wasn't suited to fighting.

The Berzerker body is a hyper-advanced design that converts a person into a living weapon of immense power (and danger!). Ido only gifts it to her because he understands that she can properly use it, and will use it properly.


I also want to see Ido use the rocket hammer!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also, getting back to the eyes:


Even in the manga, her eyes don't look that big...

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/12/13 18:49:14


   
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UK

Spoiler:
Ah yes you're right she does destroy it in battle Vs destroying it herself (I did kinda skip over that detail in my quick summary post).
We'll certainly get the body, but I just wonder if they'll not change how it happens; if just to help her achieve a single appearance through the whole film instead of changing her appearance part way through. That said if I recall right they might just be able to do it with the hands (which the manga mostly achieves through those as well as they change between the two bodies).

I do agree its a very important part of the story; heck that part in itself could be made far longer in a visual medium than the manga gives that segment of the story.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/12/13 19:05:03


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Considering that her current head/face is CGI, it wouldn't be hard to make more of her CGI.

Did you see Ex Machina? Gally's body is easier CG work than that.

   
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 JohnHwangDD wrote:
If we don't get the Berzerker body, I will be very, very disappointed, as it's an integral part of Ido accepting Gally for who she really is vs. who he wants her to be (a doll).

Spoiler:
Also, she doesn't destroy the body because it's beautify - her first body gets destroyed because she uses it in combat, but wasn't suited to fighting.

The Berzerker body is a hyper-advanced design that converts a person into a living weapon of immense power (and danger!). Ido only gifts it to her because he understands that she can properly use it, and will use it properly.


I also want to see Ido use the rocket hammer!

Spoiler:

Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also, getting back to the eyes:


Even in the manga, her eyes don't look that big...


It depends on the image and angle.

It's interesting to compare this with the Tintin film from a few years ago, which was heavily CG modified to give it the look of the comics.

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 Yodhrin wrote:
I mean, whether they pull it off in practice is one thing, but I genuinely don't see what the problem is about using a CGI character clearly built deliberately to push into uncanny valley territory to represent what is, to all external appearances, a robot..


I think the thing that jars for me is that none of the other cyborg characters (in the trailer) appear to have freaky faces--and there's a lot of them in the manga, it's a setting where cybernetics are commonplace, and it's not especially remarkable for someone to decide they want insect eyes, a titanic centaur body, or a transparent shell in place of their skull.

But maybe the look will grow on me. Fingers crossed for this movie, I loved the manga, and the film's been in development hell for a LONG time.

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 Kilkrazy wrote:


It's interesting to compare this with the Tintin film from a few years ago, which was heavily CG modified to give it the look of the comics.
I wanted to bring Tintin up, as it is an excellent movie that works visually, except for Tintin's face, which is the only one that looks realistic whereas all the other faces are more "comical" in presentation.



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Buggery is in the eyes of the beholder, perhaps.

IMO Tintin is a cartoony too, very true to the original, but the Tintin cartoons are perhaps more realistic than the Alita.

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Surely the filmmakers are hacking the uncanny valley. That is, the point is to have a protagonist that is physically repulsive in a highly oblique manner.

   
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SoCal, USA!

 Kilkrazy wrote:
It's interesting to compare this with the Tintin film from a few years ago, which was heavily CG modified to give it the look of the comics.


If we're talking heavy CG-modified to look like comics, maybe we should be talking about Valerian? Or not?

   
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Powerful Phoenix Lord





Dallas area, TX

Anyone know where I can find the original Anime for this?

It looks really interesting. I actually don't have an issue with the eyes. since she isn't supposed to be a real human.

It's not like Tarkin in R1 or Rachel in BR2049 in which I knew what those characters originally looked like, so my brain couldn't cross the uncanny valley. Even though both of those effects were done rather well.
I think this is what made Avatar look so real to me. I've never seen REAL giant blue cat people, so it was easy to believe they were real. Just like it is easy for me to not only believe Alita is real, but also kinda attractive (although this might also have something to do with her physical similarities to my wife, large eyes aside)

-

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2018/01/25 16:55:42


   
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Oxfordshire

The original is on YouTube, it was originally released as rusty angel. This is the first adult cartoon I remember watching, so I'm looking forward to the film with excitement and fear.
   
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Dallas area, TX

 Henry wrote:
The original is on YouTube, it was originally released as rusty angel. This is the first adult cartoon I remember watching, so I'm looking forward to the film with excitement and fear.

Thanx, I caught it last night. It was interesting. Nothing really special, but certainly a lot to work with.

-

   
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New trailer out:





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Did they tone down the eyes since the last trailer, or are the shots in this one not emphasizing them as much?
   
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UK

GoatboyBeta wrote:
Did they tone down the eyes since the last trailer, or are the shots in this one not emphasizing them as much?


I think the eyes stand out more when the scene is slower and thus you've more time to look at all the details. Especially if its a talking/walking scene so the face is quite prominent in the screen. Once you get into faster action sequences and running etc... then there's a lot more information to take in all at once so you don't tend to always notice specific details until you go looking for them. Plus you're likely viewing it at normal youtube embed sizes so the image on the screen isn't huge either (well unless you've got a monster screen).

From the trailer it suggests that they've taken some liberties with the story; or possibly squashed down several parts into one film (it looks like they might have just cut out the whole part where she goes into the races if they've gone beyond the first stage of the story and compressed latter elements in.)

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/07/23 22:08:39


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It's sad that Ido lost his forehead tattoo.

   
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Skaorn wrote:
This trailer makes me worried that Hugo's crimes will be down played or non-existent and that he'll survive cuz love.


Yeah the original anime focused pretty much on that story arc and actually made for a very good self contained series. I feel if the movie downplays that story or even avoids it then either they are focusing and beefing up the early segment or they are constructing their own story.

Then again it might be a rare case where the trailer is managing not to spoil the entire plot!

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Dallas area, TX

 Overread wrote:
GoatboyBeta wrote:
Did they tone down the eyes since the last trailer, or are the shots in this one not emphasizing them as much?


I think the eyes stand out more when the scene is slower and thus you've more time to look at all the details. Especially if its a talking/walking scene so the face is quite prominent in the screen. Once you get into faster action sequences and running etc... then there's a lot more information to take in all at once so you don't tend to always notice specific details until you go looking for them. Plus you're likely viewing it at normal youtube embed sizes so the image on the screen isn't huge either (well unless you've got a monster screen).

Alternatively, it could be that seeing the first trailer MONTHS ago has given your brain time to process the uncanny valley and therefore watching this trailer, the eyes seem more normal

-

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/07/24 19:21:29


   
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Fort Worth, TX

Honestly, still not bothered by the eyes. I barely even notice that they're "unnatural". Probably because I've watched too much sci-fi/fantasy and played too many video games over the years to be phased by such things. They're practically normal to me, now.

On the other hand, if I saw something like that in real life, I would probably freak out a bit.

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The eyes are still a bit oversize, but not as grotesquely as I recall in the first trailer.

   
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 Overread wrote:
Skaorn wrote:
This trailer makes me worried that Hugo's crimes will be down played or non-existent and that he'll survive cuz love.


Yeah the original anime focused pretty much on that story arc and actually made for a very good self contained series. I feel if the movie downplays that story or even avoids it then either they are focusing and beefing up the early segment or they are constructing their own story.

Then again it might be a rare case where the trailer is managing not to spoil the entire plot!


One of the things that worries me though is them keeping the fact Ido sticks her in a normal cyborg body to start but puts her back into the berserker body when she decides to be a hunter warrior. The anime cut that out just like they cut out that her first major foe had the maggot body that allowed him to take over that battle cyborgs body, created by Desty Nova, because it didn't need it. I'm not sure if those things would truely be necessary even if they are planning on several movies either. So I guess I'm worried about what gets kept, what gets cut, and how much they drag in from later arcs. Setting up Zapan for later a major antagonist in another movie isn't a bad plan. I know they want to bring in motorball, which is good, as long as it is in the background for now (I'm worried from the previews that Zapan and others will be Vector's goons and not hunter warriors). I'm also worried that Kiyomae(?) is in it apparently as her teen reporter self instead of as a child, but I understand why they might want to avoid time jumps. I think that it might not be as horrible as I fear but I'm going to go into it expecting a horrible mashup of several volumes of the manga where you get things like Desty Nova actually showing up in the movie and it turns out he is just some cyborg doc working under Mr. Vector and that's it.
   
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New Trailer #3!




Lots more Motorball, which suggests that Ido is being demoted to a bit part, rather than emphasized as her "father"

   
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I'm not sure if I'm drifting back to the opinion that the Anime Eyes look weird, however the rest of the action obviously is going to be fantastic.

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They are really hammering a lot of content into this film! I can't believe the racers got into the mix.

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