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While we are gushing about BTAS-related stuff, let me just put a word in for Shirley Walker's soundtrack. Her work on the series is wondeful in general but her leit motifs for various characters are truly amazing. Some favorite examples:

Batgirl

Joker

Penguin

Mask of the Phantasm and Return of the Joker are the 2 best dc animated movies.

 Manchu wrote:
While we are gushing about BTAS-related stuff, let me just put a word in for Shirley Walker's soundtrack. Her work on the series is wondeful in general but her leit motifs for various characters are truly amazing. Some favorite examples:

Batgirl

Joker

Penguin

I've got a medley of music from 'Mask of the Phantasm' as part of my collection of soundtracks for gaming. - This is the track. https://open.spotify.com/track/2BDV4wbndUD58n9ZNbzpjd

The chanting is apparantly the choirs names sung backwards, but it's still SOOOO effective. More Batman music needs chanting. And, of course, it still has the Danny Elfman elements too.

https://www.bleedingcool.com/2018/01/17/777155/


new trailer.

 reds8n wrote:
https://www.bleedingcool.com/2018/01/17/777155/


new trailer.

R-Rated? Good indication it's going to be good then. Lets hope it's as good or better than Assault on Arkham!

Anyone watch Batman: Gotham by Gaslight? Victorian style Batman vs Jack the Ripper? Digital release yesterday, I’m waiting for a hard copy.

Awaiting the hard copy.

Unless I can rent it off Amamamamamazon?

Apparently it's bad and wrong and bad 2.5 out of 5 because they only went out of their way to add a single female character with agency(up from the zero who were in the comic) to the story about Batman in Victorian London.

I'm starting to think maybe the Den of Geek review writers and I are looking for different things in our fiction. In that I'm looking for, you know, good fiction, and they seem to want an audio-visual checklist.

I'm very much looking forward to GbG, the art style looks fantastic and Bruce Greenwood is pretty much the Next Best Bat after Conroy. I'm awaiting a blu-ray copy though, so shall be avoiding reviews in the mean time. But to be honest, none of these are exactly 100% faithful recreations of comic book material, so telling good stories, looking slick and having quality voice work is always more important than whether this character did this thing or that panel was reproduced ect.

So long as it's not a travesty of an adaptation like the first crack at Death of Superman, it should be fine...

Yodhrin wrote:Apparently it's bad and wrong and bad 2.5 out of 5 because they only went out of their way to add a single female character with agency(up from the zero who were in the comic) to the story about Batman in Victorian London.

I'm starting to think maybe the Den of Geek review writers and I are looking for different things in our fiction. In that I'm looking for, you know, good fiction, and they seem to want an audio-visual checklist.

It's all about the pandering nowadays. That, and if you make yourself out to be a male feminist, it seems to help land chicks

 Yodhrin wrote:
Apparently it's bad and wrong and bad 2.5 out of 5 because they only went out of their way to add a single female character with agency(up from the zero who were in the comic) to the story about Batman in Victorian London.

I'm starting to think maybe the Den of Geek review writers and I are looking for different things in our fiction. In that I'm looking for, you know, good fiction, and they seem to want an audio-visual checklist.

Crowbaring in purse puppies for the sake of "diversity" automatically makes any type of media instantly and irredeemably bad.

It annoys me we can't criticize anything, lest we be tarred as bigots.

Just to make something clear - I have no issues with adding as much diversity as any given story will bear, I just think that they did that with GbG given its setting and that the DoG reviewer was being monumentally petty by giving it 2.5/5 based entirely - so far as the text of their review would suggest - on the fact they don't think it went far enough.

It's not that surprising Yod. Once read an AV Club review for an episode of Agent Carter that straight up said the episode was better than the rest because two black women wrote it. That was the single qualifier used to determine the episode's quality.

Anyway, as I had a big voucher, I just got Dark Knight Returns 1 & 2 plus The Flashpoint Paradox on DVD (no Blu-Ray available, as it happens). I'm quite happy with that. Those movies are great.

Can we possibly stick to the main topic chaps?




Automatically Appended Next Post:
For instance, just nipped on Amamamamaamazon to see about ordering BTAS on DVD.

Only to find out it's included with my Prime sub.....

As is the Young Justice, Justice League and Justice League Unlimited shows. And, I think, Superman the Animated Series.

Several DC Animated films are on there as well, though it is somewhat random which ones are and aren't.

In the UK at least there's:

Superman/Batman Public Enemies
Wonder Woman
Justice League: The New Frontier
Superman Doomsday
Green Lantern First Flight
Gotham Knight (Anime compilation)

Plus the older animated films, Mask of the Phantasm, Return of the Joker, Sub-Zero, Mystery of the Batwomen.

Got tomorrow off, guess I’m bingeing that list!

There are others, but they are the more specifically kids focused ones (Batman: The Brave and the Bold, Batman VS Dracula, Batman Monsters Unleashed, Batman Animal Instincts etc).

That's not to say they'll be bad (I've not watched them), but they're not typically what people talk about when they discuss the DC Animated Films.

And, of course, there's the Lego Batman straight-to-DVD films...

 reds8n wrote:
https://www.bleedingcool.com/2018/01/17/777155/


new trailer.

What's with the thin Amanda Waller? She came across as much cooler when she was larger.

I think it's a "New 52" thing.

Originally I blamed Arrow for it, being a CW show and all that, it sorta seemed to be not an unexpected choice they'd make. But I think she has turned up thinner in other comics before then.

Superman vs The Elite is the best portrayal of Superman I have seen on screen.

That is my favorite DC Animated Film. Take that Batman!

I also liked the Young Justice TV show alot.

I'm currently trialing "Superman VS The Elite", followed by "All-star Superman" as my "so you think Superman is boring, out of date and sucks" counterargument.

The thin Amanda Waller is from new 52 comics. When dc went full slow on the sexism.

 Compel wrote:
As is the Young Justice, Justice League and Justice League Unlimited shows. And, I think, Superman the Animated Series.

Several DC Animated films are on there as well, though it is somewhat random which ones are and aren't.

In the UK at least there's:

Superman/Batman Public Enemies
Wonder Woman
Justice League: The New Frontier
Superman Doomsday
Green Lantern First Flight
Gotham Knight (Anime compilation)

Plus the older animated films, Mask of the Phantasm, Return of the Joker, Sub-Zero, Mystery of the Batwomen.

All of which I have on DVD, interestingly enough! Lol. Had a friend who worked at a DVD store and saved all of them for me when they came in used at a killer price (10 bucks a season for the BtAS and JL stuff). I think the ONLY DC animated I don't have a hard copy of at the moment is the Adam West Batman vs. Two Face that recently released.

 Compel wrote:
I'm currently trialing "Superman VS The Elite", followed by "All-star Superman" as my "so you think Superman is boring, out of date and sucks" counterargument.

Superman VS The Elite came off more like Superman VS The Strawmen, in my opinion. It made both sides look bad, but The Elite looked bad because they were created to job for Superman, while Superman looked bad because

 AlexHolker wrote:

 Compel wrote:
I'm currently trialing "Superman VS The Elite", followed by "All-star Superman" as my "so you think Superman is boring, out of date and sucks" counterargument.

Superman VS The Elite came off more like Superman VS The Strawmen, in my opinion. It made both sides look bad, but The Elite looked bad because they were created to job for Superman, while Superman looked bad because

Spoiler:

containing a mass murderer like Atomic Skull instead of killing them is only the more ethical solution if you are actually going to contain them.

The Joker problem is a consequence of long-running serialised fiction wanting to reuse their best villains, and not wanting to tone them down to the point where that would be tolerable in-universe. It's better not to draw attention to it.

I'm going to disagree, but not necessarily because I agree with the message of the movie (or the comic its based on).

Super Man vs The Elite was about juxtaposing idealistic super heroes like Superman against the anti-hero characters of the Dark Age, represented by The Elite. There is a valid point in the story; someone as powerful as Super Man going around and killing anyone he deems worthy of dying to protect the peace and justice of the world, is really twisted, messed up, and downright terrifying. An idealistic hero like Super Man is valuable and encouraging because he doesn't use his powers to do just what he wants but rather tries to reinforce the best aspects of human civilization.

The point of the original comic was to present Superman as still being relevant in a period when comics were getting darker and the heroes and villains along with them. It's failure is that it is ultimately an analysis of comics themselves, which are inherently silly when trying to propose solutions to real world problems. Walking mass murderer atomic weapons that answer to no one don't exist in the real world, nor do flying men immune to bullets and missiles. As a metaphor for the terrifying abuse of power that is "who watches the watchers" Superman vs The Elite works, but trying to take that message and apply it anywhere other than comics is going to give us nothing (for the reasons you give) but Superman vs the Elite wasn't commenting on the real world as much as it was commenting on the changing tone of comic books.

 LordofHats wrote:

 AlexHolker wrote:

 Compel wrote:
I'm currently trialing "Superman VS The Elite", followed by "All-star Superman" as my "so you think Superman is boring, out of date and sucks" counterargument.

Superman VS The Elite came off more like Superman VS The Strawmen, in my opinion. It made both sides look bad, but The Elite looked bad because they were created to job for Superman, while Superman looked bad because

Spoiler:

containing a mass murderer like Atomic Skull instead of killing them is only the more ethical solution if you are actually going to contain them.

The Joker problem is a consequence of long-running serialised fiction wanting to reuse their best villains, and not wanting to tone them down to the point where that would be tolerable in-universe. It's better not to draw attention to it.

I'm going to disagree, but not necessarily because I agree with the message of the movie (or the comic its based on).

Super Man vs The Elite was about juxtaposing idealistic super heroes like Superman against the anti-hero characters of the Dark Age, represented by The Elite. There is a valid point in the story; someone as powerful as Super Man going around and killing anyone he deems worthy of dying to protect the peace and justice of the world, is really twisted, messed up, and downright terrifying. An idealistic hero like Super Man is valuable and encouraging because he doesn't use his powers to do just what he wants but rather tries to reinforce the best aspects of human civilization.

The point of the original comic was to present Superman as still being relevant in a period when comics were getting darker and the heroes and villains along with them. It's failure is that it is ultimately an analysis of comics themselves, which are inherently silly when trying to propose solutions to real world problems. Walking mass murderer atomic weapons that answer to no one don't exist in the real world, nor do flying men immune to bullets and missiles. As a metaphor for the terrifying abuse of power that is "who watches the watchers" Superman vs The Elite works, but trying to take that message and apply it anywhere other than comics is going to give us nothing (for the reasons you give) but Superman vs the Elite wasn't commenting on the real world as much as it was commenting on the changing tone of comic books.

Both the movie and the comic are worse versions of Kingdom Come. Which has the same general themes with a much better plot, way WAY (like unbelievably) better art, and a much better look at the consequences of these individuals running rampant vs the restraint people like Superman show and what it means.

 AlexHolker wrote:

 Compel wrote:
I'm currently trialing "Superman VS The Elite", followed by "All-star Superman" as my "so you think Superman is boring, out of date and sucks" counterargument.

Superman VS The Elite came off more like Superman VS The Strawmen, in my opinion. It made both sides look bad, but The Elite looked bad because they were created to job for Superman, while Superman looked bad because

Spoiler:

containing a mass murderer like Atomic Skull instead of killing them is only the more ethical solution if you are actually going to contain them.

The Joker problem is a consequence of long-running serialised fiction wanting to reuse their best villains, and not wanting to tone them down to the point where that would be tolerable in-universe. It's better not to draw attention to it.

It also said some not very nice things about fandom, which is always funny in a comic book movie.

Things that kind of need to be said. And still need to be said.

Really? I always find it weird when fans appreciate being slagged off by the products they pay for. I mean, nobody should expect these shows and the people who make them to lick your feet or anything, but the snotty, petulant, beret-wearing artiste sentiment that often underlies "commentary on fandom" from creatives isn't appealing IMO.

 Yodhrin wrote:
Really? I always find it weird when fans appreciate being slagged off by the products they pay for. I mean, nobody should expect these shows and the people who make them to lick your feet or anything, but the snotty, petulant, beret-wearing artiste sentiment that often underlies "commentary on fandom" from creatives isn't appealing IMO.

Roughly 2 weeks age, Kate Welch was announced as a new member to the Dungeons & Dragons team. She was pretty much immediately harassed by various vocal aspects of the D&D fandom for being unsuitable and unqualified. Something no male team members seems to have suffered.

Sometimes fandom deserves a kick in the butt.