Lion of Caliban wrote:

Spetulhu wrote: But there's absolutely no way the Comissar can be the only authority on punishments and keeping order. Having unit leaders handle matters according to some scale of severity lets the higher ups concentrate on more important stuff and shows the men who their closest boss is. A sergeant, Lt, Cpt etc who can only wail "I'll call the Comissar" if a trooper disobeys is no leader. He has no authority at all, the regiment won't function on the field or off it - and there's not enough Comissars to BLAM everyone before getting gunned down. A Comissar who demands to oversee every little detail is actually lowering morale in the regiment - by undermining the men who should lead - and is required to BLAM himself immediately.

I absolutely agree, and what an NCO or Officer deems too minor to bother the Commissar will again vary. And if they are a good Commissar they certainly won't oversee every minor detail of their men's lives, no one has that kind of time. But the point I was making is that as the morale officer and the closest thing to an MP permanently attached to a regiment they will oversee most of the actual criminal infractions. And a lot of other infractions can and often are referred to them for judgement.

Lion of Caliban wrote: 4. Absolutely, COs and NCOs will often engage in self policing in affairs where they are too minor to bother the Commissar, or they don't feel it warrants such a response. You don't always have to play the highest card possible. If you can punish and correct the soldier without involving the Commissar then there can be advantages to that.

I'm not saying that NCOs and Officers don't have the power or will to enforce the rules, quite the opposite. Just that the most official power to police the regiment will usually be in the hands of a Commissar.

 jhe90 wrote:

 Lion of Caliban wrote:

Spetulhu wrote: But there's absolutely no way the Comissar can be the only authority on punishments and keeping order. Having unit leaders handle matters according to some scale of severity lets the higher ups concentrate on more important stuff and shows the men who their closest boss is. A sergeant, Lt, Cpt etc who can only wail "I'll call the Comissar" if a trooper disobeys is no leader. He has no authority at all, the regiment won't function on the field or off it - and there's not enough Comissars to BLAM everyone before getting gunned down. A Comissar who demands to oversee every little detail is actually lowering morale in the regiment - by undermining the men who should lead - and is required to BLAM himself immediately.

I absolutely agree, and what an NCO or Officer deems too minor to bother the Commissar will again vary. And if they are a good Commissar they certainly won't oversee every minor detail of their men's lives, no one has that kind of time. But the point I was making is that as the morale officer and the closest thing to an MP permanently attached to a regiment they will oversee most of the actual criminal infractions. And a lot of other infractions can and often are referred to them for judgement.

Lion of Caliban wrote: 4. Absolutely, COs and NCOs will often engage in self policing in affairs where they are too minor to bother the Commissar, or they don't feel it warrants such a response. You don't always have to play the highest card possible. If you can punish and correct the soldier without involving the Commissar then there can be advantages to that.

I'm not saying that NCOs and Officers don't have the power or will to enforce the rules, quite the opposite. Just that the most official power to police the regiment will usually be in the hands of a Commissar.

Yeah but NCO and others could enforce basic punishments. In storm of Iron someone caught asleep during a drill was sent out to a punishment duty for a while. It seems it was handles by thr officer and so.

It carries on regiment, how and who deals with punishments.

 Lion of Caliban wrote:

 jhe90 wrote:

 Lion of Caliban wrote:

Spetulhu wrote: But there's absolutely no way the Comissar can be the only authority on punishments and keeping order. Having unit leaders handle matters according to some scale of severity lets the higher ups concentrate on more important stuff and shows the men who their closest boss is. A sergeant, Lt, Cpt etc who can only wail "I'll call the Comissar" if a trooper disobeys is no leader. He has no authority at all, the regiment won't function on the field or off it - and there's not enough Comissars to BLAM everyone before getting gunned down. A Comissar who demands to oversee every little detail is actually lowering morale in the regiment - by undermining the men who should lead - and is required to BLAM himself immediately.

I absolutely agree, and what an NCO or Officer deems too minor to bother the Commissar will again vary. And if they are a good Commissar they certainly won't oversee every minor detail of their men's lives, no one has that kind of time. But the point I was making is that as the morale officer and the closest thing to an MP permanently attached to a regiment they will oversee most of the actual criminal infractions. And a lot of other infractions can and often are referred to them for judgement.

Lion of Caliban wrote: 4. Absolutely, COs and NCOs will often engage in self policing in affairs where they are too minor to bother the Commissar, or they don't feel it warrants such a response. You don't always have to play the highest card possible. If you can punish and correct the soldier without involving the Commissar then there can be advantages to that.

I'm not saying that NCOs and Officers don't have the power or will to enforce the rules, quite the opposite. Just that the most official power to police the regiment will usually be in the hands of a Commissar.

Yeah but NCO and others could enforce basic punishments. In storm of Iron someone caught asleep during a drill was sent out to a punishment duty for a while. It seems it was handles by thr officer and so.

It carries on regiment, how and who deals with punishments.

I'm confused, it seems like we're in agreement.

 Lion of Caliban wrote:
I'm confused, it seems like we're in agreement.

 evil_kiwi_60 wrote:
So even in the year 40000 there’s still MPs? Figures those killjoys would survive. They feed on misery.

TangoTwoBravo wrote:

 evil_kiwi_60 wrote:
So even in the year 40000 there’s still MPs? Figures those killjoys would survive. They feed on misery.

Someone has to give speeding tickets at the Commissary parking lot.

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:

TangoTwoBravo wrote:

 evil_kiwi_60 wrote:
So even in the year 40000 there’s still MPs? Figures those killjoys would survive. They feed on misery.

Someone has to give speeding tickets at the Commissary parking lot.

I know this is shocking but 40k isn't really a hard-edged vision of our distant future. It's a mash up of cool tropes and one of them definitely is Sgt Cooldude getting busted for having his collar unbuttoned at parade, just before he saves everyone from an attack by killing 100 enemy goons with his entrenching tool.

nareik wrote:

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:

TangoTwoBravo wrote:

 evil_kiwi_60 wrote:
So even in the year 40000 there’s still MPs? Figures those killjoys would survive. They feed on misery.

Someone has to give speeding tickets at the Commissary parking lot.

I know this is shocking but 40k isn't really a hard-edged vision of our distant future. It's a mash up of cool tropes and one of them definitely is Sgt Cooldude getting busted for having his collar unbuttoned at parade, just before he saves everyone from an attack by killing 100 enemy goons with his entrenching tool.

Shush, you! It's a lucid vision sent as a warning of a future we will never be able to avert!