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Yeah, it seems that for Warriors you don't need to specialise at the moment though. Boneswords and Deathspitter is just straight up the best loadout for everything, with not much points over the minimum loadout.

I did remember there is one thing so far where I've intentionally gone against WYSIWYG and that's the Genestealer extended carapace. I put the carapaces on, even though I probably won't use them. Just think they look much cooler!

Stux wrote:
Yeah, it seems that for Warriors you don't need to specialise at the moment though. Boneswords and Deathspitter is just straight up the best loadout for everything, with not much points over the minimum loadout.

I did remember there is one thing so far where I've intentionally gone against WYSIWYG and that's the Genestealer extended carapace. I put the carapaces on, even though I probably won't use them. Just think they look much cooler!

Extra carapace and toxin sacs are two great example of "upgrades" that just look plain better on the models all the time and most players won't even notice that they are upgrades. Even most Tyranid players won't even really "spot" it. It's like grenades on guardsmen - it looks cool and most of the time you don't pay any attention to it all tactically and if it were important you'd likely as not not notice.

I think it's important to note there are different standards of WYSIWYG, proxy, and count as, and reasonable reactions to each based on the setting.

In casual games and practice games with friends, the entire point if the game can sometimes be to try it a new unit by proxying something, and if you and your opponent agree on what's what, you're good to go.

For pick up games, I'd say 90% of your models should not be proxied, and it's probably okay to do count as things like all of your melta guns are plasma guns, as long as you are consistant throughout the army and it's not difficult for your opponent to know what's going on. I think it's also important to realize that by doing proxy and count as weapons, you are making things sightly more complicated for your opponent, so you should be thankful and nice about it, especially if this is someone you don't know very well. The key thing about pick up games is that if your army is too crazy and complicated with proxies and whatnot the opponent can decide not to play with you, which is the regulating faction here.

For organized events, deciding to not play someone means you lose, so it's on the event organizers to ensure that everyone has a legal and easy to understand army. Here the only exception to basic WYSIWYG (that is, all models look like the unit they represent, all visible weapons were paid for, and all upgrades are modeled clearly) is custom conversions or count as units that have been cleared by the TO. The rule of cool, ease of understanding what is what, and modeling for advantage are all important here. These events should be about fair competition, and the models bring easy to understand is an important part of that.

After all of that, come the WYSIWYG standards you have for your own models. This is when you should be a WYSIWYG Nazi, and the only time you should look down on anyone for being lazy enough to leave off things like grenades and pistols etc. These things don't really make your models easy to understand, but they do make them more beautiful, so you should probably do them, while simultaneously ignoring the fact others might not.

Only think I generally proxy are the weapons on my Killa Kanz and just say "all Killa kan weapons are grotzookas" which nobody seems to mind. For my opponent I am fine with any "counts as" as long as it isn't extremely complicated to remember and the opponent doesn't try to use the unclear nature of the counts as to be sneaky about which model is which. In games with friends I'm cool with even letting empty area count as stuff if they want to test out a new model or try something they don't own yet.

For me, everything as depicted with a few exceptions.
Seraphim melta pistols, grenades, combi-weapons.

The seraphim are hard to convert, and flamer pistols are useless anyway.

Grenades, even if the kit includes them, there isn't always room to put them on.

Combi-weapons: every model with a combi-weapon will have one. My list will specify if it's a combi-plasma, melta, ect.

Everything is WYSIWYG, with a few notable exceptions - my Howling Banshees are old and have laspistols. They got rid of Eldar lasguns/laspistols in 3rd editions. I'm not going to chop them up and find plastic shuriken pistols for them, etc. A few other old Eldar models have wargear which no longer exists, etc.

I also do not model grenades, or vehicle wargear, etc. For me it's really mainly a simple matter of respect for my opponent.

my stuff overall is 75% wysiwyg, but I do have a couple of units that are 100%. I magnetized my vehicles and have all the alternate weapons ready to go.

my next goal is from here forward to make all of my models as magnetized as possible. more so I like a challenge than for playing.

My Necrons don't have many options, so, barring specific relics, or lack of them on Lords and the like, I'm pretty good.

For casual play I'm usually good with whatever, as I myself sometimes proxy if I want to try out a new unit/option. For tournaments, WYSIWYG all the way, with limited exceptions for models that are hard to model with the appropriate gear (like metal models), or things like Daemon Princes, which until the current edition didn't matter which kind of weapon they had as they always had the same stats (so it was Rule of Cool for modelling them).

I usually do my best to have the models to have the correct weapons. Some factions are a bit harder to get right than others, the biggest for me is inquisition since almost everything needs to be custom at this point. The other being I proxy my small SOB army because I'm not spending a fortune just to try a HF one week and a MM another.

Almost completely WYSIWYG, I won't proxy unless I'm trying out a unit and even then that's only in games with my brother while playtesting. I try not to every proxy at a store, and most assuredly not at a tournament.

For tournaments? 100%, for local games? as little as possible, but if trying out a new setup, new player, or just wanting to have fun, having a couple weapons swapped out isnt to bad honestly.

 Overread wrote:

Stux wrote:

 Overread wrote:
eg many marine models have seals and scrolls on them without having seal or scroll upgrades

This might be an edition thing? Because I'm pretty sure seals are purely decorative these days anyway.

Primary weapons don't move around much to be honest - BARRING - Tyranids which have quite considerable shifts at times in not only what is viable but what is legal to take (which is why if you talk to many Tyranid players they are big advocates of magnets in sockets of Warriors and anything larger).

This. A million times this. You're better off going with obscure third party weapons and playing counts-as, because at least that way your models aren't unplayable edition to edition.

The problem is a lot of decorative upgrades in previous editions now have a purpose in 8th. So the strict WYSIWYG crowd would require the appropriate carapace morph on a Carnifex, or that Adrenal Glands be glued onto the chest of a Tyrant.

Magnetizing Tyranids is the way to go, but i only magnetized the guns, I didn't anticipate needing to swap heads. So my heads are counts-as.

I never, ever, use wargear that isn't modelled, but modelled wargear might not be used.

I built my Daemonettes with an Icon, but I rarely actually pay for it.

WYSIWYG as much as possible for me, but im not going to be spending an extra 20$ in bits just to make that Heavy/special weapon squad be full of the same weapon unless I already have them handy.

IMO, as long as you show your foe your list and what models are what, WYSIWYG is trumped by what is on the army list.

Like having tau with carbines count as tau with rifles, just you can make the sqaud look cooler. Or something like modeling the sarget with two pistols to look cool, but have it say on the list it's a chainsword.

Little think that make it look good on the table. Just make sure there are no coke-can-carnifex.

My brother and I were just discussing how to go about getting some Longbeards, Hammerers, and Rangers for our 6th Ed. WFB Dwarfs force. Honestly, as long as only one unit is equipped with Great Weapons, it could pinch hit as Rangers OR Longbeards as the equipment is equal. THAT would be about the only kind of exception I'd make to WYSIWYG.

 Desubot wrote:
Non on this list

i try to WYSIWYG as much as possible but im not going to sit there and rake my self or others over the coals if the conversion or the bits are too hard to do or obtain.

especially small things like nades and pistols

relics though i mean you are taking it you should make them look bitchin

This nicely sums up my position as well.

WYSIWYG is a goal, but it shouldn't get in the way of trying something new, or just playing the game.

WYSIWYG to me just means "I can tell what your dudes have".

I've seen too many "Oh he has a Melta" turn into "I meant that guy had a multi-melta, and the other guy has a plasma" during 7th edition. If I have to sit and take notes on your squads to know what you're putting down, I'm just going to put my stuff away and find someone else to play a game with.

Bits are TOO easy to get your hands on to resort to proxies to that degree. FFS, just lay that weapon bit on his base or something, at least.

If your opponent can't tell what you've got on the table by looking at it, it's annoying. At least try, that's the main thing.

 Mr Morden wrote:
Not bothered as long as its vaugely what it seems to be

Out of interest, would accept this as an Archon with a Huskblade and Soul Seeker pistol:

if its an option it gets modelled, otherwise I confuse myself

stuff thats mandatory kit I'm less fussed over

 TheFleshIsWeak wrote:

 Mr Morden wrote:
Not bothered as long as its vaugely what it seems to be

Out of interest, would accept this as an Archon with a Huskblade and Soul Seeker pistol:

Spoiler:

If you were running the rest of the models from the box as mandrakes and they looked the same, no. If he was the only one on the board, or the other mandrakes were modeled differently, then sure, go a head.

With Morden on this one. If its vaguely represents what its supposed to be alls good. Even a bit on the whacky end I'll ride by.
Long ago stopped caring about WYSIWYG due to a large collection of old metals, Nids that lack options anyways, the need to proxy from time to time and a generally chilled attitude.

I follow the tournament standards here which I find reasonable. WYSIWYG except for stuff like basic pistols models start with/grenades.

 Mmmpi wrote:

If you were running the rest of the models from the box as mandrakes and they looked the same, no. If he was the only one on the board, or the other mandrakes were modeled differently, then sure, go a head.

He'd be the only Mandrake model on the board.

Any actual Mandrakes would be using Spirit Host models.