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Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut




As I understand it, your opponent is wrong. The Tyranid FAQ deals with what happens to an Advancing unit that moves twice in the same phase. In this case, because the Advance roll is added to their Movement characteristic for the entire phase they get to use the increased movement again without having to roll. However, if they move in another phase (as happens with the Move! Move! Move! order) they would need to roll for their Advance distance again.

I would say that these types of players aren't all that common so I hope you don't let it put you off tournaments completely. I'd also say if you bring up this rules issue with your opponent and they are a TFG about it, I'd hope the FLGS owner would take action. I'd also probably bring it up prior to the next tournament so this player doesn't get an unfair advantage throughout the whole tournament.
   
Made in gb
Lord of the Fleet






London

Was discussing it with a couple of buddies last night.

The rule issue comes from the fact that MMM states "The unit moves as if it was the Movement Phase", so his interpretation is that it's the same phase and therefore you don't roll to advance again, whereas the other argument is that "as if" isn't "it is", and it's not actually the same phase.

One thing my buddies also noticed, was the language barrier. While the guy spoke very good English, it wasn't his first language, and they said he was using that to help his argument - make out you don't understand, so eventually they'll give up.

Thanks for your advice, I'll bring it up with the TO beforehand.
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut




The words "as if" are a plague upon rules clarity and should be outlawed from rules text forever, IMO. If you want a more in-depth discussion of this particular rule you could bring it up in the rules forum here. If the guy is stooping so low as to use an apparent language barrier to get his way then maybe the best thing is just to bring it up with the TO though.
   
Made in us
Blood-Drenched Death Company Marine




Little Rock, Arkansas

If you ever don’t agree or are skeptical of what your opponent claims, ask a judge.

20000+ points
Tournament reports:
1234567 
   
Made in gb
Decrepit Dakkanaut




UK

GW doesn't always seem sure about the "as if" statement either. In AoS Morathi can make a unit shoot "as if" it were the shooting phase, however the community document states that the unit shooting does not get their bonus for rending on their attacks as normal during that extra shooting phase. Interestingly it references the addendum to the core rules and there is actually no reference there to explain why.

I think its another example of one of those rules where all the official testers know what it means, so they don't even think that those outside of that bubble would need it defined. It's a weakness you can see in their writing. It's not so much sloppy as it is that their team has likely played warhammer against each other for so long that many of the "rules" are just second nature to them so they don't even think about the fact that htey need to be written down.

Rather like how when you're driving you don't need to "think" about the clutch you just "do it" to change gear. Whilst a beginner needs that instruction (and lots of practice) before it becomes second nature.

A Blog in Miniature

3D Printing, hobbying and model fun! 
   
Made in au
Ork-Hunting Inquisitorial Xenokiller





Tourney's are fun, a few rules I live by when go:

1. Before begins:

My entire army is WYSIWYG and on correct base sizes.

If I run say different chapters etc in the same army, I always make sure they are totally different colours to each other (makes it easy for me and my opponents).

I always carry super glue, blu-tac (think maybe called poster tac in your country, just incase models break), water, snacks and some spare models. Some tourneys require other things just make sure before the event.

My army list is printed in a clear format and 1 for each opponent. I also have stapled to this all the weird rules, FAQ etc and all my stratagems for my army. Moreover, I ask them if they have any questions after they have a few minutes to flick threw (for example if I am Harlies I explain my Masque form, relics etc and implications of some strats to my opponent if they don't know).

I have all relevant rule books.

2. Gaming:

You are there for competition, but to have fun, treat it as such. Don't be the dick of the tourney.

If you start thinking in an aggressive manner, it will make it crap for you and your opponent.

If you opponent does something you think is wrong (they might not know), don't be "Bloody hell that's bollocks, you can't move like that!". Be more like " Hey mate I don't think he can move like that, lets check it over in the rule book" etc... or "Maybe we can ask a judge if that's correct, just I swear it is different now days".

It's a game about moving models around on a board not about life and death.

3. Transport:

Before the tourney practise transporting your models in whatever case/s you use a few times before (either going to work or whatever).

If it's to expensive for you to go and is driving, look for car pooling, shared accommodation etc. Sometimes some people that live near an event will put you up for a night or two at their homes if they are going just ask around etc.

A few tips.

Number one is don't be a dick. You can be competitive but still be awesome

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/12/04 10:54:33


14k Generic Space Marine Chapters
20k Deathwatch
10k Sisters of Battle
3k Inquisition
4k Grey Knights
5k Imperial Guard
4k Harlequins
8k Tau



 
   
Made in fi
Locked in the Tower of Amareo





 Valkyrie wrote:
Was discussing it with a couple of buddies last night.

The rule issue comes from the fact that MMM states "The unit moves as if it was the Movement Phase", so his interpretation is that it's the same phase and therefore you don't roll to advance again, whereas the other argument is that "as if" isn't "it is", and it's not actually the same phase.

One thing my buddies also noticed, was the language barrier. While the guy spoke very good English, it wasn't his first language, and they said he was using that to help his argument - make out you don't understand, so eventually they'll give up.

Thanks for your advice, I'll bring it up with the TO beforehand.


So movement phase of turn 2 is same as movement phase of turn 1? They both are movement phase afterall! So on that logic the first time you advance that is the advance movement for that unit for REST OF THE GAME.

It is as if movement phase but nowhere does it say it's as if previous movement phase. It's NEW movement phase movement.

2024 painted/bought: 109/109 
   
Made in us
Daemonic Dreadnought





Eye of Terror

Here's a word of advice.

It's fine to be on your guard about cheating, but it's best to come to a tournament with the attitude that you are there to have fun and so is everyone else.

The problems you hear about with tournaments have always been there and so have the complaints about tournament organizers / other players. The Internet allows some loud, angry voices to magnify their complaints to the point where problems seem much larger than what they are.

Tournaments lost their appeal for me after a few incidents where it seemed people were there to complain about each other instead of enjoy the game. Don't let it get to that point.

   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka





Feasting on the souls of unworthy opponents

Hey there, and welcome to the tournament scene! I wrote a guide to tournament play a few years ago that I'd encourage to read. It's linked in my signature. It's a good starting point.





   
 
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