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Lafuente's style seems to use a lot of hard lines and segmented parts - a lot of his main work seems to be heroes with body suits, jackets, etc. I suspect in this particular issue he's leaning into it:
The original Godzilla vs. Kong movie was corny and fun, like a lot of the Showa era films.
I liked Legendary's first Godzilla film. It was an effective movie that cleverly set itself apart from it's Japanese brethern and made a distinctly modern American movie with the source material.
King of the Monsters was garbage. The human element plot of braindead and ruined the movie for me. I couldn't enjoy the increased on-screen monster action, when everything else going on was so banally dumb.
I'm really getting those same vibes from this trailer. As much as I want to enjoy some monster fighting, it's really hard when the movie is going out of its way to try and be clever and coming out stupider for it.
I liked 2014. It's too long (as are most movies these days) and wastes too much time on an actor who can't carry the film. Still, it ends in a phenomenal fight and one of the best monster kills in the franchise.
KoM is solid. It has some absolutely stunning cinematography that sadly mostly got spoiled in the trailers. The human subplot is pretty bad and weirdly gets in the way of the climax more than it did in 2014. The action is weirdly obscured in places. A bit more even than 2014, but not reaching its highest points either.
I largely expect the same here. Good, but still disappointing. Rampage somehow stands as the best modern American attempt at the genre.
I’m confused by your stance, LOH. The first Legendary Godzilla movie spent way more time with bland characters doing forgettable things. KotM had two/three bland characters in the mold of the first movie, but gave a lot more time to quirky character actors saying cheesy-fun things. It was like a hybrid of Legendary’s Godzilla and Kong Skull Island. I found Get Out, Mil-team and Techbro went a long way towards alleviating wolf doctor and bad mom.
What do you mean it was effective?
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/01/26 16:37:18
LunarSol wrote: I liked 2014. It's too long (as are most movies these days) and wastes too much time on an actor who can't carry the film. Still, it ends in a phenomenal fight and one of the best monster kills in the franchise.
KoM is solid. It has some absolutely stunning cinematography that sadly mostly got spoiled in the trailers. The human subplot is pretty bad and weirdly gets in the way of the climax more than it did in 2014. The action is weirdly obscured in places. A bit more even than 2014, but not reaching its highest points either.
I largely expect the same here. Good, but still disappointing. Rampage somehow stands as the best modern American attempt at the genre.
I forgot about Rampage, that's such an entertaining movie. I really enjoyed it! I agree with this stance!
BobtheInquisitor wrote: I’m confused by your stance, LOH. The first Legendary Godzilla movie spent way more time with bland characters doing forgettable things.
Bland yes, but not banally dumb. The human plot in the first movie maybe wasn't exciting but it was effective in providing an audience surrogate. That was all it really needed to do. They totally bait and switched the audience with Cranston, but oh well. There was a coherent "I just want to go home" story to the plot.
KotM had two/three bland characters in the mold of the first movie, but gave a lot more time to quirky character actors saying cheesy-fun things.
KotM had the most dysfunctionally stupid family plot I've seen in a movie in a long time. The mom decides to unleash monsters and almost immediately decides oh gee maybe I shouldn't have done that. The dad is constantly given scenes in the film to show how smart he is, but mostly they just make everyone around him seem stupid. The daughter is... Do I really need to point out how the ending of the movie is utterly nonsensical? Past the one hour mark, no one really seems to have any idea what the human side of the plot is supposed to be about and it just ends up being about stupid people being stupid.
The first movie might not have been super exciting, but it worked well enough and wasn't driven by a constant string of dumb people who shouldn't be dumb doing dumb things they should ostensibly be smart enough to know are dumb. I bought into Brody's story. I couldn't by into any of the character's in KotM. They were all too stupid to be believable.
What do you mean it was effective?
Because it didn't murder the movie in the back.
I get people who thought the 2014 plot was dragged by too little monsters. I don't agree with it but I get it. I also get people who liked KotM's action scenes and just forget the stupid plot that was going on around them. I'm not really interested in forgiving one half of a movie for being god awful though. Skull Island was probably the one film in the series to actually get the human plot to work, but the trailer makes me think of KotM more than Skull Island; stupid people doing stupid things but hey it gets the plot moving don't look at the stupid things. I can't really not see the stupid things and I feel insulted that I'm expected to just because it's a monster movie.
Lots of Godzilla movies have stupid plots, but lots of them were campy and corny and didn't expect the audience to take them seriously. Legendary needs to pick a lane on that front because I think they keep trying to have it both ways.
Rampage was great fun - it also knew what it wanted to be and how to do it - quality.
Godzilla seemed to want to punish you for wanting to watch a monster movie but instead wanted to you to spend way too much some of the worst human idiots.
Skull Island again at least was prepared to be a monster movie.
Did not watch King of Monsters due to how much I disliked the first movie
I AM A MARINE PLAYER
"Unimaginably ancient xenos artefact somewhere on the planet, hive fleet poised above our heads, hidden 'stealer broods making an early start....and now a bloody Chaos cult crawling out of the woodwork just in case we were bored. Welcome to my world, Ciaphas."
Inquisitor Amberley Vail, Ordo Xenos
"I will admit that some Primachs like Russ or Horus could have a chance against an unarmed 12 year old novice but, a full Battle Sister??!! One to one? In close combat? Perhaps three Primarchs fighting together... but just one Primarch?" da001
Easy E wrote: In the grand tradition of Godzilla (and Kaiju movies in general) we need way more scenes of people in meetings and giving briefings!
There better be at least one scene of Interpol agents giving a slideshow presentation, dagnabit.
But we also don't get that in Kong movies so IMO hopefully not - again depends on which film style if follows
I AM A MARINE PLAYER
"Unimaginably ancient xenos artefact somewhere on the planet, hive fleet poised above our heads, hidden 'stealer broods making an early start....and now a bloody Chaos cult crawling out of the woodwork just in case we were bored. Welcome to my world, Ciaphas."
Inquisitor Amberley Vail, Ordo Xenos
"I will admit that some Primachs like Russ or Horus could have a chance against an unarmed 12 year old novice but, a full Battle Sister??!! One to one? In close combat? Perhaps three Primarchs fighting together... but just one Primarch?" da001
It would be nice if Legendary could take the experience it's gained from it's movies to learn a lesson.
Out of their string of Big Monster movies, I think only Pacific Rim, Skull Island, and Godzilla 2014 were worth a damn, imperfect creations as they might have been. Pacific Rim 2 and KotM were so terrible. After five movies, they've either learned what works and what doesn't or they never will.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/01/26 17:12:17
I have liked all 3 legendary monster movies so far. Il probably like this one too. Interested in seeing how they make some of the weirder gak work in this one.
These are my opinions. This is how I feel. Others may feel differently. This needs to be stated for some reason.
Been thinking that this "monsterverse" has definite similarities to the DC 'Snyderverse'.
Godzilla 2014 is similar to Man of Steel. It's focused and grounded...stands on its own. KotM is like BvS in that suddenly there's this much wider fantasy universe out there...much more comic book-y in terms of style, scope and details. And now GvK seems to be borrowing the actual plot of BvS.
LunarSol wrote: I liked 2014. It's too long (as are most movies these days) and wastes too much time on an actor who can't carry the film. Still, it ends in a phenomenal fight and one of the best monster kills in the franchise.
KoM is solid. It has some absolutely stunning cinematography that sadly mostly got spoiled in the trailers. The human subplot is pretty bad and weirdly gets in the way of the climax more than it did in 2014. The action is weirdly obscured in places. A bit more even than 2014, but not reaching its highest points either.
I largely expect the same here. Good, but still disappointing. Rampage somehow stands as the best modern American attempt at the genre.
A big part of the issue is that, during the big action scenes, they keep cutting to the humans. It doesn't give a full scene.
Kong didn't do that, which is why its better. It has coherent scenes. Come on where not on adderall, show a whole scene.
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
Considering how much you love the DCEU, I think you watch different movies than a lot of people
Also, lots of focus on humans until the monsters fight at the end describes almost every Toho Godzilla film. You certainly don't have to like that, but it is what it is.
In the same vein, it being a trope of the genre doesn't mean that I can't object to it either.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2021/01/26 21:55:40
gorgon wrote: Been thinking that this "monsterverse" has definite similarities to the DC 'Snyderverse'.
Godzilla 2014 is similar to Man of Steel. It's focused and grounded...stands on its own. KotM is like BvS in that suddenly there's this much wider fantasy universe out there...much more comic book-y in terms of style, scope and details. And now GvK seems to be borrowing the actual plot of BvS.
Well, for a time everyone was trying to do a Cinematic Universe (DC, Ghostbusters, Universal Monsters)--I think the Monsterverse is probably the best non-Marvel attempt at it.
"The 75mm gun is firing. The 37mm gun is firing, but is traversed round the wrong way. The Browning is jammed. I am saying "Driver, advance." and the driver, who can't hear me, is reversing. And as I look over the top of the turret and see twelve enemy tanks fifty yards away, someone hands me a cheese sandwich."
gorgon wrote: Been thinking that this "monsterverse" has definite similarities to the DC 'Snyderverse'.
Godzilla 2014 is similar to Man of Steel. It's focused and grounded...stands on its own. KotM is like BvS in that suddenly there's this much wider fantasy universe out there...much more comic book-y in terms of style, scope and details. And now GvK seems to be borrowing the actual plot of BvS.
Well, for a time everyone was trying to do a Cinematic Universe (DC, Ghostbusters, Universal Monsters)--I think the Monsterverse is probably the best non-Marvel attempt at it.
It's a really low bar after Marvel. The Monsterverse hasn't exactly been nailing it. I liked Godzilla more than most. Kong probably less than most. KotM was...I dunno. Feels like there's a lot to process there, similar to BvS.
But compared to the DCEU and its *crazy* drama and the dead-on-arrival 'Dark Universe'...I guess the Monsterverse is doing fairly well. Things haven't spiraled into bitter studio-director wars, recriminations and abandonments of the overall concept.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/01/28 17:46:42
I did not think that the first Godzilla film and the King Kong have anything in common which makes it really hard to cnsider them part of the same shared universe.
The monsterverse at least tried to include some elements in common (and IMO FAR more entertaing and betetr characters than the laughable cardboard cut outs in Godzilla) - sad to see it failed.
I AM A MARINE PLAYER
"Unimaginably ancient xenos artefact somewhere on the planet, hive fleet poised above our heads, hidden 'stealer broods making an early start....and now a bloody Chaos cult crawling out of the woodwork just in case we were bored. Welcome to my world, Ciaphas."
Inquisitor Amberley Vail, Ordo Xenos
"I will admit that some Primachs like Russ or Horus could have a chance against an unarmed 12 year old novice but, a full Battle Sister??!! One to one? In close combat? Perhaps three Primarchs fighting together... but just one Primarch?" da001
Mr Morden wrote: I did not think that the first Godzilla film and the King Kong have anything in common which makes it really hard to cnsider them part of the same shared universe.
The monsterverse at least tried to include some elements in common (and IMO FAR more entertaing and betetr characters than the laughable cardboard cut outs in Godzilla) - sad to see it failed.
They have a lot in common. The Monarch organization exists in both films. In Kong Skull Island you basically see them getting their start. The after credits of Kong also includes a scene were Hiddleston and Larson are in a room when a guy comes in and shows them evidence of other giant monsters. Cave paintings of lots of creatures including Godzilla and King Ghiddorah. I think the scene even ends with a Godzilla roar.
These are my opinions. This is how I feel. Others may feel differently. This needs to be stated for some reason.
I'm surprised people didn't enjoy the KotM, I thought it was quite good for a kaiju movie.
It did have silly, predictable human side of the plot, but so does 90% of kaiju movies, it's practically a tradition.Admit it, you'd HATE to watch one and not be able to gripe about "the stupid humans" at the end
Cronch wrote: I'm surprised people didn't enjoy the KotM, I thought it was quite good for a kaiju movie.
It did have silly, predictable human side of the plot, but so does 90% of kaiju movies, it's practically a tradition.Admit it, you'd HATE to watch one and not be able to gripe about "the stupid humans" at the end
Godzilla means different things to different people. As a treatise about mankind's place in the natural world, our complicated relationship with nuclear power, or the duty of science to benefit humanity, it's terrible. As a spectacle of visual effects (both artistically proficient and completely unbelievable) where monsters cut promos, well-meaning scientist protagonists scramble through falling debris to bring the Maguffin to the Place or rescue the Child of Destiny, and the military industrial complex stares on impotently, it delivers.
Godzilla has, historically, been all of these things over the course of its franchise history, and you can't really please its fanbase all at once.
Cronch wrote: I'm surprised people didn't enjoy the KotM, I thought it was quite good for a kaiju movie.
It did have silly, predictable human side of the plot, but so does 90% of kaiju movies, it's practically a tradition.Admit it, you'd HATE to watch one and not be able to gripe about "the stupid humans" at the end
I would love it
They did not have that in the Kong films - it depends if this is a Godzilla style film or a Kong style film.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/02/01 17:11:09
I AM A MARINE PLAYER
"Unimaginably ancient xenos artefact somewhere on the planet, hive fleet poised above our heads, hidden 'stealer broods making an early start....and now a bloody Chaos cult crawling out of the woodwork just in case we were bored. Welcome to my world, Ciaphas."
Inquisitor Amberley Vail, Ordo Xenos
"I will admit that some Primachs like Russ or Horus could have a chance against an unarmed 12 year old novice but, a full Battle Sister??!! One to one? In close combat? Perhaps three Primarchs fighting together... but just one Primarch?" da001
Welp, I gave it a try. It's basically King of the Monsters, but with even less effort put into the plot and a whole lot dumber.
Here are all the dumb things that happen in just the first 30 minutes;
Spoiler:
-Apparently all the other monsters just went away... Not sure. Movie doesn't bother explaining at all what happened to Rodan or the rest. This actually makes the stakes of the movie bafflingly unclear. In KotM the 'alpha' was a big deal because they controlled the other monsters. In GvK, it's still a plot point, but solely in the sense that people say Godzilla will kill Kong but with all the other monsters gone I have no idea why anyone gives a gak. Yeah, it sucks for Kong but... is that it? Kind of weird how they basically set this entire movie up with an anti-premise from the get go.
-There's a conspiracy nut who podcasts his intent to steal from his employer and broadcast their secrets. Because that's what smart whistleblowers who aren't crazy do but we all know he'll end up being right and the ambiguously evil corporation apparently is too powerful for anyone to notice how evil they are, but too dumb to notice the employee publicly bragging about stealing company secrets.
-That dumb kid from the last movie? Yeah, she's back because that's what everyone wanted. More of her being really really stupid. And it's dumber because her very first scene is being the only person on the planet besides the crazy conspiracy theorist who thinks its weird how Godzilla just showed up out of the blue to wreck a specific company's specifically shady facility. Kind of funky how all the smart (but dumb) people from the last movie are now dumber than before and not remotely suspicious about Godzilla suddenly going all aggressive for no apparent reason. The literal dialogue about this reads like some dick explaining to the young'ins how some kids are just born bad...
-A bunch of people on a whim put Kong on a boat to chase a previously completely unmentioned macguffin that won't be used nefariously by the obviously shady corporate overlords.
-Researchers who spent ten years studying Kong never noticed he speaks sign language. Which is about when I decided the movie was too fething dumb to be worth watching further.
-Edit: And as with WW1984, I tried ti again and no, it just gets dumber. Case and point, how do we help Kong win an underwater battle with Godzilla? Shower them both in depth charges... because that can't possibly hurt Kong and apparently doesn't because feth me for wanting a plot that makes even the slightest amount of sense I guess.
-How do we get Godzilla to not kill us after that plan fails? Just turn off the engines. He won't notice our ships floating here with Kong on the deck if the engines are all off. I really can't undersell how infuriating I find the entire first fight of the film. It's god awful, both in terms of action and in terms of plot. God damn it's hard for me not to see the entire exercise as nothing more than a vehement hatred directed at the audience for wanting anything more than crummy scenes of two CGI monsters wrestling underwater.
-Even 45 minutes into the movie, it's preposterously unclear what the stakes of this story are, as if the movie just expects you to be invested in Kong and Godzilla fighting over essentially nothing at all but your attention. Even the whole Godzilla has gone bad thing is very 'what' because all he did was wreck a suspiciously shady facility that reeked of something weird going on, and that's all he's apparently done in years. The film expects you, the audience, to be as unthinkingly stupid as the characters in this regard and ask no questions whatsoever about what the feth is going on or why any of it matters.
I thought King of the Monsters sucked from being a really lazy movie with barely any effort put into it. Godzilla vs Kong seems to be the same deal, but even lazier. And feth this bit at the bottom of the film's Wikipedia page really just sums it up for me in one statement;
Alonso Duralde of the TheWrap wrote that the franchise had "given up on everything but the monster fights" and wrote: "Yes, obviously, no one goes to these movies for the deep human characters or for plot machinations or even for the metaphors about the environment and industrialization. Here's the thing, though — they come in handy to fill in the gaps between the monster battles, and you miss them when they're not there. And since even those battles are somewhat perfunctory, what are we even doing here?"
This message was edited 10 times. Last update was at 2021/03/31 08:41:06
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