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Made in us
Mekboy Hammerin' Somethin'




Crescent City Fl..

I prefer hard copy andI prefer older style codex 3rd -5th, where it wasn't jammed full of pictures of GW's painted models but had mostly black and white art and painting suggestions and didn't cost as much as they do now.
Not really enjoying the digital codex or using a device to view pages. That said I would like unit datasheet cards over a page in a codex if it were an option Easier still to flip through a handful of cards than flip pages or use a search function. They did that for AoS and I really liked that.

"Pathetic earthlings. Hurling your bodies out into the void, without the slightest inkling of who or what is out here. If you had known anything about the true nature of the universe, anything at all, you would've hidden from it in terror."
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I love how a "which do you prefer and why" became a "my choice is the only correct and right choice and all other opinions are invalid" thread before breaking into page 2... bravo people

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/05/20 18:45:53


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 G00fySmiley wrote:
I love how a "which do you prefer and why" became a "my choice is the only correct and right choice and all other opinions are invalid" thread by page 2... bravo people


Welcome to the Internet, where we treat opinions like sports teams
   
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Never Forget Isstvan!






Physical Codexes allow for the smiting of Wasps. Case closed.
   
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 VladimirHerzog wrote:
 G00fySmiley wrote:
I love how a "which do you prefer and why" became a "my choice is the only correct and right choice and all other opinions are invalid" thread by page 2... bravo people


Welcome to the Internet, where we treat opinions like sports teams


People get killed over following specific football teams or being beaten up, because grandma gave you a green/white scarf for winter and you didn't know that one of the local 5th division clubs has "edge" beef with a different local club in the area who has it as club colours. Add racial and religion differences to that and sports becomes a very serious thing. Some beefs amongs whole cities are legendary, slag racing is very well know for that. Beefs that date back to pre WWII times.

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leerm02 wrote:



What about you? How much do you enjoy your physical codexes? Would a lower price point make you buy more of them?




They're crap. They contain artwork I can get online and re-hashed stories I already owned from previous codexes (except Necrons where they changed key details of their story). You are paying for someone that will be / is already out of date. It's as if you bought a book for Uni only to find 2 weeks later, it's no longer correct. Yes you have the words to read and pictures to see but it's no longer fit for it's intended purpose.

It's a way to milk the player, nothing more.
   
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Owns Whole Set of Skullz Techpriests






Versteckt in den Schatten deines Geistes.

Once upon a time they were something I really looked forward to, and something I would get even for armies I didn't play. And yes, I even own this modern day war crime. But the last Codex I bought was the 7th Ed Genestealer and Deathwatch books. I knew, by that time, that 8th was just around the corner, so I wanted to get their rules in the rules-base I was used to (3rd through 7th) and get all their initial fluff and whatnot. The fact that they were about to be invalidated didn't really matter to me, as I wanted them to have the books, not to play with. I even bought one Codex (Khorne Daemonkin) for work-related purposes, needing it for research for a book I was writing at the time.

Since then, with one exception, I've not purchased a single Codex. Or any 40k written material outside of the core rule books (which came in starter boxes anyway). They are invalidated too quickly, replaced too often, and just feel like a tremendous rip-off. The value is not there.

The only exception I have made since 8th started was the recent Tyranid Codex, because I felt it was genuinely the best Codex they've had since 4th Ed. It made me excited to play Tyranids. I am less excited that 10th seems to be just around the corner and that next weekend might be the first chance our group has had to play 9th since the pandemic started.

Codices now are also very, very expensive. Codices in 2nd Ed were full colour, and longer, and cost AUD$30, or around AUD$57 in today's money. Today they are nearly AUD$90, shorter, have less fluff, far less artwork, and have meagre colour sections. Certainly better than 3rd Ed's pamphlets, but even that trend was dying out by the end of 3rd.

What Codices are now is an interesting look at the design ethos (or lack thereof) within the 40k studio, how they lurch from one paradigm or governing idea to another at a whim, without any real rhyme or reason. I loved the format of the 4th Edition Codices (Marines, Tau, Black Templar) and thought they were really slick, but we also had to suffer through the Jervis-era of the "Wargear" section, created because his son wasn't able to easily tell what everything was, so pictures were married to weapon entries. We mock that, but it was actually a good idea. But GW is great at ideas, and absolutely awful at executing those ideas, so we ended up with Wargear sections that were filled with "See page XX" references (units could have their rules spread over 3 different sections of the book - a couple even had it over 4 different pages!).

This practice reached its absolute nadir in the Imperial Guard Codex that replaced the majestic Doctrine-filled post-Eye of Terror campaign book, where the vehicle wargear section had 31 entries, 25 of which referenced other parts of the book, and 1 was a reference to a different book!

Eventually we ended up with an Ork Codex that had big photos of units rather than artwork and was so light on fluff it made you wonder what was going on. And now we have the current era of Codex, where the fluff we get on a unit is a tiny blurb next to their unit entries, entries that take up far too much space, but also somehow not enough, leaving us with pages with massive blank spaces. Codex layout these days is absolutely atrocious.

So yeah, in the old days I would always get a new Codex. Now, they're not worth the paper they're printed on.

This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at 2022/05/20 23:44:55


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Stubborn Dark Angels Veteran Sergeant




Vancouver, BC

Zero value. None. Zilch.

That Russian page and something to type a list into are more useful than a codex by far.
   
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Heroic Senior Officer





Western Kentucky

Ive stopped buying codexes. The game is moving so fast I actually have 3 codexes that I havent even gotten to play with and could well be out of rotation before I get to them. Not to mention the fact that most books are halfway out of date within a month due to faqs, erratas, balance tweaks, and points updates.

If the codexes were $25 like they used to be itd be one thing. The new codexes do look nice and have some new lore and art here and there, but its simply not sane to buy a book less than 200 pages for $60 that has a shelf life measured in months to weeks. Hell I give GW less than 6 months from the time the IG codex finally drops till 10th edition gets announced.

I hate not buying codexes because I really like a physical book to reference mid game, but whats the point in bringing the book now? You need to reference 2-3 pdfs anyways, why bother? Not to mention the only way we're going to force GW to fix the codex issue is to vote with our wallets and stop buying them. If it gets to the point where even the space marine codex can barely move off the shelf because no one will buy it, maybe we'll finally get online rules released in a timely manner at the start of an edition. Obviously not free but Id happily pay the warhammer app subscription if I could just get up to date army rules for every army and have all the errata and updates baked in. Ive even given up on the army builder part of the app, I just want one spot up to date with all my rules that I can check on the fly.

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If I want to play 40k, I have to buy the books required.

So I value them highly.

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 BuFFo wrote:
If I want to play 40k, I have to buy the books required.
Do you?

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 H.B.M.C. wrote:
 BuFFo wrote:
If I want to play 40k, I have to buy the books required.
Do you?

If you don't want to enter the, at best, ethically murky waters of piracy, then yes.

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 Kanluwen wrote:
This is, emphatically, why I will continue suggesting nuking Guard and starting over again. It's a legacy army that needs to be rebooted with a new focal point.

Confirmation of why no-one should listen to Kanluwen when it comes to the IG - he doesn't want the IG, he want's Kan's New Model Army... 
   
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Doesn't have to do anything with ethics though. All it takes is for most of your games to be played at a store or at events. And in all those places you can forget running around with wpedia print outs.

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 Overread wrote:
So I recall when codex in the UK were closer to £12 a book. However I also have them on the shelf and I know that they were:

1) Black and White for the majority of the book, with a colour cover and colour painted section in the middle

2) Had only a small/modest amount of lore

3) Were considerably shorter

4) Were softbacks not hardback


Today the codex is £32, but they are also

1) Full colour

2) Considerably longer in both rules and lore

3) Are now hardback.


I think we have different ideas on value.

The old books were indeed softbacks but given that they were also inevitably replaced with new editions, I don't see this as a bad thing. If anything, I resent being charged extra so that they can give longer lifespans to books that have planned obsolescence regardless.

As for full colour, if anything it seems like a step backwards. We've used to have fantastic, black and white artwork that really brought the characters to life and helped set the tone of the setting. In a great many cases, adding colour to many of those drawings has made them worse. Especially since the colour seems to have been smeared on with all the care of a three-year-old painting by numbers. Added to that, we've got the new artwork. And I can't speak for every book but the art in the DE codex is beyond abysmal. It looks like the artist literally threw up on a page them tried to smear it into shapes that vaguely resembled characters and craft.

But of course, the main "benefit" of full colour is that most of the unit pictures have been replaced with catalogue photos. Catalogue photos that, quite unlike the pictures they replaced, do not bring characters to life or set the tone but if anything act to do the opposite. No longer is there anything to evoke the characters, creatures or craft that the figures are supposed to represent. No, now we've just got uninspiring photos of the models to kill any hint of immersion. And while it can be fun to browse through a catalogue, rarely are you expected to pay for them, let alone to the degree GW charges.

As for the books being longer, again I can't speak for every book, but the ones I've read nevertheless feel shorter. I don't know if it's because of the relentless copy and pasting (so I end up skipping over content that I've already read), or if the text uses more words to say less. Either way, I can't say I've ever found myself looking back at my old 8th edition books in the same way that I've looked back in my 3rd-5th era books.
   
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^"In a great many cases, adding colour to many of those drawings has made them worse."

This is so painfully true. GWs art department has gone downhill, imo.

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 Insectum7 wrote:
^"In a great many cases, adding colour to many of those drawings has made them worse."

This is so painfully true. GWs art department has gone downhill, imo.

This we definitely agree on. Even if people don't like Newcrons, I remember both the 3rd edition and 5th edition having excellent artwork.
   
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Blackclad Wayfarer





Philadelphia

I only use PDFs to game with on my phone or printed out materials

I bring the rulebooks to hand to my opponent or the tournament organizer. If you're not at an event or hitting tournaments with your army - I wouldnt buy any books

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/05/21 16:44:57


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 Dysartes wrote:
If you don't want to enter the, at best, ethically murky waters of piracy, then yes.
There are people here who think simply using BattleScribe is "piracy".

Karol wrote:
And in all those places you can forget running around with wpedia print outs.
Who needs to print out Wahapedia? I tend to transcribe everything into a spreadsheet. Far easier that way. Time consuming, sure, but it's worth the effort.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2022/05/21 18:11:40


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I don't value them at all.

1. In my native language, Codexes are plagued with typos. Words are missing, sometimes some words are still in english in the middle of a sentence (and no, it's not the name of a unit), etc. Sometimes, even the rules are wrong ffs !

2. Most Codexes are rehashing the same things (lore, units descriptions, etc). You almost never learn or discover new things. And since 9th, the long unit descriptions have disappeared in favor of the very old small, early 3rd edition style, descriptions.

3. The painting pages are boring.

4. Since GW decided to follow more closely the competitive side of 40K, we have frequent erratas / balance dataslate and as a result, they become very quickly obsolete.

I'd rather for GW to put the rules online (heck, put it behind a Warhammer+ subscription, I don't care) and to always keep them up to date rather than what we have currently.

However, I WOULD totally buy a physical book chock-full of lore (where GW really goes into the details, ala Forgeworld), with extensive painting tips and narrative rules.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/05/21 18:22:42


 
   
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 H.B.M.C. wrote:
 Dysartes wrote:
If you don't want to enter the, at best, ethically murky waters of piracy, then yes.
There are people here who think simply using BattleScribe is "piracy".

Using it without having bought the material previously, or having purchased it?

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 Kanluwen wrote:
This is, emphatically, why I will continue suggesting nuking Guard and starting over again. It's a legacy army that needs to be rebooted with a new focal point.

Confirmation of why no-one should listen to Kanluwen when it comes to the IG - he doesn't want the IG, he want's Kan's New Model Army... 
   
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Barpharanges







With the exception of the Vigilus CSM book, I have not bought a GW book since the 6th ed Chaos Daemons book. The quality of GW material is exceptionally low, and it has an incredibly brief lifespan as well. Ironically the books that tend to last the longest tend to somehow be the worst.

I do not intend to ever buy another book from GW.

People can screech and seethe about piracy all they wish. It's very silly.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/05/21 21:22:07


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Canada

Greatly prefer a physical Codex to a digital one. The in-game speed of the real book is a major advantage. I have been through many slow games where my opponent is relying on his phone for his rules.

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Infiltrating Broodlord





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 H.B.M.C. wrote:
 BuFFo wrote:
If I want to play 40k, I have to buy the books required.
Do you?


Yes.

I don't steal.

If I am going to play Warhammer 40k, I buy the models and the rules.

Which goes back to the OP... I value the rule books and the models GW makes because without either, I ain't playing 40k.

Ayn Rand "We can evade reality, but we cannot evade the consequences of evading reality" 
   
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Enigmatic Chaos Sorcerer





British Columbia

Very little. I liked the digital ones. Found them far quicker with the bookmarks.

Game churns too quickly to keep buying hardcover books.

 Crimson Devil wrote:
That's what 7th edition is about. Yelling "Forge the Narrative Pussy!" while kicking your opponent in the dick.
 BlaxicanX wrote:
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I disagree about physical books being faster to reference rules with. In many occasions, I've had both physical rulebooks and self-made PDF versions on stuff on my iPad, and it's always been way slower and awkward to find a rule from a physical book IME.

Who would use a smartphone to squint at stuff? No wonder yall prefer a physical book..

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 BuFFo wrote:
Yes.

I don't steal.
I've never stolen a Codex before. I don't think I could get it out of the store without someone noticing.

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"GW really needs to understand 'Less is more' when it comes to AoS." - Wha-Mu-077

 
   
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NE Ohio, USA

 tauist wrote:
I disagree about physical books being faster to reference rules with. In many occasions, I've had both physical rulebooks and self-made PDF versions on stuff on my iPad, and it's always been way slower and awkward to find a rule from a physical book IME.

Who would use a smartphone to squint at stuff? No wonder yall prefer a physical book..


A great many people.
   
 
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