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Vatsetis wrote:
Gert, that quote shows that Orks indeed care about losses to the point they need to justify them. It also points out that Orks do indeed retreat. Its also meant to be satiric.

They don't care though? It's not a justification to them, it just is. Not sure you understand satire if you think that quote is satiric. It's just meant to point out that Orks don't care about losses or losing because in their eyes they always win. Ork logic is child logic.

Orks are inteligent beings capable of having an ideology. They arent Tyranids.

The Ork need to fight isn't ideological, it's biological. They exist to fight so they fight. They don't need to justify a war, or losses (at least collectively since a Boss ain't a Boss if he keeps losing) they just keep going until they die. And that's fine because to them that's a good time. If they win a fight it was a good scrap because they won, but if they lose a fight then it was a really good scrap because that meant the enemy was well strong and as such a good opponent to look out for in the future. It's why Orks love to fight Space Marines, they're a real proper fight.

I'm leaving that last bit out because it breaks forum rules.

 Gert wrote:

Vatsetis wrote:
Gert, I cant understand why you consider your extreme rigoristic approach to lore to be something to be proud off.

Whaf if? Scenarios have been a part of popular culture (sure you we can agree that 40K is pop culture rather than hardcore scifi or some sort of snobbish literature, right) for decades.

If Superman can be the heir of Stalin, Orks could be "somewhat" peacefull (or simply cunning)... Sure its "out of charecter" but perhaps thats exactly the point I try to make (and some people lacking common sense might consider this trolling by my part, but thats not the case).

The difference between Red Son and your example is that Red Son changes one thing in Superman's past which then drastically alters the future along reasonable and logical pathways, and your's is just "What if different". They aren't remotely the same.

Removed - Rule #1

1 - I've had a pretty bad week so this was a nice laugh.
2 - You should maybe stop before you go a step too far.

So you didnt understand Red Son, what a surprise. Did you read the graphic novel or only watch the animated movie. I was refering to the first one alone (didnt watch the latter). In the graphic novel is not just a single change that alters the following timeline, is something much more complicated.

Im speaking always from an hipothetical perspective. If I see a fellow dakkanaut sistematically unable to follow a simple reasoning, since Im an empathic person I worry if that person dosent have some sort of problem.

The alternative would be that you are arguing out of bad faith. Would that be better?

Perhaps you havent yet grasp some of the fine points of my hipothesis, would you want me to explain any particular point with more detail. Its possible that in fact our POV are closer than what you think.

Hope you have a better week, and a better month


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 JNAProductions wrote:

Vatsetis wrote:

 JNAProductions wrote:

Vatsetis wrote:
So the life of the orks are pointless??

If so why dont the orks just walk like zombies doing scary noise hoping to be destroyed?

Its irrelevant if they are defeated in battle or if they win big?

Waiting for stock answer... "40K is stupid, dont over think it". :(

An Ork’s life isn’t pointless-it’s actually more fulfilled than most humans, especially in 40k.

It’s just that they’re not following human motivations or goals. They live to fight.

Pointless not from a subjective but rather from a biological point of view.

What on earth do you mean by that?

Orks reproduce by emitting spores. These spores are released most often by combat injuries. Fighting IS their primary means of reproduction.

This is akin to saying that MDs ussing antibiotics is in it self harmfull because that creates an evolutionary incentive for bacteria to evolve.

The analogy is relevant because Orks are believe to be a bio weapon.

So perhaps when engaging orks you can either fight with full resolution or either evade them.

If an isolated human society in the 40K milky way had a "first contact" with Orkoids and couldnt wipe them right away (because they lack the knowledge and tech to do so) fleeing (by creating a human demographic desert arround the Ork outbreak) would probably be a reasonable answer (altough only usefull during a short period of time).

Sure calling Orks "peaceful refugees" might have been a mistake. But dont take that image so literally... By the context of What I said, Its obvious I didnt pretend Orks to act like Ukranian refugees arriving to Poland for instance.

I am locking this trainwreck.