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Made in gb
Growlin' Guntrukk Driver with Killacannon





UK

 Manchu wrote:
Yeah, not sure how this is supposed to make me feel “involved.”


Got to agree here. Looking at some concept art is about as un-involved as it can get. But I guess it is more involved than nothing at all.


   
Made in us
Veteran Inquisitor with Xenos Alliances






I think it speaks to GW's art first approach to each facet of their development. It seems rather apparent that when GW starts a new project the first thing that happens is that everyone involved produces as many concepts as possible... that they distill or blend them and further develop the ones they like. How involved we are kept is really limited by their willingness to share those concepts and in particular concepts they might be willing not to pursuit at this time. Simply put, they aren't willing to share with us much in the way of concepts. I expect we will always have a certain part of their process as a black box just because of their IP concerns.
   
Made in in
[MOD]
Otiose in a Niche






Hyderabad, India

Goodwin had a good interview where he talked about developing a pallet or language of elements for a faction. IE elder all having gems and curves.

It was a good read but I can't remember where it was from. WD may be?

 
   
Made in us
Last Remaining Whole C'Tan






Pleasant Valley, Iowa

 aka_mythos wrote:
Simply put, they aren't willing to share with us much in the way of concepts. I expect we will always have a certain part of their process as a black box just because of their IP concerns.


Can't give away the secret sauce.


 lord_blackfang wrote:
Respect to the guy who subscribed just to post a massive ASCII dong in the chat and immediately get banned.

 Flinty wrote:
The benefit of slate is that its.actually a.rock with rock like properties. The downside is that it's a rock
 
   
Made in us
Nurgle Chosen Marine on a Palanquin





 Kid_Kyoto wrote:
Goodwin had a good interview where he talked about developing a pallet or language of elements for a faction. IE elder all having gems and curves.

It was a good read but I can't remember where it was from. WD may be?


Its in the Voxcast podcasts.

T
   
Made in gb
Growlin' Guntrukk Driver with Killacannon





UK

 Ouze wrote:
 aka_mythos wrote:
Simply put, they aren't willing to share with us much in the way of concepts. I expect we will always have a certain part of their process as a black box just because of their IP concerns.


Can't give away the secret sauce.







   
Made in gb
Growlin' Guntrukk Driver with Killacannon





UK

If GW is looking for inspiration for Sisters I am reminded of my new SOB design I did for them in 2011.




   
Made in nl
[MOD]
Decrepit Dakkanaut






Cozy cockpit of an Imperial Knight

No, just no.



Fatum Iustum Stultorum



Fiat justitia ruat caelum

 
   
Made in ch
The Dread Evil Lord Varlak





 ceorron wrote:
If GW is looking for inspiration for Sisters I am reminded of my new SOB design I did for them in 2011.





It seems you had too much time then, right?

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/02/24 22:45:14


https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/766717.page
A Mostly Renegades and Heretics blog.
GW:"Space marines got too many options to balance, therefore we decided to legends HH units."
Players: "why?!? Now we finally got decent plastic kits and you cut them?"
Chaos marines players: "Since when are Daemonengines 30k models and why do i have NO droppods now?"
GW" MONEY.... erm i meant TOO MANY OPTIONS (to resell your army to you again by disalowing former units)! Do you want specific tyranid fighiting Primaris? Even a new sabotage lieutnant!"
Chaos players: Guess i stop playing or go to HH.  
   
Made in jp
Longtime Dakkanaut





Maybe he meant to post this in the Joke Rumors thread?

I'm being optimistic.
   
Made in fr
Hallowed Canoness





Not Online!!! wrote:
 ceorron wrote:
If GW is looking for inspiration for Sisters I am reminded of my new SOB design I did for them in 2011.





It seems you had too much time then, right?


That was a tongue in cheek way to call you, ceorron, a spanker. A pretty funny one I must say, too!

"Our fantasy settings are grim and dark, but that is not a reflection of who we are or how we feel the real world should be. [...] We will continue to diversify the cast of characters we portray [...] so everyone can find representation and heroes they can relate to. [...] If [you don't feel the same way], you will not be missed"
https://twitter.com/WarComTeam/status/1268665798467432449/photo/1 
   
Made in gb
Fixture of Dakka




In fairness I like the drape part.

tremere47-fear leads to anger, anger leads to hate, hate, leads to triple riptide spam  
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




I like it.
   
Made in pl
Longtime Dakkanaut





Beta Codex feedback and some misc news:

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2019/03/04/battle-sister-bulletin-part-2-beta-rules-feedback/
   
Made in ca
Dakka Veteran







I have to admit that's a solid article about the feedback they got and that they actually are listening to the fans. It almost sounds like playtesting.</heresy>
   
Made in gb
Mighty Vampire Count






UK

Good to see an artcle like this:

In our inaugural Battle Sister Bulletin, we took a look at some of the concept art that inspired the development of the range’s iconography. This time, we’re taking a look at their rules development…

When Chapter Approved 2018 first hit the shelves, we asked you – our lovely community – to get your Adepta Sororitas on the battlefield and send us your feedback to help our rules team make them as fun and exciting to play as possible. And you have!

First of all, if you were one of the many hobbyists that sent us your feedback, thank you very much for your help. Now that the worldwide playtest stage is over, the rules team are now in a position to write the finished version of the codex. That being the case, any feedback sent in from today onwards is unlikely to be of use to the development process, so for now, just relax and enjoy playing games with your beta rules as normal!

Of all the feedback we received, there were three main areas in the beta codex that most people felt needed improvement.

Army-wide abilities are always an integral part of any faction’s rules, as they affect not just one, but most (if not all) of the units within it. That being the case, it’s especially important that they reflect how the army fights while giving the faction a unique edge in battle. In the case of the Adepta Sororitas, many of their units are able to manifest Acts of Faith, representing the divine will of the Emperor lending aid to his loyal subjects in battle.

In the beta rules, each Act of Faith requires a Test of Faith roll to be passed in order for them to take effect. According to your feedback, the reliance on luck for the Acts of Faith to kick in has led to some games where these rules didn’t quite have the impact that players felt they should.

The Plan: The rules team are looking to rebuild the Acts of Faith system from the ground up to ensure they are both more reliable, and can be used to impact key moments in the battle – just as acts of divine intervention should. You will be as the Emperor Himself, bestowing blessings on your units as and when they are most needed.

Exorcist Missile Launcher

The Exorcist missile launcher is a devastating weapon, as its profile in the beta codex certainly suggests.Despite having the potential to inflict a whopping 36 wounds, many of you felt that the random number of shots it fires hampers its effectiveness on the battlefield. Should you roll a low number of shots, then fail some or all of the hit rolls for your precious few attacks, it can feel a little disappointing.

The Plan: The rules team are looking at how we can make this iconic, missile-launching organ a more consistent damage-dealing addition to your army. They have a few ideas already – heretics beware!

Celestian Squads

These veteran Battle Sisters are the fighting elite of the Adepta Sororitas, acting as the loyal bodyguards and sworn protectors of senior members of their Order. Even though they can be equipped with a selection of powerful wargear, your collective feedback made it clear that they struggle to compete with the other Elites choices in the army.

The Plan: The rules team will look to add a thematic new ability or two to the Celestians to help them have more of an impact on the battlefield without sacrificing their role as sworn guardians of their Order. After all, just because Celestians are protectors first and foremost doesn’t mean they can’t dish out some serious pain!



I AM A MARINE PLAYER

"Unimaginably ancient xenos artefact somewhere on the planet, hive fleet poised above our heads, hidden 'stealer broods making an early start....and now a bloody Chaos cult crawling out of the woodwork just in case we were bored. Welcome to my world, Ciaphas."
Inquisitor Amberley Vail, Ordo Xenos

"I will admit that some Primachs like Russ or Horus could have a chance against an unarmed 12 year old novice but, a full Battle Sister??!! One to one? In close combat? Perhaps three Primarchs fighting together... but just one Primarch?" da001

www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/528517.page

A Bloody Road - my Warhammer Fantasy Fiction 
   
Made in ca
Fixture of Dakka





Surrey, BC - Canada

Stunned (in a good way)...that is about all I can say after reading the comments.

CB

   
Made in ca
Regular Dakkanaut





Eastern Ontario

They're actually listening, and seem to understand that feedback on stuff like the Exorcist doesn't mean players are opposed to variable damage output so much as "could we have a tighter range on the variance than 0-36 wounds?".

Good stuff.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/03/04 18:10:49


Hope is the first step on the road to disappointment. 
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut






All that article does is state that people fed back that obviously poor rules were poor, and then they say that they're going to do something non-specific about it.

That's nothing.

It doesn't *say* anything.

It shouldn't have required a paid for beta codex for GW's rules writers to come to recognise that Acts of Faith were rubbish. And if they thought that they were ok before, why would we expect them to be able to fix them now?

And if evident weaknesses like Acts of Faith and Celestians got as far as publication, apparently without being noticed, what hope is there for any completely new units which aren't going to get the benefit of beta testing being balanced?
   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran





Hopefully them rebuilding them from the ground up just means getting rid of the random chance element. I actually like the style of the Acts of Faith as they are, but the randomness is what kills them for me. The randomness also killed the exorcists for me a long while back too. Just replaced them with admech vehicles though. Way more versatile in load-outs anyway...

Sisters and Wolves 4000
~4000 points of Skaven
~2000 Kaptain Gitklaw's Grots
~2400 Kharadron Overlords
4x Imperial Knights
 
   
Made in fi
Courageous Space Marine Captain






It indeed sounded like they're removing, or at least heavily mitigating the randomness.

   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran





The article mentions looking at rebuilding from the ground up which just worries me they're taking the reviews and complaints as "burn it all down and start brand new!". They have something halfway decent, and the game IS about rolling dice,....but c'mon GW...not everything needs to be rolled for.

Sisters and Wolves 4000
~4000 points of Skaven
~2000 Kaptain Gitklaw's Grots
~2400 Kharadron Overlords
4x Imperial Knights
 
   
Made in us
Veteran Inquisitor with Xenos Alliances






Randomness has always been an issue with GW's rules. The potential for high performance when compared to the potential for low performance results in a weapon that is worth less than an option that has a weapon stat that is reliably an average of those extremes.

In general GW should write rules so the base line is what might otherwise be its average performance, and there is only an opportunity to perform better than expected and not worse than expect. For example, many of the weapons that have a D3 stat should be 1+D3, all other costs remaining the same. GW prices things in a vague way with wiggle room and allowing for point efficiencies; if the advantage is too significant to have a stat plus a bonus fit inside that wiggle room and the balance grayness of point efficiency they should question why its in the game.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2019/03/04 19:29:09


 
   
Made in gb
Fixture of Dakka




 Lord Damocles wrote:
All that article does is state that people fed back that obviously poor rules were poor, and then they say that they're going to do something non-specific about it.

That's nothing.

It doesn't *say* anything.

It shouldn't have required a paid for beta codex for GW's rules writers to come to recognise that Acts of Faith were rubbish. And if they thought that they were ok before, why would we expect them to be able to fix them now?

And if evident weaknesses like Acts of Faith and Celestians got as far as publication, apparently without being noticed, what hope is there for any completely new units which aren't going to get the benefit of beta testing being balanced?

So you'd prefer they did nothing? I'm glad they're at least trying.

tremere47-fear leads to anger, anger leads to hate, hate, leads to triple riptide spam  
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut






pm713 wrote:
So you'd prefer they did nothing? I'm glad they're at least trying.

I'd prefer they
1) Were competent to begin with - it is literally the job of the rules team to write rules. They shouldn't require us to tell them that Celestians are rubbish.
2) Communicated meaningful information. We learn nothing from this 'article'.
   
Made in fr
Hallowed Canoness





I love how the act of faith rules are rebuilt from the ground up… in every iteration of the rules, even the smallest ones!
I'm worried that they didn't mention the (now completely useless, I think) Gemini but just because they didn't mention them doesn't mean they won't change them, I guess.

"Our fantasy settings are grim and dark, but that is not a reflection of who we are or how we feel the real world should be. [...] We will continue to diversify the cast of characters we portray [...] so everyone can find representation and heroes they can relate to. [...] If [you don't feel the same way], you will not be missed"
https://twitter.com/WarComTeam/status/1268665798467432449/photo/1 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




Seemed like a reasonable article to me.

People don't like AoF being random. Okay, they can make them guaranteed, but probably expect them to be nerfed in some way.

People don't like the Exorcist. Okay - I don't know here, I think they are just wrong. Its a D6-dark lance tank with T8 and a 6++ (buffable) save for just 125 points. Yes you can roll a 1 and thats bad. You can also roll a 6 and its a bit good. If they were to make it always 4 shots, compare it to a quad-las Pred, costing approximately 50% more points with far weaker defensive stats. I realise a Pred is dreadful - but seriously. I can't really see why now you wouldn't always have 3 exorcists in a sisters list.

And yes, Celestians are currently a bit pointless. I'd have thought they were obviously on the table for an overhaul if/when they get new models. I can't believe they are going to go "here's a kit, use it to make sisters, celestians, dominions and retributors, because thats what we came up with in 2nd or 3rd edition and we are not changing it now".
   
Made in fr
Hallowed Canoness





Tyel wrote:
People don't like AoF being random. Okay, they can make them guaranteed, but probably expect them to be nerfed in some way.

They are already pretty weak.

"Our fantasy settings are grim and dark, but that is not a reflection of who we are or how we feel the real world should be. [...] We will continue to diversify the cast of characters we portray [...] so everyone can find representation and heroes they can relate to. [...] If [you don't feel the same way], you will not be missed"
https://twitter.com/WarComTeam/status/1268665798467432449/photo/1 
   
Made in gb
Ancient Space Wolves Venerable Dreadnought





I am totally fine with AoF going back to 2nd edition rules. I’d also like all the old Relics back, if we’re looking in that book for inspiration, and the special character cannonesses too.

"Three months? I'm going to go crazy …and I'm taking you with me!"
— Vala Mal Doran
 
   
Made in se
Bonkers Buggy Driver with Rockets





Stockholm, Sweden

Hey rules team, how about fixing the random profile of the Doomsday Ark too, while you’re at it?

Oguhmek paints Orks (and Necrons): 'Ere we go!
 
   
 
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