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Made in gb
Instigating Incubi




The dark behind the eyes.

Tyel wrote:
I don't really understand why the Kelermorph upsets people for fluff reasons.


If you mean me, I don't care about the stats of his weapons. I just find the whole 'false hero of the people' thing absurd.

Are you really telling me no one stops to question why this "hero" has an extra limb? And unlike the Locus and his tail, it's not even as if the Kelermorph goes out of the way to hide that particular feature.

Akiasura wrote:
I hate to sound like a serial killer, but I'll be reaching for my friend occam's razor yet again.
 Andilus Greatsword wrote:

"Prepare to open fire at that towering Wraithknight!"
"ARE YOU DAFT MAN!?! YOU MIGHT HIT THE MEN WHO COME UP TO ITS ANKLES!!!"



 insaniak wrote:

You're not. If you're worried about your opponent using 'fake' rules, you're having fun the wrong way. This hobby isn't about rules. It's about buying Citadel miniatures.

Please report to your nearest GW store for attitude readjustment. Take your wallet.
 
   
Made in gb
Frenzied Berserker Terminator




Hecaton wrote:
Not Online!!! wrote:


Am not even an astartes player, but besides that.
He doesn't even fit well with the aesthetique and the rest of the style of the faction. He just comparatively doesn't really fit in. Neither doctrine wise, nor style wise
And he doesn't even "not fit in" in a good way.
When i think of GSC and their infiltration and focus on mining, hiding and especially on infiltration of: military, PDF, Elites, I think of stuff like the nexos, magus, sanctus, the rider thingy with a sniperrifle on more rural worlds.
I also think sabotage and ambush, yet there is not one HQ for Sabotage?


To be honest, you're wrong.

Not Online!!! wrote:
Why have 2 charachters that do the same thing, when one solves the issues allready and you still have a vast hole in the army doctrine and fighting style`?
it would've been better to fill that hole first, but GW do GW.


That isn't an argument against the Kelermorph. What is your actual argument against it?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Tyel wrote:
I don't really understand why the Kelermorph upsets people for fluff reasons. The cries of "noooo, he should have 3 S3 AP- shots" just came across as so weird. Such would be... quite useless.


It's literally people who think that GSC shouldn't have nice things, rules wise *or* fluff wise *or* model wise. They have to have others' play experience be worse to be satisfied.


Not Online is actually suggesting making the army stronger by giving them units that don't duplicate roles. That's the opposite of what you're ranting about. He's suggesting they get more, better toys.
   
Made in ch
Warped Arch Heretic of Chaos





Dudeface wrote:
 Insectum7 wrote:
Not Online!!! wrote:
Dude Like i said i am no astartes player.
And yes i am going to complain, not about the kellermorph as a unit but as a role that was filled whilest there still is a hole in the faction that should be filled instead.
You know the Imperium has four different types of assassins, right? Not even counting the Death Cult Assassins.

What role should have been filled instead?


It's not worth the discussion, Not Online is arguing the army is lacking in a few other key points so adding another unit entry that performs a similar/same role as another didn't add value to the army. That's not wrong but likewise replacing the kellermorph with a different 1 model character unit isn't going to fix the army either.

Imperium is spoiled with a glut of options by definition, despite that the 5 assassins do all have different functions at least.


This, the kellermorph couldve been an actual usefull choice instead of beeing an assasin that then promptly got nerfed into the ground.

https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/766717.page
A Mostly Renegades and Heretics blog.

 Daedalus81 wrote:

In the 41st millennium there is only overpriced hamberders.

 
   
Made in us
Ancient Ultramarine Venerable Dreadnought






Not Online!!! wrote:
Dudeface wrote:
 Insectum7 wrote:
Not Online!!! wrote:
Dude Like i said i am no astartes player.
And yes i am going to complain, not about the kellermorph as a unit but as a role that was filled whilest there still is a hole in the faction that should be filled instead.
You know the Imperium has four different types of assassins, right? Not even counting the Death Cult Assassins.

What role should have been filled instead?


It's not worth the discussion, Not Online is arguing the army is lacking in a few other key points so adding another unit entry that performs a similar/same role as another didn't add value to the army. That's not wrong but likewise replacing the kellermorph with a different 1 model character unit isn't going to fix the army either.

Imperium is spoiled with a glut of options by definition, despite that the 5 assassins do all have different functions at least.


This, the kellermorph couldve been an actual usefull choice instead of beeing an assasin that then promptly got nerfed into the ground.
Gosh, you think it would still be useful if it weren't nerfed into the ground?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Dudeface wrote:
 Insectum7 wrote:
Not Online!!! wrote:
Dude Like i said i am no astartes player.
And yes i am going to complain, not about the kellermorph as a unit but as a role that was filled whilest there still is a hole in the faction that should be filled instead.
You know the Imperium has four different types of assassins, right? Not even counting the Death Cult Assassins.

What role should have been filled instead?

It's not worth the discussion, Not Online is arguing the army is lacking in a few other key points so adding another unit entry that performs a similar/same role as another didn't add value to the army. That's not wrong but likewise replacing the kellermorph with a different 1 model character unit isn't going to fix the army either.

Imperium is spoiled with a glut of options by definition, despite that the 5 assassins do all have different functions at least.
They assassinate in different ways?

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/09/25 18:59:00


And They Shall Not Fit Through Doors!!!

Tyranid Army Progress -- With Classic Warriors!:
https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/743240.page#9671598 
   
Made in ch
Warped Arch Heretic of Chaos





 Insectum7 wrote:
Not Online!!! wrote:
Dudeface wrote:
 Insectum7 wrote:
Not Online!!! wrote:
Dude Like i said i am no astartes player.
And yes i am going to complain, not about the kellermorph as a unit but as a role that was filled whilest there still is a hole in the faction that should be filled instead.
You know the Imperium has four different types of assassins, right? Not even counting the Death Cult Assassins.

What role should have been filled instead?


It's not worth the discussion, Not Online is arguing the army is lacking in a few other key points so adding another unit entry that performs a similar/same role as another didn't add value to the army. That's not wrong but likewise replacing the kellermorph with a different 1 model character unit isn't going to fix the army either.

Imperium is spoiled with a glut of options by definition, despite that the 5 assassins do all have different functions at least.


This, the kellermorph couldve been an actual usefull choice instead of beeing an assasin that then promptly got nerfed into the ground.
Gosh, you think it would still be useful if it weren't nerfed into the ground?

Har har, but yes of course, because there are roles and capabilities that Make Units more nerf resistant then beeing a high dakka asassin.


This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/09/25 19:02:44


https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/766717.page
A Mostly Renegades and Heretics blog.

 Daedalus81 wrote:

In the 41st millennium there is only overpriced hamberders.

 
   
Made in us
Ancient Ultramarine Venerable Dreadnought






Not Online!!! wrote:
Spoiler:
 Insectum7 wrote:
Not Online!!! wrote:
Dudeface wrote:
 Insectum7 wrote:
Not Online!!! wrote:
Dude Like i said i am no astartes player.
And yes i am going to complain, not about the kellermorph as a unit but as a role that was filled whilest there still is a hole in the faction that should be filled instead.
You know the Imperium has four different types of assassins, right? Not even counting the Death Cult Assassins.

What role should have been filled instead?


It's not worth the discussion, Not Online is arguing the army is lacking in a few other key points so adding another unit entry that performs a similar/same role as another didn't add value to the army. That's not wrong but likewise replacing the kellermorph with a different 1 model character unit isn't going to fix the army either.

Imperium is spoiled with a glut of options by definition, despite that the 5 assassins do all have different functions at least.


This, the kellermorph couldve been an actual usefull choice instead of beeing an assasin that then promptly got nerfed into the ground.
Gosh, you think it would still be useful if it weren't nerfed into the ground?

Har har, but yes of course, because there are roles and capabilities that Make Units more nerf resistant then beeing a high dakka asassin.
So being a "high dakka assassin" isn't a viable role?

And They Shall Not Fit Through Doors!!!

Tyranid Army Progress -- With Classic Warriors!:
https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/743240.page#9671598 
   
Made in ch
Warped Arch Heretic of Chaos





 Insectum7 wrote:
Not Online!!! wrote:
Spoiler:
 Insectum7 wrote:
Not Online!!! wrote:
Dudeface wrote:
 Insectum7 wrote:
Not Online!!! wrote:
Dude Like i said i am no astartes player.
And yes i am going to complain, not about the kellermorph as a unit but as a role that was filled whilest there still is a hole in the faction that should be filled instead.
You know the Imperium has four different types of assassins, right? Not even counting the Death Cult Assassins.

What role should have been filled instead?


It's not worth the discussion, Not Online is arguing the army is lacking in a few other key points so adding another unit entry that performs a similar/same role as another didn't add value to the army. That's not wrong but likewise replacing the kellermorph with a different 1 model character unit isn't going to fix the army either.

Imperium is spoiled with a glut of options by definition, despite that the 5 assassins do all have different functions at least.


This, the kellermorph couldve been an actual usefull choice instead of beeing an assasin that then promptly got nerfed into the ground.
Gosh, you think it would still be useful if it weren't nerfed into the ground?

Har har, but yes of course, because there are roles and capabilities that Make Units more nerf resistant then beeing a high dakka asassin.
So being a "high dakka assassin" isn't a viable role?


No it would be but considering gw's track record of allowing assasins to work and having high dakka.... Eehh predestinated nerf target....

https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/766717.page
A Mostly Renegades and Heretics blog.

 Daedalus81 wrote:

In the 41st millennium there is only overpriced hamberders.

 
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut




 Insectum7 wrote:
Not Online!!! wrote:
Spoiler:
 Insectum7 wrote:
Not Online!!! wrote:
Dudeface wrote:
 Insectum7 wrote:
Not Online!!! wrote:
Dude Like i said i am no astartes player.
And yes i am going to complain, not about the kellermorph as a unit but as a role that was filled whilest there still is a hole in the faction that should be filled instead.
You know the Imperium has four different types of assassins, right? Not even counting the Death Cult Assassins.

What role should have been filled instead?


It's not worth the discussion, Not Online is arguing the army is lacking in a few other key points so adding another unit entry that performs a similar/same role as another didn't add value to the army. That's not wrong but likewise replacing the kellermorph with a different 1 model character unit isn't going to fix the army either.

Imperium is spoiled with a glut of options by definition, despite that the 5 assassins do all have different functions at least.


This, the kellermorph couldve been an actual usefull choice instead of beeing an assasin that then promptly got nerfed into the ground.
Gosh, you think it would still be useful if it weren't nerfed into the ground?

Har har, but yes of course, because there are roles and capabilities that Make Units more nerf resistant then beeing a high dakka asassin.
So being a "high dakka assassin" isn't a viable role?

The bigg issue is it is an instant feels bad unit, if it does it's job the reciever of said assassination has just lost a key part of their army (stupid aura buffbots) or the kellormorf whiffs and the GSC player feels bad for taking said unit.

GW really need to decied do they want player agency or not and then build a game play paradigm and stick too it, not keep moving the goal posts every 3 codex's.

But Not Online is right assassins have always gone through woefully inept as when they finally get made to work like one shot wonders it's kinda sucky watching them destroy key charictors with zero defence.
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




Ice_can wrote:
The bigg issue is it is an instant feels bad unit, if it does it's job the reciever of said assassination has just lost a key part of their army (stupid aura buffbots) or the kellormorf whiffs and the GSC player feels bad for taking said unit.


Honestly I don't give a gak if Little Timmy feels bad that his Astartes captain got assassinated. GSC players can take the wiff in stride. Players need to be able to make meaningful decisions in-game with consequences, otherwise it isn't a game, just "cinematic dice rolling" like Kirby used to say.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Not Online!!! wrote:
No it would be but considering gw's track record of allowing assasins to work and having high dakka.... Eehh predestinated nerf target....


The argument, then, is that GW shouldn't have nerfed it, if we're being intellectually honest.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/09/25 20:04:47


 
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut




Hecaton wrote:
Ice_can wrote:
The bigg issue is it is an instant feels bad unit, if it does it's job the reciever of said assassination has just lost a key part of their army (stupid aura buffbots) or the kellormorf whiffs and the GSC player feels bad for taking said unit.


Honestly I don't give a gak if Little Timmy feels bad that his Astartes captain got assassinated. GSC players can take the wiff in stride. Players need to be able to make meaningful decisions in-game with consequences, otherwise it isn't a game, just "cinematic dice rolling" like Kirby used to say.
you might not care but GW does as they are supposedly trying to remove feelbad moments unless your playing against marines but it is what it is.
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




Ice_can wrote:
you might not care but GW does as they are supposedly trying to remove feelbad moments unless your playing against marines but it is what it is.


Yes, and it's wrongheaded. The whole point is we're criticizing the decision as wrong.
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut




Hecaton wrote:
Ice_can wrote:
you might not care but GW does as they are supposedly trying to remove feelbad moments unless your playing against marines but it is what it is.


Yes, and it's wrongheaded. The whole point is we're criticizing the decision as wrong.

I agree but it's been this way for 20 years, every time they make assasins that work they either cost as much as a tank or throw snowballs.

GW seems to want to give people assasins just not ones that work.
   
Made in gb
Ancient Ultramarine Venerable Dreadnought




Nottingham

Not Online!!! wrote:Instead of making him John wayne in space.
That's what sold me on the model.

Totally fits the aesthetic, fits in with the lore, and if it doesn't for your GSC, don't get one. Bikes don't fit my ideal aesthetic for Space Marines, so I don't often take them, but I don't complain they shouldn't exist.

Read the history of the Charadon Crusade: The Crusade of Fury was at an end.
Join the Crion Crusade: I think it's the combination of butt jokes, democratic necrons, explosions, and mind-fething that draws people to this Crusade like moths to a bug zapper - War Kitten
Rippy wrote:Never forgetti, template spaghetti.
DR:90S++G++MB+IPw40k07-D++A++/sWD366R++T(F)DM+ 
   
Made in gb
[DCM]
Ambitious Archon





Port Carmine

I love the three-armed gunslinger. I just wish GSC still had the black armoured limos.

Kabal of the Mon-keigh's Paw
Coven of the Screaming Statues

"Death is only a concern if you're both weak enough to be killed and dumb enough not to arrange your own resurrection." PM713
 
   
Made in de
Waaagh! Ork Warboss on Warbike






I also don't see anything wrong with John Wayne in space

Earth is not flat
Vaccines work
We've been to the moon
Climate change is real
Chemtrails aren't a thing
Evolution is a fact
Orks are not a melee army
Stand up for science!
 
   
Made in us
Ancient Chaos Terminator




The dark hollows of Kentucky

The model looks more like it was designed after Clint Eastwood's character from the Dollars Trilogy to me. It's the poncho.
   
Made in us
Omnipotent Necron Overlord






Personally wielding revolvers in setting where lascannons are a common thing...makes me feel like I am in a bad episode of Enterprise...

Wouldn't it be a lot cooler if he had laser pistols?

If we fail to anticipate the unforeseen or expect the unexpected in a universe of infinite possibilities, we may find ourselves at the mercy of anyone or anything that cannot be programmed, categorized or easily referenced.
- Fox Mulder 
   
Made in us
Ancient Ultramarine Venerable Dreadnought






 Xenomancers wrote:
Personally wielding revolvers in setting where lascannons are a common thing...makes me feel like I am in a bad episode of Enterprise...

Wouldn't it be a lot cooler if he had laser pistols?
All episodes of Enterprise are bad.

I dunno, I like the BLAM BLAM BLAM over the PEW PEW PEW. I'm thinking triple wielding S+W 500s.

And They Shall Not Fit Through Doors!!!

Tyranid Army Progress -- With Classic Warriors!:
https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/743240.page#9671598 
   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran




 Insectum7 wrote:
 Xenomancers wrote:
Personally wielding revolvers in setting where lascannons are a common thing...makes me feel like I am in a bad episode of Enterprise...

Wouldn't it be a lot cooler if he had laser pistols?
All episodes of Enterprise are bad.

I dunno, I like the BLAM BLAM BLAM over the PEW PEW PEW. I'm thinking triple wielding S+W 500s.


I happen to like Enterprise.



   
Made in gb
Assassin with Black Lotus Poison





Bristol

 Insectum7 wrote:
 Xenomancers wrote:
Personally wielding revolvers in setting where lascannons are a common thing...makes me feel like I am in a bad episode of Enterprise...

Wouldn't it be a lot cooler if he had laser pistols?
All episodes of Enterprise are bad.

I dunno, I like the BLAM BLAM BLAM over the PEW PEW PEW. I'm thinking triple wielding S+W 500s.


Could go the Firefly route and have BLAM mixed with PEW.

The Laws of Thermodynamics:
1) You cannot win. 2) You cannot break even. 3) You cannot stop playing the game.

Colonel Flagg wrote:You think you're real smart. But you're not smart; you're dumb. Very dumb. But you've met your match in me.
 
   
Made in gb
Instigating Incubi




The dark behind the eyes.

Hecaton wrote:

Honestly I don't give a gak if Little Timmy feels bad that his Astartes captain got assassinated. GSC players can take the wiff in stride. Players need to be able to make meaningful decisions in-game with consequences, otherwise it isn't a game, just "cinematic dice rolling" like Kirby used to say.


I agree with you on principle, but I'm not seeing how the Kelermorph being able to effortlessly blow away even very tough characters makes for "meaningful decisions".

I would think, in order to have decisions of actual value, you would need to have more options and counterplay than 'Can assassin kill Captain in one round of shooting, y/n?'

Akiasura wrote:
I hate to sound like a serial killer, but I'll be reaching for my friend occam's razor yet again.
 Andilus Greatsword wrote:

"Prepare to open fire at that towering Wraithknight!"
"ARE YOU DAFT MAN!?! YOU MIGHT HIT THE MEN WHO COME UP TO ITS ANKLES!!!"



 insaniak wrote:

You're not. If you're worried about your opponent using 'fake' rules, you're having fun the wrong way. This hobby isn't about rules. It's about buying Citadel miniatures.

Please report to your nearest GW store for attitude readjustment. Take your wallet.
 
   
Made in us
Shadowy Grot Kommittee Memba





whiny imperial players wrote: 3 pages of proving my point for me.


 Lance845 wrote:
Everyone arguing fluff comparison is completely missing the point. It's a damn game and the unit serves a purpose to the army in the form of a character assassin. It's stats need to represent it's role and be effective at doing it's job.

It doesn't mater if you can't figure out what the gun is shooting. It doesn't mater if you think it would be more thematic to double or triple down on the saboteur aspect. The faction got a character assassin unit (which ALSO fits with that theme btw) and it's stat line and weapons did the job the army needed it to.

How they explain it all is completely trivial.


THIS.

No problems with imperial assassins, no proems with space marine characters who can deal 3x the damage on the drop. Zero regard for the common statlines of characters in 8th necessitating a particular damage output for such a piece to work just "WEPPIN CALLED STUB SHOULD NOT HAVE CRAZY INSANE STATLINE LIKE S4 ap-1 d2!!!"

They dont even care about the actual lore explanation (the bullets are radioactive or something).

Marines get ap-1 on their stubbers by making them "ironhail." Whats the lore behind that? Eh, who cares. Certainly not yall.

"I can't believe all these tryhard WAACs out there just care about winning all the time when it's supposed to be a game for fun!!!!!!! Also here's my 27 page essay on why marines are OP and Orkz should get a bunch of OP rules so I can win more games

-the_scotsman"

-ERJAK 
   
Made in us
Excellent Exalted Champion of Chaos





And in fairness, GW could piss in bottles of water, sell them with 'we've literally urinated in these lmao' labels and they'd probably still sell out with a lot of people telling them it's the best water ever.


And then ebay scalpers would be making $300 a bottle.

Parabellum Conquest Vanguard and champion of all things Conquest: The Last Argument of Kings

www.underspire.net for all things Conquest 
   
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Blastaar wrote:

I happen to like Enterprise.
You are wrong to do so , hahah
(actually I never really saw it, but I had a roommate who watched it religiously and it didn't grab me.)
All in fun, all in fun.

 A Town Called Malus wrote:
 Insectum7 wrote:
 Xenomancers wrote:
Personally wielding revolvers in setting where lascannons are a common thing...makes me feel like I am in a bad episode of Enterprise...

Wouldn't it be a lot cooler if he had laser pistols?
All episodes of Enterprise are bad.

I dunno, I like the BLAM BLAM BLAM over the PEW PEW PEW. I'm thinking triple wielding S+W 500s.

Could go the Firefly route and have BLAM mixed with PEW.
Aww it's been a while, I had to look it up.

I was also thinking of the Robocop gun, the scene at the firing range in particular.

And They Shall Not Fit Through Doors!!!

Tyranid Army Progress -- With Classic Warriors!:
https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/743240.page#9671598 
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




 vipoid wrote:
Hecaton wrote:

Honestly I don't give a gak if Little Timmy feels bad that his Astartes captain got assassinated. GSC players can take the wiff in stride. Players need to be able to make meaningful decisions in-game with consequences, otherwise it isn't a game, just "cinematic dice rolling" like Kirby used to say.


I agree with you on principle, but I'm not seeing how the Kelermorph being able to effortlessly blow away even very tough characters makes for "meaningful decisions".

I would think, in order to have decisions of actual value, you would need to have more options and counterplay than 'Can assassin kill Captain in one round of shooting, y/n?'


I mean the question is whether or not to go in for that attack run on any given turn, and whether the opposing character tries to hide from the Kelermorph. There *is* counterplay, just it means not running your "press A to win" strategy that Astartes players love.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Xenomancers wrote:
Personally wielding revolvers in setting where lascannons are a common thing...makes me feel like I am in a bad episode of Enterprise...

Wouldn't it be a lot cooler if he had laser pistols?


Maybe, but you could say the same thing about Astartes and their bolt weapons.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/09/25 23:14:58


 
   
Made in gb
Instigating Incubi




The dark behind the eyes.

Hecaton wrote:

I mean the question is whether or not to go in for that attack run on any given turn, and whether the opposing character tries to hide from the Kelermorph. There *is* counterplay, just it means not running your "press A to win" strategy that Astartes players love.


I'll be honest, that really doesn't sound like meaningful options or counterplay.

And just to be clear, I'm not arguing that the Kelermorph should be weaker, because that doesn't fix the issue either.

It's more an illustration of the fact that 40k just isn't a mechanically deep game. Let's be honest here, 'move into range and shoot' is hardly involved gameplay or meaningful decision making. Not when it could just as easily be done by a simple if/then algorithm.

Akiasura wrote:
I hate to sound like a serial killer, but I'll be reaching for my friend occam's razor yet again.
 Andilus Greatsword wrote:

"Prepare to open fire at that towering Wraithknight!"
"ARE YOU DAFT MAN!?! YOU MIGHT HIT THE MEN WHO COME UP TO ITS ANKLES!!!"



 insaniak wrote:

You're not. If you're worried about your opponent using 'fake' rules, you're having fun the wrong way. This hobby isn't about rules. It's about buying Citadel miniatures.

Please report to your nearest GW store for attitude readjustment. Take your wallet.
 
   
Made in us
Dive-Bombin' Fighta-Bomba Pilot






 Xenomancers wrote:
Personally wielding revolvers in setting where lascannons are a common thing...makes me feel like I am in a bad episode of Enterprise...

Wouldn't it be a lot cooler if he had laser pistols?


eh... i mean laser weapons are cool and all, but I imagine most imperial armor is meant to stop or defend against laser weaponry mroe than slugs. Also a large revolver in modern loads has a lot of energy behind it, often rivaling full rifle rounds, move that forward to space age materials with scifi things like a super hard diamond tip on rounds, some unheard of pressures being abel to be used, due to some unobtanium metal shell casing, forcing cone, barrel and cylinder etc.

10000 points 7000
6000
5000
5000
2000
 
   
Made in ca
Regular Dakkanaut




As someone who has played orks Vindicares are far more terrifying and frustrating then the kelermorph ever was. They park across the map unable to be hit by anything except a suiciding flyer and just gib your weirdboy/big mek/warboss once a turn unless they are cowering in a trukk or battlewagon and thus contributing nothing to your army.




 
   
Made in us
Ancient Ultramarine Venerable Dreadnought






Can we mention squads of marines that can shoot your characters from 36" away and out of line of sight?

And They Shall Not Fit Through Doors!!!

Tyranid Army Progress -- With Classic Warriors!:
https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/743240.page#9671598 
   
Made in ch
Warped Arch Heretic of Chaos





Hecaton wrote:

Not Online!!! wrote:
No it would be but considering gw's track record of allowing assasins to work and having high dakka.... Eehh predestinated nerf target....


The argument, then, is that GW shouldn't have nerfed it, if we're being intellectually honest.


Actually, i am unsure, i think he was a bit overly effective.
The argument would be more akin to stop GW from using the Southpark Chicken kazoo method when balancing in general. Preferably before a dex is out.

https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/766717.page
A Mostly Renegades and Heretics blog.

 Daedalus81 wrote:

In the 41st millennium there is only overpriced hamberders.

 
   
 
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