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I liked the idea of chaos utilizing a vehicle that can be used for pillaging/an assault vehicle. So I drafted this:

Land Raider Mortifactor

Cost: 260 points
Av: 14/14/14
Troop Capacity – 12 (6 in terminator armour)
Bs: 4

Wargear:
• Hull-mounted twin-linked Heavy Flamer
• Sponson Heavy flamers (2 each side)
• Smoke Launchers
• Frag assault launcher

Options:
• May take a Havoc Launcher for 15pts
• May take a twin-linked bolter for 5pts
• May take a combi-weapon for 10pts

Special Rules:
• Daemon Engine -> Each Land Raider Mortifactor is bound to a malicious daemon. The Land Raider Mortifactor may count a heavy flamer from each side as defensive weapons and may fire 1 more weapon than normally allowed when moving.

• Hell-fire -> The daemon possessing each Land Raider Mortifactor is spiteful, and enjoys the screams of burning mortals. If the Land Raider Mortifactor does not move in its Movement Phase, ALL “flamer”-type weapons (flamer, heavy flamer, combi-flamer, etc.) count as AP1.

• Assault ramp

Thoughts?

S_P

Too much like the Redeemer imo. But if you keep it that way, you can probably lower the price a bit

How about instead of having the Hvy Flamers as defensive, why not make them regular flamers, and toss in Ap 2/3 to represent the Daemons other-wordly powers etc etc.

Would still wreck hordes, and now MEQ have to watch their backs.

Plus cheaper points cost= more incentive to take

It sounds nice... Like a Reedemer, but i dont like the AP1 thing...

Make it AP3 and that is fine, but 1 is too Low, specially in a flamers...

Make it cheaper, 250 points is ok...

I like the idea of replacing the sponsons with regular flamers. I want to keep the AP1 thing though; I mean, if you've allowed a Land Raider to sit that close to your guys for a full turn, you deserve to get burned. It's got no real long range weaponry, so if you're that scared of a low-AP flaming, kill it before it can get close enough to do so.

Revised edition:

Land Raider Mortifactor

Cost: 220 points
Av: 14/14/14
Troop Capacity – 12 (6 in terminator armour)
Bs: 4

Wargear:
• Hull-mounted twin-linked Heavy Flamer
• Sponson flamers (2 each side)
• Smoke Launchers
• Frag assault launcher

Options:
• May take a Havoc Launcher for 15pts
• May take a twin-linked bolter for 5pts
• May take a combi-weapon for 10pts

Special Rules:
• Daemon Engine -> Each Land Raider Mortifactor is bound to a malicious daemon. The Land Raider Mortifactor may fire 1 more weapon than normally allowed when moving.

• Hell-fire -> The daemon possessing each Land Raider Mortifactor is spiteful, and enjoys the screams of burning mortals. If the Land Raider Mortifactor does not move in its Movement Phase, ALL “flamer”-type weapons (flamer, heavy flamer, combi-flamer, etc.) count as AP1.

• Assault ramp

Thoughts?

S_P

Space_Potato wrote:
• Hell-fire -> The daemon possessing each Land Raider Mortifactor is spiteful, and enjoys the screams of burning mortals. If the Land Raider Mortifactor does not move in its Movement Phase, ALL “flamer”-type weapons (flamer, heavy flamer, combi-flamer, etc.) count as AP1.

Thoughts?

S_P

The AP1 is really not a good idea.

say a unit of guys assaults this thing and fails to kill or stun it. then on the chaos turn that unit goes away Killing 5 or more terminators with this weapon that does not scatter is overpowered, nothing else in the game, save for Demolisher cannons and the like, can do that, and even then those can scatter.

not good.

Maybe make it count as twin linked might work though. or +1 or +2 strength if you are stationary might work.

Space_Potato wrote: if you've allowed a Land Raider to sit that close to your guys for a full turn, you deserve to get burned."

Its not about letting them sit close, with this you can just park on an objective and force guys to get close or lose the point...

DeathReaper wrote:

Space_Potato wrote:
• Hell-fire -> The daemon possessing each Land Raider Mortifactor is spiteful, and enjoys the screams of burning mortals. If the Land Raider Mortifactor does not move in its Movement Phase, ALL “flamer”-type weapons (flamer, heavy flamer, combi-flamer, etc.) count as AP1.

Thoughts?

S_P

The AP1 is really not a good idea.

say a unit of guys assaults this thing and fails to kill or stun it. then on the chaos turn that unit goes away Killing 5 or more terminators with this weapon that does not scatter is overpowered, nothing else in the game, save for Demolisher cannons and the like, can do that, and even then those can scatter.

not good.

Maybe make it count as twin linked might work though. or +1 or +2 strength if you are stationary might work.

Space_Potato wrote: if you've allowed a Land Raider to sit that close to your guys for a full turn, you deserve to get burned."

Its not about letting them sit close, with this you can just park on an objective and force guys to get close or lose the point...

+1

I agree that the AP1 is OP. What if it grants a range, say 12", to template attacks like a Hellhound if it doesn't move?

/\

Now that is one brilliant idea for the Land Raider, that would give it HUGE benifits in practicality. On a side note you could just say when the land raider stays still for a whole turn, the Daemon inside puts his full energy into the flamers, making them 12" range templates like a hell hound, and +1 str

Or is that just me in a plastic kit fueled pipe dream?

Why don't you just remove the Heavy flamers

Stick 3 Daemon Maws on it.

1 on each side and one on the top.
and say it can fire the Wind of Chaos Psyker power?
The one on the top counts as twin linked ^^?

a redeemer cannon is a AP3 S6 flamer. a heavy flamer is a AP4 S5 flamer. HB and HF are deemed to be the same points. so why bother having a redeemer, which replaces a HB with a HF for 10 points (should be free IMO) and have a worse version of the redeemer cannon? just have a redeemer cannon. maybe a deff-rolla type thing on the front, not having the assault ramp, but have 2 flamestorm cannons and a HF for 250pts?

Gavin Thorne wrote:

DeathReaper wrote:

Space_Potato wrote:
• Hell-fire -> The daemon possessing each Land Raider Mortifactor is spiteful, and enjoys the screams of burning mortals. If the Land Raider Mortifactor does not move in its Movement Phase, ALL “flamer”-type weapons (flamer, heavy flamer, combi-flamer, etc.) count as AP1.

Thoughts?

S_P

The AP1 is really not a good idea.

say a unit of guys assaults this thing and fails to kill or stun it. then on the chaos turn that unit goes away Killing 5 or more terminators with this weapon that does not scatter is overpowered, nothing else in the game, save for Demolisher cannons and the like, can do that, and even then those can scatter.

not good.

Maybe make it count as twin linked might work though. or +1 or +2 strength if you are stationary might work.

Space_Potato wrote: if you've allowed a Land Raider to sit that close to your guys for a full turn, you deserve to get burned."

Its not about letting them sit close, with this you can just park on an objective and force guys to get close or lose the point...

+1

I agree that the AP1 is OP. What if it grants a range, say 12", to template attacks like a Hellhound if it doesn't move?

Chaos Lord Gir wrote:/\

Now that is one brilliant idea for the Land Raider, that would give it HUGE benifits in practicality. On a side note you could just say when the land raider stays still for a whole turn, the Daemon inside puts his full energy into the flamers, making them 12" range templates like a hell hound, and +1 str

Or is that just me in a plastic kit fueled pipe dream?

I like the Hellhound-esque element. I'll use this instead of the AP1.

S_P


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Land Raider Mortifactor (Mk III)

Cost: 220 points
Av: 14/14/14
Troop Capacity – 12 (6 in terminator armour)
Bs: 4

Wargear:
• Hull-mounted twin-linked Heavy Flamer
• Sponson flamers (2 each side)
• Smoke Launchers
• Frag assault launcher

Options:
• May take a Havoc Launcher for 15pts
• May take a twin-linked bolter for 5pts
• May take a combi-weapon for 10pts

Special Rules:
• Daemon Engine -> Each Land Raider Mortifactor is bound to a malicious daemon. The Land Raider Mortifactor may fire 1 more weapon than normally allowed when moving.

• Hell-fire -> The daemon possessing each Land Raider Mortifactor is spiteful, and enjoys the screams of burning mortals. If the Land Raider Mortifactor does not move in its Movement Phase, then you may fire any of it's flamer and flamer-type weapons at a range of 12" (place template so that at least one point of the template is WITHIN 12" of the weapon, from here use the template as normal)

• Assault ramp

Thoughts on this?

S_P

Hmm... IMO the flamers arn't so much of a threat why not give them the within 12" range all the time, but when the land raider stands still the flamers become twin linked (so re-rolling all to wounds)

At the end of a day, they're flamers and still murder GEQ, but now becomes more (if only slightly) effective against MEQ.

and personally if it had that ability, I'd pay around 230-240 points for it. The reach would be alot to consider and may need balancing.

Again, why not make it a Wind of Chaos tank when not moving?

The whole 4+ to wound ignores armour and whatnot would be great.

but on a roll of a 5+ when attempting to use, the Daemon inside reacts to the crew and the tank suffers a glancing hit?

It's a daemon inside, How about:

if (Condition X)
Treat all flamers as being "Breath of chaos"

Shas'O Dorian wrote:It's a daemon inside, How about:

if (Condition X)
Treat all flamers as being "Breath of chaos"

Now this makes good sense to me

Land Raider Mortifactor (Mk IV)

Cost: 230 points
Av: 14/14/14
Troop Capacity – 12 (6 in terminator armour)
Bs: 4

Wargear:
• Hull-mounted twin-linked Heavy Flamer
• Sponson flamers (2 each side)
• Smoke Launchers
• Frag assault launcher

Options:
• May take a Havoc Launcher for 15pts
• May take a twin-linked bolter for 5pts
• May take a combi-weapon for 10pts

Special Rules:
• Daemon Engine -> Each Land Raider Mortifactor is bound to a malicious daemon. The Land Raider Mortifactor may fire 1 more weapon than normally allowed when moving.

• Hell-fire -> The daemon possessing each Land Raider Mortifactor is spiteful, and enjoys the screams of burning mortals. If the Land Raider Mortifactor does not move in its Movement Phase, then each of it's flamer-type weapons (heavy flamer, flamers, combi-flamers, etc) may be used as "Breath of Chaos", that does not require a psychic test. However, if two or more 1s are rolled when rolling to wound, the Land Raider Mortifactor takes a glancing hit, and any embarked troops take a strength 3 Ap- hit each.

• Assault ramp

I've put the Breath of Chaos thing in, as it was so popular, and put a downside in (glancing hit) and bumped up the cost a tiny bit (10 points). What's the general consensus with this.

S_P

I would personally ignore the glancing hit tbh, Chaos codex ALREADY has enough of things which come back to bite you in the ass, don't ruin another potentional toy with the prospect of dead friendly marines :p

I'd keep it in, but make it so that whenever you want to use it, roll a d6 for each weapon (3 or less)
If any of those dice are a one, you suffer a glancing hit.

I think the basis of the mk4 is pretty good (the no save breath of chaos is less overpoweringly good when it can only be employed when stationary).

Personally I'd only suggest a few cosmetic rules changes at this point:

1. Ditch the flaw where it hurts it self and just increase it to 240 (maybe 250 and include daemonic possession standard).

2. I'd twin link the sponson flamers as its rather odd twin single mounts...makes it feel like a power gamey choice.

Other then that I think its getting pretty close to good.

Jack

/\

Totally agree with above idea

Me Too !

Land Raider Mortifactor (Mk V)

Cost: 240 points
Av: 14/14/14
Troop Capacity – 12 (6 in terminator armour)
Bs: 4

Wargear:
• Hull-mounted twin-linked Heavy Flamer
• Sponson Twin-linked flamers (1 each side)
• Smoke Launchers
• Frag assault launcher

Options:
• May take a Havoc Launcher for 15pts
• May take a twin-linked bolter for 5pts
• May take a combi-weapon for 10pts

Special Rules:
• Daemon Engine -> Each Land Raider Mortifactor is bound to a malicious daemon. The Land Raider Mortifactor may fire 1 more weapon than normally allowed when moving.

• Hell-fire -> The daemon possessing each Land Raider Mortifactor is spiteful, and enjoys the screams of burning mortals. If the Land Raider Mortifactor does not move in its Movement Phase, then each of it's flamer-type weapons (heavy flamer, flamers, combi-flamers, etc) may be used as "Breath of Chaos", that does not require a psychic test.

• Assault ramp

• Daemonic Possession

Bumped it up to 240, removed the self-damage thing, added Possession, and added twinlinked to the sponsons.

Thoughts?

S_P

Now there is a land raider which I would be happy to field for my traitor legions!

since a LR redeemer is basically this but with better flamers, why not have the sponsons flamerstorm cannons? 2x S6 AP3 template and S6 AP4 assault 4, or 3x S5 AP4 templates, and they are both the same points cost?
Just have 2 flamestorms and a TL hull-mounted HF.

shrike wrote:since a LR redeemer is basically this but with better flamers, why not have the sponsons flamerstorm cannons? 2x S6 AP3 template and S6 AP4 assault 4, or 3x S5 AP4 templates, and they are both the same points cost?
Just have 2 flamestorms and a TL hull-mounted HF.

I think the theme and weapon layout behind this land raider really compliments the chaos army theme alot more than simply stealing from the loyalists (which I know happens alot) but this represents them applying Daemon logic to countering the loyalists advancing technology.

What can I say, Im a sucker for a man and his daemonicly possessed land raider.

Chaos Lord Gir wrote:

shrike wrote:since a LR redeemer is basically this but with better flamers, why not have the sponsons flamerstorm cannons? 2x S6 AP3 template and S6 AP4 assault 4, or 3x S5 AP4 templates, and they are both the same points cost?
Just have 2 flamestorms and a TL hull-mounted HF.

I think the theme and weapon layout behind this land raider really compliments the chaos army theme alot more than simply stealing from the loyalists (which I know happens alot) but this represents them applying Daemon logic to countering the loyalists advancing technology.

What can I say, Im a sucker for a man and his daemonicly possessed land raider.

This. I much preferred the idea of an LR with a flame spitting daemon inside rather than a Redeemer with a new paint job.

This way, it's less powerful as a machine ("smaller" technology due to lack of resources), but more powerful as a sentient entity (Angry daemon against machine spirit).

S_P

Looks solid to me, only two edits I would suggest now are mostly cosmetic:

1. It should be BS 3 since its got Daemonic Possession.

2. Is the twin linking meant to affect the breath of chaos effect? If so you should note it in the rule since its otherwise unclear if it would.

Jack

Land Raider Mortifactor (Mk V.II (Cosmetic updates))

Cost: 240 points
Av: 14/14/14
Troop Capacity – 12 (6 in terminator armour)
Bs: 3

Wargear:
• Hull-mounted twin-linked Heavy Flamer
• Sponson Twin-linked flamers (1 each side)
• Smoke Launchers
• Frag assault launcher

Options:
• May take a Havoc Launcher for 15pts
• May take a twin-linked bolter for 5pts
• May take a combi-weapon for 10pts

Special Rules:
• Daemon Engine -> Each Land Raider Mortifactor is bound to a malicious daemon. The Land Raider Mortifactor may fire 1 more weapon than normally allowed when moving.

• Hell-fire -> The daemon possessing each Land Raider Mortifactor is spiteful, and enjoys the screams of burning mortals. If the Land Raider Mortifactor does not move in its Movement Phase, then each of it's flamer-type weapons (heavy flamer, flamers, combi-flamers, etc) may be used as "Breath of Chaos", that does not require a psychic test. Note that the twin-linked effect from the flamers does not apply to "Breath".

• Assault ramp

• Daemonic Possession

I've made it Bs 3 (Daemonic possession) and disallowed use of twin-linking and "Breath" (I figure the 3/4 shots you're allowed balances this).

S_P

Looks good to me, I'd be more then happy to play against it at those point values (and see from that experience if any adjustment is needed).

Jack

I'm not entirely sure that you should have the breath of chaos working for a combi-flamer. Seems just a little too burny (even though there's no such thing ). That extra 10 points seems a little price to pay for such an epic upgrade.

You could consider switching out the TL Heavy flamer for a Flamestorm cannon but that's just my $0.02.