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Ok, I've been playing Warmachine Khador for a while now and have had great success with my pButcher Man O War tier list and my eIrusk winterguard list. Recently my friends have gotten into Hordes and I'm thinking of joining them. My first thought was to go Trollbloods but there are three troll players already. So... next up is Circle which has some models I really like. My first question would be are Warpborn Skinwalkers worth anything? I'm a big fan of heavy infantry so I was immediately drawn to them. Plus I like their models more than the Tharn Ravagers. I'm kind of drawn to the wolf themed stuff more than the construct stuff, most circle lists I've seen have the constructs. Are Warpwolf Stalkers any good or should I stick to Feral and Pureblood? So, is there a good way to do a wolf themed competitive Circle list at 35pts? Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Stalkers are fantastic.

Skinwalkers and Ravagers serve two separate purposes. Ravagers hit fast,
give you tokens for some (of all things) ravaging, and really need a charge.
Skinwalkers are slower, try to get stuck into combat where it takes someone a
little more time to deal with them.

What's your idea of "wolf themed"?

Funny, I came from playing khador to wanting to play circle too. I wanted a switch though, so I am looking at the ravagers instead of the skinwalkers as the skinwalkers are very similar to khador's MoW.

@ Sandman: Epic Kaya would be your friend. She's a solid beast caster and can get Skinwalkers (IIRC) in her tier.

Stalkers, Purebloods and Ferals are all fantastic, and serve different roles - I often use a mix of the three. I'm a huge fan of the Pureblood though, simply because of Blessed (his animus gives magic weapons and blessed to its target).

Skinwalkers do a great job of holding down the fort but they really don't hit very hard without some help. That said, i do use them, often to contest an objective, since they can tie up an opponent for a couple of turns unless they seriously commit to destroying them.

eKaya is fantastic with a Beast heavy such as Stalkers, Ferals and Purebloods as has previously been mentioned, and her tier list (which requires Skinwalkers IIRC) is quite competitive.

pKaya provides a passive buff to her living beasts (+2 to hit IIRC), but people tend to dismiss her as weak as her feat/spell combination is underwhelming when compared to what she used to do.

I would also look at Kromac as he brings some very useful buffs to his beasts.

Wow, thanks for all the help guys. My idea for wolf themed is like mentioned... war wolves, any of the warp wolves, skinwalkers and Argus'. I was leaning towards Kaya or eKaya.

What I've come up with was:
Kaya
Stalker
Stalker
Argus
5x Skinwalkers
5x Skinwalkers
War Wolf

OR

eKaya
Argus
Stalker
Stalker
5x Skinwalkers
3x Skinwalkers
War Wolf.

Are either of these in the slightest even ok? (I can't do a tier list yet as I still have to pick up the Circle book) Which would serve me better? Thanks again for all the help.

Don't field the war wolf without Reeves or Wolves of Orboros. They're largely useless without the additional abilities they grant (a free out-of-activation charge and Flank, respectively). If you need to fill the single point, I'd throw in some Gobbers.

Yeah, it was just another wolf to fill a point.

I would highly recommend taking a pureblood warpwolf their ability to give themself and any other warpwolf ghostly is essential since 90% of circle power is movement.

I would recommend something more like

pKaya
argus
Pureblood Warpwofl
Stalker

5x Skin Walkers
5x Wolfriders

for eKaya
drop the argus since she basically gets one for free-ish

Yeah, but I didn't think Laris could give the 360 vision animus. Which I thought would be kind of brutal on a Stalker.

Sandman wrote:Yeah, but I didn't think Laris could give the 360 vision animus. Which I thought would be kind of brutal on a Stalker.

360 degree front arc is nice but i have honestly had it come into play very rarely, either things die in a frontal charge or they are positioned in such a way that back strikes are almost impossible anyways.

Ok, got the book and switched some stuff around... Now with the models I'm buying on the cheap from a friend I've come up with:

pKaya
Stalker
Pureblood
Argus
Argus
10x Wolves of Orboros
Wolves of Orboros UA
Wolf Lord Morraig
1 War Wolf

OR

eKaya w/ Laris
Stalker
Pureblood
Argus
Morraig
10x Wolves of Orboros
Wolves UA
2x War Wolves

Also he's got some Tharn so I came up with

Kromac
Stalker
Argus
6x Tharn Ravagers
Tharn Chieftan
Tharn Shaman
4x Tharn Ravagers
(free Chieftan with Kromac's tier)
Ravager Whitemane
Ravager Whitemane


Sound any better? Getting most of this for over half off is way better than buying skinwalkers for full price.

Ekaya and kromac may want a couple more beasts and a bit less unit. Especially the kromac list is very beastlite.

Because I do not know kaya that well I will only delve deeper in what I know about Kromac now.

Kromac needs a couple large beasts and a gorax. The argus is not really that good as far as I can see. he can take on the odd solo or be in the way. He is also quite fast, but he is no good in combat and no good at range. Gorax on the other hand gives you an excellent animus and a moddel that can hold his own in melee.

For beasts it is also important to get at least 2 heavys. I would prefer a feral and a pureblood minimum. I like to run all three, but then the spots for tharn will get lost. The fact you run this amount of beasts also lets you get enough fury and then some when a beast is lost, (believe me, it happens) so you do not have to start cutting yourself for fury to early in the game.

That is all the beast advice I can give right now...

ill agree with LordRavurion here

more beasts for ekaya and Kromac as this maximizes their spells, upkeeps and feats. Ill even go as far as get 4 or more beasts and just have support units that will help with fury management or placement. Druids, stones etc. You really dont need the troops to kill stuff as the beasts can do that better and that many troops will probably clog up your charge lanes.

Fair enough, and thanks for the responses. I'm mainly going with what I have available. He is also throwing in a Gnarlhorn so I rekitted the Kromac list and dropped the Argus and one of the whitemanes to pick up the Gnarlhorn. I understand the need for beasts but I figured a big group of Ravagers with the chieftan running in to hit at P&S 15 can even ruin a Jack or Beasts day. I also generally prefer the units to beasts. I can't run the Gorax, he's too damn hideous. Maybe when they have a resculpt but not now. Worst model in the entire PP line.

As far as eKaya, I figured two heavies plus her two lights would be enough beast. Same amount as pKaya. Is there no way to win without being another pure beast player?

you can win but again we're just suggesting the beast heavy list to really take advantage of what they bring to the table. And since running aggressive with these casters is recommended, having a redundancy of heavy beasts is a good idea because you're gonna bet that one of your beasts will go down by turn 2 or so. and the heavy furries just work so well together that its hard to keep em apart. lol.

Kromac and Kaya really dont have a lot to give infantry in the way of buffs and spells. The infantry that work well with both casters arent in the list like, bloodtrackers, skinwalkers and wolfriders. If you want a more infantry heavy list, other warlocks would probably be better, like Mohsar or Morvhanna.

Good advice all, I'm doing my first game with them soon. I like the warpwolves, all of them but I'm also a sucker for infantry. Especially the Wolves, they just look awesome and are dirt cheap. Plus they really seem to add to Morraig.

pKaya is all bout hit-n-run tactics. Charge your beast in, do some damage, then have Kaya walk up, teleport her beast back and 2" behind her, then she can teleport herself back to get behind the beast as well. On her feat turn, I think you can get like 4 teleports or something in (can't remember if Spirit Door is 2 or 3 fury). She and her beasts are hard to get to, even for a quick faction like Legion.