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Just today me and two friends went into town to buy some stuff (as we had just discovered that there was a warhammer stockist in our town) and asked what days that they played. The answer was every day, but you must pay a £5 subscription fee every month. Is this a normal thing to happen or is this a bit "abnormal" for want of a better word?

I've seen this at stores before in my travels. The LGS used to do this, but did away with it.

From what I gathered from the last time this topic popped up, it seems to be a more common occurrence in the UK than the US. I'd give more of my thoughts, but then we'll have people saying how entitled US players are vs the rest of the world again.

Usually its some kind of club you buy into that allows for some benefit after so many "games".

When stores let you play there, they probably hope you'll see something you like during or after the game and buy it. If a store had limited space or just needed the $$ to pay rent or whatever, I could see them charging.

The trick is if they charge too much, people will play elsewhere - and the store misses out on having more visits/potentially more impulse buys. If the store is the only one in town, I could see them pulling this off. If there is another store, too, well, maybe not. Unless that other store charges, too.

If it was me and I thought I'd play a couple of times a month, it might be worth it. Consider the cost of a movie and popcorn and then decide. Or if you really don't want to play, you can always start building your own game table - or playing with a friend who has one. But you may find more new opponents at the store, which is also a plus.

If it's good terrain, washroom facilities, refreshment available etc in a nice environment, then why not.

Upkeep costs money. Decide if you would get your money's worth and then make the decision.

lol, here's about 7 pages of heated discussion on the same topic. try to avoid the same pitfalls...

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/335304.page


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the general consensus from the thread seemed to be that it's perfectly acceptable to most gamers for a store to charge you to play (via a membership or daily fee) as long as they provide a service over and above what you'd expect from a "free" gaming space. Basically, very nice terrain (and copious amounts of it to choose from) as well as a nice player base and possibly even some structure to the gaming nights (themed battles with referees/judges and/or campaigns where your play actually matters from game to game).

My thoughts: The store makes its money selling items. They shouldn't be charging you just to play, if they have an area set up to do so. That's my general opinion, however...

If they only allow you to play on certain days or at tournies and it involves closing the store and major rearranging to accomodate games, then maybe I could see it.

I can also see it if they have a "league night" type scenario. A local game club did this where they would come to the store and play on Wednesdays and stay well after the store normally closed. But we paid a membership to the league not to the store, but I could see a store taking a cut for the space in this scenario, especially considering we would have 50+ people there all to game.

our LGS once jumped the price of a can of soda from .50 cents to .80 onvernight. The owners reasoning was that he was a game store not a refreshment stand and didnt want people spending money on drinks instead of games. He realised his mistake when a few tournaments rolled through and folks would walk across the street and buy drinks rather than spend the .80 cents there. I see his point but you might as well provide for your guests...

Not something my LGS does, we all just wander in, though if they charged £5.00 ($) and provided extra thingsl ike refreshments, I would be more than happy to pay.

MeanGreenStompa wrote:If it's good terrain, washroom facilities, refreshment available etc in a nice environment, then why not.

Upkeep costs money. Decide if you would get your money's worth and then make the decision.

This, I've paid to play for 10 years, it helps the store buy new terrain, upkeep and stay open, small price to pay for such a long spanning enjoyment i've received in return.

Ahhh, I see most people are fine with it (which i am), I will just have to check it out a bit more before I decide to buy into this (despite it only being a fiver, compared to my monthly amount of money [and getting there on the bus which is £3!]). Thanks for the input guys, I just needed to check this was a fairly regular thing!

When I had the time to go to stores more often, I'd probably have been annoyed if the store started charging for all access. However, I see no problem with 'membership' offering benefits like priority access (I.E. reserving a few tables for members or even members-only on certain nights) but I think they should keep a few free, especially so they can demo games or try to get players involved that normally play at home.

at my LGS they didn't make you pay and had amazing boards! they had four boxes full of terrain and three already set out. If you used terrain they would keep take 12$ from you and put in a little envelope, if you broke any terrain, they would keep it for repairs, if you didn't they would give it back to you. They also had an 7-11 store on the floor below them.

Most of the game stores that I used to hang out at in the past 15-20 years have come and gone (five in total). We all used to balk at paying a "cover" as well...

I don't see any problem with it. My LGS charges a $5 fee to rent a table for the day. I do the same thing at the local billiard hall. It helps out the local business I like to frequent and it isn't really breaking my bank, so I don't mind. Plus, on the designated nights of your particular game, it's free as long as there is a table available.

It's abnormal, due primarily to, to put it delicately, the typical gamer's thriftiness.

Everybody wants value for their dollar, of course, but a lot of gamers deeply resent paying for anything that they think should be free. That nearly all successful stores in the US provide free play space, there's some compelling evidence that it's the cultural norm.

I wouldn't mind it, but OTOH it would probably limit how often I just pop in to see about a game. Every store owner that posts here has made good arguments why it's simply more hassle than it's worth.

My LGS has 40k every Monday and charges 5 dollars to play. However, that 5 dollar charge becomes a gift cert. In which adds up the more Mondays you come, andallows you to buy something later on. Kind of like a mini bank. Its a good idea.

I generally walk into my local GW and put the kettle on anyway
But yea, it all depends on what you get for that.


If its simply a crap hole of a place that offers nothing, i wouldnt pay.

If it was a semi-decent place with regular players and decent boards i wouldnt mind paying for it.

Living in the US I have never seen this. However I wouldn't at all mind paying a monthly fee if it was reasonable and I was clearly paying for something..Good terrain...Nice environment and so forth. I would not only not mind I would actually be happy to do so.

I don't understand why most game stores don't run a variety of tournaments constantly

It seems that when stores start charging a fee to play, it's usually in response to gamers coming in and playing, but never purchasing anything. Well, running tournaments is basically encouraging gamers to come in and pay to play, with the incentive of possibly winning credit or merchandise in the process. It's a win for both parties, and most gamers seems to be a competitive lot, so it shouldn't take too much persuading.

5 of whatever type of money you use over there (sea shells?) over the period of a month doesn't seem too bad if they have nice facilities.

Incoming layman consumer opinion: You have to look at this in the context of the internet. Brick&mortars must compete with internet stores but, as a general principle, are at a disadvantage because of overhead and maintenance. In this market, the infrastructure that enables you to play the game becomes a product itself. I don't think that consumers or store owners are really comfortable with this idea yet -- or maybe store owners are but they're bound to be sensitive (see Polonius's post) to their customers' discomfort. Over time, I imagine that both store owners and customers will need to accept that playing in a store is commodity for which there is a charge.

I guess I wouldn't argue that car rentals should be free because of public transportation.

Something to think about though. Stores typically rent space by the square foot. Any owner knows that any space with a table is not going to generate him any income as he can't stock product there to sell. Fees for playing may be what keeps the place open.

My LGS doesn't charge but we support the owner with a gaming club of over 70 paid members that he can count on to buy a majority of their minis from him. It is a tradeoff. He provides a place to game we provide him a solid customer base.

So you have to ask those who aren't the "regulars" to stay away? That's not the best business model . . .


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I think of it like this:

I recently bought all the models I need from an army from a local-to-Dakka web merchant. In doing so, I saved nearly $150 dollars. Had I made the same purchase from the FLGS, would that $150 actually go into having a place to play? That's case-by-case. But assuming it did, and assuming a $5/session (whatever that entails) table fee, I'd have to play thirty sessions to get my money's worth. I'd much rather pay as I play then subscribe. Whether the business model that the consumer prefers will be able to support is a good question.

Would you pay to use a table at a restaurant after already paying for your dinner?

I wouldn't bring my own dinner in and expect to be able to use the table.

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italiaplaya wrote:My LGS has 40k every Monday and charges 5 dollars to play. However, that 5 dollar charge becomes a gift cert. In which adds up the more Mondays you come, andallows you to buy something later on. Kind of like a mini bank. Its a good idea.

This is a smart one. My new local (Myriad Games) has a similar setup. Playing has a fee after the first time, or you can buy a monthly membership at various levels (starting at Bronze: $10/month). Each level provides a certain number of play "tokens" (2/month at Bronze), plus other membership benefits like discounts, an increasingly favorable rate on trade-ins, etc. You also get play tokens every time you spend at least a certain amount, IIRC. But the monthly membership fee is ALSO given back to you as store credit. So it functionally costs you nothing if you're willing to commit to buying a certain amount each month.

All that being said, while that's now the closest store to me, I still drive farther to play at another store which has more space and a 40k crowd. I do maintain a Bronze membership at Myriad, however, and play there a couple of times a month with my old gaming crew, for boardgaming and such.

WUWU wrote:I don't understand why most game stores don't run a variety of tournaments constantly

It seems that when stores start charging a fee to play, it's usually in response to gamers coming in and playing, but never purchasing anything. Well, running tournaments is basically encouraging gamers to come in and pay to play, with the incentive of possibly winning credit or merchandise in the process. It's a win for both parties, and most gamers seems to be a competitive lot, so it shouldn't take too much persuading.

This. I think 100% to prizes (store credit) tournaments are brilliant. We have a store out here that does it and it means that they take in $15 x participant number for each tournament and it all goes to the store. In exchange, you know that all of that money is 'coming back' to the participants. Win/Win.

If I lived closer than 30 minutes to my two flgs, I would have no problem paying five dollars a month or what not to play.

I was in a tournament Saturday, five dollar entry cost, for a chance to get a little store credit (I came in second, and got 10 dollars worth of credit). But because of how small the store is I couldn't use my debit card to pay for the tournament until I could spent at least 5 dollars in other things (10 minimum to use a card) so I bought some drinks for the game, and some new dice.

But I definitely agree that if stores held more tournaments they would have less reason to charge players to just come in and play. But then again, some stores can't afford the possibility of giving away products to the tournament winners unless there is a good enough turnaround on the tournament.

Touche. And yes that does happen sometimes. People buying their gaming supply elsewhere and just coming in to use the tables. But even these moochers help promote the product in their own way. The more people playing in an area means more impulse buys and new people becoming interested and joining in.

But my metaphor was in regards to the many people who actually buy their product from their LGS and continue to buy product throughout the course of coming to said gaming store.

So, to clarify, when you go to a restaurant and buy your food there are you expected to also pay for the table you eat at?