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So after a recent game of having the pure utility of an orbital strike at my hands...I decided to take something more suited to them.

HQ
Grand Master
- Halberd
- Orbital Strike
- Psychostroke Grenades

Grand Master
- Halberd
- Orbital Strike
- Psychostroke Grenades

TROOP
5 Terminators
- 4 Halberds
- 1 Hammer
- Psycannon

5 Terminators
- 4 Halberds
- 1 Hammer
- Psycannon

FAST
10 Interceptors
- Psybolt Ammo
- 2 Psycannons
- 2 Hammers
- 4 Halberds

10 Interceptors
- 2 Psycannons
- 2 Hammers
- 4 Halberds

HEAVY
Dreadknight
- Personal Teleporter

Dreadknight
- Personal Teleporter

2000/2000

Now as much as Terminators seem like an assault unit...this is not their purpose in the GK army. They are our objective holders...they are slow and there's a reason you can't find a good transport for them into the fray. They are meant to sit back whilst your opponent deals with whatever other threat vectors you throw at them. Paladins are even better at this.

So the Orbital Strikes either attach to the terminators or sit back separately. Interceptors are kitted to either sit back as a squad and keep shooting or to combat squad into an assault unit and a psycannon unit. These are the prime Objective takers from your opponent's backfield...they can sit and shoot all game long and jump forward last minute. Psybolt ammo is here because you get more for your money with bigger squads.

I have not played with the servo skulls thus far...I will tell you if they are as hit or miss as spore mines or not.

EDIT:List Revision

seems good only problem is see is you have alot hanging back and that means your interceptors could easliy be swarmed or templated meaning that in objective games you could but just sitting and taking shots while not doing much in return

also i don't see anything too threatening. your interceptors can pop tanks but if they aren't quick the whole army could pop them while out of your termies 24"range


if you could run through what you plan to do it would perhaps show more of a insight on how the list works but its strong for what you said it was meant for objective holding, although having re-read this if you get lucky with your orbitals it could be devestating.

There we go...now you see the orbital strikes...

The GMs and Techmarine split into the different Terminators Squads...Interceptors can always come in from reserve or outflank if necessary.

Everything is threatening. I didn't mention Grand Strategy in the first place because it's not good to rely on such things...but if need be...any unit could scout or outflank.

I really do plan on the terminators sitting back and shooting at whatever the orbitals popped open.

Orbitals on GM's is a BAD idea, and double GM's is in general unnecessary.

Interceptors are a lot of points for a lot of meh. You have elite slots open, why not just take purifiers for cheaper and more psycannons overall?

I'd prefer at least 2 Psyflemen, IMO pretty much any list will benefit from them, although here they will stick out like a sore thumb due to being the only AV on the field. Just be aware that your army contains no reliable AT over 30" range, so you will be pretty much hamstrung against mech on t1. The orbitals will help a bit though.

I have played many lists...and Psyfleman Dreads are a no go for me. Maybe a good choice for the Inquisition but it sucks hardcore in a good GK list. EDIT:I just can't see spending the points on an expensive hydra when there are so many better options.

I don't need purifiers...what I need is speed. And Strategy. Interceptors offer this better than anyone else.

Dual GMs is never a bad choice. Ask any GK veteran.

Over 30''? So the back 6'' of the board will be safe...darn. (^_^)

Psyflemen suck hardcore in a good GK list? Really?

"I don't need purifiers...what I need is speed. And Strategy. Interceptors offer this better than anyone else."

Mind elaborating? You're paying more for a squad that is LESS effective than purifiers in almost every way. Only advantage they have is that they are jump infantry, and the 30" shunt, which is admittedly good for contesting, but that's about it.


"Dual GMs is never a bad choice. Ask any GK veteran."

I dont really see what you mean by this... In the last codex you couldnt take dual GM's. The new codex hasn't even come out yet, and I wouldnt call people who have been playtesting different GK lists for ~2 weeks "veterans" of that army. Who exactly are you referring to here? Yourself?

Stupid of me to forget, of course every smart opponent with 48" range weaponry will deploy straight across from you to negate your crappy range and give you the advantage

Sorry for forgetting to elaborate. Stern and a GM was pretty much the same thing as two GMs.

Yeah...If you play GKs you'll soon realize that the less armor you have on the board the more your abilities will shine. Boxing them up dulls the blade. Taking armor in general starts to become a liability.

The Interceptors allow me many different modes of attack...deepstrike outflank...the shunt especially. S5 Bolters are where these guys shine.

With 2 Grand Masters it's even possible to scout the entire army. As I said...I never rely on such things though.

What we really have to consider is the only issue my army here will have problems with is mech armies...in which case...3 Lances every turn can take out a lot of vehicles while my units will endure...some even more well so with bolstered defenses.

ductvader wrote:I have played many lists...and Psyfleman Dreads are a no go for me. Maybe a good choice for the Inquisition but it sucks hardcore in a good GK list. EDIT:I just can't see spending the points on an expensive hydra when there are so many better options.

I don't need purifiers...what I need is speed. And Strategy. Interceptors offer this better than anyone else.

Dual GMs is never a bad choice. Ask any GK veteran.

Over 30''? So the back 6'' of the board will be safe...darn. (^_^)

I think you're going about this the wrong way if you want any sort of constructive criticism. If you just want this to be a "HERES HOW TO RUN GK'S AND ITS THE ONLY WAY" then continue on. Try to avoid turns of phrase and supporting arguments with "XX is true always. Ask anyone." You haven't explained why, and you haven't convinced anyone, or shared any knowledge. Realize, a lot of folks are "GK Veterans" and don't agree with you, and also being a "GK Veteran" doesn't mean you were ever any good with them.

ductvader wrote:What we really have to consider is the only issue my army here will have problems with is mech armies...in which case...3 Lances every turn can take out a lot of vehicles while my units will endure...some even more well so with bolstered defenses.

So your only issue is the type of army that constitutes 90% of the tournament field at the moment? Also, lance strikes can never hit. And they use the small blast template. In a superbly lucky world, you'll get 1 pen per turn from your lances. Against armies at this points level fielding 10-14 vehicles, this feels more than a little lackluster.

ductvader wrote:Yeah...If you play GKs you'll soon realize that the less armor you have on the board the more your abilities will shine. Boxing them up dulls the blade. Taking armor in general starts to become a liability.

I fundamentally disagree. You're playing an army with a save identical to a basic marine, and you cost more. It would behoove you to protect them from fire, and one of the best ways is to utilize cheap transports (which are available now) and sport one of the shining gems of the new book (fortitude).

ductvader wrote:I really do plan on the terminators sitting back and shooting at whatever the orbitals popped open.

How. Your GKT's are sitting in the back, in terrain (only one of which is bolstered). Lances are firing at the tanks across the board, and your max range is 24 inches. How are you planning on firing at the contents? Are you moving forward? If so, you sure aren't lancing any tanks (if the lance even hits).

ductvader wrote:Dual GMs is never a bad choice. Ask any GK veteran.

I'm a GK Veteran, I played the old book from when it came out until about a year ago, and am now rebuilding the force for the new book. It's a terrible choice. You already play an elite army, and you're now pumping over 400 points into 2 models. 2 Models that won't be moving if they want to be useful. 2 models that will never access transports or be mobile. One of these is arguable, two is far too high of a points commitment.

Your main problem is: your scorers aren't mobile. Yes, I realize you can make 2-6 of them scoring using the grandmaster's grand strategy. Now your entire mobile scoring element consists of 20 guys with 3+ saves, no invul, and no transport to protect them.

How won't the lances hit?...a small blast template is a big ball to throw in this parking lot of a game you are talking about.

ductvader wrote:How won't the lances hit?...a small blast template is a big ball to throw in this parking lot of a game you are talking about.

Because 10 to 14 tanks aren't side by side and touching each other, and they aren't all created equal. You aren't concerned as a general with just blowing anything up, you need to blow a specific something up, it's why target priority is so important. Since the rules for orbital relay are the same as orbital bombardment, you flat out can't roll a hit, it will always scatter 2d6 inches, always. Given how small a small blast template is, this means the safest place to be when it's fired, is where it's actually aimed. Grey knights were never meant to be sloppy, haphazard, throw shells down range guys like guard, they're a precision tool. They hit hard, they hit decisively, and they have to, because they can't afford with their low model count to just "weather" the storm. They're not a forgiving army.

And since you can't just aim at something "near" the one you want and pray it goes in the right direction, the right distance, and expect good results..this is where the problem lies. Remember, 10-14 tanks isn't as crowded as it seems, the board is 6 feet long. The tanks are about 3-4 inches wide., and aren't lined up. Some will be off board outflanking, some will be advancing. There is far more "empty" space, even against a parking lot army, the there is "full" space.

Was thinking about taking out 5 Termies and the Techmarine for Two Dreadknights with Heavy Psycannons...leaving 34 Points open as well.

Gives me the dakka and survivability.

What makes up for the "sloppiness of the template...is it's special rules.

ductvader wrote:Was thinking about taking out 5 Termies and the Techmarine for Two Dreadknights with Heavy Psycannons...leaving 34 Points open as well.

Gives me the dakka and survivability.

What makes up for the "sloppiness of the template...is it's special rules.

Heavy Psycannons help with anti-horde, not anti-vehicle, which was your admitted issue.

Explain how it's special rules make up for it's sloppiness.

Well...especially when combined with the servo skulls. Even when the template is partially over a vehicle...it counts as full strength. Now if you can put layers of servo skulls out there...you can reduce your scatter to d6.

Regardless if the Dreadknight has an anti horde weapon or not...he is AT...

ductvader wrote:Well...especially when combined with the servo skulls. Even when the template is partially over a vehicle...it counts as full strength. Now if you can put layers of servo skulls out there...you can reduce your scatter to d6.

If the enemy moves within 6 inches of the servo skull, it disappears. If you're firing at something near the servo skull, it has already poofed in all likelihood. You'll be hard pressed to find an opponent that will end movement within 12 inches of a servo skull, but not within the 6 inches to just remove it. Servo skulls main purpose is to serve as a hard counter to an opponents alpha-strike and tricks involving infiltrators and first turn scouting charges (such as from your own interceptors).

ductvader wrote:Regardless if the Dreadknight has an anti horde weapon or not...he is AT...

Just because you say things are true doesn't make them so. The dreadknight is not anymore a source of AT than a crap-gunned carnifex. He move 6, he charges 6, any tank can simply move away from him and remain unharmed for as long as it wishes. If you give him a PT, he becomes AT, because he can run them down. He now costs nearly as much as a land raider however. But, with a PT, he strengthens your interceptors game plan, and provides a bit of a distraction so they don't take the entirety of enemy fire.

It's still a risky proposition imo, relying on essentially the most inaccurate attack in the game to be your sole source of anti-tank. If you are going to spam Orbital strikes, why not take 3 Techmarines and a GM instead of 2 GM? You end up with more, and their servo skulls (which may or may not affect OSR, I think its debatable and probably needs a FAQ) are cheaper.

Also, taking Terminators with such expensive support seems like a losing proposition, take Strike Squads, for more boots on the ground and protection against Deepstriking armies.

targetawg wrote:

ductvader wrote:Regardless if the Dreadknight has an anti horde weapon or not...he is AT...

Just because you say things are true doesn't make them so. The dreadknight is not anymore a source of AT than a crap-gunned carnifex. He move 6, he charges 6, any tank can simply move away from him and remain unharmed for as long as it wishes. If you give him a PT, he becomes AT, because he can run them down. He now costs nearly as much as a land raider however. But, with a PT, he strengthens your interceptors game plan, and provides a bit of a distraction so they don't take the entirety of enemy fire.

There we go...now thats constructive...I will shift around points in a bit.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
All right...done.

Of course something else I think has been hinted at here...you're only fielding 34 models at 2k points. While yea its GK so yo're supposed to have a low count, all those nice big juicy targets are asking for some railgun fire...and your termies die in droves to plasma guns, so much so I've seen them panic off the table in one round of long range shooting...two guys dead is more than 25% after all. Plus your dreadknights are big tasty targets, and having played against my friend's ig and THEIR orbital strike? having two isn't scarying me at all. unless I clump my army up (which any tau player will tell you not to do...mobility is, after all, one of our most key capabilities to develop firing lanes) those orbitals are pretty much garunteed to miss and to miss badly.meanwhile your termies iwll be sitting on objectives just asking for a barrage of S6+ AP2 fire. Yea the 30" range is a scary ability for you but again, concentrated ap2 fire will just tear you apart. and thats just tau...guard loooove their plasmas and meltas, and, at least in all my flgs's fire dragons go hand in hand with dire avengers for eldar. So while yes your units are powerful...their key abilities are too prone to failure at a critical moment. I would suggest reworking your list in such a way that your only troop choices aren't so easily killed by ap2 fire...which is most easily fixed by more models in your troop slots.

Looking at the list as is it appears to be a bit of a mess.

You've got Termmies sitting back firing with orbital strikes with no servo skulls. They really aren't going to do much if anything. Strike squads witrh 2 heavy weapons and * psybolt stormbolters would cost similar and have far more fire power and similar staying power.

But Purifiers would really add cheap fire power. So it looks like your buildinga fire base and then assaullting with rapid response JI.

Thats fine but your fire base needs more firepower and more range hence Purifers and Psyfleman dreads would be better choices.

Your rapid assault force also struggles. Yes you can turn 1 charge with it but the interceptors will bounce as they've no AT and the likely hood is that all the Dread Knights will be able to attack is Rhinos (perhaps the odd Vindi or Pred) and are dead the next turn. If your going for that you need can oppening from your fire base (Psyfleman dreads).

Also throwing yoru rapid assault guys forward further questions the usefulness of the OSR as you now have your own guys cluttering up that "parking lot" you're firing at and your guys are exposed as your opponet laughs as you shake his rhino and then kill 3-4 of your own interceptors...

I like the idea of a solid fire base and an elite assault force dove tailing as I think this fits the GKs best. But your hatred of Mech just makes you too fragile unlike say BA you can't take horde marines and it only works for them because those Marines have FnP. You've 34 models at 2k none of it protected in transports and little of it with serious threat unless your opponent presents ideal targets.

GK Mech has really come forward in the new dex and fits the army so much better now.

If you're really so interested in the orbital strikes, consider running Karamazov perhaps? This way you could always nuke your own terminators if you need a guaranteed hit in their area (and pray for invul saves.) Also, Karamazov is 200 points as well.

ductvader wrote:So after a recent game of having the pure utility of an orbital strike at my hands...I decided to take something more suited to them.

HQ
Grand Master
- Halberd
- Orbital Strike
- Psychostroke Grenades

Grand Master
- Halberd
- Orbital Strike
- Psychostroke Grenades

TROOP
5 Terminators
- 4 Halberds
- 1 Hammer
- Psycannon

5 Terminators
- 4 Halberds
- 1 Hammer
- Psycannon

FAST
10 Interceptors
- Psybolt Ammo
- 2 Psycannons
- 2 Hammers
- 4 Halberds

10 Interceptors
- 2 Psycannons
- 2 Hammers
- 4 Halberds

HEAVY
Dreadknight
- Personal Teleporter

Dreadknight
- Personal Teleporter

2000/2000

Played against this similar list 3 days ago in Vassal. The guy conceded to my SW army by turn 4.
He just don't have enough range & firepower to exchange with me.

I refused flank him, wipe out his squad one by one, then advanced.

Im a fan of elitist lists that Dakkites say wont work. So I like this list. I plan on playing it or something similar tonight in fact. With an elitist list of my own! Mwahahahaha!!!

Mhmm...too many players get stuck in a box...or boxes rather...and then the box blows up and I stand around laughing at them.

It appears you are wasting a lot of unnecessary points.

I cannot intelligently comment yet, as I do not have enough games in with the new dex.

Pending a ruling on shunting-scout move-dreadknight love, I am unsure as to how this list would play out.

One of our locals is trying hard to convince us that personal teleporter = jump infantry. PT on DK therefore = jump infantry. Jump infantry ride in a raven.

My response?
No.

As of right now it is jump infantry...which sucks.

The put it in a storm raven is bs.

not FaQ'd yet.

but as of now...becoming jump infantry is bad for us...loses 2d6 armor pen...makes the sword a bad choice...can't mave and shoot because he is not relentless...all he gets is cheesy cover saves.

I would rather my dread could jump and use a heavy incinerator personally.

ductvader wrote:As of right now it is jump infantry...which sucks.

The put it in a storm raven is bs.

not FaQ'd yet.

but as of now...becoming jump infantry is bad for us...loses 2d6 armor pen...makes the sword a bad choice...can't mave and shoot because he is not relentless...all he gets is cheesy cover saves.

I would rather my dread could jump and use a heavy incinerator personally.

I don't have the codex, but doesn't the personal teleporter entry in the interceptor squad state (Interceptor Squad only). Does that mean that only interceptor squads are considered jump infantry?

Or is there a separate war gear entry for PT's besides the explanation in the interceptor squad write up?

DK options text (that you can't see in pdf) says "works just like the Interceptor personal teleporter"

Is this a direct quote?
If it is then it seems, when it says "works just like" as opposed to follows the personal teleporter rule.

I think its safe to say that it acts like jump infantry meaning MC with JI capabilities + shunt special rule.

On the raven rule: If indeed They are no longer MC but JI you absolutely can put them in it! so pick your poision if you can't read with out FAQ lol

BTW this isn't directed at anyone in particular!!!

I def. like the Ideas behind the list.
Although I do have a feeling that with a bit more IDk focus or a couple more runs at it, it will be solid and alot of fun ...

Have you seen the Assasin bomb thread? That was pretty cool lol