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I have a tournament this weekend and have till Thursday to submit my list. It's 2000pts, FW is allowed but under 20pl (No Gauss Pylon).

This is what I was thinking of bringing;


Triarch Stalker with THG will target T7-9 units to help the Tomb Sentinel re-rolling 1s.

Tomb Sentinel will primarily Target high Toughness units due to it's exile Cannon being a a tank killer. GP is to deny a pysk power incase it is needed.

Triarch Stalker with Particle Shredder will mostly target T6 and below units to help the Tesla Immortals and Gauss Tomb Blades.

Annihilation Barge will target units that are left over from the Immortals and TBs.

2 units of Deathmarks are for Character snipping, placing on Objectives, anti-DS and line breaker if possible. Can potentially kill high toughness units as every 6+ to wound does an MW.

2 units of Scarabs are for board control and to prevent the Triarch Stalkers or TBs from being charged.

TB will target infantry models and other T5 or lower units. 3 have 3+ save to get a 2+ in cover and 4 have 5+ invul so when they are targeted I can choose which model to roll on to have a better chance of them surviving.

Cryptek with give 5+ Invul to Immortals if I don't put them in cover and to give 4+ RP to the Immortals and maybe TBs if I Daisy Chain them to get the benefit.

Overlord with give MWBD on the Immortals.

Any one have any tips on what I can improve or swap out? Cheers guys.

I find warriors to be more durable than immortals because wiping out a 20 man squad is harder than a 10 man squad. Anyways, how are tomb blades 8th edition? I've got three and never used them.

The problem I find with 20 man warriors is that we can loss a lot through Morale and I only have 5CPs so I rather not pay 2cp to make them pass morale. I prefer a unit of 14-16 and if I am going to do that I might as well take a GA or DDA.

I like TBs, they can always get into Rapid fire range and a unit of 7 will dish out 28 shots and if they can re-roll 1s it make them so much better. Great at killing T5 and low units.you can also equip them to either have 3+ save, 5+ invul or to ignore cover. I personally always take a mixture of 3+ and 5+ invul if taking Gauss. If using Tesla or Particle Beamer I give them Ignore cover. You might want more then 3 though because if all wiped out you can't RP them.

 Klowny wrote:
Times arrow has got me thinking. With a CP reroll the chances of sniping a commissar is pretty good, and it's a more reliable method of killing TH/SS termies pretty efficiently. Most situations still call for the 'smite' but I'm going to start using it ore and more, especially against guard and eldar and other fragile armies

Haven't really put much thought into Times arrow, but the way you describe it it might not be so bad.

Requires more planning and tactics which is always fun when you succeed.


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 Odrankt wrote:

Spoiler:

Dairecon-Necrons (Warhammer 40,000 8th Edition) [100 PL, 1996pts]
Vanguard Detachment +1CP (Necrons)

HQ

Cryptek
Staff of Light

Elites

Deathmarks
10x Deathmark

Deathmarks
10x Deathmark

Triarch Stalker
Twin Heavy Gauss Cannon

Triarch Stalker
Particle Shredder

Heavy Support

Annihilation Barge
Tesla Cannon

Outrider Detachment +1CP (Necrons)
HQ

Overlord
Warscythe

Troops

Immortals
10x Immortal, Tesla Carbine

Fast Attack

(FW) Canoptek Tomb Sentinel
Gloom Prism

Canoptek Scarabs
8x Canoptek Scarab Swarm

Canoptek Scarabs
8x Canoptek Scarab Swarm

Tomb Blades

Tomb Blade
Shieldvanes
Two Gauss Blasters
2x Gauss Blaster

Tomb Blade
Shieldvanes
Two Gauss Blasters
2x Gauss Blaster

Tomb Blade
Shieldvanes
Two Gauss Blasters
2x Gauss Blaster

Tomb Blade
Shadowloom
Two Gauss Blasters
2x Gauss Blaster

Tomb Blade
Shadowloom
Two Gauss Blasters
2x Gauss Blaster

Tomb Blade
Shadowloom
Two Gauss Blasters
2x Gauss Blaster

Tomb Blade
Shadowloom
Two Gauss Blasters
2x Gauss Blaster

Looks like a fun army to play. It will put some pressure on your opponent with it's mobility.
It might lack a bit of heavy support if you face a vehicle heavy army, but then you could always play objectives and missions.

I will be very eager to hear how the two Deathmark units perform.

Looks like a fun army to play. It will put some pressure on your opponent with it's mobility.
It might lack a bit of heavy support if you face a vehicle heavy army, but then you could always play objectives and missions.

I will be very eager to hear how the two Deathmark units perform.

from previous game I found the Triarch Stalker and Tomb Sentinel to be quite the pair when it comes to anti-heavy Vehicles. I could swap the Particle Shredder for the THG but I like the option if having 2 ways of re-rolling 1s

A friend of mine demo-straighted how 40 Deathmarks can cripple Flying Tzeentch Circus and Conscript Spam. Over the course of 4 turns against FTC he killed 4 Daemon Princesses, The Changling and 4 Exhalted Flamers.

All 180 Conscripts were gone by turn 3 due to the Deathmarks and 2 Tesseract Vaults going into flaming range. It was a blood bath but opened my eyes to how well Deathmarks can be. You just need to have lots of them to make sure your getting as many 6+ to wound as possible.

 Odrankt wrote:
Cryptek with give 5+ Invul to Immortals if I don't put them in cover and to give 4+ RP to the Immortals and maybe TBs if I Daisy Chain them to get the benefit.

Can Tomb Blades benefit from generic Crypteks buffs?

I compared Deathmarks and Immortals in my mathhammare spread sheet.

10 Deathmarks compared to 10 Immortals because that's max squad sizes. Gauss is at rapid fire range and so are the Deathmarks.
The numbers to the far right is just a sum of all the wounds. I like to have that to see how viable the unit is towards all targets.


Some conclusions:
- Deathmarks are viable against most targets thanks to mortal wounds.
- Deathmarks should perhaps be compared to Tesla Immortals in the first hand since Gauss Immortals need to manouver into rapid fire range.
- Tesla is of course better against low armored units.
- You actually get almost 12 Tesla Immortals for the cost of 10 Deathmarks. In that comparison Tesla is better against anything but high toughness 3+ or all toughness 2+.

...and of course Deathmarks can deep strike which is huge.

I've just been running them in small 5 man units, but can definetly see the appeal of several units of 10 in an army.
Sadly I run a Battalion detachement 95% of the times which makes it difficult to include large units of Deathmarks.
Now if Deathmarks would be a troop choice in the codex (not going to happen) then they would be amazing.
Perhaps there will be some crazy Stratagem for them, then let's just hope that Necrons can get more CP some way since the CP system seems broken.

There was a guy on youtube who ran .. a gadzillion deathmarks, essentialyl it was all deathmarks and some doomsday arks against tyranids. He dropped deathmarks left and right and eventually almost tabled the nids player, but I think it ended with a realtively close points victory

 skoffs wrote:

 Odrankt wrote:
Cryptek with give 5+ Invul to Immortals if I don't put them in cover and to give 4+ RP to the Immortals and maybe TBs if I Daisy Chain them to get the benefit.

Can Tomb Blades benefit from generic Crypteks buffs?

The 5+ Invul only affects Infantry models but the 4+ RP is totally legal. Taken from the generic Cryptek; Add 1 to all Reanimation Protocol rolls for models from friendly DYNASTY units within 3" of any friendly DYNASTY CRYPTEKS.


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Nice Spread sheet, never thought about comparing them to Tesla Immortals. You can also factor in that they are snippers so they can target enemy Characters without any issue.

The only problem with DM is that they are 20pts a model so 10 cost 200 and if you bring 3-4 full units that's 600-800pts already spent. Granted it can totally be worth it from what I saw IRL. I just wish they were 17pts a model just like Immortals. I feel at 170pts for 10 of them looks a lot better then 200pts for 10.

 Odrankt wrote:

Looks like a fun army to play. It will put some pressure on your opponent with it's mobility.
It might lack a bit of heavy support if you face a vehicle heavy army, but then you could always play objectives and missions.

I will be very eager to hear how the two Deathmark units perform.

from previous game I found the Triarch Stalker and Tomb Sentinel to be quite the pair when it comes to anti-heavy Vehicles. I could swap the Particle Shredder for the THG but I like the option if having 2 ways of re-rolling 1s

A friend of mine demo-straighted how 40 Deathmarks can cripple Flying Tzeentch Circus and Conscript Spam. Over the course of 4 turns against FTC he killed 4 Daemon Princesses, The Changling and 4 Exhalted Flamers.

All 180 Conscripts were gone by turn 3 due to the Deathmarks and 2 Tesseract Vaults going into flaming range. It was a blood bath but opened my eyes to how well Deathmarks can be. You just need to have lots of them to make sure your getting as many 6+ to wound as possible.

2 Tesseract Arks you mean? How could 2 small flamers even start to move 180 conscripts over 3 turns? They'd score 21 hits over 3 turns, inflicting some... 15 kills?

Yeah I meant Tesseract Arks.

Because he split fired his 4 units of Deathmarks Into them as well so he had 5 Deathmarks per unit of Conscripts within Rapid Fire range and used the Tesseract Arks Flamers as well. Over the course of 3 turns he was able to dispatch of them.

So image the 40 Deathmarks shot at the left hand side and the TA flanked the right and slowly came into the middle of the Conscripts spam. He also used a Unit of Tesla Immortals on turn 3 but it was mainly the Deathmarks and TAs that did all the killing.

Huh. its almost 120 on average down to the last model.So they were too slow to get into combat over 2/3 turns? Did he pull back while they advanced and just withered them down?

statistics says the 40 deathmarks (in rapid fire range) dispatch 32/33 models, the 2 TA's do another 3-9, depending on flamer being in range (assuming tesla).


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Ofcourse plain warriors (67 for the price of 40 deathmarks) kill 50 conscripts each turn in rapid fire range, though they couldn't drop into rapid fire range in the first place, and would be a much tastier target to assault with them.

Did he not want to assault 10 lone deathmarks? Ie rather walk them up the field for juicier targets?


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The DM also threaten the commissar for some nasty moral situations for the conscripts.

torblind

Stats say DM should kill on average 33-34 but with 6+ being Mortal wounds plus a saving throw and Dice being random it's kind of hard to look at statistics. Plus he did a lot of damage to himself trying to charge the TAs and DMs.

Nevertheless, the avg is a nice metric to consider, but definitely, some level of variation should be considered too

1: Can Nightshrouds use their bombardment to snipe characters cause they can target any unit they moved over? I know it's wasteful but I just wanted to know cause I like having options open.

2: If I use Triarch stalkers for their targeting relay, does this allow me to reroll 1's on Seismic Assault power, Death sphere bombardment or Stormlords lightning drop? Or are those considered to wound rolls? Also does it allow you to reroll the number of hits when say using a flamer weapon like Gauntlet of fire or dispersed heat ray?

3: If im running Stormlord, Ctan's with Seismic assault and Nightshrouds as part of a horde slap build, am I correct in assuming the order I should use them are....

Ctans (assuming initiative grand illusion as appropriate) - Cause its 1dice per model...

Followed by Stormlord - because you are dealing in all other units in 6" proximity and widdling down horde models could effect this. (The only reason I see to change this order around might be if you are dealing with chaos horrors or stuff that spawn other mobs as you kill them etc and thus you can generate more rolls from this by doing damage first.)

Followed by the nightshrouds who would only bomb squads if they have 4x vehicles/monsters in a squad or 12+ models left for max effect. If no such target is available then base it off highest armor/invul saves cause mortal wounds.

4 - Also I assume the 'within 6" ' on lord of storm is just from the first unit right? It doesn't let me hit unit number 2 and then jump to another unit up to 6" from that one etc until all units have been hit at least once assuming I can keep chaining a route?

We can only go on averages, obviously the dice may betray us.

In reference to clearing out that amount of conscripts, I suppose the TA's tesla would have done some work too.

 Klowny wrote:
We can only go on averages, obviously the dice may betray us.

In reference to clearing out that amount of conscripts, I suppose the TA's tesla would have done some work too.

I'm not saying that having averages is a bad idea, for the most part, I use averages to compare which units I want to bring in my army e.g DDA reliability vs a Triarch Stalker or Tesseract Ark, Tesla Immortals vs Gauss Immortals. It is just hard to average the Deathmarks due to 6+ basically giving you an unsaved wound and a wound you get to roll a save on. In his game the only thing that betrayed him was the TA Tesla Cannons not rolling any 6s.

Yeah the TA used his Tesla Cannons but they basically rolled 4s 5s. He only got to Overwatch once with the telsa cannons on both of the TAs in all the Charge phase they were subjected in.

In my list I hope to use the TBs in the same way he used the TA. Damage out put isn't as much but 28 S5 -2 d1 shots with re-rolling 1s, if the Triarch Stalker shot 1st, should do quite a lot of damage to Conscripts spam and Brimstone/Pink Horrors spam with back up from the DMs, Tesla Immos and Triarch Stalker.

I would think MWBD tesla immortals would be the goto tool for horde control, or be in the toolbox at least

(tip: the fancy dice tool I'm linking to in my signature let's you see dmg output from deathmarks including all rolls (the snipe checkbox if you expand the weapon options) . You could eg punch in 40 DM and 2 Ta and see their total damage output over different combinations of Toughness and armor saves, then add a new army and punch in some other units you'd like to consider for horde control and flicker forth and back to compare)


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Also I agree on the TB part, they also offer great speed to go where they need to be. It would be nice if they could fit in a horde control strategy

Unreal, I'll make sure to use it Torblind when I want to compare different units.

I structured my list to deal with hordes (Tesla Immortals w/ mwbd, Tomb Blades, particle shedder Triarch Stalker, Deathmarks and Tesla Annihilation Barge) units with 2+-3+ saves (Tomb Blades, Triarch Stalker with THG, Cryptek SoL) and high Toughness units (TS with THG and the tomb Sentinel).

Scarabs are literally there to either hold things up or to protect some units from being charged.

Hi dakka. Long time reader, occasional poster. I primarily play Necron and I am working on my 2000 point take all comers list for 8th. I generally play one guy who usually brings either a Deathwatch list (Low model count, big armor, big guns, lots of HPs) or Harly / Eldar (Leaping murder clowns with invuln saves and psyker powers). I find that every list I build has a glaring weakness to one of his two armies, example is I used a monolith, stalker, DDark to kill his DW armor and my low shot count high AP guns were useless next game on Harl transports. Right now I have an inventory of:

Overlord
CCB (Or Anni Barge)
Orikan
D Lord
40 warriors
5 immortals (Gauss)
5 deathmarks
5 lychguard (Shield)
Stalker (Heat Ray)
Spyder
9 scarabs
3 wraiths
3 tomb blades (PB)
9 destroyers
2 heavy destroyers
Monolith
DD Ark


I rarely magnetize despite it being stupid not to mostly because I add narrative to my guys as part of the enjoyment and narrative breaks down quickly when their arms come off. So preamble aside here is my question... I am going to partner up with my buddy on a Forgeworld buy to save on shipping. I am thinking about the Tesla Ark and possibly a Gauss Pylon to build a 2000 point 8th edition list around. Can I build around that with what I have? Or is it better to look at something like a sentinel or maybe two T arks instead of the pylon? I like the idea of a robot death centipede but I also like the idea of my kid going to college some day so I need to meter our my spending where I can.

M -

I enjoy pairing a Gauss Pylon with a cluster of vehicles all of which have Quantum shielding so that not only do they get an invul save in case of high AP but if the GP does explode and do high damage then you have a chance of tanking it.

Throw in some dedicated spyder repair guys and keep em near their respective armor to fix em and some scarabs to rush out of the invul field (though keep them near the edge too) and counter charge stuff coming at you as a stop gap.

Keeping your spyders and scarabs near the bubble perimeter might let you stroll out and avoid the 50% explosion if you're lucky enough that an entire turn of fire power doesn't take it down. If enemies take out scarabs then you can replenish them with spyders.


You could run Toholk with this concept and buff the GP with D3 instead of 1 for living metal, if it's on the board turn 1 but it should only be deployed via TP in case of Seize in my opinion. Ive lost it turn one before. But if you have init and are willing to take the risk for the bisk then who am I to argue.

However since the GP doesnt have Quantum shielding and is just a wound sponge and at best you are getting back 2d3 a round, i'd honestly say putting that on the Tesseract ark might be better cause that thing has its own invul save already as well as QS making it even more annoying vanguard mobile.

If you do field Toholk, fielding him with a full man squad of warriors or two and a ghost ark or two makes the best use of him being a cryptek in my opinion. The ghost ark can also be turned to be part of the GP's defense line castling and the warriors arrayed in front of that and you can just march them at the enemies or keep them around in case of Deep strike or infiltration shenanigans so you can keep your vehicles from getting tied up and deny deployment area by spreading out if that's the type of army you are fielding against.

---

But if im restricting myself to just the models you listed and you wont be proxying...

CCB - (still an overlord with QS so even tankier in the GP field)
Orikon (as himself or run as Toholk or a cryptek if shaving points. Just need for RP and invul. Note - applies to Destroyers caus infantry.)
Destroyer lord + rez orb + staff - 187
Destroyer squad (5x Destroyers and 1 Heavy destroyer) - 390 (keep near cryptek but outside of GP bubble and in range of CCB for MWBD. Hits on 2+ reroll 1's on hits and wounds. Dont need Stalker at this point cause cant reroll reroll so either remove it or have these fire on targets other then what stalker shoots for and all vehciles focus down your Stalker target and then move on once done.)
Gauss pylon - TP matrix - 485
Monolith - drop this in GP's field but between it and enemies and in weapons range - 381
Stalker (heat ray) - 171 (if not WYSIWYG then +10 for the Twin gauss so it be behind the GP and still in range)
1 spyder
1 DDA

check points and adjust as needed...

Tesla ark is really fun, if you have room field it but it will be with your vanguard forces. Run it forward and lure fools into trying to charge it and laugh at their misfortune if you get lucky.

Hm seeing how deathguard got an awesome near 500 pt primarch with their codex, makes me optimistic that we might have a worthwhile silent King waiting down the road with our codex

torblind wrote:
Hm seeing how deathguard got an awesome near 500 pt primarch with their codex, makes me optimistic that we might have a worthwhile silent King waiting down the road with our codex

I can see Szerakh the Silent King being a LoW as well. I hope he isn't much bigger then the other HQs though. If he is the same size as Imotekh and really detailed I would be happy with that. in terms of his point cost. I hope he is less then 400. If he is around 300pts that would be amazing. Unlss they gave him crazy rules that would make him worth 400+ points.

Based off of our fluff I feel like he should have specific weaponary against the Tyranids due to them being our biggest threat.

The Void Dragon would also be a cool model to have as a LoW. Maybe the Silent King will be a normal HQ and the VD could be a new LoW?

Also, after watching MWGs review of Codex Ad Mech and the way their forge world's work. Do any of ye think we will get specific buffs and stratagems based off of our Dynasties? We should atleast get our Artifacts of Aeons in the same way DG gets to use their relics.

Not trying to start a "wish list" just curious on your opinions on what we might get with our Codex

Definitely, I can very well see dynasties getting stratagems and artifacts following distinct flavors. I was impressed by the diversity in abilities they dug out for Admech. Necrons being essentially a blank canvas in terms of wargear and abilities, shold be easy to add exiting new rules to.

Would the Void Dragon fight along side the necrons though? Seems he would fight against them rather.

Would the Void Dragon fight along side the necrons though? Seems he would fight against them rather.

I believe due to the C'tan keyword that if we were to field the Void Dragon we would need either Deceiver, Nightbringer or Transcendent C'tan to be within the same army as it. GW could update our fluff to make it work in a way that it would rather target other armies rather then Necrons.

You do make a good point in the the VD would turn on us if it had the chance so maybe it won't be a LoW or even modelled? I just want it to be a model cause I can only imagine how bad ass it would look.

Almost every C'tan was sharded (notable exception being the Outsider), so we'd still only be seeing a Shard of the Void Dragon... but they could make him a bigger version, like the old Apocalypse Transcendent version (... just not as broken).

Now the Outsider would be a awesome model to have. Even if they made it via FW I would be all over it.

I never played apocalypse before. How broken was Transcendent C'tan?

I would expect to see rules for the Silent King, however I feel that there shouldn't be rules for powerful beings such as the Silent King, Primarchs, Swarm Lord, etc.

I'd rather only have them in the fluff saying how powerful they are. When you have killed Bobby G (or have had him killed) a dozen times on the tabletop it's weird to read about how badass he is in the novels.

What GW should do instead is to give our normal characters more options so that you can create your own "special character". Of course this will not happen.

About the Void Dragon, I would hazard to guess that they must have a large shard on Mars. I hope they don't publish the rules in the codex before they have had a major story arc involving the Void Dragon and Necrons wrecking havoc in the Sol system.

It's easier with the Silent King, because he can just say he has returned and then expand the story afterwards about the Tyranid threat..

They promised that every race would have something coming their way with the launch of the gathering storm series , it should be easy to spin a story that involves both tyranids and necrons, somehow trailing of from where the current empire/chaos/eldar is focus. Trazyn is already linked with Cawl and Creed, that's one possible start.