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Which is better 3 rokkit buggies or 2 deff koptas 1 with a buzz saw.
The buggies are Av10 and can benift from the KFF and being vehicles cant get bogged down in combat which makes them great for parking on objectives late game . The Koptas can alpha strike tanks with scout and bog down ranged units like long fangs.

You basically just said the reasons why to use one over the other. Personally Im a rokkit buggy guy, but if I think the need comes for the super assaulty deffkoptas, thats what I bring

rokkit buggies all day long.

AV and since they are vehicles unlike the deff koptas there is no morale, if one kopta dies the other has to take morale and will possibly run away. I'll take cheaper rokkit buggies all day long, hard to beat 3 twin linked rokkits for 105 in a fast vehicle squad

Yeah the only reason im thinking about koptas is the ability to assault long fangs and back line heavy guns turn 1 shutting them down before they an do anything .Yes the moral thing is a problem but running two you are never below 50%. And turn 1 your going to have a 3+ from shooting . I was thinking about running 2x3 buggies 1x2 koptas i only really lose 1 shot and gain some variety.

They both have advantages and disadvantages, you just have to play with them and see which one you like better. Personally the only reason I don't run buggies is because I hate the old models and I haven't taken the time to convert my own.

I love the deffkoptas with TL Rokkits. The scout movement is great if your going first or second (3+ invulnerable). It will cause the enimy to split its fire or to focus it's fire on the koptas allowing the green tide to get closer. As for the buz saw I'm 50/50 on the subject. I feel like koptas should be a shooty unit not a close combat one.

G00fySmiley wrote:rokkit buggies all day long.

AV and since they are vehicles unlike the deff koptas there is no morale, if one kopta dies the other has to take morale and will possibly run away. I'll take cheaper rokkit buggies all day long, hard to beat 3 twin linked rokkits for 105 in a fast vehicle squad

Agreed here for sure. I love using them to grant me some obscured on BWs or a trukk full of nobz when they are outside of the KFF bubble. You either shoot them, which I dont care about or you shoot the vehicle they are blocking and I get a 4+ cover for it, and that just leaves them unmolested to lob rokkits at you. Its pretty much a win win

The age old question. I like the Deffkoptas, for their scout movement, and against the right opponents the ability to outflank.

But Buggies like it's been stated, have AV no morale checks to deal with and they're cheaper.

Honestly it's more of a personal choice most of the time. I don't think one is obviously superior over the other.

I always run buggies with a KFF inside a battle wagon. They absorb an uncanny amount of fire with that 4+ magic save and once the wagon is in deffrolla/range and begins its endless rampage, the buggies are usually close enough to attempt side armor shots.

For stuff like longfangs, predators or anything that sits in the back, snikrot handles them all.

EDIT: oh and its AWESOME that buggies are immune to lasguns. Plus, everyone at my local club sucks at rolling good damage results so they rarely get destroyed. Just repeatedly stunned. Pretty sure that the driver is too busy puking all over the buggy to shoot.

The copta alphastrike or outflank can be great at saving your other units from being shot. The buggies really add only shooting, shooting that can be purchased elsewhere for slightly more cost... like kans, who are tougher and can punch face with their claws.

DevianID wrote:The copta alphastrike or outflank can be great at saving your other units from being shot. The buggies really add only shooting, shooting that can be purchased elsewhere for slightly more cost... like kans, who are tougher and can punch face with their claws.

But bad things happen to kans if you run them with a mechanized list.

DevianID wrote:The copta alphastrike or outflank can be great at saving your other units from being shot. The buggies really add only shooting, shooting that can be purchased elsewhere for slightly more cost... like kans, who are tougher and can punch face with their claws.

Really only add shooting? Your forgetting when in squadrons can obscure bigger vehicles, and grant cover saves to foot units, so they either get shot at, which keeps fire off said units, or they are ignore, you have a 50% chance of saving against the shot and still can lob rokkits at the enemy. Thats a bit more useful then just shooting

KingCracker wrote:

DevianID wrote:The copta alphastrike or outflank can be great at saving your other units from being shot. The buggies really add only shooting, shooting that can be purchased elsewhere for slightly more cost... like kans, who are tougher and can punch face with their claws.

Really only add shooting? Your forgetting when in squadrons can obscure bigger vehicles, and grant cover saves to foot units, so they either get shot at, which keeps fire off said units, or they are ignore, you have a 50% chance of saving against the shot and still can lob rokkits at the enemy. Thats a bit more useful then just shooting

With TLOS the obscurity is only if 50% of the vehicle is obscured I thought. So that large Battle Wagon shouldn't get it being behind the buggies. Right? (I"m looking at page 62 of the BRB and didn't find anything for squadrons and on page 64 the page for squadrons and found no obscurity rule).

As for infantry yes they get it but a Kan wall would be better considering they can do something in CC.

The deffkoptas are nice for outflanking tanks w/ rokkits. I do this all the time against my Tau brother and if im lucky I can cripple his armor and move in mine.

Hytanthas wrote:

KingCracker wrote:

DevianID wrote:The copta alphastrike or outflank can be great at saving your other units from being shot. The buggies really add only shooting, shooting that can be purchased elsewhere for slightly more cost... like kans, who are tougher and can punch face with their claws.

Really only add shooting? Your forgetting when in squadrons can obscure bigger vehicles, and grant cover saves to foot units, so they either get shot at, which keeps fire off said units, or they are ignore, you have a 50% chance of saving against the shot and still can lob rokkits at the enemy. Thats a bit more useful then just shooting

With TLOS the obscurity is only if 50% of the vehicle is obscured I thought. So that large Battle Wagon shouldn't get it being behind the buggies. Right? (I"m looking at page 62 of the BRB and didn't find anything for squadrons and on page 64 the page for squadrons and found no obscurity rule).

As for infantry yes they get it but a Kan wall would be better considering they can do something in CC.

You could probably turn the buggy sideways since armor facing is no real concern and get something out of it for obscuring the vehicles.

Bingo. Not to mention TLOS also refers to the shooters TLOS, and in most cases the shooter, shooting at a BW with sideways rokkitbuggies, their LOS is blocked 50% or more. Specially for trukks, BWs are harder to get with this one.


Also that wasnt a replacement for a kanwall. If your running trukks/BWs then your not running a kanwall, just saying

^^^ Agreed on not replacing the kan wall^^^ but it seems that I didn't fully understand the obscurity of buggies.

Read the rules on obscured vehicles. Basically if you block 50% or more of a vehicle (terrain or other units) then it counts as obscured and is granted a 4+ cover save. So what you do, since buggies are fast, they can easily keep up with a trukk or BW, and you just position the buggies to block the vehicle in question granting them obscured. So either your opponent shoots the buggies (which is fine since your using them as a bullet sponge anyways) and the trukk/BW is fine, or they shoot at the trukk/bw and it gets a 4+ cover

Jollydevil wrote:The deffkoptas are nice for outflanking tanks w/ rokkits. I do this all the time against my Tau brother and if im lucky I can cripple his armor and move in mine.

I do the exact same thing against my brother who plays Tau

KingCracker wrote:Read the rules on obscured vehicles. Basically if you block 50% or more of a vehicle (terrain or other units) then it counts as obscured and is granted a 4+ cover save. So what you do, since buggies are fast, they can easily keep up with a trukk or BW, and you just position the buggies to block the vehicle in question granting them obscured. So either your opponent shoots the buggies (which is fine since your using them as a bullet sponge anyways) and the trukk/BW is fine, or they shoot at the trukk/bw and it gets a 4+ cover

This I knew I just forgot how narrow and long Ork vehicles are.

Narrow? The front is still as wide as most box-shaped vehicles in the game, except for the landraider

Thats really where ALOT of beef against the BW model came from. Before it was released everyone and their brother made them out of Landraiders because of the size, which if compared, is WAY thinner then the LR front is.