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I got into a mini argument with an opponent yesterday during a game. One of his dice rolled onto a bit of terrain, and it was a 6 (rolling to blow up a rhino), but I said that the dice was cocked. In my definition, a dice is cocked, if you can't put another dice (of the same size and weight etc) on top of it, and the dice doesnt stay on by itself. This scenario failed that test, and he couldnt balance the dice. He disagreed with me, so we D6'd it, going in his favour.

What's your definition of a cocked dice? I thought my interpretation of it was pretty universal, but I guess it isnt.

liam0404 wrote:I got into a mini argument with an opponent yesterday during a game. One of his dice rolled onto a bit of terrain, and it was a 6 (rolling to blow up a rhino), but I said that the dice was cocked. In my definition, a dice is cocked, if you can't put another dice (of the same size and weight etc) on top of it, and the dice doesnt stay on by itself. This scenario failed that test, and he couldnt balance the dice. He disagreed with me, so we D6'd it, going in his favour.

What's your definition of a cocked dice? I thought my interpretation of it was pretty universal, but I guess it isnt.

+1 for me thats how we decide

I hear that's a fairly common system. Personally, we favour the zero-tolerance approach. If a dice is not completely level, it's cocked. Looking to try and get a nice tray to roll in too, to avoid knocking over minis and scenery with dice. I strive for dice purity!

Personally I'm happy to agree with my opponent on what it is first, (though my personal is if it's not level).

The big issue I have is that it -must- be consistent throughout though.

I prefer zero-tolerance cock-ness.

I've never heard of the "die on top" test, however in my view a die is cocked if the bottom face isn't flat on the surface, which would satisfy that test so it comes to the same thing.

It's best for many reasons not to roll dice into terrain, and a dice tower, cup and tray etc. are very good for achieving a good random roll and fair lay.

Yep, we roll in a box lid. Anything which isn't flat on the surface is re-rolled.

Usually when it has had too much to drink.

Zero tolerance, it makes everything so much easier. Remember, though, a dice that lands unevenly isn't a "cocked dice". The correct term is "a Swede"

Kaptajn Congoboy wrote:Zero tolerance, it makes everything so much easier. Remember, though, a dice that lands unevenly isn't a "cocked dice". The correct term is "a Swede"

That's how I play it. If it's not perfectly flat it gets re-rolled. It takes a lot of stress out of it

I typically just talk to my opponent before and roll with whatever they like.

Lots of terrain are on bases that are very thin and the cockness isn't too much, you could go through balancing dice the entire game but we either just let it roll or have zero tolerance.

Expecting a NSFW slang battle

Kaptajn Congoboy wrote:Zero tolerance, it makes everything so much easier. Remember, though, a dice that lands unevenly isn't a "cocked dice". The correct term is "a Swede"

Only in Norway I guess

Kroothawk wrote:Expecting a NSFW slang battle

Won't be long now, I'm sure.

I think that the only way to avoid possible arguments is to say that any die that doesn't land flat on the table is cocked and must be rerolled.

Dice on top of dice count as cocked and are rerolled.

We've always played that if you can't place a dice on top, it's cocked.

I don't care about level (landing on a piece of sloped terrain is fine) but it has to be sitting flat.

The aforementioned die balancing test is what I go off of. It's a consistent enough system that doesn't require a judgment call between two parties with vested interests.

I don't care about the degree of cockedness to a certain point.
Any time I'm playing someone new, I tell them this (regarding cocked dice):
For cocked dice, I always keep the roll, for better or worse, if the majority of one side faces up. So, for dice like this (I show a die with one of the side corners facing exactly up), I will reroll. Like this (I make it so the corner is not exactly upwards), I will keep it. If that bothers you, let me know, and we can arrange something else.
I then ask them their policy on rerolls and usually will accept whatever it is, provided they are consistent with it throughout the entire game.

I also do not take die rolls that fall out of my hand -for better or worse. If I wasn't INTENDING to roll the die, it doesn't count. I make that known in the beginning and, typically, will call out "that doesn't count" as soon as a die drops, before it stops rolling.
We call that not taking "Crap rolls." Other "Crap Rolls" include dice that leave the table.


Eric

What about D4s?

I don't usually end up rolling d4's on a surface that's prone to suffer from cocked dice. Hard to say what I'd do.

Kilkrazy wrote:What about D4s?

Silly me. I was presuming "wargaming." Since the only wargame I play uses d6's...


Eric

I can't believe that.

MagickalMemories wrote:

Kilkrazy wrote:What about D4s?

Silly me. I was presuming "wargaming." Since the only wargame I play uses d6's...


Eric

Infinity uses d20s

IMO, its cocked if it fails the die on top test. It annoys me to no end though when an opponent calls a die cocked because it was a bad roll, and its barely cocked at all, one side being a mm or 2 higher than the other. Even worse when they are inconsistent and don't do the same for those 6's they roll...

@Malf

But I don't play Infinity.

Like I said, I was referring to the only wargame *I* play.

Eric

Arbitrarily calling/checking on dice by trying to balance a d6 on top of it is just plain silly. It's a silly ritual that can be used to influence the outcome of rolls and games. For example, in the OP's post here:

liam0404 wrote:...One of his dice rolled onto a bit of terrain, and it was a 6 (rolling to blow up a rhino), but I said that the dice was cocked...

What if that die had just landed on a 1-3 instead? You might say you would have still forced him to balance, but that's actually BS. Psychology studies have found that in similar situations, you'll only call things out when it benefits you, and you will do this subconsciously. Just ask yourself how strict you've been on this? I bet you can come up with a decent count of similar rolls you've let slide because it wouldn't cost you the game.

Now despite saying that, I'm not saying you, or other players who use this method are cheaters, but rather this is a reality of human psychology that needs to be removed from use in order to make sure games are well and truly fair. It's the reason why scientists use blinded studies and things like control groups. The more human element you remove, the fairer the rolls get.

The way I play, and the way I encourage every player to play:
Whatever face is the topmost face on die is, that is what the die has rolled. If there is ever a case where there's enough confusion as to what face is topmost, don't bother trying to balance a die, just pickup the die and reroll.

You have to remember that, assuming a player rolled the dice from a good distance above the table, and at a good speed without some fancy grip or so, as soon as the die leaves his hands, it is already being randomized. Thus, the die hitting and leaning on some bit of terrain does not mean that the die didn't fully randomize, instead, the die roll simply was randomized to whatever face is the topmost face. In the OP, The very fact that you could tell that the 6 was the topmost die face meant that the roll was going to be a 6.

I think you'll find that getting rid of silly dice balancing shenanigans will not only speed up your games and cause less arguments, it will be much more fair. You might even find yourself enjoying just rolling the dice and leaving things where they lie.

I have become the proponent of if it looks questionable, then its cocked.

the psycho babble argument (while valid) is moot because either side would call for a re-roll.

I like to setup a small dice rolling area off to the side so we do not interrupt the models or terrain in play. that way, its flat, its mostly level, and its not contestable.

my simplest answer is, if all 4 edges or corners are NOT on the surface, it is a cocked die.

Q: When is a dice "cocked"?

A: When it is loaded.

Chibi Bodge-Battle wrote:Q: When is a dice "cocked"?

A: When it is loaded.

cute, but a gun can be loaded and not cocked.