Switch Theme:

We was made ta fight an’ win! - 9th Edition Ork Tactics  [RSS] Share on facebook Share on Twitter Submit to Reddit
»
Author Message
Advert


Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you:
  • No adverts like this in the forums anymore.
  • Times and dates in your local timezone.
  • Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance.
  • Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely.
  • Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net.
If you are already a member then feel free to login now.




Made in de
Krazy Grot Kutta Driva




Nickin' 'ur stuff

Concerning the "Ghazzy in Deathskulls-Lists"-discussion: I read the Goonhammer competitive Tier list article for april and apparantly there was a guy getting first place at Freestate GT with something similar. Also there was a Grot Mob getting second place in another GT as well . I'm no competitive player and in no way informed how big and representative those events were, though.

Link to the article:
https://www.goonhammer.com/goonhammer-competitive-tier-list-april-2021/#The_Tiers

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/04/08 06:54:36


Empty your mind, be formless, shapeless — like soup. Now you put soup in a cup, it becomes the cup; You put soup into a bottle it becomes the bottle; You put it in a teapot it becomes the teapot. Now soup can flow or it can crash. Be soup, my friend. 
   
Made in gb
Ork Boy Hangin' off a Trukk





As I'd said back in that discussion - he needs his own Goff detachment.
   
Made in se
Yellin' Yoof on a Scooter





Looking at the style of Secondaries coming from the 9th Codexes I wonder if we wont get some for just fighting. While everyone in the galaxy excels at fighting no one but us like it. This makes me think we´d fit with a Secondary that rewarded fighting on scale somehow. Say 1 VP turn for shooting or melee, 2 VP per turn for both shooting and melee, 3 VP for both and killing something. In those environs.
   
Made in dk
Dakka Veteran




Danmark

The guy with Ghaz in deathskulls list i believe did have his own Goff patrol with a painboy in it.

Hope, is the first step on the road to disappointment.

- About Dawn of War 3 
   
Made in it
Gargantuan Gargant




Italy

The grot list is extremely skew, with that many grots and 18 mek gunz. Typical rock-paper-scissor attitude that might either reward in a tournament with a totally unexpected and counter meta force or auto lose against mediocre lists.

Deathskull list definitely has a Goff patrol to include Ghaz.

Orks 7000
Space Wolves 4000
 
   
Made in cz
Lead-Footed Trukkboy Driver





Prague

 Blackie wrote:
The grot list is extremely skew, with that many grots and 18 mek gunz. Typical rock-paper-scissor attitude that might either reward in a tournament with a totally unexpected and counter meta force or auto lose against mediocre lists.

Deathskull list definitely has a Goff patrol to include Ghaz.


I wanna see the table on this tournament. There was similar list few weeks ago from the US and the table was clear 8th ed open field....

8000pt 
   
Made in gb
Lead-Footed Trukkboy Driver






Waaaghbert wrote:
Concerning the "Ghazzy in Deathskulls-Lists"-discussion: I read the Goonhammer competitive Tier list article for april and apparantly there was a guy getting first place at Freestate GT with something similar. Also there was a Grot Mob getting second place in another GT as well . I'm no competitive player and in no way informed how big and representative those events were, though.

Link to the article:
https://www.goonhammer.com/goonhammer-competitive-tier-list-april-2021/#The_Tiers


The Ghaz build in this article is a Deathskulls army with a Goff patrol for Ghaz and the painboy.


 Scactha wrote:
Looking at the style of Secondaries coming from the 9th Codexes I wonder if we wont get some for just fighting. While everyone in the galaxy excels at fighting no one but us like it. This makes me think we´d fit with a Secondary that rewarded fighting on scale somehow. Say 1 VP turn for shooting or melee, 2 VP per turn for both shooting and melee, 3 VP for both and killing something. In those environs.


I'm hoping for this as well. A mixture of one's for kill units in X phase, and some for kill a unit over this PL, that kind of thing.

Orks love to fight, why shouldn't we be rewarded for doing so?

I also think we're going to see a change in the power klaw/killsaw dynamic. I think PKs are going to be made the more reliable one, with decent AP and fixed damage, and killsaws being the high AP with swingy damage, but with a reliability bonus if you shell out the points for a pair rather than just one.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2021/04/09 08:59:21


 
   
Made in cz
Lead-Footed Trukkboy Driver





Prague

Secondary obj. VP for exploded vehicles would be also great. Not sure about its competitivnes, but take the burnabommers, snazzwagons and gunwagons and try to spark the chain of explosions could be cool beerhammer scenario. With a decent power to do it and win in the same time

8000pt 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




Discussing in the general forum about Melta and the comparison to Rokkitz came up.

A Multi-Melta is currently 2 shots at 24' S8 AP-4 and D6 dmg with D6+2 dmg if within half range. For all of that a Space Marine gets it for 10pts.

A Rokkit is the same price, same strength, same range but gets half the shots, half the AP and Flat 3dmg.

So with that in mind, do you think Gdubz is going to buff the Rokkit whenever we get our codex, do you think they will just leave it as is or do you think it will get a price reduction?

I would really like to see the rokkit either gain an extra shot OR go back down to 5pts which would reduce the price of a host of our vehicles and units by a significant amount. The Twin Rokkit Kopta for instance would go down 10ppm, the Scrapjet would theoretically go down 20-25pts etc. (Rokkit cannon averages 4 shots and wing missile is basically a rokkit)

 Xenomancers wrote:
It is utterly idiotic...like 8.5 ironhands idiotic to include this rule. I can assure you within 1 month it will be nerfed too...to only be DA characters...which is fine for a free rule that no other marines get...

Just cant stand these snow flake marines anymore.
 
   
Made in ca
Stormin' Stompa






SemperMortis wrote:
Discussing in the general forum about Melta and the comparison to Rokkitz came up.

A Multi-Melta is currently 2 shots at 24' S8 AP-4 and D6 dmg with D6+2 dmg if within half range. For all of that a Space Marine gets it for 10pts.

A Rokkit is the same price, same strength, same range but gets half the shots, half the AP and Flat 3dmg.

So with that in mind, do you think Gdubz is going to buff the Rokkit whenever we get our codex, do you think they will just leave it as is or do you think it will get a price reduction?

I would really like to see the rokkit either gain an extra shot OR go back down to 5pts which would reduce the price of a host of our vehicles and units by a significant amount. The Twin Rokkit Kopta for instance would go down 10ppm, the Scrapjet would theoretically go down 20-25pts etc. (Rokkit cannon averages 4 shots and wing missile is basically a rokkit)


I doubt GW is going to change the stats for the rokkit since it was more or less has stayed the same throughout it's incarnation so far. At most I would say it gets an extra shot like you mentioned, which would help a lot to manage our BS5+. I know units like Killa Kanz and units with twin rokkits would really benefit from getting double the amount of shots so it doesn't seem like a waste of time when you shoot them.
   
Made in us
Nasty Nob on Warbike with Klaw





Nebraska, USA

Rokkit stats are fine, if anything the price will change.
S8 AP2 3D is pretty dang good, even if its only 24" range and on a usually BS5 model. I commonly piss people off with the random rokkit damage lol

An ork with an idea tends to end with a bang.

14000pts Big 'n Bad Orkz
6000pts Admech/Knights
7500pts Necron Goldboys 
   
Made in us
Roarin' Runtherd




I'd gladly take double shots on rokkits for the same price, would boost the hell out of my Killa Kanz and both the Nauts funnily enough as they both have 2 rokkit launchers.
   
Made in us
Nasty Nob on Warbike with Klaw





Nebraska, USA

10pts for 2 shots feels a bit much to me. I feel like we'd suddenly be firing like 60+ rokkits on average.

An ork with an idea tends to end with a bang.

14000pts Big 'n Bad Orkz
6000pts Admech/Knights
7500pts Necron Goldboys 
   
Made in ca
Stormin' Stompa






 Vineheart01 wrote:
10pts for 2 shots feels a bit much to me. I feel like we'd suddenly be firing like 60+ rokkits on average.


Right, but with Deffskullz likely being toned down so we don't get to reroll as much, I think it isn't that crazy given that we can no longer take them on stuff like trukks and battlewagons where it would become overly used. Wing missiles and presumably the big rokkit kannon on the megatrakk scrapjets wouldn't be changed here. The only area of potential trouble are tankbustas and maybe deffkoptas, but even then they would be more reliable for their glass cannon role in destroying an enemy unit before being absolutely murdered.
   
Made in ca
Waaagh! Warbiker





My hope is that they bring the other klans up rather than docking the 1 really good one that we have. It plays so well with our random damage and poor BS.

I dont understand how they can nerf orks when every release so far has been nuts.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/04/10 07:40:33


 
   
Made in cz
Lead-Footed Trukkboy Driver





Prague

 Dr.Duck wrote:
My hope is that they bring the other klans up rather than docking the 1 really good one that we have. It plays so well with our random damage and poor BS.

I dont understand how they can nerf orks when every release so far has been nuts.


Hey hey man! Saga of the Beats with tons of new custom jobs and strategems, clan powers and ghazzy has been nuts? Or our last codex? Or Vigilus Defiant with relikt SSAG etc.? C' mon!

8000pt 
   
Made in de
Ork Admiral Kroozin Da Kosmos on Da Hulk






 Vineheart01 wrote:
10pts for 2 shots feels a bit much to me. I feel like we'd suddenly be firing like 60+ rokkits on average.


I still like the idea of all models just getting 1 shot of rokkit for every rokkit modeled on them. This could easily bring kanz (3 per model) and koptas (4 per model) back into decent shooting territory without making rokkits on nobz or tankbustas insane.

Earth is not flat
Vaccines work
We've been to the moon
Climate change is real
Chemtrails aren't a thing
Evolution is a fact
Orks are not a melee army
Stand up for science!
 
   
Made in us
Fresh-Faced New User




A few pages back people were asking about how to play green tide. Here’s my take. It’s very important to keep your army together and not spread out all over the field too early. Moving one unit of 30 boys onto an objective alone isn’t going to end well. Save your command points for skarboyz, medisquig, force field projecta, hit em harder don’t worry about tellyporta it’s more fun than effective. Bring some grots in 10 man units to soak up some fire and hold objectives when you can hide them out of LOS. Meganobz should be in 5 man units or less your gonna want two or three squads with as many killsawz as you can afford. Mega Mek is very good if you use him correctly. I recently started to bring a bike boss with my horse and he weaves around well enough to help boys advance and charge and also benefits from look out sir. He is fragile and with Ghaz has no invuln so be patient with him don’t just charge whatever is available. Ghaz is too good not to take with skarboyz. For secondary objectives this is always the struggle with orks that depends heavily on the map & opponent. But for games with 5 objectives domination is very good. You can even have success with while we stand we fight if you are running 30 man blobs as you can generally plan to keep Ghaz and at least one unit alive with green tide. Banners/scramblers are good too since you aren’t gonna be doing much shooting. Hope this is helpful and not just a rambling jumble. Most importantly play the objectives not the opponent make them adjust to you don’t get distracted by the beautiful celebrities!
   
Made in us
Nasty Nob on Warbike with Klaw





Nebraska, USA

 Jidmah wrote:
 Vineheart01 wrote:
10pts for 2 shots feels a bit much to me. I feel like we'd suddenly be firing like 60+ rokkits on average.


I still like the idea of all models just getting 1 shot of rokkit for every rokkit modeled on them. This could easily bring kanz (3 per model) and koptas (4 per model) back into decent shooting territory without making rokkits on nobz or tankbustas insane.


That does make sense.
Never understood why its the same rokkit profile the boyz have and the kanz, which are clearly a triple rokkit.
Or deffdread's underslung gun mounts duo-rokkits.

An ork with an idea tends to end with a bang.

14000pts Big 'n Bad Orkz
6000pts Admech/Knights
7500pts Necron Goldboys 
   
Made in cz
Lead-Footed Trukkboy Driver





Prague

Greenblood wrote:
A few pages back people were asking about how to play green tide. Here’s my take. It’s very important to keep your army together and not spread out all over the field too early. Moving one unit of 30 boys onto an objective alone isn’t going to end well. Save your command points for skarboyz, medisquig, force field projecta, hit em harder don’t worry about tellyporta it’s more fun than effective. Bring some grots in 10 man units to soak up some fire and hold objectives when you can hide them out of LOS. Meganobz should be in 5 man units or less your gonna want two or three squads with as many killsawz as you can afford. Mega Mek is very good if you use him correctly. I recently started to bring a bike boss with my horse and he weaves around well enough to help boys advance and charge and also benefits from look out sir. He is fragile and with Ghaz has no invuln so be patient with him don’t just charge whatever is available. Ghaz is too good not to take with skarboyz. For secondary objectives this is always the struggle with orks that depends heavily on the map & opponent. But for games with 5 objectives domination is very good. You can even have success with while we stand we fight if you are running 30 man blobs as you can generally plan to keep Ghaz and at least one unit alive with green tide. Banners/scramblers are good too since you aren’t gonna be doing much shooting. Hope this is helpful and not just a rambling jumble. Most importantly play the objectives not the opponent make them adjust to you don’t get distracted by the beautiful celebrities!


Thanks!

8000pt 
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




 Vineheart01 wrote:
 Jidmah wrote:
 Vineheart01 wrote:
10pts for 2 shots feels a bit much to me. I feel like we'd suddenly be firing like 60+ rokkits on average.


I still like the idea of all models just getting 1 shot of rokkit for every rokkit modeled on them. This could easily bring kanz (3 per model) and koptas (4 per model) back into decent shooting territory without making rokkits on nobz or tankbustas insane.


That does make sense.
Never understood why its the same rokkit profile the boyz have and the kanz, which are clearly a triple rokkit.
Or deffdread's underslung gun mounts duo-rokkits.


Shokkjump dragsta's got 3 rokkits as well.
   
Made in dk
Dakka Veteran




Danmark

Hey guys. Are burna bommas allowed to throw both bombs at the same time? It says it "can" drop a burna bomb, but does that "can" exclude two burna bombs?

I feel like It "can" drop a burna bomb as it flies over enemy units" is a weak word to try and exclude that it cant use two bombs if thats the case.
Depending on how you put the pressure on the word, "can" doesnt have to exclude. like, you "can" get a piece of paper, but you could also get two pieces of paper. I "can" drop a bomb but i could also drop "both" bombs.
Im just confused as they already have a text for the stompa "Only one supa-rokkit can be fired by the bearer per turn, and each can only be fired once per battle.". In no way can you be confused about whether this can be done once or twice.
I mean change that to: "Only a single bomb can be dropped by the bearer per turn, and each can only be dropped once per battle" when the burna bommer has 2 bombs. that would clear all confusion. The Stompa Supa Rokkits are also very explicit in that it cant be fired twice per turn. If you should only throw a single bomb per round, why wouldnt it be explicitly stated?

This message was edited 12 times. Last update was at 2021/04/11 12:13:27


Hope, is the first step on the road to disappointment.

- About Dawn of War 3 
   
Made in ca
Waaagh! Warbiker





 Tomsug wrote:
 Dr.Duck wrote:
My hope is that they bring the other klans up rather than docking the 1 really good one that we have. It plays so well with our random damage and poor BS.

I dont understand how they can nerf orks when every release so far has been nuts.


Hey hey man! Saga of the Beats with tons of new custom jobs and strategems, clan powers and ghazzy has been nuts? Or our last codex? Or Vigilus Defiant with relikt SSAG etc.? C' mon!


refering to 9th edition releases in general being nuts and the prior comment talking about nerfing deffskullz.

Im not sure what ur getting at
   
Made in cz
Lead-Footed Trukkboy Driver





Prague

If there is a wish list for the new codex, put there flamers on MANz for me...

And I mean FLAMERS. Not the joke called Burna...

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/04/11 10:10:53


8000pt 
   
Made in us
Mekboy Hammerin' Somethin'




Crescent City Fl..

 Tomsug wrote:
If there is a wish list for the new codex, put there flamers on MANz for me...

And I mean FLAMERS. Not the joke called Burna...


Not sure I understand. MANZ can't get Burnas they can take scorchas, which are much better. Just need more range. 8" is too short.

"Pathetic earthlings. Hurling your bodies out into the void, without the slightest inkling of who or what is out here. If you had known anything about the true nature of the universe, anything at all, you would've hidden from it in terror."
My blog http://warhead01.blogspot.com/2014/02/the-art-of-ork.html 
   
Made in cz
Lead-Footed Trukkboy Driver





Prague

 warhead01 wrote:
 Tomsug wrote:
If there is a wish list for the new codex, put there flamers on MANz for me...

And I mean FLAMERS. Not the joke called Burna...


Not sure I understand. MANZ can't get Burnas they can take scorchas, which are much better. Just need more range. 8" is too short.


Yeah, it' s Skorcha. Anyway, it' s useless.

8000pt 
   
Made in gb
Lead-Footed Trukkboy Driver






The start collecting box is no longer available online. Sign of a new box/book earlier than we thought?
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




 Vineheart01 wrote:
10pts for 2 shots feels a bit much to me. I feel like we'd suddenly be firing like 60+ rokkits on average.

Compare 2 shots at 10pts to a Multi-melta getting 2 shots at 20pts for Space Marines. So the Ork gets 4 shots at 20pts, 4 shots = 1.55 hits which = 1 wound against T5-7. Against a 3+ save that is 0.66 chance to get 3dmg, or basically averages 2dmg a turn. The Multimelta gets 2 shots for 1.33 hits, against T5-7 that is 0.86 wounds and at -4AP it goes through the 3+ to do D6 dmg or 3.5 which = 3.1dmg a turn.

Now there are some things to look at, ease of access to rerolls to hit/wound, abilities which increase damage and/or shot potential, And in all of those? The Space Marine wins. What about durability? An Ork boy is T4 with a 6+ save, A Marine is T4 with a 3+ and 2 wounds. So at the moment 2 ork boyz with Rokkitz = 36pts, A Marine with a Multi-Melta is 38pts. Again there are a host of other factors to consider, but doubling rokkit shots would make them still worse point for point than a Marine with a Multi-melta but at least on the same footing or will close the gap significantly to the point where you might actually take a Rokkit on a Boyz mob as opposed to going in bare bones.

On the more "problematic" ork units like Tankbustas, ATM Tankbustas are actually CHEAPER than a Boy with a Rokkit, (Which shows how over priced rokkitz are since Tankbustas aren't widely used in Competitive games atm). a unit of 9 Tankbustas would get 18 shots now instead of 9 and would do 10.6 hits vs Vehicles, against T5-7 that is 7.1 wounds and against a 3+ that is 4.7 ish going through for about 14 dmg a turn on average. Not bad for a 153pt unit, A Unit of 3 Eradicators with Heavy rifles and a MM is 155pts and averages 4 shots from the heavy rifles and 4 shots from the Multi-melta, that is 2.66 hits each, against T5-7 that is 1.77 wounds each and goes through the 3+ armor. Those heavy rifles will do 9.7dmg and the Multi-melta will do 6.2ish for a total of almost 16dmg so more than the average dmg of those Tankbustas, and the kicker? at half range that dmg goes up to 22.9

So, doubling the Rokkit to 2 shots each would actually make them still worse point for point than a Multi-melta but would absolutely make them more competitive.

 Xenomancers wrote:
It is utterly idiotic...like 8.5 ironhands idiotic to include this rule. I can assure you within 1 month it will be nerfed too...to only be DA characters...which is fine for a free rule that no other marines get...

Just cant stand these snow flake marines anymore.
 
   
Made in dk
Dakka Veteran




Danmark

Hey guys. Would someone mind looking at my Goff list and say what i would need to change out to improve it? Its basically just inspired heavily by Goff ghaz blobs but im not sure what the perfect loadout is yet. I have, however, won two times in a row with this army. So i feel like its doing well, but im always looking for things to improve upon.


Spoiler:
Battalion.

Goff.

HQs:
Big Mek w/Kustom Force Field (Warlord, Follow me, Ladz!)
Ghazghkull The destroyer of gods
Weirdboy (Warphead, Scorched Gitbonez, Da Jump/Warpath (i thought about giving him super cybork instead of gitbonez)

Troops:
1 Nob with powerklaw/slugga, 29 Boyz with slugga/Choppa. 3 tankbusta bombs. Skarboyz.
1 Nob with powerklaw/slugga, 29 Boyz with slugga/Choppa. 3 tankbusta bombs. Skarboyz.
1 Nob with powerklaw/slugga, 27 Boyz with slugga/Choppa. 2 tankbusta bombs. Skarboyz.

Elites:
5 kommandos (no boss with powerklaw)
5 kommandos (no boss with powerklaw)

4x Mega nobs with Double Killsaws
4x Mega nobs with Double Killsaws

Painboy

Heavy Support:
2x Mek Gunz: Smasha Gun
2x Mek Gunz: Smasha Gun
1x Mek Gunz: Smasha Gun

Dedicated Flyer:
Burna-Bommer


I would run with killsaws for my Nobs in the Boyz squads, but i dont have any Killsaws to spare sadly. So what do you think? What would you change? Ditch the Burna-bommer for more Mega Nobs maybe? Ive spread out my Mek Gunz in order to make my own deployment better, by putting down 1 mek gun, then 2 mek guns, and then 2 again, rather than slamming down all 5 at the same time. I wouldnt go for while we stand we fight here anyway as it would be Ghaz and 2 Boyz squads. and they tend to be close to death if not entirely dead by turn 5.

This message was edited 5 times. Last update was at 2021/04/12 07:09:27


Hope, is the first step on the road to disappointment.

- About Dawn of War 3 
   
Made in us
Mekboy Hammerin' Somethin'




Crescent City Fl..

 Tomsug wrote:
 warhead01 wrote:
 Tomsug wrote:
If there is a wish list for the new codex, put there flamers on MANz for me...

And I mean FLAMERS. Not the joke called Burna...


Not sure I understand. MANZ can't get Burnas they can take scorchas, which are much better. Just need more range. 8" is too short.


Yeah, it' s Skorcha. Anyway, it' s useless.


Lot's of stuff is useless.
It's almost better than a flamer. It'd be a heavy flamer if it had the same range. Just like everything else, 1 isn't very good, 3 or more is way better. Just needs a bit more range.

"Pathetic earthlings. Hurling your bodies out into the void, without the slightest inkling of who or what is out here. If you had known anything about the true nature of the universe, anything at all, you would've hidden from it in terror."
My blog http://warhead01.blogspot.com/2014/02/the-art-of-ork.html 
   
 
Forum Index » 40K Tactics
Go to: