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As the title says, what would be a good IC to put with Vulkan and 5 Hammernators?
I was thinking a Librarian.

A librarian in termie armour or not.

forruner_mercy wrote:As the title says, what would be a good IC to put with Vulkan and 5 Hammernators?
I was thinking a Librarian.

Any particular loadout that has worked well for you?
Also, what does a Epistolary do to a Libby?

Epistolary lets them use two powers a turn, save for two PSAs. Not worth it though of course so don't even bother with it.

Honestly, despite how much chaplains suck I would actually get Cassius. For 25pts more you get +2T and FNP on a chaplain, plus you get re-rolls to hit on the first turn of a combat of course. For me, I prefer re-rolls to hit, rather than forced re-rolled saves, since re-rolls to hit affects a larger number.

AchillesFTW wrote:Epistolary lets them use two powers a turn, save for two PSAs. Not worth it though of course so don't even bother with it.

Honestly, despite how much chaplains suck I would actually get Cassius. For 25pts more you get +2T and FNP on a chaplain, plus you get re-rolls to hit on the first turn of a combat of course. For me, I prefer re-rolls to hit, rather than forced re-rolled saves, since re-rolls to hit affects a larger number.

I would, but Vulkan allows the Hammernators to re-roll hits, and he comes with digital weapons, so he gets to re-roll too.
But that squad with fearless should be terrifying.

Either put a null zone/avenger librarian with power armor in there, and bring him out to thin out hordes or keep him inside and cast null zone to give your terminators an edge against any opposing heavy infantry...OR....Bring Cassius. Mastercrafted only allows one miss per model to be rerolled. Chaplains allow ALL misses on the charge to be rerolled.

SOFDC wrote:Either put a null zone/avenger librarian with power armor in there, and bring him out to thin out hordes or keep him inside and cast null zone to give your terminators an edge against any opposing heavy infantry...OR....Bring Cassius. Mastercrafted only allows one miss per model to be rerolled. Chaplains allow ALL misses on the charge to be rerolled.

Ah, now I see the significance. I forgot that Hammernators have 2 attacks each.

SOFDC wrote:Either put a null zone/avenger librarian with power armor in there, and bring him out to thin out hordes or keep him inside and cast null zone to give your terminators an edge against any opposing heavy infantry...OR....Bring Cassius. Mastercrafted only allows one miss per model to be rerolled. Chaplains allow ALL misses on the charge to be rerolled.

I believe this is probably the best answer possible.

I forgot to make mention that Cassius also brings a combi-flamer to the fight, so he also brings something to compliment Vulkans gauntlet in thinning down hordes for a charge.

SOFDC wrote:I forgot to make mention that Cassius also brings a combi-flamer to the fight, so he also brings something to compliment Vulkans gauntlet in thinning down hordes for a charge.

Which is always good!

I like the terminator librarian using gate of infinity and null zone. turn 1 gate into a threat range, turn two null zone and attack. It's a very scary unit espeically with 7-10 hammernators included.

tetrisphreak wrote:I like the terminator librarian using gate of infinity and null zone. turn 1 gate into a threat range, turn two null zone and attack. It's a very scary unit espeically with 7-10 hammernators included.

This. It is a very nasty combo and it is a really big fire magnet.

Hückleberry wrote:

tetrisphreak wrote:I like the terminator librarian using gate of infinity and null zone. turn 1 gate into a threat range, turn two null zone and attack. It's a very scary unit espeically with 7-10 hammernators included.

This. It is a very nasty combo and it is a really big fire magnet.

Also pretty expensive.

Expensive? Yes. Over 500 points, actually. However, whatever the unit runs into will most likely die, unless it's another expensive death star.

For a more expensive space wolf death star, see 4x Wolf Lords, riding Thunderwolves, with Storm Shields and various weaponry. And a pet wolf apiece for extra ablative wounds. that is over 1000 points in one unit.

If Cassius wasnt a HQ choice, sure he could be a good choice to go along with termies. But unfortunately he is and Vulkan lists cant really spare a 2nd HQ that is not a libby... Nullzone and psychic hood are just too useful in the current meta... all these GKs, deathstars, and DE flicker fields everywhere.

SonsofVulkan wrote:If Cassius wasnt a HQ choice, sure he could be a good choice to go along with termies. But unfortunately he is and Vulkan lists cant really spare a 2nd HQ that is not a libby... Nullzone and psychic hood are just too useful in the current meta... all these GKs, deathstars, and DE flicker fields everywhere.

Yeah, can see how that is useful. Gonna have to think about this. Switching him out would give me another 25 points I can put on something.
What does fearless and stealth do again? I can't find my BRB...

Also, how useful is Vortex of Doom?

tetrisphreak wrote:I like the terminator librarian using gate of infinity and null zone. turn 1 gate into a threat range, turn two null zone and attack. It's a very scary unit espeically with 7-10 hammernators included.

My favorite tactic against this?

Walk away.

Tely-port your nasty CC-unit to within 12" of my units, and my units will simply shift farther away so you have to spend some time chasing me while I empty some light-gunfire into your unit, or otherwise ignore them(what's that? 1/3 of your army is being kited around? sucks to be you.)

Kommissar Kel wrote:

tetrisphreak wrote:I like the terminator librarian using gate of infinity and null zone. turn 1 gate into a threat range, turn two null zone and attack. It's a very scary unit espeically with 7-10 hammernators included.

My favorite tactic against this?

Walk away.

Tely-port your nasty CC-unit to within 12" of my units, and my units will simply shift farther away so you have to spend some time chasing me while I empty some light-gunfire into your unit, or otherwise ignore them(what's that? 1/3 of your army is being kited around? sucks to be you.)

I used to also run them in the shooting phase...and deep strike between 7-9" away from a unit (risky but necessary) before scatter.

Also if the enemy is running away from this death star then my typhoon missile launchers and lascannon razorbacks are just setting up fields of fire and plinking at transports.

Then of course there is always the option of taking the HQ that gives all your space marines Fleet instead of vulkan. Along with the libby, gate close, then fleet into combat on turn 2. It's kinda hard to avoid unless you have fast skimmers to get away from. But as you noted, every tactic has a counter.

Kommissar Kel wrote:

tetrisphreak wrote:I like the terminator librarian using gate of infinity and null zone. turn 1 gate into a threat range, turn two null zone and attack. It's a very scary unit espeically with 7-10 hammernators included.

My favorite tactic against this?

Walk away.

Tely-port your nasty CC-unit to within 12" of my units, and my units will simply shift farther away so you have to spend some time chasing me while I empty some light-gunfire into your unit, or otherwise ignore them(what's that? 1/3 of your army is being kited around? sucks to be you.)

That's a good point, but sometimes walking away is not an option. If it's an objective game, for instance, and they close together enough to be rolled in sequence.

tetrisphreak wrote:I used to also run them in the shooting phase...and deep strike between 7-9" away from a unit (risky but necessary) before scatter.

Also if the enemy is running away from this death star then my typhoon missile launchers and lascannon razorbacks are just setting up fields of fire and plinking at transports.

Then of course there is always the option of taking the HQ that gives all your space marines Fleet instead of vulkan. Along with the libby, gate close, then fleet into combat on turn 2. It's kinda hard to avoid unless you have fast skimmers to get away from. But as you noted, every tactic has a counter.

First Part: Sound tactics.

Second Part: ~700 points for the Deathstar and Typhoon, followed by 75 points/Lazerback means only about 1000 points are left to contend with(and as your 610-point Deathstar is being kited by a few units, that leaves most of my army to fight yours at a 3:2 advantage, points-wise).

Third Part: If you are taking Shrike's Chapter tactics, then the T-Hammers, meltas, and Flamers lose the MC/T-L. Also you cannot have Shrike, Vulcan, and a Gate-Libby

Sephyr: In objectives games, and knowing that your enemy is fielding a vulcan/Gate-libby star, you do 2 things:
1) set your objectives farther apart.
2) laugh at the lack of scoring unit your opponent has.

Maybe I am just in the minority though; I always field 3-6 Scoring units and enjoy the theory that Quantity has a Quality all on it's own(If you have more models than the enemy has guns, you can enjoy some freedom in tactics/Win condition).

Kel: All sound tactics. Well posed.

However to the OP, he asked for a strong accompaniment for Vulkan and Hammernators. My contention that a gate-libby is a great HQ to bring along for the ride.

My question is: Why? You have vulkan and hammernators. What more does this unit need? Vulkan is damned hard in close combat, and the TH/SS terminators dominate just about everything. I can't see this unit getting THAT much better, especially considering Vulkan is so expensive already. So we need to make our expensive deathstar even more expensive, when they can already nom-nom just about anything?

Has anyone thought of running said unit with Shrike, and then joining them. Shrike allows him and his unit to infiltrate.

That sounds pretty nasty. Vulkan, Shrike, and 5 Hammernators infiltrating?

And if you are willing to give up Vulkan's power, then you can take's Shrike's, which gives them fleet.

Deadshot wrote:And if you are willing to give up Vulkan's power, then you can take's Shrike's, which gives them fleet.

Mmm..not quite willing to do that.

I realise you are buildin a Vulkan list, but in a non Vulkan list, without Flamers/Meltas, it can be devastating.

So, if I were willing to put a IC with that unit, either a Libby or, if I have the points, Shrike?

Libby definatley. And Epistolarty isn't useless, just over priced. Being able to use Null Zone and Avenger is 100 times better than having just Null Zone, esp[ecially since the squad cuurently has next to know fire power, or abilty to threaten in the shooting phase, other than a TL HF, or a BP.

No one answered my question about Vortex of Doom.