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Iago40k wrote:
Also keep in mind that its really easy to surround it, kill it and every Priest inside because you cant place them. I think that drill is really risky. If your opponent goes first you have to put that thing somewhere where its not chargeable so Priests wont die through surrounding. This means that slow drill will move over a lot of Board to do something useful. Am I just thinking this wrong?

The Termite is too awkward a shape to just surround that easily.

Something occurred to me earlier today, it’s not amazing but i thought i’d share it just incase it ends up being a crucial play for someone.

It’s expensive cp-wise, but gloria mechanicus allows you to instantly change your canticle. Instantly. That includes halway through a phase. So for example you could have chant of the remorseless fist on for re-roll 1s in the fight phase on, then after you’ve resolved your hit rolls pay your cp and switch to invocation of machine might for +1 str when wounding.

Or even ram as many units into combat as you can and switch to litany of the electromancer.

Like i said, not necessarily game changing, but it could be the difference between destroying a unit and not, and if that is a significant enough play it may be worth it. We dont often have much support for our assault armies, so re-rolling those 1s on dragoons against a knight when you have your +2 then switching to +1 str to wound on a 3 might just tip it enough to outright kill it.

That's pretty good! Also very relevant to the current termite/priest discussion. Killing a squad with fulgurites could be made easier with such means. It is expensive though, as you say.

Octovol wrote:
Something occurred to me earlier today, it’s not amazing but i thought i’d share it just incase it ends up being a crucial play for someone.

It’s expensive cp-wise, but gloria mechanicus allows you to instantly change your canticle. Instantly. That includes halway through a phase. So for example you could have chant of the remorseless fist on for re-roll 1s in the fight phase on, then after you’ve resolved your hit rolls pay your cp and switch to invocation of machine might for +1 str when wounding.

Or even ram as many units into combat as you can and switch to litany of the electromancer.

Like i said, not necessarily game changing, but it could be the difference between destroying a unit and not, and if that is a significant enough play it may be worth it. We dont often have much support for our assault armies, so re-rolling those 1s on dragoons against a knight when you have your +2 then switching to +1 str to wound on a 3 might just tip it enough to outright kill it.

Yeah. I think this was discussed back when the codex first released. Thing is, back then, we were really CP starved, so 2 CP seem exorbitant for anything but the reroll 1s into +1S for Dragoons.

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

Iago40k wrote:
Also keep in mind that its really easy to surround it, kill it and every Priest inside because you cant place them. I think that drill is really risky. If your opponent goes first you have to put that thing somewhere where its not chargeable so Priests wont die through surrounding. This means that slow drill will move over a lot of Board to do something useful. Am I just thinking this wrong?

The Termite is too awkward a shape to just surround that easily.

I mean yeah its base to hull measuring but I really dont see why its odd shape makes it any harder to surround if you want to make it happen. So AdMech player need to have an eye on that. Which means we have to keep it rather far in the back if we dont have first turn. Which also means that we paid Premium price for a transport that drives our priests 6 inches over the board each round and gets blown up pretty easy.

Suzuteo wrote:
Something occurred to me earlier today, it’s not amazing but i thought i’d share it just incase it ends up being a crucial play for someone.

It’s expensive cp-wise, but gloria mechanicus allows you to instantly change your canticle.

Thing is, back then, we were really CP starved, so 2 CP seem exorbitant for anything but the reroll 1s into +1S for Dragoons.

I realised this the other day as well. 2 CP to change canticle back when the codex came out was a ridiculous idea... you could do Wrath of Mars for that! What a terrible stratagem.

But now I go into games with 12+ CP's, of which approx 40% will come back to me... there's some super clever stuff that can be done.

The most basic is... if you get 1st turn, pick reroll 1's or whatever... then switch to shroudpsalm.
If you get 2nd turn, pick shoudpsalm then immediately switch to reroll 1's or whatever for your own phase.

On the downside i realised that my MARS admech army with a TARANIS knight only confers one of the two canticle rolls when using Knight of the Cog, not both. So you need to roll canticles one at a time really.

I think I've only ever done that for the Rerolls of 1 for shooting and then Shroudpsalm. With us having Termites available needing that T1 is less important though.

 Silentz wrote:

Suzuteo wrote:
Something occurred to me earlier today, it’s not amazing but i thought i’d share it just incase it ends up being a crucial play for someone.

It’s expensive cp-wise, but gloria mechanicus allows you to instantly change your canticle.

Thing is, back then, we were really CP starved, so 2 CP seem exorbitant for anything but the reroll 1s into +1S for Dragoons.

I realised this the other day as well. 2 CP to change canticle back when the codex came out was a ridiculous idea... you could do Wrath of Mars for that! What a terrible stratagem.

But now I go into games with 12+ CP's, of which approx 40% will come back to me... there's some super clever stuff that can be done.

The most basic is... if you get 1st turn, pick reroll 1's or whatever... then switch to shroudpsalm.
If you get 2nd turn, pick shoudpsalm then immediately switch to reroll 1's or whatever for your own phase.

On the downside i realised that my MARS admech army with a TARANIS knight only confers one of the two canticle rolls when using Knight of the Cog, not both. So you need to roll canticles one at a time really.

That raises the question. If I have shroudpsalm and reroll 1s do I pick which the knight has or is it order of selection?

 Ideasweasel wrote:

 Silentz wrote:

Suzuteo wrote:
Something occurred to me earlier today, it’s not amazing but i thought i’d share it just incase it ends up being a crucial play for someone.

It’s expensive cp-wise, but gloria mechanicus allows you to instantly change your canticle.

Thing is, back then, we were really CP starved, so 2 CP seem exorbitant for anything but the reroll 1s into +1S for Dragoons.

I realised this the other day as well. 2 CP to change canticle back when the codex came out was a ridiculous idea... you could do Wrath of Mars for that! What a terrible stratagem.

But now I go into games with 12+ CP's, of which approx 40% will come back to me... there's some super clever stuff that can be done.

The most basic is... if you get 1st turn, pick reroll 1's or whatever... then switch to shroudpsalm.
If you get 2nd turn, pick shoudpsalm then immediately switch to reroll 1's or whatever for your own phase.

On the downside i realised that my MARS admech army with a TARANIS knight only confers one of the two canticle rolls when using Knight of the Cog, not both. So you need to roll canticles one at a time really.

That raises the question. If I have shroudpsalm and reroll 1s do I pick which the knight has or is it order of selection?

Wait what? I think someone clipped the quote wrong. That was Octovol, not me. xD

Knight of the Cog grants the Canticles ability, so it becomes like all non-Mars AdMech units. If you change the Canticle after Knight of the Cog, the Knight gets the updated Canticle as well.

It’s probably me breaking the quotes.

Cool that clears that up

For Ad Mech with Knight allies, what's our best options and strategies against Tyranids? (Genestealers, Flyrants, etc.)

Kastelan Robots? A Crusader or Warden? Maybe Icarus Crawlers or Autocannon Ballistarii? Hard to say without seeing a list.

Something along the lines like this with an option to swap out a Dunecrawler and a Robot for 10x Fulgurites and a Termite Drill to add pressure on any Kronos fire support. Might swap out Endless Fury for Sanctuary and Ion Bulwark for Knight Seneschal for the extra stomps and gauntlet swings against Hive Tyrants. A Gallant is tempting as well but I'm concerned with it getting bogged down by Genestealers and while it can take them down with stomps well enough I'm not sure of its overall effectiveness.

At this point, I'm not a big fan of Kastelan Robots in Stygies. Of course, some others here have been doing it. I would love to hear them chime in. But the way I envision Kastelans being used is to switch to Protector mode and kill 400+ points worth of enemies in a single turn, then disrupt movement in their 36" LOS for the remainder of the game.

For Stygies shooting, 3-6x Ironstrider units are really good. You can run two units and constantly move/advance and shoot from 48" away. Rage and Doctrina let you shoot at BS2 or BS3.

Consider Sainted Ion. It's great for <AP-3 fighting and shooting. Gallant is a really bad idea against any horde army. The primary problem is that you cannot fight where you cannot stand.

The idea with the Kastelans is to switch them to Protector protocol and try and take out as many of the horde as I can. Hitting on 4+ isn't great but rerolling 1's with a TPD and with the sheer amount of shots should put a nice dent at least. I like Sanctuary because of the prevalence of AP -3 and better melee Tyranids have, getting it to a 4++ with Rotate Ion Shields is huge especially if I'm going with a Warden that wants to be in combat.

quick question: how do i use the castellans robots double shoot rule in the first turn?

 _Ness wrote:
quick question: how do i use the castellans robots double shoot rule in the first turn?

You need to use the Binharic Override stratagem, it's found at the bottom of the first page of stratagems in the codex.

So I just found out about the transport. I have several questions.

1) Has anyone planned to run the shooty priests out of them? Assault 3, Wrath of Mars, and +1 to hit so that they get 3 hits on 5+. If you fill up a drill, that's 36 shots base at strength 5...plus the extra hits...plus Wrath mortal wounds...and that was without mentioning that someone like me would run like 3 drills. Sounds like they will be useful.
2) Cawl is infantry. Can he jump in one of these things? For laughs? I just want to see him crawl out like some kind of eldritch abomination from a machine that is clearly bigger on the inside.
3) Those drills are designed to kill characters. 6 attacks to start with, wounding everything on 2s, 3D a pop, AND if the poor sod is still alive, the mortal wounds rules are fricking awesome. Anyone going to run them like that in any list? You could almost run it empty just for that.

I only have one right now, will buy a second if chapter approved doesnt nerf them.

Ravemastaj wrote:
So I just found out about the transport. I have several questions.

1) Has anyone planned to run the shooty priests out of them? Assault 3, Wrath of Mars, and +1 to hit so that they get 3 hits on 5+. If you fill up a drill, that's 36 shots base at strength 5...plus the extra hits...plus Wrath mortal wounds...and that was without mentioning that someone like me would run like 3 drills. Sounds like they will be useful.
2) Cawl is infantry. Can he jump in one of these things? For laughs? I just want to see him crawl out like some kind of eldritch abomination from a machine that is clearly bigger on the inside.
3) Those drills are designed to kill characters. 6 attacks to start with, wounding everything on 2s, 3D a pop, AND if the poor sod is still alive, the mortal wounds rules are fricking awesome. Anyone going to run them like that in any list? You could almost run it empty just for that.

1. I've been throwing Vanguard in them so no comment.
2. The rules of the Drill forbid him.
3. Definitely run them at something worth a good amount of points if you can. I imagine they can take even a good chunk off a Knight but I haven't run the math on it as I haven't made a successful charge with them ever yet.

Ravemastaj wrote:
So I just found out about the transport. I have several questions.

1) Has anyone planned to run the shooty priests out of them? Assault 3, Wrath of Mars, and +1 to hit so that they get 3 hits on 5+. If you fill up a drill, that's 36 shots base at strength 5...plus the extra hits...plus Wrath mortal wounds...and that was without mentioning that someone like me would run like 3 drills. Sounds like they will be useful.
2) Cawl is infantry. Can he jump in one of these things? For laughs? I just want to see him crawl out like some kind of eldritch abomination from a machine that is clearly bigger on the inside.
3) Those drills are designed to kill characters. 6 attacks to start with, wounding everything on 2s, 3D a pop, AND if the poor sod is still alive, the mortal wounds rules are fricking awesome. Anyone going to run them like that in any list? You could almost run it empty just for that.

The Protector Doctrinal Imperative can't be used on Electro-Priests as they aren't Skitarii and as said already Cawl isn't allowed in a Drill. If you can attack a character with the drill you'll probably do a lot of damage, they seem like they'd be good against light vehicles as well. Really looking forward to trying my pair out when I get them.

Ravemastaj wrote:
So I just found out about the transport. I have several questions.

1) Has anyone planned to run the shooty priests out of them? Assault 3, Wrath of Mars, and +1 to hit so that they get 3 hits on 5+. If you fill up a drill, that's 36 shots base at strength 5...plus the extra hits...plus Wrath mortal wounds...and that was without mentioning that someone like me would run like 3 drills. Sounds like they will be useful.
2) Cawl is infantry. Can he jump in one of these things? For laughs? I just want to see him crawl out like some kind of eldritch abomination from a machine that is clearly bigger on the inside.
3) Those drills are designed to kill characters. 6 attacks to start with, wounding everything on 2s, 3D a pop, AND if the poor sod is still alive, the mortal wounds rules are fricking awesome. Anyone going to run them like that in any list? You could almost run it empty just for that.

I've tried the shooty priests in the drill. They're pretty good against infantry, but as others pointed out you can't boost their to hit roll with the skitarri specific stratagem. If you want to go for a bomb using wrath of mars, basic vanguard are cheaper and have the same number of shots. Infiltrators with uzis would have the most shots and if you take 10 they only cost 20 more points than the shooty priests and they could do some work in the assault phase.

bogalubov wrote:

Ravemastaj wrote:
So I just found out about the transport. I have several questions.

1) Has anyone planned to run the shooty priests out of them? Assault 3, Wrath of Mars, and +1 to hit so that they get 3 hits on 5+. If you fill up a drill, that's 36 shots base at strength 5...plus the extra hits...plus Wrath mortal wounds...and that was without mentioning that someone like me would run like 3 drills. Sounds like they will be useful.
2) Cawl is infantry. Can he jump in one of these things? For laughs? I just want to see him crawl out like some kind of eldritch abomination from a machine that is clearly bigger on the inside.
3) Those drills are designed to kill characters. 6 attacks to start with, wounding everything on 2s, 3D a pop, AND if the poor sod is still alive, the mortal wounds rules are fricking awesome. Anyone going to run them like that in any list? You could almost run it empty just for that.

I've tried the shooty priests in the drill. They're pretty good against infantry, but as others pointed out you can't boost their to hit roll with the skitarri specific stratagem. If you want to go for a bomb using wrath of mars, basic vanguard are cheaper and have the same number of shots. Infiltrators with uzis would have the most shots and if you take 10 they only cost 20 more points than the shooty priests and they could do some work in the assault phase.

A squad of 10 infiltrators (22 each) is 80pts more expensive than a squad of 10 corpuscarii (14 each)

But you do get more wounds with infiltrators, but better saves with priests, depends what you’re up against.

Your cheapest wrath of mars candidate WOULD be Peltasts at 90pts per squad of 10 for 40 shots at 12” and +2 to hit from doctrina. But sadly they dont have the forgeworld keyword, so bleh.

Corpuscarii are probably still your best bet for a drill wrath bomb. Remember you can also pick up some mortal wounds from the priests voltageist shield when charging. BUT infiltrators get to use those pistols with wrath of mars while in combat range, which the priests dont. Corpuscarii are probably still your best bet.

Thats if your 4-6 robots arent in range of anything, because the number of shots far outstrips the 1 less balistic skill of any unit anywhere in any army.

I’ve stopped taking Cawl with my robots because it just feels unfair. Even without a tech-priest buddy they’re more than enough to delete a unit or two of anything short of a LoW.

I think Stygies Drill + Fulgurites is the way to go. Infiltrate the Drill, move into position, pop out and fight the next turn.

I am in the process of stripping and rebasing my Peltasts for use as Vanguard/Rangers. If they were the Troop slot, I might consider using them, but they're sort of a disappointment in how they lack synergy with Knights and such.

I have yet to try this, but I'm sure some you guys have. I'm thinking of a unit of 11, and a unit of 12 fulgurites in drills accompanied by a tech priest engineseer with the omnicient mask. I also plan on a third drill with 2 units of 6 vanguard with 2 plasma calivers in each to drop in a bit of close range fire support. I think that sounds pretty mean.

Problem is the Omniscient Mask only works on Skitarii, Electropriests are Cult Mechanicus, I would probably only use it if I was infiltrating Dragoons nearby. I'd stuff an Enginseer in anyway though just to repair the Drill, I feel like it could do a lot of work by itself.

The main issue remains for ad mech. Codex is trash designed early released and bad written.

1) you are forced to use guard for cp cycling. 5+/5+ don't even come close to 6+ for every stratagem used not CP used.

So main change 6+ for every CP used.

2) the hq no synergy tax. We got no real aura from our hq. The mask does not work the CP won't be used with synergy . And it's not a complain it's a fact. You got specific ad mech strats. Period

Mask won't synergise troops don't worth it can't make hq combo beyond Cawl and if try to take inflitrators or peltast etc you again pay tax in points vs other armies for no real plan .

3) the duo dimension strategy stygies Dragoons - priests maybe drill and Cawl star competitive wise has no competition rest are semi working!

Why invest 2*5 ppasma vang in a drill? Semi competitive vs many assault armies /points invest
Priests we got the infiltration and it's good waste 130 pints for a drill just to lower the unit count is not optimal for me still viable and somewhat forming our one strat.

Lastly if we are to support other armies as vehicle killers then again we are forced to take dakka lines and soup screen . I really don't understand the whole design for ad mech it still feels badly designed? After lowering the cost after some codex even transport still feels bad.

Take the knight detachment once more is a must take and the current state of the game clearly shows knights are atm strong.

Ad mech is for me the best ally for knights maybe with guard. So competitive wise ad mech will not top solo.

And I strongly believe this now cause I hoped maybe a force of 2*19 priests Dragoons ec could do it but they wont!

Superheavy Castelan +helverins and stygies /guard should be the most wise play for me. If you run low priest count you will have issues producing mortals but ...

All other options will severely change the point/ result ratio.

I will really gonna try make a Cawl star work with some melee knight but we again have to sacrifice a lot to take robots and won't have effective screen once more!

I pressure we should be happy ad mech is at least shown in etc breakdown other armies didn't make it.

Hey guys, for those interested I started a Tactica for the upcoming Kill Team game, here's the link https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/760770.page

Mr. Funktastic wrote:
Problem is the Omniscient Mask only works on Skitarii, Electropriests are Cult Mechanicus, I would probably only use it if I was infiltrating Dragoons nearby. I'd stuff an Enginseer in anyway though just to repair the Drill, I feel like it could do a lot of work by itself.

Dang, overlooked that. Then I'll go balls to the wall and put in a tech priest dominus warlord with the hermitcon warlord trait.

So now that the Knight codex is out for a few weeks what are your guys experience.
What is our most strongest soup option? AdMech + Guard + Blood Angels or AdMech + Knight(s) + Guard / BA?