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Greetings,

the phrasing of veil starts with "instead of moving normally...'do X'" and occurs at the start of the movement phase

Question 1: Does this inherently infer that you must be able to move "normally" to use the veil in any capacity?
Sub-Question A: What necessitates a 'normal' move exactly?

This is important for tactical considerations in light of :

A) If I am pinned or gone to ground, at the start of my next movement phase may I simply use the Veil instead of trying to move normally-- which would be prohibited.

B) If I fail in assault and fall back (more than 6 inches from enemy), at the start of my next movement phase I have to take the test to regroup and then, normally, move D3 into consolidation.... may I instead take the test and later choose to use the veil for movement instead?

C) If I fail in assault and fall back but am still within 6 inches and would normally fall back an addition 2D6 may I instead use the veil for movement?-- In this instance, transporting away from the edge and hopefully away from the enemy so that I may succeed in the test the following turn?

I am leaning towards 'maybe' on A, and no on B and C due to rules calling for other specific movement types. Are there other similar abilities and situations which have already been debated? Perhaps regarding GK teleports?

Thank you,

The Dragon


Automatically Appended Next Post:
*I stand corrected about it being used at beginning of the Cryptech's movement phase. All it says, verbatim is:

"A Cryptech with a veil of darkness can use it in its movement phase instead of moving normally"

Still, the question of normaility remains.

Is any movement occurring in the 'movement phase
technically normal i.e. any fallback/pin?

I would say that units that are pinned or falling back also do not move normally. One might claim that they are moving normally for a unit that is falling back, but the qualifier *for a unit that is falling back* is not the normal move.

The problem remains that veil offers an alternative option to moving normally without necessarily requiring that you be able TO move normally.

I am disinclined to allow it, but not prohibted from currently.

Another possible comparison suggested to me has been the Codex:SM Gate of Infinity Psychic Power which involves teleportation at the start of the unit's movement phase.

I will ask again if these issues have verifiably been covered already.

I would classify "normal" movement as any movement that is unrestricted by prohibitive circumstance. That is, movement that -must- be made (such as falling back) is not normal.

I would say no to all those things.

I appreciate the erm.. input so far (come on people, over a hundred and fourty views but almost no comments!).

An issue I am having with the responses so far however is that essentially it has ALL been RAI i.e. read as intended.

We can tell the intent is to use veil in place of normal movement and the rule obviously supports that. Veil is thus an alternative moment.... however because it has an alternative movement (read: you're taking models off the table and deepstriking rather than ACTUALLY moving) it begs the question of what restrictions, limitations,etc remain.

I understand folks are maybe sort of leaning the same way, but perhaps a more substantive rules-based opinion beyond "I don't like it" or "I don't think so" can be offered.

Thanks. I'm really just hoping to have something of a discussion on this to understand all the angles involved.

mikhaila wrote:I would say no to all those things.

This does not answer the OP's questions in any way.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
"A Cryptech with a veil of darkness can use it in its movement phase instead of moving normally"

I think that you would have to be able to move normally to be able to use this. A 'normal' move would be as defined starting on page 11. Random and Compulsory moves are differentiated. Going to Ground, being Pinned, Falling Back, Consolidating, these are not situations in which you get to move normally.

Ghenghis Jon wrote:

mikhaila wrote:I would say no to all those things.

This does not answer the OP's questions in any way.

Wasn't feeling like arguing forever over it. If someone wanted to use any of those 'alternate ways' of moving with a veil, in any tournament or gt I was TO at, I'd say 'NO'.

This section of the forums is called "YMDC". That's the call I'd make in this situation. Feel free to argue it to death, but I see the likelihood of anyone letting someone get away with this to be slight at best.

mikhaila wrote:Wasn't feeling like arguing forever over it. If someone wanted to use any of those 'alternate ways' of moving with a veil, in any tournament or gt I was TO at, I'd say 'NO'.

This section of the forums is called "YMDC". That's the call I'd make in this situation. Feel free to argue it to death, but I see the likelihood of anyone letting someone get away with this to be slight at best.

This is a rules discussion forum. The OP's fundamental question was not about using the Veil, it was about the game definition of 'normal movement'. The OP was not asking for your unsubstantiated opinion. If you didn't feel like contributing supporting arguments, why would you type anything at all?