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Made in de
Decrepit Dakkanaut







Hi,
guess this should not be buried in the release schedule thread.

Hastings, a trusted rumour monger for years, announced quitting the rumour business because 80% of current rumours are deliberately made up. This started a heated Warseer discussion on credibility of rumours, in which ghost21 posted this
ghost21 wrote:I made It up,I wont be posting any more

So if you see an old rumour thread with rumours by him, don't give it any value. This includes a lot of Tau, Black Templar, Sororitas, Eldar, Hrud, Fantasy Contingent Supplement among others. While his first correct rumours about Dreadfleet gave him some credibility, he was wrong on a real Sororitas Codex with plastic releases and most other things that were released until now. That's why I was reluctant lately to post his rumours when not backed up by real rumour mongers like Harry, Hastings, BramGaunt and Frgt/10. But keep in mind that some things may turn out true even if made up, because ghost21 read rumour threads and used part of it when making up things.

So the quantity of real rumours remains quite low due to GW's anti-word-of-mouth-campaign. While rumours are not facts and always can turn out false, a few black sheep deliberately make up rumours to enjoy public attention. This is not cool. But we have to deal with this. Good thing seems to be that Hastings is back posting rumours about the next 40k starter set

Cheers, Kroothawk

BTW, here an insightful post on the topic by straightsilver:
I used to post rumours fairly regularly, and more often thatn not they haven't always panned out at all, or if they did not in the way that was expected.

I'm sure this is the case for all the rumour mongers.

This doesn't necessarily mean that the rumour was strictly wrong, things do change but there is also an element of Chinese Whispers as well.

By the time it gets to Warseer (or other forums) it is more often than not 3rd hand information at least.

There has only been one rumour that I have posted that I was 100% certain about, and that's because it came directly from Jes Goodwin, however in in that instance I feel out of respect for Jes that maybe I shouldn't have posted it,

Although in my defence it wasn't apparent that anything he said was top secret, but in hindsight maybe it was only meant for my ears and not the wider community.

I have however posted other rumours when I wasn't so sure because I thought it's what the community wanted, but unfortunately that isn't always the case.

Rumours are just that. The only people that really know are the people at the top, and it's not often that anybody gets to speak to them.

I have 2 sources at GW HQ, both of whom I have been friends with for 20 or so years, and both of whom hold positions that I would consider to be very reliable.

However they are not necessarily privy to the GW release schedule, just what projects they are working on at the time.

We alll know that GW often holds back releases until they feel it is the optimum time for them to sel them, and more often than not they are held back for a reason, and that means changes will be made.

And any source is of course only human, they have opinions and predictions of their own, which then get passed on by somebody else, and somebody else etc. These rumours get embellished and added to long before they get onto the internet.

GW at the very least know 3 months in advance what is coming as that's when White Dwarf is sent to the printers, but I suspect it is a bit more than that.

What I will say is that I have held back on posting rumours for several reasons.

One of which is the trolling or flaming that occurs, but to be honest I am big enough and old enough to ignore that.

But the other reason is because I have been asked not to. I haven't got anybody into trouble, but obviously things said to me by my friends probably shouldn't be repeated on these types of forums.

And the other simple reason is that there simply aren't that many rumours at the moment, or at least not that I can discern.

Thinngs at GW HQ have got a lot tighter, sources have become a lot more tight lipped and although people are working on projects they aren't necessarily told when these things will be released, they are as in the dark as the rest of us.

Obviously they have the same deadlines but this doesn't necessarily equate to a release date any more.

There are projects that have been on the go for more than 2 years now, but there is no indication they will be released any time soon.

So I guess my point is don't be too hard on thhose that do provide rumours, just accept that's alll they are unless they can be absolutely certain it's true (which more often then not thhey can't).

If I would also address the OP, the reason there are simply so many rumours regarding 40K at the moment is simply that there is just so much 40K stuff going on at Notts at the moment.

It is quite possible that projects that should have come out last year were being held back for the 25th aniversary, or it may just be that upon completion GW weren't happy with the end project and had put it on hold.

I would also like to say thankyou to all the rumour mongers, I still enjoy reading them even if they don't pan out so don't be put off posting them.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2012/01/31 15:31:18


Hive Fleet Ouroboros (my Tyranid blog): http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/286852.page
The Dusk-Wraiths of Szith Morcane (my Dark Eldar blog): http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/364786.page
Kroothawk's Malifaux Blog http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/455759.page
If you want to understand the concept of the "Greater Good", read this article, and you never again call Tau commies: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utilitarianism 
   
Made in ie
Dominating Dominatrix






Dublin, Ireland

Cheers Krooty.

Dman137 wrote:
goobs is all you guys will ever be

By 1-irt: Still as long as Hissy keeps showing up this is one of the most entertaining threads ever.

"Feelin' goods, good enough". 
   
Made in gb
Willing Inquisitorial Excruciator





Classified

Frankly it's no surprise, but it's useful to see it confirmed.

Thanks Kroothawk.



Red Hunters: 2000 points Grey Knights: 2000 points Black Legion: 600 points and counting 
   
Made in us
Badass "Sister Sin"






Camas, WA

No way, ghost21 is unreliable!

Now you have a lot of thread editing to do, Kroothawk.

Live in the Pacific NW? Check out http://ordofanaticus.com
Want to know your rumor monger's history? Check out the Ongoing Rumor Accuracy Tracking thread

"For this thread to have some utility and remain useful, please refrain from spamming it with 'jokes'." - Alpharius
"Irrational negativity is the engine that drives the forums" - BrassScorpion
"It's too early to be crying about this. Maybe next month all your tears will be valid." - Redbeard

190+ Successful Trades on Dakka.
My trade list: http://mindtaker.org/trade.html 
   
Made in us
[DCM]
Pre Heresy Black Templar Librarian






North of Chicago, IL USA

I thought the ghost versus Aaron Demsky Bowden exchange was pretty damning...

Forgeworld Download Page <-- Here there be cool stuff! DA:70S+G+M+B++I++Pw40k08+D++A++/fWD-R+T(M)DM+
 
   
Made in ie
Dominating Dominatrix






Dublin, Ireland

Link? Slow day in work.

Dman137 wrote:
goobs is all you guys will ever be

By 1-irt: Still as long as Hissy keeps showing up this is one of the most entertaining threads ever.

"Feelin' goods, good enough". 
   
Made in gb
Infiltrating Prowler






Yorkshire, UK

Thanks for this Kroot (not to mention your sterling efforts in collating rumours on behalf of lazy buggers like me ).

It is a shame that advance knowledge of anything is becoming increasingly difficult to get hold of and I do appreciate straightsilver's difficult position (I wouldn't like to think I could be getting my mates into trouble just for internet cookies) and his candour in that post.

The real tragedy, of course is that GW cannot throw us a bone themselves. The buzz created by the 6th ed playtest leak was quite incredible, given the usual level of vitriol sent in GWs direction - including by myself as I'll be the first to admit. At some point they may see the value in building up anticipation in their fanbase (presumably when the company is run by people who know one end of a network cable from another) but until then we'll have to feed off the crumbs

At least some of the reliable sources are battling on. Fingers crossed that we can start to get a better feel of things as we go through the next few months.

While you sleep, they'll be waiting...

Have you thought about the Axis of Evil pension scheme? 
   
Made in us
Lord Commander in a Plush Chair





Norristown, PA

doesn't surprise me that this stuff happens. I like to read rumors but I really don't bother believing anything till I see it come from GW (a day before it's released).

   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran





Between being wrong about Sisters, inferring Blood of Kittens to be untrustworthy, the Hrud codex rumors were all pretty damning, but politely being eviscerated by ADB was the final nail in the coffin.

....really, guys? A Hrud codex? That should have sent red flags all over the place.
   
Made in de
Decrepit Dakkanaut







pretre wrote:No way, ghost21 is unreliable!
Now you have a lot of thread editing to do, Kroothawk.

Actually no, because I always state the sources I quote.

And when MajorTom11 urged me two months ago to compile ghost21's numerous Tau rumours, this is what I replied (25th November):
Hi Major,
I might do it by just tsarting a new thread and you then closing this one.
To be frank, I am uncomfortable with posting the flood of ghost21 rumours. He was dead on with Dreadfleet and that was his entry in the rumour business. He then flooded Warseer with rumours about everything, some far in the future (including the Hrud Codex he believes in but seems to just be a joke test Codex for internal training purposes), the rest proven false like his detailed description of the August Sororitas release (slight chance that the miniatures are ready and he saw then, but big chance that it was either made up or fed falsly).

On Tau, some things are nobrainers and easy to invent, other things sound fishy like "similar to the Battletech mech with the ancient weapon name"

That's why I didn't start a Chaos Codex and Black Templar thread: Too far in the future, only source ghost21. I posted stickmonkey also speculative and far future rumours, but somehow I have a bad feeling with this one and would prefer to have ghost21 proven more reliable.

Anyway, I will start a new Tau thread with a certain disclaimer on salt usage. Hope that helps.
Cheers, Kroothawk.

Hive Fleet Ouroboros (my Tyranid blog): http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/286852.page
The Dusk-Wraiths of Szith Morcane (my Dark Eldar blog): http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/364786.page
Kroothawk's Malifaux Blog http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/455759.page
If you want to understand the concept of the "Greater Good", read this article, and you never again call Tau commies: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utilitarianism 
   
Made in us
Badass "Sister Sin"






Camas, WA

I was joshing.

Live in the Pacific NW? Check out http://ordofanaticus.com
Want to know your rumor monger's history? Check out the Ongoing Rumor Accuracy Tracking thread

"For this thread to have some utility and remain useful, please refrain from spamming it with 'jokes'." - Alpharius
"Irrational negativity is the engine that drives the forums" - BrassScorpion
"It's too early to be crying about this. Maybe next month all your tears will be valid." - Redbeard

190+ Successful Trades on Dakka.
My trade list: http://mindtaker.org/trade.html 
   
Made in us
[MOD]
Fixture of Dakka






San Jose, CA

<preemptive warning here - so far, the thread has been nice & civil; please keep it that way>

Quis Custodiet Ipsos Custodes? 
   
Made in us
Ultramarine Master with Gauntlets of Macragge





Boston, MA

Ratius wrote:Link? Slow day in work.

http://www.warseer.com/forums/showthread.php?331638-The-credibility-of-the-current-wave-of-rumours&p=6062466&viewfull=1#post6062466
Click here to see Warseer users giving excuses, justifying his lies, and asking him to keep on posting. Yeeeep.

Check out my Youtube channel!
 
   
Made in de
Decrepit Dakkanaut







pretre wrote:I was joshing.

Well, I know (after looking up that word ). Just wanted to make it clear.

BTW I played safe even earlier with the Fantasy contingent rumour thread (8th October, about 4 months ago):
I still don't know what to think of ghost21's rumours, but here they are:
(...)
But then Harry supports this rumour:

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/402558.page

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2012/01/31 16:00:09


Hive Fleet Ouroboros (my Tyranid blog): http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/286852.page
The Dusk-Wraiths of Szith Morcane (my Dark Eldar blog): http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/364786.page
Kroothawk's Malifaux Blog http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/455759.page
If you want to understand the concept of the "Greater Good", read this article, and you never again call Tau commies: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utilitarianism 
   
Made in us
Badass "Sister Sin"






Camas, WA

We should have a scoreboard thread for anyone that releases an original rumor. Just a list of names with a percentage and a quick breakdown.

Would help us keep track better.

Live in the Pacific NW? Check out http://ordofanaticus.com
Want to know your rumor monger's history? Check out the Ongoing Rumor Accuracy Tracking thread

"For this thread to have some utility and remain useful, please refrain from spamming it with 'jokes'." - Alpharius
"Irrational negativity is the engine that drives the forums" - BrassScorpion
"It's too early to be crying about this. Maybe next month all your tears will be valid." - Redbeard

190+ Successful Trades on Dakka.
My trade list: http://mindtaker.org/trade.html 
   
Made in us
Hooded Inquisitorial Interrogator





Oklahoma

Yeah, his false leads on the Sisters of Battle stuff made me sad and start distrusting what he said... but the Dreadfleet accuracy was weird... :/

Oh well... rumors are just that.

4000pts now... - Main Army, 4000pt , 5000pt , 8000pt ,3000pt

My battle reports and vids: http://www.youtube.com/user/Pulledpunches 
   
Made in us
Veteran Inquisitor with Xenos Alliances






At least it gave us something to talk about. That's more than GW's done.
   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran





aka_mythos wrote:At least it gave us something to talk about. That's more than GW's done.


This is a terrible opinion to hold. At no point is being intentionally deceived better, and it absolves posters like ghost21 of what they've done.
   
Made in gb
Unhealthy Competition With Other Legions





York, North Yorkshire, England

This is what I want to do with my time, sit on the internet and make up fake rumours about GW products.

Some people amaze me.

| Imperial Guard-1000pts | Eldar-1000pts | Space Wolves-1000ptsWIP|
--------------------------------------------
| High Elves-1500pts | Dwarfs-1500ptsWIP|
--------------------------------------------
| Trollbloods-35ptsWIP|
--------------------------------------------
http://projectpictor.blogspot.co.uk/ 
   
Made in it
Focused Dark Angels Land Raider Pilot





I simply do not understand the support that sometimes ghost21 receives. He was labeled as an untrustworthy source a long time ago, but he kept posting deliberately false rumours for unknown reasons.
Surely he didn't kill anyone but what he did is still unpleasant. Since WH40k is a wonderful hobby, a lot of people wants to be informed about it... sometimes also to project spending behaviour since it's a damn expensive hobby.
Deliberately posting false rumours can be innocuous for those that keep themselves continuously informed, but can be a real punch in the face for those that didn't know that ghost was a totally unreliable source...
I will not defend or find justifications for him... he acted in weird way showing mass disrepect for the community.
   
Made in gb
Bonkers Buggy Driver with Rockets





UK

bhsman wrote:
aka_mythos wrote:At least it gave us something to talk about. That's more than GW's done.


This is a terrible opinion to hold. At no point is being intentionally deceived better, and it absolves posters like ghost21 of what they've done.


Saying that people are often deceived by a lot of things, particularly guys. How many guys have gone out with a girl simply because she is good looking but deep down secretly know that really she only wants you for the money.

People believe what they want to believe if it makes them feel good, I have nothing against those who want to believe what they really know is untrue, so I think aka_mythos is right at least it gave some people some happiness, especially those on the tyranid 2nd wave rumor thread

   
Made in ie
Dominating Dominatrix






Dublin, Ireland

Thanks SRM.

This post by SoD on Warseer seems pertinent and quite well written

If anything, we (as in the 'rumour audience') are the problem - and I include myself in that.

When did it become so important to know everything about an upcoming release before it is actually released? I can understand the temptation but it reminds me of rooting around in your parents' cupboard as a kid in the lead up to Christmas in the hope of discovering your presents. There is an initial burst of excitement but when the big day comes you're left with a feeling of emptiness because there's no big surprise. This is exactly what happened with the 4th ed Eldar 'dex - we knew pretty much everything a whole month before the release.

Perhaps we've become spoilt. I think this is evident in some of the posts I have seen with some people even talking of quitting the hobby because the latest rumour suggests that their army of choice isn't coming out for another two years. Get a grip people.

It's only natural to want to know if your favourite army is on the horizon but is there really any need to know every minute detail before you get the codex in your hands? I applaud GW for trying to remain so tight lipped in recent years.

So I can't really complain too much if it has become incredibly difficult to sort the wheat from the chaff due to the deluge of rumours. Our furious demand has created this environment and if it has become a circus due to the number of contradictory rumours flying around then I think that is a lesson for us all.

Dman137 wrote:
goobs is all you guys will ever be

By 1-irt: Still as long as Hissy keeps showing up this is one of the most entertaining threads ever.

"Feelin' goods, good enough". 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





Fresno, CA

I don't take any of the rumors seriously. I even thought that the command barge pictures from BOW were fake, only because it looked ridiculous. Turns out the one with the destroyer pilots was a fake though, so I was partly right!

I RIDE FOR DOOMTHUMBS!
For the love of beef, visit my blog: My miniature painting blog 
   
Made in us
Ultramarine Master with Gauntlets of Macragge





Boston, MA

Ratius wrote:Thanks SRM.

This post by SoD on Warseer seems pertinent and quite well written

If anything, we (as in the 'rumour audience') are the problem - and I include myself in that.

When did it become so important to know everything about an upcoming release before it is actually released? I can understand the temptation but it reminds me of rooting around in your parents' cupboard as a kid in the lead up to Christmas in the hope of discovering your presents. There is an initial burst of excitement but when the big day comes you're left with a feeling of emptiness because there's no big surprise. This is exactly what happened with the 4th ed Eldar 'dex - we knew pretty much everything a whole month before the release.

Perhaps we've become spoilt. I think this is evident in some of the posts I have seen with some people even talking of quitting the hobby because the latest rumour suggests that their army of choice isn't coming out for another two years. Get a grip people.

It's only natural to want to know if your favourite army is on the horizon but is there really any need to know every minute detail before you get the codex in your hands? I applaud GW for trying to remain so tight lipped in recent years.

So I can't really complain too much if it has become incredibly difficult to sort the wheat from the chaff due to the deluge of rumours. Our furious demand has created this environment and if it has become a circus due to the number of contradictory rumours flying around then I think that is a lesson for us all.

That seems about half right. I want to know what's coming up so I know what to save for, what to look forward to, and so on. We don't like being kept in the dark, but we don't necessarily need the full codex leak ahead of time either. We may or may not want to know exactly what presents are in that closet, but at the very least we want to know that there ARE presents in that closet.

Check out my Youtube channel!
 
   
Made in us
Fireknife Shas'el





Reedsburg, WI

bhsman wrote:
aka_mythos wrote:At least it gave us something to talk about. That's more than GW's done.


This is a terrible opinion to hold. At no point is being intentionally deceived better, and it absolves posters like ghost21 of what they've done.


I agree. People shouldn't post deliberately made-up rumors. Personally, I not going to hold such a poster over a barrel. Hate makes my hair fall out . I'm just going to move on and ignore them in the future.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2012/01/31 16:54:35


Wyomingfox's Space Wolves Paint Blog A journey across decades.
Splinter Fleet Stygian Paint Blogg Home of the Albino Bugs. 
   
Made in us
Hooded Inquisitorial Interrogator





Oklahoma

Brother SRM wrote:I want to know what's coming up so I know what to save for, what to look forward to, and so on. We don't like being kept in the dark...


THIS.

4000pts now... - Main Army, 4000pt , 5000pt , 8000pt ,3000pt

My battle reports and vids: http://www.youtube.com/user/Pulledpunches 
   
Made in us
Veteran Inquisitor with Xenos Alliances






wyomingfox wrote:
bhsman wrote:
aka_mythos wrote:At least it gave us something to talk about. That's more than GW's done.


This is a terrible opinion to hold. At no point is being intentionally deceived better, and it absolves posters like ghost21 of what they've done.


I agree. People shouldn't post deliberately made-up rumors. Personally, I not going to hold such a poster over a barrel. Hate makes my hair fall out . I'm just going to move on and ignore them in the future.
I'm not saying anyone should have made up rumors. Its a criticism of GW, that one guy trying to decieve us all was more entertaining than a $200M company in this very narrow way.
   
Made in au
Incorporating Wet-Blending






Australia

Ratius wrote:This post by SoD on Warseer seems pertinent and quite well written

It's really not. If he needs that surprise to make a new army fun, that's his problem. As a former would-be Sisters player, my concerns were rather simpler: I wanted a reason not to write GW off completely. I'd been waiting for a plastic Sisters of Battle kit since I was in high school, and there's a pretty good chance that I'd still be waiting when I hit my thirties, if I hadn't left. That's just fething depressing.

"When I became a man I put away childish things, including the fear of childishness and the desire to be very grown up."
-C.S. Lewis 
   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran





aka_mythos wrote:I'm not saying anyone should have made up rumors. Its a criticism of GW, that one guy trying to decieve us all was more entertaining than a $200M company in this very narrow way.


Someone intentionally deceiving you is more entertaining than anything GW does? Seriously?
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





Brother SRM wrote:
Ratius wrote:Link? Slow day in work.

http://www.warseer.com/forums/showthread.php?331638-The-credibility-of-the-current-wave-of-rumours&p=6062466&viewfull=1#post6062466
Click here to see Warseer users giving excuses, justifying his lies, and asking him to keep on posting. Yeeeep.


I think people will accept "rumors" by just about anyone, just so they can have something to talk about for a few months.

My Armies:
5,500pts
2,700pts
2,000pts


 
   
 
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