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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2025/01/13 17:00:08
Subject: Warhammer 40k news and rumours. Store Anniversary mini 2025 revealed.p.132.
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Fixture of Dakka
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Lord Zarkov wrote:
Tbh 10th in a nutshell is probably ‘great rules for playing, pump rules for army construction’.
Though the volume of errata and FAQs has got a bit silly.
I really don't want to spend time building lists I don't enjoy playing.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2025/01/13 17:00:40
Subject: Warhammer 40k news and rumours. Store Anniversary mini 2025 revealed.p.132.
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Decrepit Dakkanaut
UK
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Lord Zarkov wrote:
Tbh 10th in a nutshell is probably ‘great rules for playing, pump rules for army construction’.
Though the volume of errata and FAQs has got a bit silly.
The problem with them is that GW rebuilds the game every 3 years. So they not only have to start fresh with those documents and have them come about again; but they also can't just collate them into a single printed fresh document. If the next edition were just 10th rules with the errata/ faq built into every publication then the amount of additional paper material would steadily decrease.
Because GW doesn't stay with a single game and polish it there are limits.
That said I'll take the FAST FAQ/Errata publication we have today over the old-days. I still recall Tyranids getting an FAQ for an edition almost a week/month before the next edition came out.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2025/01/13 19:00:10
Subject: Re:Warhammer 40k news and rumours. Store Anniversary mini 2025 revealed.p.132.
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Mysterious Techpriest
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I keep hearing the no models, no rules arguments. Is it safe to assume that of no model exists for a unit (or has ever existed, ever) that it will probably be removed for the next codex?
For example the Grey Knight Techmarine.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2025/01/13 19:00:47
Subject: Warhammer 40k news and rumours. Store Anniversary mini 2025 revealed.p.132.
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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Let's also not forget the Tyranid FAQ from 4th/5th edition that answered the question about what happens when a Carnifex has to take a leadership test. Answer: "why? Monstrous creatures don't take leadership tests." Uh.... Yes they did?
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2025/01/13 19:15:03
Subject: Re:Warhammer 40k news and rumours. Store Anniversary mini 2025 revealed.p.132.
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The Marine Standing Behind Marneus Calgar
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Lathe Biosas wrote:I keep hearing the no models, no rules arguments. Is it safe to assume that of no model exists for a unit (or has ever existed, ever) that it will probably be removed for the next codex?
For example the Grey Knight Techmarine.
Anything without a model should be on the watch list. It may or may not go when a new codex drops. Or it might get a new model. Ot it might still keep he old rules.
One of the many frustrations with NMNR is that it’s wildly inconsistent. It’s not like they have formally come out and claimed it as an ofical policy, ut they do seem to follow it. Most of the time.
But not always…
I would recommend new players against investing heavily in things not in the box. You will never know if/when it will be cut.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2025/01/13 19:22:17
Subject: Warhammer 40k news and rumours. Store Anniversary mini 2025 revealed.p.132.
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Decrepit Dakkanaut
UK
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For example Tyranid Warriors have only 1 close combat weapon profile despite the boxed kit having multiple close combat weapon choices.
Sometimes this is because rules are made for a future product - eg I could see GW doing a new warrior kit with wings included instead of multiple close combat weapon options so that warriors better pair with the new warrior prime released in leviathan.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2025/01/13 20:17:31
Subject: Re:Warhammer 40k news and rumours. Store Anniversary mini 2025 revealed.p.132.
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Fixture of Dakka
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Nevelon wrote: Lathe Biosas wrote:I keep hearing the no models, no rules arguments. Is it safe to assume that of no model exists for a unit (or has ever existed, ever) that it will probably be removed for the next codex?
For example the Grey Knight Techmarine.
Anything without a model should be on the watch list. It may or may not go when a new codex drops. Or it might get a new model. Ot it might still keep he old rules.
One of the many frustrations with NMNR is that it’s wildly inconsistent. It’s not like they have formally come out and claimed it as an ofical policy, ut they do seem to follow it. Most of the time.
But not always…
I would recommend new players against investing heavily in things not in the box. You will never know if/when it will be cut.
Honestly, its not all that inconsistent. If its resin, its gone. If its rules feel like absolute placeholder garbage its either gone or getting replaced. If kitbashing is in any way required, expect it gone eventually. I've been more surprised by the things they haven't cut than anything that goes away, but understandably new players would have a much harder time telling the difference.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2025/01/13 20:59:32
Subject: Re:Warhammer 40k news and rumours. Store Anniversary mini 2025 revealed.p.132.
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Towering Hierophant Bio-Titan
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LunarSol wrote:Honestly, its not all that inconsistent. If its resin, its gone.
Not always... we've had a few cases of resin models sticking around only to be replaced with a plastic kit within about a year. Tankbustas are the most recent example, and Tyranids had a small cull of resin datasheets in 9th but kept several others until they were replaced with plastic 18 months later.
That's why I fully expect to see an updated Trazyn model before 11th rolls around.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2025/01/13 21:06:18
Subject: Warhammer 40k news and rumours. Store Anniversary mini 2025 revealed.p.132.
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Decrepit Dakkanaut
UK
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I fully expect to see Necrons get all their named heroes; the destroyer kit and the destroyer lord updated in modern plastics.
The only real surprise is that they dripfed a new generic lord model in plastic and that they still haven't updated the destroyer model.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2025/01/13 21:07:54
Subject: Re:Warhammer 40k news and rumours. Store Anniversary mini 2025 revealed.p.132.
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Fixture of Dakka
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Lathe Biosas wrote:I keep hearing the no models, no rules arguments. Is it safe to assume that of no model exists for a unit (or has ever existed, ever) that it will probably be removed for the next codex?
For example the Grey Knight Techmarine.
Depends as an existing model might be given a new role as a new unit is introduced to take it's place. For example, a Tyranid Prime was taken from the Tyranid Warriors set but with 10th edition it was demoted from an HQ unit to a mere unit leader. At the same time they introduced a new Winged Prime model as it's replacement in the HQ slot.
Another similar example is the Harlequin Troupe Master which no longer has an official model. In a nutshell it was a build from the Players kit, but since 9th edtion its been given the new role of "Lead Player" which - like the Tyranid Prime - is only a unit leader. If not a new model then the other option is to retire the Troupe Master unit to legends and have the Shadowseer take over as the Warlord for the Harlequins. I'm okay with that as Eldar leadership is mostly filled by Seer councils anyway, but either way the Eldar codex is up next...
Not looked into the situation with the Techmarine, but I would assume it will be addressed when the codex is dropped or maybe even introduced through Kill Team? A Techmarine might have more relevence in Kill Team if continuing the indoor combat thing - operating and fixing stuff.
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Casual gaming, mostly solo-coop these days.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2025/01/13 22:41:54
Subject: Re:Warhammer 40k news and rumours. Store Anniversary mini 2025 revealed.p.132.
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Sadistic Inquisitorial Excruciator
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LunarSol wrote:Honestly, its not all that inconsistent. If its resin, its gone.
Imperial Agents lost Jokaero, Crusaders, Daemonhosts and Death Cultists - but retained resin Inquisitors. Inconsistent.
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This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2025/01/13 22:43:42
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2025/01/13 23:38:35
Subject: Re:Warhammer 40k news and rumours. Store Anniversary mini 2025 revealed.p.132.
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Confessor Of Sins
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Shakalooloo wrote: LunarSol wrote:Honestly, its not all that inconsistent. If its resin, its gone.
Imperial Agents lost Jokaero, Crusaders, Daemonhosts and Death Cultists - but retained resin Inquisitors. Inconsistent.
Inconsistent, but easy to explain. If they didn't keep the resin Inquistors, there would be no generic Inquisitors, just the three named Inquisitors.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2025/01/13 23:48:03
Subject: Warhammer 40k news and rumours. Store Anniversary mini 2025 revealed.p.132.
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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There was a plastic crusader from Blackstone Fortress, same as the two priests.
Death cultists I suppose joined up with the Rogue Trader retinue.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2025/01/13 23:49:20
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2025/01/14 00:21:12
Subject: Warhammer 40k news and rumours. Store Anniversary mini 2025 revealed.p.132.
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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cerebaton wrote:Voss wrote:Huh. The Krieg squad options got even worse.
Its almost impressive.
Now there are two groups of options.
0-2 models can take a flamer, grenade launcher or long las (no duplicates, unless 20 man squad)
and
0-2 models can take a meltagun, plasma gun or lasgun & vox (also no duplicates, unless 20 men)
BUT, all the special weapons (so, everything except the vox) are limited to 2 total (4 total if 20 man squad)
So you can take 0-2 special weapons and 0-2 special weapons, as long as you only take 2 special weapons. or 2 and a vox. (or 0-4 + 0-4, but max of 4 (+vox) for 20 man squad)
Its also all laid out with asterisks, so people are going to misread it.
----
Also the medi-pack is assigned to a model now (who has to keep is his lasgun, and can't double up with a vox), but that seems reasonable.
I actually can't work this one out (and I've seen the screenshot of the actual entry too) - why separate them out into those two chunks? It seems from the wording like I can have any two of the five listed special weapons in a 10-man squad, so why not just have one list?
But if you take a Vox, you can't double plasma or double melta.
If another rule says you can't take doubles at all, this convoluted wording would still mean that if you took a vox, you couldn't take both a plasma and a melta. Automatically Appended Next Post: kodos wrote:Not like you can't make a simple but deep game that has flavour and tactical depth, it is just GW that can not (and somehow people assuming that if GW doesn't try it is not possible) which is understandable as putting more work than the bare minimum into a game that is replaced within 3 years as long as people buy it anyway would be a bad business decision
Well, I'm not going to stand up and mindlessly defend GW- they certainly could improve, and if they'd just drop the stupid three-year edition cycle, they could really have a good game on their hands.
But I'll say one thing that I'm willing to consider in GW's defense:
Is there another game company with a range and number of factions and scale variety as we get with 40k? I'm pretty sure there isn't.
People talk about how awesome Dust is. But yeah... There are more models in the Imperial Guard range than there are in ALL of Dust... And yeah, I think there's what, four factions? Six?
Battletech- great game, and as long lived as 40k (though it's changed owners a fair number of times, so it ain't a continuous 40 year reign)... But yeah, again... more models in just the guard than in all of Battletech, and again, five factions?
I think Infinity and Warmahordes are the closest, but GW's still got'em beat, especially when you consider scale- from characters to fliers, tanks, superheavies, knights...
Nothing anywhere comes close, and if it does, please tell me.
Now even with everything GW's got, I still concede it can be done better... And GW themselves HAVE done it better. I far prefer 9th to 10th... But even if you didn't let me have 9th, 4th was better than 10th. Third was better than 10th too, and so were 2nd and Rogue Trader... But these last three have so few models that they are closer to other games in scope and scale than they are to the modern behemoth. Second might as well have been Warmachine or Battletech. Rogue Trader might as well have been Infinity.
There are a lot of people who say GW should shrink the range and the number of factions for exactly that reason... And when you look at HH with its narrower, more likely to mirror match ups with fewer factions (though many subfactions), and much more limited range. It does well because it CAN'T be Knights vs. Grots. But 40k CAN be Knights vs Grots, and every damned obscure combination. And so yeah, its rules have to be kinda nuts.
Now I see WHY these people suggest that: they are Wargamers, and trimming superhavies and fliers, as well as other centrepiece and supercharacter models and streamlining down to no more than 10 factions (combining where necessary- ie. all eldar types are now combined into a single faction) would make a better, more balanced, easier to play game.
But I think that 40k's place is to not be every other well written but modest game. I think 40k is it's own thing, outside of Wargaming. I certainly play it as more of a large scale RPG than I do as a Wargame. I think if 40k WAS every other well written but modest game, it would not have survived 40 years and absolutely DEVOURED the marketshare. It might have had a good decade, and then maybe died, or maybe changed ownership...
You know, kinda like what did, does, will always seem to happen to all of these other games that everyone tells me are so good.
And Id rather play 10th than 10faction 40k with no knights, fliers or superheavies. It's exactly why I don't play Heresy era games. And I suspect a lot of other players feel the same way, though of course I can't speaak for anyone but myself.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2025/01/14 01:14:41
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2025/01/14 01:54:53
Subject: Warhammer 40k news and rumours. Store Anniversary mini 2025 revealed.p.132.
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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There's over 650 battlemechs (closer to 4500+ if you include variants) in Battletech.
Plus a few hundred different aircraft, ground units, dropships and infantry units.
It's a ridiculously enormous game if you count everything.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2025/01/14 01:55:14
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2025/01/14 05:20:17
Subject: Re:Warhammer 40k news and rumours. Store Anniversary mini 2025 revealed.p.132.
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Fixture of Dakka
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Shakalooloo wrote: LunarSol wrote:Honestly, its not all that inconsistent. If its resin, its gone.
Imperial Agents lost Jokaero, Crusaders, Daemonhosts and Death Cultists - but retained resin Inquisitors. Inconsistent.
And a year after I bought Finecrap Drukari Mandrakes (and spent what felt like an eternity cleaning them up) they got replaced by nice new plastics.
Meanwhile, over in HH.... There's a Sisters of Silence squad that can include caimans. Yes, that's right, small alligators. To the best of my knowledge GWs never made a caiman. Or even an alligator/crocodile. And likely wont.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2025/01/14 06:01:18
Subject: Warhammer 40k news and rumours. Store Anniversary mini 2025 revealed.p.132.
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Boosting Space Marine Biker
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Tastyfish wrote:There's over 650 battlemechs (closer to 4500+ if you include variants) in Battletech.
Plus a few hundred different aircraft, ground units, dropships and infantry units.
It's a ridiculously enormous game if you count everything.
Battletech has its own unique problems balancing that much stuff, clan pulseboats that can jump 6+ come up pretty often. But it is nice having a history that long.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2025/01/14 06:01:50
Subject: Warhammer 40k news and rumours. Store Anniversary mini 2025 revealed.p.132.
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Fixture of Dakka
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PenitentJake wrote:
Battletech- great game, and as long lived as 40k (though it's changed owners a fair number of times, so it ain't a continuous 40 year reign)... But yeah, again... more models in just the guard than in all of Battletech, and again, five factions?
You don't know a damned thing about BTech do you?
There are 100 Guard units in the current base Munitorium list. + some more under Imperial armor & Legends.
Battletechs Technical Readout: 3025, published in 1986, contains 89 units (not counting variants).
So 39 years ago BTechs core unit book was only 11 units shy of todays base list for the Guard....
Then you add the Tech Readout for vehicles, the 2750 tech guide with more advanced mechs/vehicles, the 3050 guide with the original clan mechs, books full of areospace fighters, drop ships, jumpships, capital ship scale spacecraft.... and they keep right on publishing books full of new mechs etc to this day.
So are you sure you want to stand by your claim that the IG range out numbers Battletechs?
And Battle-Tech has well more than 5 factions here in 2025. (there were more than 5 in 1986 as well)
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2025/01/14 06:32:32
Subject: Re:Warhammer 40k news and rumours
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Grim Dark Angels Interrogator-Chaplain
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Those Battletech unit counts make me think of Star Fleet Battles and its 1200+ ship classes/variants spread across 50+ factions. 40k has NOTHING on these older games!
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2025/01/14 07:10:23
Subject: Re:Warhammer 40k news and rumours. Store Anniversary mini 2025 revealed.p.132.
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Gore-Drenched Khorne Chaos Lord
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alextroy wrote: Shakalooloo wrote: LunarSol wrote:Honestly, its not all that inconsistent. If its resin, its gone.
Imperial Agents lost Jokaero, Crusaders, Daemonhosts and Death Cultists - but retained resin Inquisitors. Inconsistent.
Inconsistent, but easy to explain. If they didn't keep the resin Inquistors, there would be no generic Inquisitors, just the three named Inquisitors.
Putting some foil on my bonce for a minute, there have been 2 plastic inquisitors, one as a store anniversary they can now roll out at least as MTO, the other a d the current WH+. From daddy GWs perspective, what loyal fan doesn't have WH+ and access to a plastic inquisitor?
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2025/01/14 07:12:45
Subject: Re:Warhammer 40k news and rumours. Store Anniversary mini 2025 revealed.p.132.
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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ccs wrote:
Meanwhile, over in HH.... There's a Sisters of Silence squad that can include caimans. Yes, that's right, small alligators. To the best of my knowledge GWs never made a caiman. Or even an alligator/crocodile. And likely wont.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2025/01/14 08:22:29
Subject: Re:Warhammer 40k news and rumours
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Second Story Man
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ZergSmasher wrote:Those Battletech unit counts make me think of Star Fleet Battles and its 1200+ ship classes/variants spread across 50+ factions. 40k has NOTHING on these older games!
adding to that that in those games the factions actually have a different play style and are not just different colours
Even if you say BT only has 5 factions, those 5 have more variations on lists and play style than all of 40k together
Number of units of factions mean nothing if all are playing similar
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Harry, bring this ring to Narnia or the Sith will take the Enterprise |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2025/01/14 13:27:01
Subject: Warhammer 40k news and rumours. Store Anniversary mini 2025 revealed.p.132.
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Battleship Captain
The Land of the Rising Sun
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PenitentJake wrote:
Battletech- great game, and as long lived as 40k (though it's changed owners a fair number of times, so it ain't a continuous 40 year reign)... But yeah, again... more models in just the guard than in all of Battletech, and again, five factions?
What? It's true that Btech had a troubled history until the success of the KS but it has more mechs than 40K has by a good margin. We are getting cheap plastic mechs now but for a long time all you needed was the mech record sheet, and a carboard cutout with only the most hardcore players going for only metal minis. Iron Wind Metals has hundreds of metal mechs in their catalog, it's that tables don't look as crowded because you just need 4 mechs to a side for a game unlike 40K where in some armies figures are just glorified wound counters.
M.
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Jenkins: You don't have jurisdiction here!
Smith Jamison: We aren't here, which means when we open up on you and shred your bodies with automatic fire then this will never have happened.
About the Clans: "Those brief outbursts of sense can't hold back the wave of sibko bred, over hormoned sociopaths that they crank out though." |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2025/01/14 15:14:38
Subject: Re:Warhammer 40k news and rumours. Store Anniversary mini 2025 revealed.p.132.
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Fixture of Dakka
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xttz wrote: LunarSol wrote:Honestly, its not all that inconsistent. If its resin, its gone.
Not always... we've had a few cases of resin models sticking around only to be replaced with a plastic kit within about a year. Tankbustas are the most recent example, and Tyranids had a small cull of resin datasheets in 9th but kept several others until they were replaced with plastic 18 months later.
That's why I fully expect to see an updated Trazyn model before 11th rolls around.
As I said, I'm more surprised by things that stay than by things that go. If it stays, there's apparently a plastic rework in the cards though when we see it seems to be a bit up in the air.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2025/01/14 17:57:12
Subject: Re:Warhammer 40k news and rumours. Store Anniversary mini 2025 revealed.p.132.
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Sadistic Inquisitorial Excruciator
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Dudeface wrote: alextroy wrote: Shakalooloo wrote: LunarSol wrote:Honestly, its not all that inconsistent. If its resin, its gone.
Imperial Agents lost Jokaero, Crusaders, Daemonhosts and Death Cultists - but retained resin Inquisitors. Inconsistent.
Inconsistent, but easy to explain. If they didn't keep the resin Inquistors, there would be no generic Inquisitors, just the three named Inquisitors.
Putting some foil on my bonce for a minute, there have been 2 plastic inquisitors, one as a store anniversary they can now roll out at least as MTO, the other a d the current WH+. From daddy GWs perspective, what loyal fan doesn't have WH+ and access to a plastic inquisitor?
It's a mystery why they didn't just release one of the LE models as a regular Inquisitor for the line, and thus do away with another resin relic.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2025/01/14 20:27:39
Subject: Re:Warhammer 40k news and rumours. Store Anniversary mini 2025 revealed.p.132.
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Fixture of Dakka
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Shakalooloo wrote:
It's a mystery why they didn't just release one of the LE models as a regular Inquisitor for the line, and thus do away with another resin relic.
Particularly when they made such a show of the agents codex and only released Coteaz. A generic Inquisitor would have really helped move some of those boxes.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2025/01/15 04:07:56
Subject: Warhammer 40k news and rumours
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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Y'all are hittin me with some big numbers.
If battletech has 99,000 units on paper represented by 100 models, guess what?
Battle tech has 100 units. Cuz paper don't mean JACK.
Link me to the page where I can buy models for all of these units. There are 26 products available in the model section of the Battletech store. Now many if not most of those have four models each, so let's call it 120 units in 26 kits.
The Guard have 60 products on their page, though some are books, some are resin, some are boxed sets, whatever. This number will go up from here once the new release happens. But let's call it 50 kits to Battletech's 26 at present. And that's ONE 40k faction.
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This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2025/01/15 04:10:36
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2025/01/15 04:24:53
Subject: Warhammer 40k news and rumours
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Shadowy Grot Kommittee Memba
The Great State of New Jersey
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Someone clearly doesnt understand how Battletech products work. Heres the store youre looking for:
https://www.ironwindmetals.com/index.php/categories/cat-battletech
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2025/01/15 06:36:46
Subject: Warhammer 40k news and rumours
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Battleship Captain
The Land of the Rising Sun
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PenitentJake wrote:Y'all are hittin me with some big numbers.
If battletech has 99,000 units on paper represented by 100 models, guess what?
Battle tech has 100 units. Cuz paper don't mean JACK.
Link me to the page where I can buy models for all of these units. There are 26 products available in the model section of the Battletech store. Now many if not most of those have four models each, so let's call it 120 units in 26 kits.
The Guard have 60 products on their page, though some are books, some are resin, some are boxed sets, whatever. This number will go up from here once the new release happens. But let's call it 50 kits to Battletech's 26 at present. And that's ONE 40k faction.
First, Btech is not a WYSIWYG game, a Stinger can be used for any variant you want (14 just Inner Sphere + 2 Clan) nobody is going to have a fit if your mech doesn't represent exactly the stats unlike 40K.
Second, what Caos0Xomega said, and if that doesn't suit your taste check the 3d Cults page where you can find another ton of non-official but authorised models from Mechwarrior online.
M.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2025/01/15 07:02:57
Jenkins: You don't have jurisdiction here!
Smith Jamison: We aren't here, which means when we open up on you and shred your bodies with automatic fire then this will never have happened.
About the Clans: "Those brief outbursts of sense can't hold back the wave of sibko bred, over hormoned sociopaths that they crank out though." |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2025/01/15 06:43:14
Subject: Warhammer 40k news and rumours
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Second Story Man
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So I guess if Space Marines have a 100 different units on paper, but people only use 10 on the table, the game only has 10 units
Going by that, Space Marine are also just 1 faction as they share units.
So we compare BTs 5 factions to 40ks 7
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Harry, bring this ring to Narnia or the Sith will take the Enterprise |
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