Archon Studios News and Rumours - MoTU GF 15 May, D&L 6 Caves late pledge/PM 25th June.

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**DaveC**

Another preview - I like that they went for 2 different types of tree. No indication yet if this is a pledge level (probably just a sample of renders they have handy) or what size "table" it's on

Edit: This is just 1 of the 3 themes and is half a basic pledge worth.

EDIT okay its a 2 foot by 2 foot set up

**lord_blackfang**

That all looks fantastic. Even the hills look like 3 individual sculpts, which is a lot of sprue space for something likely perceived as "unexciting".

**Grumpy Gnome**

I am liking what I see more than I was expecting. I would have liked to see Archon do more to improve their D&L buildings but those trees do look pretty good. Nice and quirky, full of character. Between Citadel/GW, Dwarven Forge and Monster Fight Club I am not sure I need more trees and rocks but considering Archon‘s normally decent pricing during Kickstarters these could do a lot to improve budget wargaming tables across the hobby community.

**Monkeysloth**

Gamefound link live. https://gamefound.com/projects/draft/jkf3q87ffrgk7r2bwz0pxqjhfm0#/section/project-story

Only bare minimum right now but they're not planning any tiles from the description as they mention game mats. Unless they have something amazing there I'll just stick to the plastic as shipping on mats is expensive and I have a few already.

**BigOscar**

Kind of surprised they've moved to Gamefound. I assume the rates are a lot more generous than KS, but I'd be surprised if they get anywhere near the footfall there that you would on KS

**DaveC**

BigOscar wrote:
Kind of surprised they've moved to Gamefound. I assume the rates are a lot more generous than KS, but I'd be surprised if they get anywhere near the footfall there that you would on KS

They did Masters of the Universe there so they likely have the data to show it's viable (5,317 backers @ €912,028 and that was limited to EU only and not even all of the EU - US backers are often 40%+ of KS backers) but I'd say they'll get less backers just because it's not Kickstarter. Also both Archon and Gamefound are Polish companies so keeping it local. It's likely Gamefound have better rates as well.

Monkeysloth wrote:

Only bare minimum right now but they're not planning any tiles from the description as they mention game mats. Unless they have something amazing there I'll just stick to the plastic as shipping on mats is expensive and I have a few already.

Not sure they will be offering game mats it just says by using game mats. It's not something they make and would have to outsource and to date they've kept everything in house so they can have control over it all - and deliver early if possible.

So from today's update the 3 themes are Elven Woods, Swamps of Doom and Land of the Giants.

**Monkeysloth**

Man I could spend a lot here even with a printer as their designs are good and some parts won't be that durable in resin so it's worth the cost. Might not get a lot of the scatter as that's easy to find.

Gamefound has also become a pretty good competitor to Kickstarter which is good as it's way better feature wise for both backer and publisher.

**lord_blackfang**

Archon have also been using Gamefound for their Pledge Managers, so all previous backers already have an account, it's not a huge leap at all. There's already 3000+ followers of the preview page.

**DaveC**

The one thing to look out for - and I say this having not used Gamefound other than for pledge managers - is that Gamefound charge on reaching the funding goal so it's something to be aware of (unless anyone has had a different experience?)

https://gamefound.com/info/crowdfunding-guide#/section/pledging

When the project is launched, the creator declares its goal – the amount of funds needed to make the project happen. When the goal is reached, backers are charged for their pledges. But reaching the campaign's goal is not the end of crowdfunding.
This is when stretch goals step in. Stretch goals are additional targets for the campaign. They include freebies, extensions, upgraded quality of the product, etc. Each stretch goal is a threshold that needs to be reached to unlock their content.

**lord_blackfang**

DaveC wrote:
The one thing to look out for - and I say this having not used Gamefound other than for pledge managers - is that Gamefound charge on reaching the funding goal so it's something to be aware of (unless anyone has had a different experience?)

https://gamefound.com/info/crowdfunding-guide#/section/pledging

When the project is launched, the creator declares its goal – the amount of funds needed to make the project happen. When the goal is reached, backers are charged for their pledges. But reaching the campaign's goal is not the end of crowdfunding.
This is when stretch goals step in. Stretch goals are additional targets for the campaign. They include freebies, extensions, upgraded quality of the product, etc. Each stretch goal is a threshold that needs to be reached to unlock their content.

Oh that is nasty if true, it could really mess up my card balance.

**BigOscar**

I don't think that's correct, because I'm pretty sure you can backout any time before the campaign ends? So they surely wouldn't waste a bunch of transfer fees having you able to back and back out without consequence?

It's a very strange choice if that is the case that you get charged before the campaign ends, as a lot of people back campaigns and then decide late on whether to follow through, back out or up their pledge

**DaveC**

Ah it's okay the terms of service say otherwise it's just badly worded in the general area.

a) Collection of the funds from the Backers during the crowdfunding campaign

Gamefound, acting on behalf of the Creator, collects the funds from the Backers to support the specific Project during its crowdfunding campaign.

During the crowdfunding campaign, the Backers provide their payment details (card number, cardholder name, expiration date, security code) and define the amount they want to pledge for a particular Project, but they are not charged until the end date of the crowdfunding campaign of the Project, which is displayed on the Website. Gamefound can reserve the amount on the Backer’s card for a period of crowdfunding campaign, i.e. from the day on which the Backer makes declaration of the Pledge until the achievement of the Creator’s financial goal. The funds are charged only if the Creator achieves the financial goal.

The Backer can change or cancel the declaration of the Pledge at any time before the end date of the crowdfunding campaign of the Project which is displayed on the Website.

Some Pledges cannot be collected (whole or in part) for objective reasons, for example when the Backer’s credit card expires before funding ends, and he does not provide updated information and/or due to our partners fee.

**Stormonu**

Needs more lasers. Like, sci-fi scatter terrain; alien trees, hills made of bones (for T800 terminators to stand atop) or stacked concrete slabs, and more.

Generic plastic wilderness terrain is nice, but it's also dime-a-dozen. Hopefully they'll have some more fantastic/sci-fi add-ons that will take it past the basics.

**lord_blackfang**

Stormonu wrote:

Generic plastic wilderness terrain is nice, but it's also dime-a-dozen.

Where tho

**Stevefamine**

lord_blackfang wrote:
Stormonu wrote:

Generic plastic wilderness terrain is nice, but it's also dime-a-dozen.

Where tho

citadel GW, galeforce nine terrain in a box, terrain essentials dungeon in a box, monster scenery, and so on and then you can order for build your own trees like Wood land scenics.

If you're into working with terrain this is a known fact

I like this kickstarter but the trees are an absolute skip due to how generic they are

**lord_blackfang**

The only one of those that's plastic is GW and this will be a quarter of GW's cost and not covered in skulls.

I'd prefer sci-fi too but there's not really this glut of fantasy plastics that you're trying to represent.

**Bossk_Hogg**

Stevefamine wrote:
lord_blackfang wrote:
Stormonu wrote:

Generic plastic wilderness terrain is nice, but it's also dime-a-dozen.

Where tho

citadel GW, galeforce nine terrain in a box, terrain essentials dungeon in a box, monster scenery, and so on and then you can order for build your own trees like Wood land scenics.

If you're into working with terrain this is a known fact

I like this kickstarter but the trees are an absolute skip due to how generic they are

GW is $50 for 3 trees. GF9 stuff is frequently out of stock, isn't plastic, and is expensive. Who knows for 3 trees, because they're out of stock. $30+ for a hill. Monster scenery is also a ripoff. $40 for 3 trees. Woodland scenics arent plastic, and in my house, have cat fur stuck in after 5 seconds.

Of those, only Mantic has decent priced terrain, and it is unfortunately restic. I think the market could use another HIPS option.

**Carlovonsexron**

timd wrote:
lord_blackfang wrote:
They'll work for Turnip28, not much else.

Looks like they will work fine for Frostgrave and similar 28mm games.

T

Yeah, I had no idea of the scale of the minis before this and some of the other posts around it, but now I'm super interested in whatever it is they will be offering mini wise.

**Stevefamine**

Bossk_Hogg wrote:
Stevefamine wrote:
lord_blackfang wrote:
Stormonu wrote:

Generic plastic wilderness terrain is nice, but it's also dime-a-dozen.

Where tho

citadel GW, galeforce nine terrain in a box, terrain essentials dungeon in a box, monster scenery, and so on and then you can order for build your own trees like Wood land scenics.

If you're into working with terrain this is a known fact

I like this kickstarter but the trees are an absolute skip due to how generic they are

GW is $50 for 3 trees. GF9 stuff is frequently out of stock, isn't plastic, and is expensive. Who knows for 3 trees, because they're out of stock. $30+ for a hill. Monster scenery is also a ripoff. $40 for 3 trees. Woodland scenics arent plastic, and in my house, have cat fur stuck in after 5 seconds.

Of those, only Mantic has decent priced terrain, and it is unfortunately restic. I think the market could use another HIPS option.

Outside of the GW trees that is some poor reasonsing. We play with expensive man dollies and toys here. Youve spent thousands already - getting a gaming table up and running with trees is a small portion of that hobby.

**Carlovonsexron**

Stevefamine 7 wrote:
Outside of the GW trees that is some poor reasonsing. We play with expensive man dollies and toys here. Youve spent thousands already - getting a gaming table up and running with trees is a small portion of that hobby.

If only because of the cat hair it seems like fine reasoning to me. You shouldn't seriously expect everyone to put in the same investment of money or time into their hobby as you do yours, as at the end of the day they will (or at least probably should) do what thier budget, environment and interests allow for. For some some people that means wanting a bigger option of HIPS trees.

**Monkeysloth**

Bossk_Hogg wrote:

Of those, only Mantic has decent priced terrain, and it is unfortunately restic. I think the market could use another HIPS option.

The mantic stuff I have is all PVC. Early bones quality at that. Not sure how the modern terrain is.

**Stevefamine**

Carlovonsexron wrote:
Stevefamine 7 wrote:
Outside of the GW trees that is some poor reasonsing. We play with expensive man dollies and toys here. Youve spent thousands already - getting a gaming table up and running with trees is a small portion of that hobby.

If only because of the cat hair it seems like fine reasoning to me. You shouldn't seriously expect everyone to put in the same investment of money or time into their hobby as you do yours, as at the end of the day they will (or at least probably should) do what thier budget, environment and interests allow for. For some some people that means wanting a bigger option of HIPS trees.

My apologies you are correct

@Monkeysloth Terraincrate from Mantic is great. Really well priced and the newer products are great. Citiscape/scifi doors/modern terrain is the better boxed sets... however Dungeons and Lasers beats Mantic on the fantasy side of things. The stalls/market/doodads/ that Dungeons and Lasers look fantastic and I'll pick them up over Mantic's fantasy range. The larger models are also a great find

**scarletsquig**

This is exactly the sort of quaint woodland terrain I'd like for burrows & badgers.

I have an FDM printer but layer lines are far more problematic on organic prints like trees and large flat-topped pieces like the hills puddle on the top without any good detail.

Definitely a market for this stuff, hard plastic means durable as well.

**GreenScorpion**

@Monkeysloth: I got the military compound from Mantic and it is HIPS and good overall in terms of modularity. The connectors aren't always perfect, as some holes are too tight and need to be widened, but with a bit of work you can turn those pieces into terrain that you can assemble and disassemble. I have glued mine but it is mostly because I am not interested in the rebuild possibility. Regular plastic cement for HIPS works perfectly in all the parts, so it doesn't seem like they did some things in HIPS and other in PVC.

**lord_blackfang**

Yes the old modular Deadzone and Mars Attacks wall planels are in HIPS. All the TerrainCrate scatter is bendy PVC.

**The_Real_Chris**

I can't view the picture of the models (my internet provider blocks a lot of sites). Are they good generic (hopefully unarmed) fellows? Always looking for civs and I liked the set from their last KS. Can someone upload the model image direct to Dakka?

**DaveC**

Contents of the Elven Woods set (attachment for those blocked). And a free model for every follower, click follow if you intend to back to get it.

Gaming mat is included after all.

**lord_blackfang**

Hmm. Not thirlled about paying for a bunch of mats I won't use. Hills seem a lot smaler than they did before.

**Bossk_Hogg**

Stevefamine wrote:
Bossk_Hogg wrote:
Stevefamine wrote:
lord_blackfang wrote:
Stormonu wrote:

Generic plastic wilderness terrain is nice, but it's also dime-a-dozen.

Where tho

citadel GW, galeforce nine terrain in a box, terrain essentials dungeon in a box, monster scenery, and so on and then you can order for build your own trees like Wood land scenics.

If you're into working with terrain this is a known fact

I like this kickstarter but the trees are an absolute skip due to how generic they are

GW is $50 for 3 trees. GF9 stuff is frequently out of stock, isn't plastic, and is expensive. Who knows for 3 trees, because they're out of stock. $30+ for a hill. Monster scenery is also a ripoff. $40 for 3 trees. Woodland scenics arent plastic, and in my house, have cat fur stuck in after 5 seconds.

Of those, only Mantic has decent priced terrain, and it is unfortunately restic. I think the market could use another HIPS option.

Outside of the GW trees that is some poor reasonsing. We play with expensive man dollies and toys here. Youve spent thousands already - getting a gaming table up and running with trees is a small portion of that hobby.

Why do you seem to have a problem with cheaper options for essentially the same thing?

**BigOscar**

Bossk_Hogg wrote:
Stevefamine wrote:
Bossk_Hogg wrote:
Stevefamine wrote:
lord_blackfang wrote:
Stormonu wrote:

Generic plastic wilderness terrain is nice, but it's also dime-a-dozen.

Where tho

citadel GW, galeforce nine terrain in a box, terrain essentials dungeon in a box, monster scenery, and so on and then you can order for build your own trees like Wood land scenics.

If you're into working with terrain this is a known fact

I like this kickstarter but the trees are an absolute skip due to how generic they are

GW is $50 for 3 trees. GF9 stuff is frequently out of stock, isn't plastic, and is expensive. Who knows for 3 trees, because they're out of stock. $30+ for a hill. Monster scenery is also a ripoff. $40 for 3 trees. Woodland scenics arent plastic, and in my house, have cat fur stuck in after 5 seconds.

Of those, only Mantic has decent priced terrain, and it is unfortunately restic. I think the market could use another HIPS option.

Outside of the GW trees that is some poor reasonsing. We play with expensive man dollies and toys here. Youve spent thousands already - getting a gaming table up and running with trees is a small portion of that hobby.

Why do you seem to have a problem with cheaper options for essentially the same thing?

It is a baffling one, but I think it's because he wanted Sci-Fi scenery instead, so is trying to rationalise why they shouldn't have done fantasy? But the "the hobby is expensive so why make things cheaper?" argument was a strange one

Automatically Appended Next Post:
In reality, I can see why you'd go generic fantasy over generic sci-fi, because generic sci-fi isn't really a thing. Generic fantasy works in pretty much hundreds of different games, a tree is a tree, a hill is a hill, ye olde market stall is a market stall, it's all built on essentially historical real life things mainly.

But sci-fi doesn't fit like that, not all "futuristic" settings are the same or are compatible unfortunately. The market is more spread out and niche, you aren't going to get a one size fits all collection in the same way. (although I assume they also have huge amounts of data on this from previous kickstarters and projects)